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Admiral_Oily_Discharge

Bourgogne Or Shikishima ?

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Greetings ,

I have now enough steel to unlock bourgy . But I was wondering when are they gonna release shikishima ? Should I wait or just get bourgy ? I am bb main and I see stalingrad has very good ap . I am a lil confused what do I do with 21k steel right now . Any inputs shall be greatly appreciated :)

 

Many thanks !

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[NWP]
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Do keep in mind, Bourg is not your typical BB. It has a unique playstyle.

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[SHAD]
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I don’t think Shikishima is finalised yet.

Wargaming might actually make it good. 
it might be a good idea to wait and see.

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[RODS]
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From what I have seen following Flamu, Flambass and a few more on Twitch and Youtube 

Bourgogne every day of the week

Shikishima cant hit a damn thing

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[BLITZ]
Modder
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2 hours ago, Hipp8r said:

Bourgogne without a doubt.

^ this

 

Shikishima is just a slightly modified Yamato. Shikishima can nothing a Yamato can do as well. Except the high alpha damage there is nothing in my opinion that speaks for the Shikishima. In a fight you have to angle well, because of the Yamato-hull, and thus you only have four guns to use, which is sometimes a pain in the a$$. 

 

On the other side has the Bourgogne a quite unique playstyle. Fast, squishy, secondaries, many guns, and a reaload booster on top. The Bourgogne is a ship you take out for a fun ride. 

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Players
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Bourgogne is my favourite ship by far, and while I feel I should recommend you buy her immediately, Shikishima may be in as early as next week. It could be that we see interesting changes very soon (such as the fact that they suddenly took her from 6km secondary range to one of the highest in the game).

 

I am planning on buying Shikishima regardless, but I think there will likely be additional buffs pre-launch to really justify the cost (although this is seemingly just being done to drain the steel economy). What's more is that the Yamato unique upgrade- which many people tout- has been designated as a candidate for nerfing perhaps as early as 0.9.6, so there may be a greater accuracy advantage given by the Shikishima over the Yamato.


All the same, Bourgogne is incredibly fun to play, and I doubt Shikishima will match that with any changes they're likely to roll out. The dispersion can honestly be infuriating at times, but it's well-compensated for by the low reload time and reload booster. When you can skip around the enemy flank at almost 40kts under engine boost (and sometimes higher, depending on captain skills/arms race- I've hit 44kts in her before), you can pretty much set yourself up for sneaky broadsides and obliterate cruisers not paying enough attention.

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[ADRIA]
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Burger is the best cruiser in the game. Shikishima looks like a nice port decoration.

 

^ that description should let you know all you needed to make the decision

 

 

And if you want to see just why Burger is one of my favourite ships in the game...

Spoiler

 

 

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[PANEU]
Beta Tester
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Bourgogne all the way.

Spoiler

Cause I dont want to share Shiki with every pleb, since it looks like its gonna be my own exclusive T10, havent heard anybody else being excited about it

 

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IMO Shikishima needs serious buff to make it worth the steel. I didn't saw any CC yet that makes this ship work. 

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12 hours ago, principat121 said:

Shikishima is just a slightly modified Yamato. Shikishima can nothing a Yamato can do as well.

 

^ This indeed.

 

If the penetrative power of the 51 cm/45 would actually be scaled in the same manner as the 41 cm/45 and 46 cm/45 are scaled in this game, then Shiki would actually even have a reason to exist. As with the correctly scaled penetrative power you could deal with the enemy battleships (read: citadel them) in a way Yamato simply can't.

 

 

Mass/Calibre/Drag/V0/Krupp

1984/0.51/0.235/780/2410

 

With those values the AP shell would be correctly scaled, using the 20 km as the reference point. If one wants to use even more realistic shell mass, then:

 

2000/0.51/0.235/780/2400

 

Both those parameter sets give the 51 cm/45 about 610 mm penetration at 20 km, while the 46 cm/45 has ~500 mm, and the 41 cm/45 has ~390 mm.

 

Another option would be to use the other referenced 51 cm AP shell mass value of 1950 kg and aim for ~600 mm pen at 20 km, but I don't have any ready parameters for such version at hand right now. The difference in pen is only 10 mm, so I think just the mass drop would be enough to achieve it. If not, then fine tune the drag and possibly Krupp as well. Personally I'd simply set the Krupp to 2400 and then tweak the drag for the desired result.

 

 

It surely is a gun with a tremendeous power, which is why it was designed to begin with, to crack open and smash any heavy armour it would ever meet. I advocate for the correct power scaling, as thus Shiki would really differ from Yamato, in a way people expect her to, and thus give her a reason to be. A reason to buy.

 

 

Fixing the shell parameters like explained above is my main and most important proposal for Shikishima. I have also some other, smaller details I'd change, but let them be.

 

12 hours ago, gopher31 said:

I don’t think Shikishima is finalised yet.

Wargaming might actually make it good. 
it might be a good idea to wait and see.

 

Given the Steel price rumour/leak, the latest tiny change to the ship itself (secondary range buff) etc. I think they want to get her into Armory in the next patch. Also the coupon will expire ~two weeks after the patch, which gives them even more "reason" to release her.

 

Overall, watching this show around the ship for six long months, while also researching the ship and the gun myself during that same time has just made me lose pretty much all the remaining faith. Of course the things can change, but I surely won't hold my breath anymore.

 


 

As for the OriginalPoster, I recommend Bourgogne as well. Given the current state of Shikishima, Bourgogne just gives a lot better bang per Steel. Also, if you know where to (re)position on the map, the insane speed of Bourgogne will be very handy. Same story goes for the Georgia. Quickly peeking at your stats, it seems you do know how to position/influence the battle, so you should be able to make Bourgogne work just well. Just imagine a buffed Alcase.

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9 hours ago, Miblogdegolf said:

Slava :Smile_trollface:

Slava will be very dull and boring to play from back at camping positions after all armor/survivability nerfs. 

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12 hours ago, Hipp8r said:

Slava will be very dull and boring to play from back at camping positions after all armor/survivability nerfs. 

I wouldn't mind making a trade armour x those amazingly precise 406 barrels :Smile_trollface:

BTW, tell me what the meta is lately at WoWs, and you will remember that the big amount of HE spammers don't allow BB tanking, except to the OP russian bias ships.

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