General CV related discussions.

[Camperdown]

Dutch subs with airstrikes! 

[El2aZeR]

1 hour ago, Panocek said:

WG already tampered with guided missiles in the past, nothing stops them unshelving the idea and combining with existing gimmicks.

 

For all intents and purposes CVs are essentially guided missile cruisers anyway.

And given how similar the two concepts are I wouldn't be surprised at all if the CV rework evolved out of WG's missile iteration.

[Panocek]

5 minutes ago, El2aZeR said:

 

For all intents and purposes CVs are essentially guided missile cruisers anyway.

And given how similar the two concepts are I wouldn't be surprised at all if the CV rework evolved out of WG's missile iteration.

I don't know whether tested guided missiles were guided WSAD style, like current planes or "missile follows crosshair", like various ATGMs back in Battlefield games. Given former is already occupied by carriers, I guess comeback to missiles would be of latter kind.

[Prophecy82]

On 8/2/2021 at 6:26 PM, mcboernester said:

A little follow up here since its not NDA -> i asked if there any plans to buff the carriers again in response to the decreasing player numbers

 

Nice copy-paste-zero-content-answer from the dev. 

Not that I expected anything else.... 

[El2aZeR]

1 hour ago, Panocek said:

I don't know whether tested guided missiles were guided WSAD style, like current planes or "missile follows crosshair", like various ATGMs back in Battlefield games. Given former is already occupied by carriers, I guess comeback to missiles would be of latter kind.

 

If I remember the interview where they talked about missiles correctly it was manual WASD steering. "Super fun but too effective against certain ship types."

[Panocek]

1 minute ago, El2aZeR said:

 

If I remember the interview where they talked about missiles correctly it was manual WASD steering. "Super fun but too effective against certain ship types."

Its not like it has changed much from proof of concept till today

[Nibenay78]

13 hours ago, Pikkozoikum said:

What is the context about ballistic missiles? No idea what you want say here^^

I am trying to point out to you that even if a certain element is part of naval warfare exists, doesn't mean that it'll be a great addition to a game.

 

Like I and others have pointed out, carriers are effectively ships with weapons that are guided 99% of the distance to the target. It's not a huge leap to include anti ship missiles, and lets take it one step further, ballistic nukes. After all either can be mounted on warships, yet there is no reason to believe they will be fun & engaging™ if included into WoWs.

 

Also CVs "enjoys" several automatic features. Automatic launch of COP, Automatic DCP and even automated enemy fire (AA). in most of my gaming experience, most automation on such a trivial level does NOT add to the game in any way.

 

So back to ballistic missiles - I can design you a ballistic missile sub where all one has to do is click LMB and kill a player on the other side of the map. It can even be "balanced" by average damage, kills, deaths etc. None of these elements will make it a good addition to the game in my opinion. On the other hand, i'm sure of the tens of thousand of players that has played WoWs, probably some statistical anomalies would enjoy this gameplay....

 

Quote

Yes, that is the point of that ^^

Yes and it does not say why. Maybe it's because they are weak. Or maybe because they are boring, or just that people who play wows generally prefer gunboats... who knows...

[Miscommunication_dept]

WG need to try and make sure that ships are fun to play AGAINST.

So what ships are fun to play against?

 

Thunderer firing HE...... NO!!!

Thunderer firing AP.......YES!!!

CVs......No unless in Halland or Austin.

Smolensk...NO

Minotaur....YES (It can spam from smoke but it eats citadels and can be angled against)

 

 

Why? Its all about having options to mitigate the damage.  

 

If you are a legendary GK with 19km range and  Thunderer is HE spamming you from 21km away. There is nothing you can do. Flinging HE or AP at that range does nothing. If instead of a Thunderer , it's a Yamato, you can angle and either charge or disengage.

 

It frustrates me that WG spend so much time trying to make new ships fun without looking at it from other angles.

 

[Nibenay78]

1 hour ago, gopher31 said:

WG need to try and make sure that ships are fun to play AGAINST.

So what ships are fun to play against?

From our long thread, this isnt the top priority for several CV players.

1 hour ago, gopher31 said:

CVs......No unless in Halland or Austin.

Which quickly becomes NO when either is near enemy ships anyway :D so its a conditional YES

 

[Yosha_AtaIante]

1 hour ago, gopher31 said:

CVs......No unless in Halland or Austin.

Hold my beer... 

[Prophecy82]

1 hour ago, gopher31 said:

Thunderer firing AP.......YES!!!

 

Why? Its all about having options to mitigate the damage.  

 

Ask some CA/CL-Boys how their options are to mitigate 450s shells with cruiser dispersion... they really like their chances! 

[Lordcrafty]

2 hours ago, gopher31 said:

CVs......No unless in Halland or Austin.

someone get me a [edited]midway, now!

[Pikkozoikum]

2 hours ago, gopher31 said:

CVs......No unless in Halland or Austin.

Actually I have fun with all my ships against CVs, especially with Yoshino and AA build :D

[Lordcrafty]

2 minutes ago, Pikkozoikum said:

Actually I have fun with all my ships against CVs, especially with Yoshino and AA build :D

I doubt you'd be saying that without lying after getting focused by FDR in a zao.

edit: well it's not as bad now that the rockets are nerfed.

[Pikkozoikum]

1 minute ago, Lordcrafty said:

I doubt you'd be saying that without lying after getting focused by FDR in a T10 IJN cruiser.

You can have doubts like you want. I have fun. Actually I can't remember, that FDR is an issue for a cruiser like Yoshino (damage wise). Yoshino as a lot flak explosions, FDRs take a lot damage. Mostly they avoide ships like that. Once I "two-shotted" a FDR squadron, that was fun :3

 

[Pikkozoikum]

3 hours ago, Nibenay78 said:

I am trying to point out to you that even if a certain element is part of naval warfare exists, doesn't mean that it'll be a great addition to a game.

 

Like I and others have pointed out, carriers are effectively ships with weapons that are guided 99% of the distance to the target. It's not a huge leap to include anti ship missiles, and lets take it one step further, ballistic nukes. After all either can be mounted on warships, yet there is no reason to believe they will be fun & engaging™ if included into WoWs.

 

Also CVs "enjoys" several automatic features. Automatic launch of COP, Automatic DCP and even automated enemy fire (AA). in most of my gaming experience, most automation on such a trivial level does NOT add to the game in any way.

 

So back to ballistic missiles - I can design you a ballistic missile sub where all one has to do is click LMB and kill a player on the other side of the map. It can even be "balanced" by average damage, kills, deaths etc. None of these elements will make it a good addition to the game in my opinion. On the other hand, i'm sure of the tens of thousand of players that has played WoWs, probably some statistical anomalies would enjoy this gameplay....

 

Yes and it does not say why. Maybe it's because they are weak. Or maybe because they are boring, or just that people who play wows generally prefer gunboats... who knows...

I don't get the context. I was talking about the misinterpretation of "WGs balances around popularity"

[Yosha_AtaIante]

52 minutes ago, Lordcrafty said:

I doubt you'd be saying that without lying after getting focused by FDR in a zao.

edit: well it's not as bad now that the rockets are nerfed.

Actually you can try on my full AA Zao and you will probably regret trying. If no one can punish a Zao then dodging an FDR is really easy. 

[Panocek]

2 minutes ago, Yosha_nai said:

Actually you can try on my full AA Zao and you will probably regret trying. If no one can punish a Zao then dodging an FDR is really easy. 

And this might be key ingredient to "CVs OP reee" - red team always knows to focus fire targets of opportunity

[Yosha_AtaIante]

20 minutes ago, Panocek said:

And this might be key ingredient to "CVs OP reee" - red team always knows to focus fire targets of opportunity

If only green team knew q_q

[Lootboxer]

9 hours ago, Panocek said:

So, for all intents and purposes said missile would be damage equivalent of airborne European torpedo

And WG would never ever add one more 0 to damage and/or speed by "mistake' or balancing^TM reasons.

[Panocek]

11 minutes ago, Yosha_nai said:

If only green team knew q_q

That is universal problem, be it at land, air or sea though you can somewhat alleviate it by adding more people you can screech at via voip to the battle. With emphasis on "somewhat", with hint of "sometimes it might work".

 

Just now, DariusJacek said:

And WG would never ever add one more 0 to damage and/or speed by "mistake' or balancing^TM reasons.

When spreadshiet demands it, they will add all the zeros 

[Nibenay78]

3 hours ago, Pikkozoikum said:

I don't get the context. I was talking about the misinterpretation of "WGs balances around popularity"

Context: WG shoves some entity (CVs) into the game then "balances" it by various parameters in which popularity may or may not be relevant. 

Doesnt mean its a good addition regardless of their efforts.

 

Anyways, do you really believe popularity is not relevant? Sure maybe its not the whole equation, but you can be sure WG would make changes if CVs fall below a certain treshold thing will happen. And that means not a new rework with hopefully better gameplay, but simply making CVs more "comfortable" to play. 

(In case this is unclear in any way for you, "comfortable" here means easier to play or stronger)

[Deckeru_Maiku]

11 hours ago, Camperdown said:

Dutch subs with airstrikes! 

And then dutch CVs that launch airborne submarines that launch airstrikes...

[Camperdown]

Just now, Deckeru_Maiku said:

And then dutch CVs that launch airborne submarines that launch airstrikes...

WG always seeks to enhance our gaming experience 

[Deckeru_Maiku]

5 hours ago, Pikkozoikum said:

Actually I have fun with all my ships against CVs

Of course having a masochistic mindset helps a lot with this, I guess...