General CV related discussions.

[Ze_Reckless]

39 minutes ago, DFens_666 said:

 

Yeah, i dont understand why they dont even want to try this... Or basicly any form of minimap only spotting. THey once said "people wouldnt understand that".

It was a good argument for them to scrap minimap only spotting for CVs. And this season they introduced cyclones: minimap only spotting for everyone outside of 14 km, I never shot so many minimap targets in all other seasons combined. I'm pretty sure the people who 'wouldn't understand that' are the same people who believe these BS excuses.

[BLUB__BLUB]

23 minutes ago, Absolute_Potato said:

Yeah, in CB once the game got going I focused the defending side of the enemy (mostly 2 ships) and support the pushing side on request. But when in a Petro, I got almost destroyed because of a mistake I made. A moving ship is a lot more difficult to citadel with a MVR, you can mitigate a lot of damage by wiggling. But in Randoms especially in early game when all ships are still in the game, getting focused down by a CV is annoying. But even while playing DD (RN DD) you can annoy the crap out of a CV player. But you have to play differently.

It got as far as me drawing the Cv intentionally. I play CV quite often... so I know what they do.

So, I wander off from the main bunch, and I shoot... MVR detects me and flies in. I turn out... he gets meagre damage. 

 

Also what we did is, one shoots, we all stick together. CVs leaves with NO plane left. 

 

In fact the only ones that managed to #$^@# me was one CB-team of FORUMITES here. 

The Cv kept me detected and his teammates focus-finished me off. Dammit. I was first to sink. 

However it took them too long and they ended up broadside to my teammates (we had 2 BBs...) and they lost... 

 

 

BTW it is not s due to that they are no good, as they in fact are: 

 

[BLUB__BLUB]

16 minutes ago, Ze_Reckless said:

It was a good argument for them to scrap minimap only spotting for CVs. And this season they introduced cyclones: minimap only spotting for everyone outside of 14 km, I never shot so many minimap targets in all other seasons combined. I'm pretty sure the people who 'wouldn't understand that' are the same people who believe these BS excuses.

It was better for the CV too. Finally that ships didn't get "kill secured" 2 secs before my last bomb hits it. 

I don't mind in CB, but in randoms very often I get >>. 100k damage and no kills at all. Just spilled bombs/torps.

Especially in Ark Royal, as it keeps targets spotted for veeeeerrryyyy looooongggg time (the planes are slow as sh...). 

 

I'd say, how about "fair is fair"? NO "live spotting" for more range than they can spot my planes.

So if they detect my planes at 9km, THAT is how far they are visible on the screen. 

[HARBINGER_OF_SKULLS]

https://blog.worldofwarships.com/blog/102

 

So, will this be the first TX CV for money? Why only skip bombs, not Fritz X?

[Nov_A]

25 minutes ago, HARBINGER_OF_SKULLS said:

https://blog.worldofwarships.com/blog/102

 

So, will this be the first TX CV for money? Why only skip bombs, not Fritz X?

Check on the Werner Voss, Immelmann is literally the same ship and both were added for supertesting of skip bombs.

 

Voss was added on the 7th of October.

[HARBINGER_OF_SKULLS]

Just now, Nov_A said:

Check on the Werner Voss, Immelmann is literally the same ship and both were added for supertesting of skip bombs.

 

Voss was added on the 7th of October.

Well, so we can expect the German CV "Boelcke", "Hartmann" and "Rudel" soon? 

[Deckeru_Maiku]

8 hours ago, Absolute_Potato said:

With MM the CV takes a place of a BB, so they should be able to attack and give a punch.

I don't really believe that... I've seen tons of battles with one CV and five BBs. And usually (!) five BB is the maximum number for BBs except for weird times (middle of the night for example).

So for me CVs take the place of a cruiser, making them not the "hard hitter" but a "support" class.

 

Of course I can understand that CV players would love to have an excuse for doing the amount of damage they can deal (unless they are potatoes like me...) and attribute it to being an "ersatz BB".

But they aren't.

[arquata2019_]

9 ore fa, Absolute_Potato ha scritto:

A lot of players are talking about nerfing the CV... But unfortunately it is not that easy....

Because if it was that simple, WG already would have implemented this long ago.

 

If you look at average damage and kills of the CV's, CV's perform at the level of the better cruisers and at the bottom level of BB's.

CV's excel on spotting damage, although they do not outperform DD's on average (yes, CV's are in the top 10).

 

With MM the CV takes a place of a BB, so they should be able to attack and give a punch.

But if a player thinks that he can play a static game with a CV in the game is almost the same as sailing broadside with a Zao to the whole enemy team within detection range..... (we can predict the outcome of that action).

 

The DPM of a CV is not that great, if the position of the CV is not optimal it might take a while before he can return and attack again. A CV can still be deplaned (varies per CV).

 

So, what kind of nerfs are we talking about?

1. Remove the spotting or restrict it to the minimap (but CV's get outperformed by DD's on spotting damage)?
2. Have DD's spotting range from the air cut in half (so that everyone get's torped to smithereens and have every BB player crying that DD's should be spotted)?
3. Change the aiming rectacle so that DD's almost don't receive damage from rocket attacks? (that is already done).

If you change the game mechanics to much on one class, you also have to change the other balance too..

• DD's complain about CV and Radar
• CL / CA complain about to much BB's with over-match in a game.
• BB complain about DD's, HE Spam and CV's

If you look at the numbers (yes they are average, but that's is universal and applies also on all other classes), does anyone have a good idea how to balance CV in respect to other classes?

 

I use Maplesyrup for analysis.

first with 2069 base exp... cv outperforms dds??

[arquata2019_]

9 ore fa, LoveZeppelin ha scritto:

 

But CVs cannot be nerfed to have the equivalent battle influence of a single dd, (unless aircraft speed were reduced to dd levels of max 50 knots, which I'm sure would seem ridiculous to many), or unless CV players were only able to controlm a single squadron for the duration of a battle (no replacement planes, no regeneration), which would of course make the concept of CVs, redundant.

@El2aZeR will still have fun and sink everyone

[BLUB__BLUB]

4 hours ago, HARBINGER_OF_SKULLS said:

https://blog.worldofwarships.com/blog/102

 

So, will this be the first TX CV for money? Why only skip bombs, not Fritz X?

I'd not be surprised. Both Manfred and Roosevelt are pretty bad ideas. 

Still a must-have, because they'll put them in CB and I'm not gonna let my team down. 

But it is why I prefer T5/6/7, 8. The most fun nowadays is amongst the potaters, potatering around. 

Forget T10 randoms, it is the same but just with more blap. 

[Captain_Lootbox]

Why is it people say CV is OP when CVs rarely finish top in their team.  If they were OP then should they not finish top more than they dont?

[Sunleader]

23 minutes ago, Dashwood_Fowler_Moir said:

Why is it people say CV is OP when CVs rarely finish top in their team.  If they were OP then should they not finish top more than they dont?

 

Because being OP depends on Influence and Power in the Match.

Not on your Exp Gain.

 

Back in the Day CVs actually Finished Top of the Team constantly.

Which isnt Surprising as they do Damage and Kills like BBs while doing Spotting like DDs and Support like Cruisers.

 

Hence.

WG nerfed their Base Exp Values.

Meaning a CV has to actually get better Results than other Ships to receive the same Exp.

[Mad_Dog_Dante]

33 minutes ago, Dashwood_Fowler_Moir said:

Why is it people say CV is OP when CVs rarely finish top in their team.  If they were OP then should they not finish top more than they dont?

Because they vent their frustration with the wrong words.

[Kathapalt]

6 hours ago, Dashwood_Fowler_Moir said:

Why is it people say CV is OP when CVs rarely finish top in their team.  If they were OP then should they not finish top more than they dont?

Bacally because of this 

 

 

WG Breaks the game to benefit only one class of ships that plays their own game in the clouds.

Ofcourse MFR is on other level in the CV power ladder, but others are basically a bit less of the same.

[Lootboxer]

10 hours ago, Dashwood_Fowler_Moir said:

Why is it people say CV is OP when CVs rarely finish top in their team.  If they were OP then should they not finish top more than they dont?

Because base XP erned has been nerfed globally for all CVs to make them look a bit balanced and to limit the number of pissed surface players. I remember games where both CVs had nearly 1k more XP then next ships in both teams respectively. 

[Flashp0int]

Could Wargaming try to have a "No-CV Standard Battle" mode for like a month? Just to check if it is more or less popular than the one with CVs 

More seriously, a game mode with more bad weather and no planes (not suited for blizzards and storms) would be nice.
 

 

[BLUB__BLUB]

10 hours ago, Dashwood_Fowler_Moir said:

Why is it people say CV is OP when CVs rarely finish top in their team.  If they were OP then should they not finish top more than they dont?

IMO a CV is not OP, but actually more BROKEN AF. 

I don't generally do more damage than with a BB, but I can do it to anyone and at any time. 

[LemonadeWarriorITA]

I took 20k+ damage from a CV today in 1 drop in my Montana.
 

There is not a single surface ship or player that can do that much damage to my Montana, unless I let them do.
CVs are PvE so remove them from Randoms. It is not our fault that you cannot make a normal rework with all the feedback we provided, so don’t make us play with this garbage...

[arquata2019_]

@Excavatus why did you had to rework cvs? be honest :v

they're broken af in so many ways, should i write my second part of the Master Piece of balansing?

[BLUB__BLUB]

2 hours ago, LemonadeWarriorITA said:

I took 20k+ damage from a CV today in 1 drop in my Montana.

Well, I'm just a savvy one but that's not something I manage to do often in a CV. 

However I do it on a weekly base in a BB. I play both about just as much. 

maybe I should send more sheep to RNGesus. Or did you forget to send some?

 

Quote

There is not a single surface ship or player that can do that much damage to my Montana, unless I let them do.

You mean, unless he manages to do it to your broadside when you aren;t looking or have no way to prevent it. 

But it is not something you "allow" them to do. Also, it must mean you allow the CV player to do it. 

Else I'd be able to do it every game. But I'm not, while last CB I deleted a Yamato - in my Conqueror. 

That's a bit more than 20K, did he allow it? Or did he sniff too much glue?

 

Quote

CVs are PvE so remove them from Randoms. It is not our fault that you cannot make a normal rework with all the feedback we provided, so don’t make us play with this garbage...

I agree they FF-ed it up, but there is no use making up stories. 

Between that feedback there's also a LOT of hateful BS. 

 

I regularly manage 20k salvos in Thunderer though. Do they all allow it? 

[Ashardalon_Dragnipur]

no when a surface ship catches you broadside he either outplayed you or his team forced you in that position

when a CV citadels you from any angle he figured out how to hit the lmb 

 

pretty big difference 

[LemonadeWarriorITA]

7 hours ago, BLUB__BLUB said:

Well, I'm just a savvy one but that's not something I manage to do often in a CV. 

However I do it on a weekly base in a BB. I play both about just as much. 

maybe I should send more sheep to RNGesus. Or did you forget to send some?

 

You mean, unless he manages to do it to your broadside when you aren;t looking or have no way to prevent it. 

But it is not something you "allow" them to do. Also, it must mean you allow the CV player to do it. 

Else I'd be able to do it every game. But I'm not, while last CB I deleted a Yamato - in my Conqueror. 

That's a bit more than 20K, did he allow it? Or did he sniff too much glue?

 

I agree they FF-ed it up, but there is no use making up stories. 

Between that feedback there's also a LOT of hateful BS. 

 

I regularly manage 20k salvos in Thunderer though. Do they all allow it? 

The only way you will be able to deal that much damage to my Montana is by using HE. Using AP will give you less damage, since you can only penetrate my superstructure, which doesn't even hold 20k HP.

Assuming you hit all 8 High Explosive shells on my non saturated ship you can do 21,9k damage to my Montana, of this 21,9k damage I can repair 50% or 11k hp.  Since we are exact; this carrier removed 26,4k from my HP, of which I can repair 10% or 2,64k HP.

 

To sum this up:

• This carrier effectively removed 24,7% HP of my Montana, which is unrepairable, with 1 drop.
• You can effectively remove 11,4% HP of my Montana, which is unrepairable, with 1 salvo.

You hitting all 8 shells on me is possible due to the good dispersion of Thunderer, but still you will need good RNG and you will need to predict my movement correctly. I will try to dodge, because I will know when you shoot at me. So when you do all of this right you will be able to do 20k damage to my Montana. Very unlikely, but still possible. Even if you do so I can repair 50% of it and reposition.

 

I am sure you do 20k damage per salvo against other players often. I do it myself as well. Do they sniff glue? I don't know. Can you do the same amount of damage to me? No, you cannot. I am a good Montana player and I know exactly where you are on the map and what you do. There is no way in hell I will trade 20k hp for nothing, or in my previous words unless I want to. Is it a made up story? No, it is the way this game is designed. I use my armour layout, concealment, islands and etcetera to pull a victory across the finish line, so when I lose 24,7% of my HP by a badly designed mini game it is annoying. And hell, even WG admits their rework is garbage. Otherwise it wouldn't need all those buffs.

[Capra76]

1 hour ago, LemonadeWarriorITA said:

You hitting all 8 shells on me is possible due to the good dispersion of Thunderer, but still you will need good RNG and you will need to predict my movement correctly.

 

And all of this ignores the idiocy of battleships spamming HE in the first place.

[Nov_A]

1 hour ago, LemonadeWarriorITA said:

[..] but still you will need good RNG and you will need to predict my movement correctly.

So, like a Manfred?

[LemonadeWarriorITA]

35 minutes ago, Nov_A said:

So, like a Manfred?

Can you be more precise of what part you do not understand. I will make it easier for you ;)