Tier X Gameplay is worst than ever - what are doing WG ?!

[matia251]

26 minutes ago, MrConway said:

Its impossible to please everyone unfortunately.

So right now you are focused on pleasing the majority of the playerbase which by coincidence are mostly new players? So can't you on behalf of WG, AT LEAST acknowledge this horrible situation for starters?  Do you have ANY idea how the "veterans"who actually helped this game to grow are now pushed away by this situation? Do you happen to have any idea of how does it feel to get your intelligence constanly insulted by just taking part in the majority of high tiered games? Is this some kind of punishment we have to endure because we made the mistake of climbing up the ladder of experience? The least you MUST do is ACKNOWLEDGE this, dont keep hiding it under the carpet, its infuriating for everyone. You cant keep mocking people by whistling happy and looking at the other side. Come forward and say "yes we know TX experience is reduced to dust, we are SORRY its our fault, we will do something about it" and then you can ask for ideas and implementations.

[MrConway]

19 minutes ago, matia251 said:

So right now you are focused on pleasing the majority of the playerbase which by coincidence are mostly new players? So can't you on behalf of WG, AT LEAST acknowledge this horrible situation for starters?  Do you have ANY idea how the "veterans"who actually helped this game to grow are now pushed away by this situation? Do you happen to have any idea of how does it feel to get your intelligence constanly insulted by just taking part in the majority of high tiered games? Is this some kind of punishment we have to endure because we made the mistake of climbing up the ladder of experience? The least you MUST do is ACKNOWLEDGE this, dont keep hiding it under the carpet, its infuriating for everyone. You cant keep mocking people by whistling happy and looking at the other side. Come forward and say "yes we know TX experience is reduced to dust, we are SORRY its our fault, we will do something about it" and then you can ask for ideas and implementations.

 

You think veterans are pushed away by a lack of the Ocean map in the rotation!?

 

I personally would play only at tier X if I could, I think it is the most enjoyable gameplay available, sure there can be issues with some team mates being a little stupid at times, but that is just a feature of random matchmaking.

[HaachamaShipping]

4 minutes ago, MrConway said:

 

You think veterans are pushed away by a lock of the Ocean map in the rotation!?

 

I doubt I'm new and I detest Ocean and frankly wonder why it even still is in the game. The map is an abomination and a FU to any ship that was designed around the potential use of terrain. Something like radar RN CL is basically just absolutely screwed. Even cyclone is better, despite making ships that depend on an advantage at range to go into closer ranges.

[ImTryingButYouDontHelp]

22 hours ago, SEN_SEN_Channel_Portugue said:

to use W key ?

 

With those numbers would have done more or less the same in battle than reversing; nothing 

[Itwastuesday]

5 minutes ago, Bunny_Lover_Kallen said:

I doubt I'm new and I detest Ocean and frankly wonder why it even still is in the game. The map is an abomination and a FU to any ship that was designed around the potential use of terrain. Something like radar RN CL is basically just absolutely screwed. Even cyclone is better, despite making ships that depend on an advantage at range to go into closer ranges.

 

The first time I got onto that map I thought it had glitched out all the terrain. Who even likes that map?

[Bratoev]

25 minutes ago, matia251 said:

So right now you are focused on pleasing the majority of the playerbase which by coincidence are mostly new players? So can't you on behalf of WG, AT LEAST acknowledge this horrible situation for starters?  Do you have ANY idea how the "veterans"who actually helped this game to grow are now pushed away by this situation? Do you happen to have any idea of how does it feel to get your intelligence constanly insulted by just taking part in the majority of high tiered games? Is this some kind of punishment we have to endure because we made the mistake of climbing up the ladder of experience? The least you MUST do is ACKNOWLEDGE this, dont keep hiding it under the carpet, its infuriating for everyone. You cant keep mocking people by whistling happy and looking at the other side. Come forward and say "yes we know TX experience is reduced to dust, we are SORRY its our fault, we will do something about it" and then you can ask for ideas and implementations.

Honestly if you are so infuriated and punished why do you even play? As for Tier 10 games being reduced to dust and such. Well: https://forum.worldofwarships.com/topic/85047-is-higher-tier-gameplay-all-about-camping/

The more things change the more they stay the same.

[ImTryingButYouDontHelp]

42 minutes ago, matia251 said:

So right now you are focused on pleasing the majority of the playerbase which by coincidence are mostly new players? So can't you on behalf of WG, AT LEAST acknowledge this horrible situation for starters?  Do you have ANY idea how the "veterans"who actually helped this game to grow are now pushed away by this situation? Do you happen to have any idea of how does it feel to get your intelligence constanly insulted by just taking part in the majority of high tiered games? Is this some kind of punishment we have to endure because we made the mistake of climbing up the ladder of experience? The least you MUST do is ACKNOWLEDGE this, dont keep hiding it under the carpet, its infuriating for everyone. You cant keep mocking people by whistling happy and looking at the other side. Come forward and say "yes we know TX experience is reduced to dust, we are SORRY its our fault, we will do something about it" and then you can ask for ideas and implementations.

Veterans don't spend so much money as the new players as they have many ships. Not a surprise tha WG is focused on them as money is the only thing they care. I'm not saying that, as a company, you don't have to earn it, but there are ways to do it developing a game with a little of balance, not creating abominations Smolensk/Stalin, or being so imaginative to release three "different" ships from an Amagi (Kii, Ashitaka and Asama) 

 

25 minutes ago, MrConway said:

I personally would play only at tier X if I could, I think it is the most enjoyable gameplay available, sure there can be issues with some team mates being a little stupid at times, but that is just a feature of random matchmaking.

 

Yep, as tier X is the only one where you can win a battle, and still lose money. Good for your business, I presume. 

 

20 minutes ago, Bunny_Lover_Kallen said:

I doubt I'm new and I detest Ocean and frankly wonder why it even still is in the game. The map is an abomination and a FU to any ship that was designed around the potential use of terrain. Something like radar RN CL is basically just absolutely screwed. Even cyclone is better, despite making ships that depend on an advantage at range to go into closer ranges.

 

At least, at Ocean you need a little of skill to survive. And there, just to see the bright side, torps don't crash against the numerous bad rendered island corners, and ships don't get stranded the same way. Now let's talk about the real abomination that is EPICENTER (with that other abomination, ciclones or similar). I wonder why they make us play it when everybody hates it, but don't make pro teams play it at KOTS 

[HaachamaShipping]

Just now, Miblogdegolf said:

At least, at Ocean you need a little of skill to survive.

I hope that's a joke...

[Molly_Delaney]

Ocean could be hysterically funny with a fail division of Shima, Yoshino & Asashio all with 20km torps.

[ImTryingButYouDontHelp]

2 minutes ago, Bunny_Lover_Kallen said:

I hope that's a joke...

Nope, and I'm not saying I like that map. Maximum range, kiting, engage-desengage, angling, and try to survive as long as possible.

 

Mino has a larger citadel and less armour than USA LC

 

 

[matia251]

38 minutes ago, MrConway said:

 

You think veterans are pushed away by a lack of the Ocean map in the rotation!?

 

I personally would play only at tier X if I could, I think it is the most enjoyable gameplay available, sure there can be issues with some team mates being a little stupid at times, but that is just a feature of random matchmaking.

Ehm maybe you got confused, i wasnt talking about Ocean map, i think its perfectly clear that i m refering to this thread's scope of existence, that TX gameplay is WORST THAN EVER. My whole post refers to this HUGE problem and you are again trying to sidestep it by marketing it as a feature and THIS IS THE PROBLEM...right there.

Its not a feature to constantly have teammates that take over 50%-60% of the team at TX games who lack totally at basic knowledge of how to play with their "end of game" TX ship.

The problem is not that teammates "act a little stupid", it sounds so cute and irrelevant if you put it that way but DEFINETELY IS NOT like this. They SHOULDNT have got a TX ship with such low experience in the game, they should still be at lower tier till they are able to compete in the higher more demanding level like we ALL DID all these years.

They are not "some", they are THE MAJORITY in EACH AND EVERY GAME.

 

You are doing the same thing i was begging in my post to avoid, you are undermining the problem, trying to shove it under the carpet and look the other way. The existence of this thread and so many others that got LOCKED has the same issue, its in the title of this thread, TX battles are WORSE than T4 battles with underage kids as captains, honestly how can you still try to bury it? I made a proposal so at least we can start to get to a solution....ACKNOWLEDGE IT.. come forward and ACKNOWLEDGE IT...its insulting if you dont...its insulting if you refer to it as a "feature" of random battles....some people act stupid cause its fun..i do it too a few times..we all do it cause its a game....now though its MOST people ACT ignorant cause they just DONT KNOW how to play their end game TX ship...and that is INSULTING THE INTELLIGENCE OF EVERYONE that tries to have fun by just playing this game in his/her TX ship.

 

I hope its crystal clear now.

 

 

15 minutes ago, Miblogdegolf said:

Veterans don't spend so much money as the new players as they have many ships. Not a surprise tha WG is focused on them as money is the only thing they care.

I get that, we all get that, we dont live in a different universe. Thats why i am asking them to ACKNOWLEDGE this situation cause they still consider it as non-existent, as a "feature" as Mr. Conway said. If they still think its a sweet little feature how can we deal with it? Its a problem, problems get acknowledge first, get analyzed and then get solved. We are not even at the 1st step cause they dont consider it a problem...sometimes i wonder if we indeed live in the same universe...

 

 

 

[HaachamaShipping]

4 minutes ago, Miblogdegolf said:

Nope, and I'm not saying I like that map. Maximum range, kiting, engage-desengage, angling, and try to survive as long as possible.

Angling on a RN cruiser against a BB is a joke. You get overmatched.

 

Basically, a smokeless CL can utilise all the things you describe plus island cover and show their skill through proper use of cover. If you go on Ocean, one major aspect falls away. That Mino had advantages like the high number of DDs that created smokes, that allowed at times to shoot without being lid up. But that's not much different from a temporary island, but that is unreliable because you don't get any say in its deployment and it also is temporary.

 

Good luck pulling such stunts regularly in current MM with post-rework CVs and the high accuracy BBs we have these days.

[Bratoev]

11 minutes ago, matia251 said:

Ehm maybe you got confused, i wasnt talking about Ocean map, i think its perfectly clear that i m refering to this thread's scope of existence, that TX gameplay is WORST THAN EVER. My whole post refers to this HUGE problem and you are again trying to sidestep it by marketing it as a feature and THIS IS THE PROBLEM...right there.

Kindly refer to the example from 4 years ago. I'm bored at work so I can pull more for your convenience. 

11 minutes ago, matia251 said:

Its not a feature to constantly have teammates that take over 50%-60% of the team at TX games who lack totally at basic knowledge of how to play with their "end of game" TX ship.

The problem is not that teammates "act a little stupid", it sounds so cute and irrelevant if you put it that way but DEFINETELY IS NOT like this. They SHOULDNT have got a TX ship with such low experience in the game, they should still be at lower tier till they are able to compete in the higher more demanding level like we ALL DID all these years.

They are not "some", they are THE MAJORITY in EACH AND EVERY GAME.

So do please share with me, the unworthy potato, what are the basics. I learned about angling, overmatch, saturation and dispersion on my way to tier T10. Also don't push without communicating with the team. What else of the basics am I missing? 

[matia251]

Can you try to have a game with a T4-T5 now that you have some experience? What you will observe is what i am observing at high tiers battles, most players dont know how to play at an efficient level but at T4-T5 you expect this cause most people just started, at higher tiers you expect the opposite but its not the opposite, its the same level of ignorance. This "anomaly" was at normal levels all these years but the last 6 months or so this has changed significantly, to the point that the feel of progress that you would have by playing with high tier ships is just missing. You think that you are playing a disoriented team game with most teammates running around without purpose or strategy resembling the random tremblings of a headless chicken...this is just disheartening

[Karasu_Browarszky]

44 minutes ago, Bunny_Lover_Kallen said:

I hope that's a joke...

 

No, Ocean is as close as you can get to a game mode which is all about team and individual tactical skill, not 'abuse' of 'interesting' map features or gimmicky mechanics. IMO this game is at its best when two formations clash in battle, and the outcome is decided on the combined effects of skill and luck.

[HaachamaShipping]

1 minute ago, Karasu_Hidesuke said:

 

No, Ocean is as close as you can get to a game mode which is all about team and individual tactical skill, not 'abuse' of 'interesting' map features or gimmicky mechanics. IMO this game is at its best when two formations clash in battle, and the outcome is decided on the combined effects of skill and luck.

The ships are not balanced around this philosophy. If you balance all ships to be as strong without using map features, then we can talk about it being sensible to have maps that have no map features and just open areas.

[Karasu_Browarszky]

2 minutes ago, Bunny_Lover_Kallen said:

The ships are not balanced around this philosophy. If you balance all ships to be as strong without using map features, then we can talk about it being sensible to have maps that have no map features and just open areas.

 

You got it!

[Bratoev]

15 minutes ago, matia251 said:

Can you try to have a game with a T4-T5 now that you have some experience? What you will observe is what i am observing at high tiers battles, most players dont know how to play at an efficient level but at T4-T5 you expect this cause most people just started, at higher tiers you expect the opposite but its not the opposite, its the same level of ignorance. This "anomaly" was at normal levels all these years but the last 6 months or so this has changed significantly, to the point that the feel of progress that you would have by playing with high tier ships is just missing. You think that you are playing a disoriented team game with most teammates running around without purpose or strategy resembling the random tremblings of a headless chicken...this is just disheartening

Having reset 3 of my 5 T10 lines I did. The difference was not really noticeable, except perhaps people pushing more recklessly then usual. 

What you must come to understand is that your skill after so many games is not comparable to someone in their first tier 10. This is a gap that will be closed after considerable time and effort which cannot be expected from everyone.  

I came to WoWS after 10k games in WoT. I knew what overmatching and angling is before the first game in the Hermelin started all that time ago. The rest was easy enough to learn. Mastering it is a different beast but I will get there with time and effort. 

 

Someone without prior experience will take more time to learn these mechanics and even more to master them. That is not accounting for player age or free time available, much less willingness. Everyone getting to T10 is inevitable and while they will be better there then they were at tier 1 they will not be unicums, some will never be otherwise we wouldn't have unicums. 

What this game does in comparison to WoT is set a much better pace for team communication via chat. I've had wonderful games where I bothered to ask the CV for help killing/spotting and got it. There were those where I stated my intention to push and got the support lined behind me to pummel the opposition. Of course there are those where I forgot to do so like one in the Conqueror today where I pushed without notice and got pummeled 3 vs 1. Still speaking to your teammates in a polite fashion is something we should all do more of and will have better games for it.

[creamgravy]

46 minutes ago, Bunny_Lover_Kallen said:

If you balance all ships to be as strong without using map features

 

Correct WOWS PvP gameplay is to island camp for 20 minutes with all classes at all tiers.

[Jimbomaxi]

1 hour ago, Miblogdegolf said:

Veterans don't spend so much money as the new players as they have many ships. Not a surprise tha WG is focused on them as money is the only thing they care. I'm not saying that, as a company, you don't have to earn it, but there are ways to do it developing a game with a little of balance, not creating abominations Smolensk/Stalin, or being so imaginative to release three "different" ships from an Amagi (Kii, Ashitaka and Asama) 

 

 

Yep, as tier X is the only one where you can win a battle, and still lose money. Good for your business, I presume. 

 

 

At least, at Ocean you need a little of skill to survive. And there, just to see the bright side, torps don't crash against the numerous bad rendered island corners, and ships don't get stranded the same way. Now let's talk about the real abomination that is EPICENTER (with that other abomination, ciclones or similar). I wonder why they make us play it when everybody hates it, but don't make pro teams play it at KOTS 

Totally agree. Ocean dont show up often, but when it  does , playing for example Hindenburg is great fun. I understand it might be not so fun playing it in ships with low manouverability. But isnt that just the way WoWs work? You never know if the ship you bring to battle is suitable for the map coming up?  And Epicenter...in my opinion it should be buried and forgot. The sooner the better.

[hellhound666]

2 hours ago, MrConway said:

 

You think veterans are pushed away by a lack of the Ocean map in the rotation!?

 

I personally would play only at tier X if I could, I think it is the most enjoyable gameplay available, sure there can be issues with some team mates being a little stupid at times, but that is just a feature of random matchmaking.

no wonder t10 is so fcked up - apparently, for smbdy it is "most enjoyable" ... people tend to enjoy different things ...

[mrandrewclark85]

It is the current Meta. It is often far easier to get a bunch of radar cruisers into hard cover, next to the caps, and let the enemy to try push.
as soon as you see a cap is being capped by the enemy, Hit Radar, and lul as half your team blaps that guy. 

repeat until its time to push.
 

[jcol]

its just my opinion.

 

Its just too easy for a new player to race to tier X, and not know the game mechanics, especially now where we can load loads more flags.

 

I run matchmaking monitor occasionally and it can be depressing to see the amount of tier X BB's that have average damage in the low 30k range and low 40% win rates.

 

[Migantium_Mashum]

4 hours ago, Molly_Delaney said:

In the free to play area the only ranked game I can recall is America's Army which made players complete a training course before going online, but it was a thinly disguised recruiting tool for the US Army.

Wow, I remember that game....

Did you manage to complete the SE training? I found that a real pain... Favourite Maps for me were Hospital or Bridge....

[PaP_Mentoles]

When you will finally realize that WG doesn't care about their player base?

They only care to milk money from newcomers, [edited]their spreadsheets show.