General CV related discussions.

[BLUB__BLUB]

I'd call "campers" those that sit at their max range, depending on others to get targets, shooting HE. 
Usually those are the easy kills for a CV, unless there is a whole bunch of them.

Then I just throw in some torps from a bit of distance... 

[Nibenay78]

31 minutes ago, Pukovnik7 said:

island camping is mainly a provinence of cruisers, as unlike battleships they do not block their own lines of fire by doing so - a cruiser has much more pronounced firing arcs and so she can afford to simply shoot over the island.

I'd say it depends, camping so you can extend firepower over the cap as BB plus draw fire helps a lot. Especially in Missouri for some reason...

 

Quote

 

But what you described is not what I would call camping, simply because we don't know what he was doing rest of the game. If he had a good firing position with cover, of course he will use it...

Iirc he was stuck all game being banged by half the enemy team. I'd call it camping (although not negatively ment) and I'm sure many would also (but with a negative connotation) :D

 

However it seems to me that mr @Beastofwar considers these good tactical choices to be destructive for the game. Apparently CVS are great to dislodge such players. The fact that being dynamic drives you back away from the cap areas gives a more boring and long-distance game. Yay for CVs.

[Pukovnik7]

39 minutes ago, Nibenay78 said:

 I'd say it depends, camping so you can extend firepower over the cap as BB plus draw fire helps a lot. Especially in Missouri for some reason...

 

Iirc he was stuck all game being banged by half the enemy team. I'd call it camping (although not negatively ment) and I'm sure many would also (but with a negative connotation) :D

 

However it seems to me that mr @Beastofwar considers these good tactical choices to be destructive for the game. Apparently CVS are great to dislodge such players. The fact that being dynamic drives you back away from the cap areas gives a more boring and long-distance game. Yay for CVs.

For my own internal use, I separate "camping" and "tanking". If you are sitting at an island, receiving fire from good portion of the enemy team, while using island(s) to limit enemy's engagement options to, for you, favourable angles, then you are tanking. Camping is when you are avoiding enemy fire by using superior engagement range and, generally, refusing to be a threat through proximity (of course, it is possible to use islands for camping as well... but as I wrote, it comes down to being a threat through proximity).

 

So if I understood you right, what he was doing was basically tanking for the team. Which is what battleships are supposed to do in the first place... myself, I measure my battleship games by the potential damage received. If it is above a million, then it was a good game. If it was anywhere below a million, then it means that I have played it waay too passively.

[Nibenay78]

2 minutes ago, Pukovnik7 said:

For my own internal use, I separate "camping" and "tanking". If you are sitting at an island, receiving fire from good portion of the enemy team, while using island(s) to limit enemy's engagement options to, for you, favourable angles, then you are tanking. Camping is when you are avoiding enemy fire by using superior engagement range and, generally, refusing to be a threat through proximity (of course, it is possible to use islands for camping as well... but as I wrote, it comes down to being a threat through proximity).

 

So if I understood you right, what he was doing was basically tanking for the team. Which is what battleships are supposed to do in the first place... myself, I measure my battleship games by the potential damage received. If it is above a million, then it was a good game. If it was anywhere below a million, then it means that I have played it waay too passively.

He was essentially next to the cap, all game, against superiour force. Me and the newbie guy died (him first trying to counter push, and me just because I was an easier target than mr good player)

I believe he was playing DM.

 

Again we see how definitions on camping differs...

[voidwyrm]

4 hours ago, BLUB__BLUB said:

Usually those are the easy kills for a CV, unless there is a whole bunch of them.

That may be very true indeed, but why would a carrier go for them (first), when spotting/killing DDs wins the game by points?

 

As a very serious sidenote:

Of course the person who designed the the FDR should be fired asap. There is no excuse for such incompetence in game-design. PPL like him WILL continue to make WG lose money.

[Edi4Play]

i agree with you 

On 6/24/2021 at 10:27 AM, qtback said:

hello, i want to add post about cv, ppl often complain me that i have to spot dd  and  do my job,

 

after big negative company versus cv like bancv, killcv, rapecv and e.t.c

 

nowdays i as  cv need 3-4 + run to kill dd, so only way is to spot for those guys who did everything to nerf cv and make my game not fun,

 

also it means that i cant get statistics and game is also not fun any more,

 

spent 38m credits for spotting for community who killed cv is not ok for me,

 

now guys move and kill dd yourself, or ask wg to add spotter to your ship, because spending 38m  for spotting is not ok for me, it  gives me neither statistics, nor fun, though i want to enjoy game aswell, so i will play for my fun, farm damage and decide whom to attack and when.

 

cv-s join my protest  and lets tell dev-s this way that killing cv because of clan ban/killcv wanted to play 3-4x  french dd-s is not normal.

I totally agree with you, it is not our job to go search for dds and only spot them, I will go for ships who I think are the biggest threat and also the loneliest so I can kill them easier... 

 

However I also don't mind putting some fighters over dds if I see one while passing over them. That keeps them spotted for allied ships, and also lets me enjoy farming other ships.

[BLUB__BLUB]

7 hours ago, voidwyrm said:

That may be very true indeed, but why would a carrier go for them (first), when spotting/killing DDs wins the game by points?

Because spotting DDs doesn't deliver any points at all, and killing them has been nerfed to the max. 

Also, you'd never go for them first. You farm the lonely ones first, preferably cruisers that threathen your DD or caps. 

After that you smack the (lone) BBs that farm your cruisers. And THEN you dislodge bunches of island-huggers. 

Sometimes it is kinda same, like your best target is that Stalingrad that is sitting nicely hidden next to an island, radaring and farming your DDs/cruisers.

 

7 hours ago, voidwyrm said:

As a very serious sidenote:

Of course the person who designed the the FDR should be fired asap. There is no excuse for such incompetence in game-design. PPL like him WILL continue to make WG lose money.

FDR is kinda crap. Yes it is really easy to annoy the %%@^# out of one player or keep stuff spotted. 

But to influence the outcome, it is absolutely crap. I'd take MvR or Haku anyday. 

 

FDR is good for damage farming though. Man the games I had today, they deserve FDR. 

Any more such games tomorrow and I'll be playing FDR rest of the weekend. That is what it is good for.

[Sunleader]

4 hours ago, BLUB__BLUB said:

Because spotting DDs doesn't deliver any points at all, and killing them has been nerfed to the max. 

Also, you'd never go for them first. You farm the lonely ones first, preferably cruisers that threathen your DD or caps. 

After that you smack the (lone) BBs that farm your cruisers. And THEN you dislodge bunches of island-huggers. 

Sometimes it is kinda same, like your best target is that Stalingrad that is sitting nicely hidden next to an island, radaring and farming your DDs/cruisers.

 

FDR is kinda crap. Yes it is really easy to annoy the %%@^# out of one player or keep stuff spotted. 

But to influence the outcome, it is absolutely crap. I'd take MvR or Haku anyday. 

 

FDR is good for damage farming though. Man the games I had today, they deserve FDR. 

Any more such games tomorrow and I'll be playing FDR rest of the weekend. That is what it is good for.

 

Any CV with HE DBs still works fine for DDs.

Roclets still work to some Degree. Just now its actually possible to Dodge them sometimes.

[Bindolaf_Werebane]

As @BLUB__BLUB posted, FDR is great for weekends. Game starts, two DDs are dead at 19:37, the "team" is all headed east and the GK is reversing from spawn to go snipe on the border. Any other ship I'd be rage quitting. FDR? No problem. I mean, we'll lose and lose bad, but I'll do my 180k damage, make my credits and laugh at fatties trying to dodge©

[Vbeest]

3 hours ago, Sunleader said:

Just now its actually possible to Dodge them sometimes.

 

Sometimes? If you 'sometimes' can dodge rockets, then maybe reconsider your ability to play DDs?

[Sunleader]

59 minutes ago, Vbeest said:

 

Sometimes? If you 'sometimes' can dodge rockets, then maybe reconsider your ability to play DDs?

 

Its been Said several Times.

5 Seconds is the Delay a Cruiser has when Firing at a DD 10km away. Most CVs have 3.5 to 4 Seconds Delay and actually Cover a Larger Area with their Attack.

If you cannot Predict Evasive Maneuvers then thats an L2P Issue on your Side.

 

Welcome to the World of all other Ships in the Game. Where you cannot Guarantee a Hit and instead have to Predict the Evasion giving you 50/50 chance wether or not the other Ship actually Evades into that Direction or not ;)

 

 

[BLUB__BLUB]

4 hours ago, Sunleader said:

Any CV with HE DBs still works fine for DDs.

Roclets still work to some Degree. Just now its actually possible to Dodge them sometimes.

Does. Thing is, do you want to. Especially in the weekend, because:

1. If they are good, they'll dodge... and you spend a huge amount of time to kill them. 

2. If they re bad, they die when first smoke gets produced in the cap. 

 

TBH yes I can get those DDs, and/or at least "discourage" them to go somewhere, but why would I...

Because THIS: 

 

 

[BLUB__BLUB]

2 minutes ago, Sunleader said:

giving you 50/50 chance wether or not the other Ship actually Evades into that Direction or not ;)

Weekends: 75% he just carries on same speed & direction... 

[Vbeest]

9 minutes ago, Sunleader said:

 

Its been Said several Times.

5 Seconds is the Delay a Cruiser has when Firing at a DD 10km away. Most CVs have 3.5 to 4 Seconds Delay and actually Cover a Larger Area with their Attack.

If you cannot Predict Evasive Maneuvers then thats an L2P Issue on your Side.

 

Welcome to the World of all other Ships in the Game. Where you cannot Guarantee a Hit and instead have to Predict the Evasion giving you 50/50 chance wether or not the other Ship actually Evades into that Direction or not ;)

 

 

 

Yes, and of course a CV can attack again the same DD in a sub 10 seconds time, repeatedly, lol. Excellent comparison.

 

Further, from 10 km the trajectory is flat, so the evasion matters less than against rocket plane attack.

 

I don't blame you if you are happy with the nerf, just don't spread blatant lies. It is a significant hit to CV's ability to counter DDs in the majority of combat situations.

[Sunleader]

1 hour ago, Vbeest said:

 

Yes, and of course a CV can attack again the same DD in a sub 10 seconds time, repeatedly, lol. Excellent comparison.

 

Further, from 10 km the trajectory is flat, so the evasion matters less than against rocket plane attack.

 

I don't blame you if you are happy with the nerf, just don't spread blatant lies. It is a significant hit to CV's ability to counter DDs in the majority of combat situations.

 

I am Happy about this Nerf indeed lol.

Its Nice that Finally the Game is a bit more Balanced ^^

 

As for your Claims.

 

1.

You have Flat Trajectory which helps a little bit assuming the DD Shows you Broadside. Oh Wait....

Right. If he is a Potato that Shows Broadside the CV will Slap him for 4-5k easily as well.

 

2.

Now for a more Realistic Course of Action on a Competent DD Player evading.

It is actually the same as against a CV. You show Longside and when you see the Enemy Firing you Change the Lane so that you are not crossing the Path which the Shells/Rockets will be Aimed at.

And while its True that the Cruiser will usually have something between 5-15 Seconds to get another Try while a CV Generally needs about 20 Seconds.

The CV also Covers a way Larger Area with his Attack because he uses alot more Projectiles. Not only having a Higher Alpha with that Salvo but also being Harder to Evade as the DD needs to Avoid a Larger Area when Changing Course.

 

3.

So Yeah.

Mate. Not to Offend You.

But maybe take a Look here.

https://wows-numbers.com/player/500033399,Sunleader/

 

And I dont mean looking at me having Good Stats or anything like that.

I mean taking a Look at which Class I am Performing Best at.

 

So Maybe dont make a Clown out of Yourself by trying to Claim that I am some DD Player which just wants CVs Nerfed to have it Easier.

Because I am seriously alot. But not a DD Player lol

 

 

 

TLDR.

Just Dodge is actually Finally a Statement thats actually having a Meaning.

Because for the First Time in 3 Years.

A DD ACTUALLY CAN DODGE CV Attacks to some Degree.

 

I know its always Harsh when your Overpowered Toy gets Nerfed.

But maybe Start Adapting yourself rather than always just Demanding others do so.

 

 

 

 

 

[Vbeest]

 

15 minutes ago, Sunleader said:

And I dont mean looking at me having Good Stats or anything like that.

I mean taking a Look at which Class I am Performing Best at.

 

 

Well, it shows that your actually worst performing class is DD, which I assumed from your previous post.

It would explain why you had issues with dodging CVs.

[Sunleader]

Just now, Vbeest said:

 

 

Well, it shows that your actually worst performing class is DD, which I assumed from your previous post.

 

Well Yes lol.

Because I dont really Play DDs xD

My 2 most Played Ships are Kaga and GZ. Which is CVs.

 

But well. I guess I should not have Expected someone to See the Obvious meaning behind an Statement when he cant even give a DD 4 Seconds Lead when Aiming...

Sorry for Expecting too much of you.

My Fault. Wont happen again.

 

[Vbeest]

Just now, Sunleader said:

 

Well Yes lol.

Because I dont really Play DDs xD

My 2 most Played Ships are Kaga and GZ. Which is CVs.

 

But well. I guess I should not have Expected someone to See the Obvious meaning behind an Statement when he cant even give a DD 4 Seconds Lead when Aiming...

Sorry for Expecting too much of you.

My Fault. Wont happen again.

 

 

Before you go with personal insults, can you explain wHy you Type So FuNNy?

[Nibenay78]

1 hour ago, Vbeest said:

 

Before you go with personal insults, can you explain wHy you Type So FuNNy?

Because he chose to make it as unreadable as possible. A pity since he has a few good points.

[Lootboxer]

10 hours ago, BLUB__BLUB said:

Weekends: 75% he just carries on same speed & direction... 

Just dodge at the master level: evade by not eveding 

[geschlittert]

On 6/24/2021 at 2:29 PM, Nibenay78 said:

Randomly tagging @Beastofwar

can you just not? dont want that guy here

[Nibenay78]

6 minutes ago, geschlittert said:

can you just not? dont want that guy here

Dont worry, he doesnt show up when one makes a point that doesnt fit his weird perspective on the game.

[CptBarney]

Seems the tiny ivans are quite strong on the nashy.

[Montrala]

I found this amusing somehow :)

 

[Tankduck]

Remove the class or start reworking it. Current status is just frustrating