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_Dunc_

WG: Hows the bot detection going?

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Kiev this evening, shooting islands, torping empty water, and generally hampering the team's effort to not lose quite so quickly.

 

I've circled the telling bits (as if 12k average damage in a Domskoi wasn't a big enough clue. 

 

It's this, more than anything else, which makes me frustration-quit the game. I can mostly tolerate all the engineered-in challenges, but what chance do you have when the enemy team effectively get one free DD (or any other boat this guy decides to bot with?)

bot1.jpg

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Well, if you look at MY stats, you'll see weeks in which I'm a unicum and weeks in which I'm a potato squared.

WR is not really telling you anything. Sometimes you do lots of damage, sink a lot of ships, cap all 3 flags and still end up losing. Sometimes you run into torps and are blapped in the first 3 minutes of the game and still win.

What you are talking about is probably simply someone who's unable to understand the basics of the game.

He somehow got to Tier 9 (it only takes time, eventually everyone is going to get there, even I) but is still unable to understand the basic mechanics. Or he does not care.

Or it might be that he's been AFK'd by WG servers, so his ships keeps on doing what it was doing before he got kicked out of the game.

Recently this thing happens quite often.

Amazingly enough, WG Player Support is unable to solve the issue, first blaming your computer, then asking you to check the connection with Pingplotter, then blaming your ISP.

Just tonight I was chatting with my clan mates before a clan battle and 4 out of 7 got kicked out of the game.

We were chatting on Discord, so the internet connections were fine.

It's obviously a WG server problem, but they deny the existence of the problem and blame the victims (the players).

Or the guy you're talking about is simply a below-average citizen of this planet.

A bot? Well, as Jingles once said, if I had paid for bot that did what you are telling us, I'd want my money back!

 

Good hunting on the high seas

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I think the "50-70+ games over 2 days with extremely low damage which happens over numerous occasions" is what would flag this account for potential botting, rather than any WR% issues.

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2 hours ago, IanH755 said:

I think the "50-70+ games over 2 days with extremely low damage which happens over numerous occasions" is what would flag this account for potential botting, rather than any WR% issues.

It's more like 60-70 battles in 1.5 day. Which isn't that crazy. Especially if you play a DD only with 2-3 min each round. When I did regrind I played 48-55 rounds per day (I wasn't working then, it was just after I finished my studies) 

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I had a 40% wr lightning on my team with.. what was it.. 16-17k battles on my team yesterday. He played about a thousand battles in the last week alone. All he did was go to the 10 line on Northern Lights, charged an Alaska and died.

 

Has to be a bot.. right? Reported him, but I doubt anything will come of it.

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5 minutes ago, Captain_Newman said:

about a thousand battles in the last week alone

:cap_wander_2:

Well that's crazy. Though I heard some people that work in different hours playing same account. But even though 1k battles in a week that's definitely 24h bot playing 6 battles in one hour. 

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15 minutes ago, MacArthur92 said:

:cap_wander_2:

Well that's crazy. Though I heard some people that work in different hours playing same account. But even though 1k battles in a week that's definitely 24h bot playing 6 battles in one hour. 

 

I remembered it wrong, but I did find his profile. This is him:

 

Screenshot_11.thumb.jpg.b069175c15bd642694896558ab3c6b5e.jpg

 

Not allowed to name him. Shame he's allowed to mess up our games. I did raise a ticket to support and asked for them to check for botting.

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10 hours ago, _Dunc_ said:

Kiev this evening, shooting islands, torping empty water, and generally hampering the team's effort to not lose quite so quickly.

 

I've circled the telling bits (as if 12k average damage in a Domskoi wasn't a big enough clue. 

 

It's this, more than anything else, which makes me frustration-quit the game. I can mostly tolerate all the engineered-in challenges, but what chance do you have when the enemy team effectively get one free DD (or any other boat this guy decides to bot with?)

bot1.jpg

These are random battles or co-ops?:fish_book: In the last case, playing with DD's you can play more than 30 battles in around 3 hours, each day, for example during a weekend.

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6 minutes ago, Captain_Newman said:

I remembered it wrong, but I did find his profile. This is him:

~110 games on average per day - report him to MrConway. Must be a bot. We had one like this a couple of weeks back - 15 min after @DFens_666 reported him to MrConway the acc was gone.

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Just now, neorvo said:

These are random battles or co-ops?:fish_book: In the last case, playing with DD's you can play more than 30 battles in around 3 hours, each day, for example during a weekend.

 

Cant be coop - even if you try your hardest to screw your team, you would never be able to reach a 41 % WR ^^

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4 minutes ago, ForlornSailor said:

 

Cant be coop - even if you try your hardest to screw your team, you would never be able to reach a 41 % WR ^^

:Smile_facepalm: Ohhhhh its happening again, that little detail scaped me :Smile_sceptic:

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19 minutes ago, ForlornSailor said:

~110 games on average per day - report him to MrConway. Must be a bot. We had one like this a couple of weeks back - 15 min after @DFens_666 reported him to MrConway the acc was gone.

 

Done, thanks for the advice. Sent a PM to MrConway with all the relevant details and the support ticket ID that I raised. Hopefully something happens. Another reason why his profile is highly suspicious: when you check his individual ship stats, you'll see that he actually does surprisingly decently in some, while the others are a sea of red. Basically, the dude likes his Yamato and play it, lets the bot handle the rest.

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Well if there were actual bots in the game the reason for that would be that WG added them to bolster low player numbers of certain tiers or all tiers but either way since it's most likely WG who added these bots, why would they then try to "detect" and remove them? 

 

Beside, I've found that bots tend to be much better than a lot actual real ppl in this game, sometimes significantly better depending on the level of neanderthal mashing their saliva covered keyboard.

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3 minutes ago, Sir_Sinksalot said:

Well if there were actual bots in the game the reason for that would be that WG added them to bolster low player numbers of certain tiers or all tiers but either way since it's most likely WG who added these bots, why would they then try to "detect" and remove them? 

 

Beside, I've found that bots tend to be much better than a lot actual real ppl in this game, sometimes significantly better depending on the level of neanderthal mashing their saliva covered keyboard.

 

You're missing the point. There was no shortage of players, it was during prime time, and there was almost no q time, taken into battle instantly. This isn't some tinfoil WG bot to bolster player numbers, this is a player running a bot 24/7 to farm stuff with. WG does populate teams with bots in coop when there aren't enough players around, and you can tell it's a bot by the ":" in front of the name. This does not happen in randoms, and if there's a theory they do it secretly to bolster numbers, fine, but I highly doubt this is the case here. What we're trying to do here is get some action taken against people that are making the game worse for all of us, if that's all right with you.

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3 minutes ago, Captain_Newman said:

 

You're missing the point. There was no shortage of players, it was during prime time, and there was almost no q time, taken into battle instantly. This isn't some tinfoil WG bot to bolster player numbers, this is a player running a bot 24/7 to farm stuff with.

Also if WG were seeding the game with bots, they'd presumably try to tune the AI to mirror an average player, not this kind of 40% WR single figures damage botting.

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1 minute ago, Captain_Newman said:

 

You're missing the point. There was no shortage of players, it was during prime time, and there was almost no q time, taken into battle instantly. This isn't some tinfoil WG bot to bolster player numbers, this is a player running a bot 24/7 to farm stuff with.

No shortage of players you say? Having already picked up the Aigle and other cheap coal ships I decided to knock another one off the list, the tier3 Campbeltown. Now, I didn't have any real ambitions to play a whole lot with this little tug boat but certainly I wanted to try it a few times. This was a Saturday and surely a peak day and time for players and yet...

 

cGjZzk8.jpg

 

 

...not exactly a "plenty of players" sort of case is it? The clock would run on to 5 minutes or longer before I eventually gave up on it. Also, if this is how it is at lower tiers these days then @ WG, maybe stop selling lower tier ships? In this case for me it was only a minor inconvenience since it was purchased with coal I collect from daily missions etc but if a person was to purchase one of these lower tier premium with money, that's just not cool, you're selling premium ships that cannot get a random battle unless they sit there for God knows how long. 

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18 minutes ago, Sir_Sinksalot said:

No shortage of players you say? Having already picked up the Aigle and other cheap coal ships I decided to knock another one off the list, the tier3 Campbeltown. Now, I didn't have any real ambitions to play a whole lot with this little tug boat but certainly I wanted to try it a few times. This was a Saturday and surely a peak day and time for players and yet...

 

cGjZzk8.jpg

 

 

...not exactly a "plenty of players" sort of case is it? The clock would run on to 5 minutes or longer before I eventually gave up on it. Also, if this is how it is at lower tiers these days then @ WG, maybe stop selling lower tier ships? In this case for me it was only a minor inconvenience since it was purchased with coal I collect from daily missions etc but if a person was to purchase one of these lower tier premium with money, that's just not cool, you're selling premium ships that cannot get a random battle unless they sit there for God knows how long. 

 

 

Sigh, making an argument there aren't many players with a tier 3 queue time.. you literally can't make this **** up.

 

 

Point 1: This was on tier 3. Q times can be long on that. It has nothing to do with my example.

Point 2: Saturday, sure, didn't say what time on sat, though, kind of irrelevant because of point 1.

Point 3: My suspected bot was in a lightning, that's t8, in a t10 game. And I had no q time, so your counterexample is irrelevant.

Point 4: All we want is for WG to check if this is indeed a player abusing the bot program, is there a point to your arguing against it? Does it hurt to check? There is literally nothing to lose here. Are you arguing for the sake of arguing, or are you genuinely opposed to WG checking for bots when someone looks suspicious?

 

Again, all we're asking for is for WG to check. Not sure why you're arguing against it? Is there some downside to us asking them to check for botting? As you can see in this thread, there have been examples of accounts being removed because of this. Everyone's a winner when that happens. Apart from the guy running the bot, ofc, but good riddance there. With respect, you're arguing about your experiences in MM with someone that has over 22 times more battles than you do. You might not have spent enough time here to spot a bot, and that's fine, but stop arguing with people who have, please.

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25 minutes ago, Captain_Newman said:

 

 

Sigh, making an argument there aren't many players with a tier 3 queue time.. you literally can't make this **** up.

 

 

Point 1: This was on tier 3. Q times can be long on that. It has nothing to do with my example.

Point 2: Saturday, sure, didn't say what time on sat, though, kind of irrelevant because of point 1.

Point 3: My suspected bot was in a lightning, that's t8, in a t10 game. And I had no q time, so your counterexample is irrelevant.

Point 4: All we want is for WG to check if this is indeed a player abusing the bot program, is there a point to your arguing against it? Does it hurt to check? There is literally nothing to lose here. Are you arguing for the sake of arguing, or are you genuinely opposed to WG checking for bots when someone looks suspicious?

 

Again, all we're asking for is for WG to check. Not sure why you're arguing against it? Is there some downside to us asking them to check for botting? As you can see in this thread, there have been examples of accounts being removed because of this. Everyone's a winner when that happens. Apart from the guy running the bot, ofc, but good riddance there. With respect, you're arguing about your experiences in MM with someone that has over 22 times more battles than you do. You might not have spent enough time here to spot a bot, and that's fine, but stop arguing with people who have, please.

 

If you're trying to dismiss a lower tier battle with like... 5 ppl in the Q on a Saturday as typical and irrelevant to boting that's untrue since it clearly points to a very unhealthy sized playerbase, it points to a lack of new player growth since they obviously start from lower tiers and it outlines why most likely any bots in this game are WG creations to bolster the shortfall.

 

Is there more players at higher tiers and therefore battles should start faster and with less bots? Yes, obviously. Higher tiers is where all players eventually filter into and mostly stay if they like the game but it doesn't take away from the fact that there was barely any players signing up on a Saturday which one would imagine, since a lot of ppl are finished work and college for the weekend, would be one of the better days for player growth and also just a higher playerbase in general that day... so my point was that if during this time I was stalling for 5 minutes with just a few other players in the MM, then it must also be that there's some higher tier battles that at times need some bots added to get a faster MM and if so, this is most likely a WG created bot and less likely some botting program created by some player that's gone scratching his backside. 

 

Sure, no harm in asking WG to check I suppose. What purpose would a botting program serve anyway though? Most players that really like the game worship their stats so are not going to have some bot tarnishing them just to easy mode to higher tier ships without having to grind it themselves since they're stats would be utterly trashed from repeatedly doing that with each line and nation. Would a person do it so they can unlock all the ships and sell the account with all those unlocked ships illegally as a viable business or form of income? Possibly, is the game that popular that a person would pay a lot for that account full of ships and also, is there that many people per day or per week that would be interested in buying that account to make the botting venture a viable for of worthwhile income? I doubt it. With WoT maybe because it's much more popular but you never know, it might be a viable income with WoWs too, especially if it's a program that's somewhat easily adjust to bot for both games at least one would get an extra little bit by including WoWs too.

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1 hour ago, Sir_Sinksalot said:

Well if there were actual bots in the game the reason for that would be that WG added them to bolster low player numbers of certain tiers or all tiers but either way since it's most likely WG who added these bots, why would they then try to "detect" and remove them? 

 

Beside, I've found that bots tend to be much better than a lot actual real ppl in this game, sometimes significantly better depending on the level of neanderthal mashing their saliva covered keyboard.

If bots would be added they would be in early morning. But that one is playing 6-7 battles per hour 24/7. 

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1 hour ago, Sir_Sinksalot said:

Most players that really like the game worship their stats so are not going to have some bot tarnishing them just to easy mode to higher tier ships without having to grind it themselves since they're stats would be utterly trashed from repeatedly doing that with each line and nation. Would a person do it so they can unlock all the ships and sell the account with all those unlocked ships illegally as a viable business or form of income? Possibly, is the game that popular that a person would pay a lot for that account full of ships and also, is there that many people per day or per week that would be interested in buying that account to make the botting venture a viable for of worthwhile income? I doubt it. With WoT maybe because it's much more popular but you never know, it might be a viable income with WoWs too, especially if it's a program that's somewhat easily adjust to bot for both games at least one would get an extra little bit by including WoWs too.

 

48 minutes ago, MacArthur92 said:

If bots would be added they would be in early morning. But that one is playing 6-7 battles per hour 24/7. 

 

- I'm not dismissing anything, but tier 3 always has far less players than t10, and is thus irrelevant to the example of my t8 bot in a t10 game.

 

- Most people who care enough about the game and their stats are vocal enough to express that care in venues such as this. That is the circle of people you're drawing your conclusions from. The vast majority of the player base are very casual who "just play for fun", have garbage stats and don't care about improving. You won't see them on forums, you won't really see them in any clans short of some of the pure economy ones, they will rarely division, they just log in once in a blue moon to shoot some ships, and don't really care about anything else. Don't believe me? Install matchmaking monitor and run it over how many battles you want. The vast majority of players in every battle will have red profiles, indicating bad winrates, PR, damage, etc. Most of the player base does not care about stats at all, but they do want their t10's.

 

- There are people who sell their accounts, but I can only speculate on how profitable this can be and what would be the point of botting. I agree it's pointless, but it's also pointless that someone with 40% win rate and 17k battles is still playing the game, yet, here they are.

 

Anyhow, MrConway responded, they'll look into it. Worst case scenario, he's genuinely very bad but not a bot, and he keeps ruining games, so no change, best case scenario, botting is determined and he's removed. That's one less person that makes the game less fun, so, worth it. As @MacArthur92 has pointed out, this person has a suspicious amount of battles per day (it's basically necessary to suicide quickly in order to even do this), extremely garbage stats in most ships, then in some ships (that he probably likes and actually plays, rather than run a bot) you can see a sharp increase. The gameplay is bot-like as well, as in, his lightning just moves forward into the enemy (in this case, Alaska, another DD and I forget what else), and keep sailing forward and shooting them until he dies. Kind of like bots in coop. Yes, there are players that bad, but when you look at all the evidence, it at least warrants a look. If there are indeed people running bots to skip grinds, they need to be removed as they make the game much less fun for the rest of us.

 

 

 

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1 hour ago, MacArthur92 said:

If bots would be added they would be in early morning. But that one is playing 6-7 battles per hour 24/7. 

 

So if these were 3rd-party bots, to what end would a person bother creating this program and adding it into the game? 

 

Ok, we know its so you can go AFK and unlock ship and/or grind credits, free xp etc but to what end? This isn't an argument btw, none of my points or posts in this thread are, I'm just adding to the topic while also I'm curious to know why there would be bots in this game other than the ones WG add to pick up the shortfall for battles where the MM hasn't the available players with classes of ship to construct a relatively short battle waiting time.

 

For me, the notion of BOT programs seems almost far fetched, at least in a game that's not really that popular to make it a profitable undertaking and so the only other reason to go to the trouble outside of selling accounts with all the unlocked ships would be to fast grind to higher tiers while being AFK and not actually having to suffer the grinds but to me this seems like way too much trouble and time to invest in such a low profit and/or time that would probably take as much time and effort, if not more, to create the program as it would to just simply grind the foching ships lol.

 

Thing about a bot program is it would have to be sophisticated enough beyond just botting around for one single battle to worth bothering with. If a person using a bot program they created also had to click the battle button themselves after each single battle then this wouldn't be worth bothering with and a lot of trouble to create a bot program just so that person still has to hang around and monitor how the progress is going to catch the end of each and every battle as to click the battle button for another.... to me this seems really R word.

 

So the bot program would definitely have to be somewhat sophisticated at least I believe so, could be wrong, often am. Lower tier grinds are pretty quick and so the bot program wouldn't just have to be sophisticated enough to automatically detect when it needs to start a new battle but also sophisticated enough as to detect that a grind is complete with the next tier unlocked, select to unlock that tier, select to purchase that ship with a captain, possible sophisticated enough to detect, unlock and purchase each module within each ships grind from stock. Otherwise, the AFK producer of this bot program would have to hang around and keep a watch on it and to me that would seem a really annoying, almost pointless thing to have to do, not much less annoying that having to actually play and grind the ship, and also a hell of a lot of trouble just to still have to hang around.

 

If the bot program WAS made that sophisticated to automatically do everything from detecting when its time to click into a new battle, detecting when its unlocked the next tier and automatically purchases that ship and captain along with then starting into battles once more, for me the real question is why go to all that trouble? The only reasons I can think of are

 

1. Lazy. Yet this theory fails because the time and effort involved in creating a sophisticated bot program what would allow a person to not have to hang around and automatically selects battles and detects different things would totally be more trouble for a lazy person than simply just click battle and tapping a few buttons just enough to avoid detection as being AFK. For me, a lazy person would be defeated by the notion of the effort involved in creating a bot program and just do what they need to do in a battle to avoid being deemed as afk... shoot the gun a few times, press forwards and then go afk, however it works.

 

2. Selling accounts. Not sure this works either but probably the most likely to go to the trouble. Thing is though, and I don't have fact and figures outside of seeing the server population when I play and where it ranks on Twitch view etc, but to me, it seems like to go to the trouble of creating a fully AFK bot program that churns out fast accounts of fully unlocked ships you would need a customer base big enough to worth bothering with and I don't see WoWs being that attractive. Sure, will sell some, but is it enough worth bothering with? I don't know, I doubt it. 

 

So to me it seems unlikely that outside of WG added bots, anyone would bother or go to the trouble when the reasons are not justified for the effort involved. I could explain a lot of encounters with bot like behavior as those that are actually mentally challenged that might have been put in front of this slow paced game just to ummm... "entertain" them and also the more likely explanation for erratic and ummm.... "odd" behavior is simply nothing more than a player using a potato pc not able to handle the graphics demand overheating and for others, simply bad network and connectivity issues. This doesn't explain accounts with apparent 6 battles per hour X 24 hours a day X 7 days a week though, those are most interesting. What do you guys think? 

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3 hours ago, Sir_Sinksalot said:

Well if there were actual bots in the game the reason for that would be that WG added them to bolster low player numbers of certain tiers or all tiers but either way since it's most likely WG who added these bots, why would they then try to "detect" and remove them? 

 

Beside, I've found that bots tend to be much better than a lot actual real ppl in this game, sometimes significantly better depending on the level of neanderthal mashing their saliva covered keyboard.

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