Sov.Soyuz and the average to bad player story.

[cimmerian_steel]

Hey all. 

 

I read a thread by a guy around last July complaining about the Sov. Soyuz and a bunch of people jumping on him telling him the same old story. "Ship is fine, you don't know how to play it, and play in general"

 

Fast forward to recent events in my WoWs life where I got the Sov. Soyuz.  I couldn't agree more with the OP in that thread.

 

And yes, my WR is terrible, and my stats are terrible and everything about me is terrible (as a player). But guess what, we are not all John Wick. You can't give us a pencil and expect us to kill 10 people with it, and then praise the attributes of the pencil as a lethal weapon. 

 

Terrible players or average players or below average players make the vast numbers of the player base. We need to be able to be at least entertained by the ships in the game. Not frustrated.  I understand how "ships" need to be different, but I don't understand how making a ship miss (!!) a full broadside with 6 out its nine shells going OVER the target (!)  at 11 km away when you are aiming the waterline of a Buffalo showing you her full sides, helps anyone. For the history of the thing, the other 3 shells over penetrated. It wouldn't be so bad, if this happened like once. It happens with alarming regularity. 

 

The other thing that happens with alarming regularity is that even when the gods of aiming are at your side a full broadside from the Sov.Soyuz (or at least when I -the crap player- play it, will never kill a ship. 

I have counted over 20 times times when I fired what should have been devastating strikes at the broadsides of BBs and CAs and always there is just a little bit left. The cake takes me scoring 4 citadels (in one salvo) on an a full health CA and living it with 55 HP.  

 

My only kills with the Sov.Soyuz are scooping up other peoples garbage and only when the target is below 2k.  My most usual damage is like 1325 iirc. 

 

My two biggest disappointments in the game so far have been the Moskva (man talk about a sore spot, once I got the Salem I never looked back) and the Sov.Soyuz.  Both Russian, both (for my personal style and limited ability) utterly useless. And yes, it does burn like a matchbox, and no, not all tier 9 ships burn like it. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[MRGTB]

Never played a Russian BB yet. But have played against them, and they seem pretty strong to me. Good armour against AP and pretty fireproof as well it appears compared other nations BB's. The let down for them seems to be their slow manoeuvrability mostly.

[ColonelPete]

13 minutes ago, cimmerian_steel said:

Hey all. 

 

I read a thread by a guy around last July complaining about the Sov. Soyuz and a bunch of people jumping on him telling him the same old story. "Ship is fine, you don't know how to play it, and play in general"

 

Fast forward to recent events in my WoWs life where I got the Sov. Soyuz.  I couldn't agree more with the OP in that thread.

 

And yes, my WR is terrible, and my stats are terrible and everything about me is terrible (as a player). But guess what, we are not all John Wick. You can't give us a pencil and expect us to kill 10 people with it, and then praise the attributes of the pencil as a lethal weapon. 

 

Terrible players or average players or below average players make the vast numbers of the player base. We need to be able to be at least entertained by the ships in the game. Not frustrated.  I understand how "ships" need to be different, but I don't understand how making a ship miss (!!) a full broadside with 6 out its nine shells going OVER the target (!)  at 11 km away when you are aiming the waterline of a Buffalo showing you her full sides, helps anyone. For the history of the thing, the other 3 shells over penetrated. It wouldn't be so bad, if this happened like once. It happens with alarming regularity. 

 

The other thing that happens with alarming regularity is that even when the gods of aiming are at your side a full broadside from the Sov.Soyuz (or at least when I -the crap player- play it, will never kill a ship. 

I have counted over 20 times times when I fired what should have been devastating strikes at the broadsides of BBs and CAs and always there is just a little bit left. The cake takes me scoring 4 citadels (in one salvo) on an a full health CA and living it with 55 HP.  

 

My only kills with the Sov.Soyuz are scooping up other peoples garbage and only when the target is below 2k.  My most usual damage is like 1325 iirc. 

 

My two biggest disappointments in the game so far have been the Moskva (man talk about a sore spot, once I got the Salem I never looked back) and the Sov.Soyuz.  Both Russian, both (for my personal style and limited ability) utterly useless. And yes, it does burn like a matchbox, and no, not all tier 9 ships burn like it. 

 

This is your pencil:

http://maplesyrup.sweet.coocan.jp/wows/ranking/20200111/eu_2month/average_ship.html

If it does not work for you, use something else to write. The average player does more than fine with it.

And yes, the RU BB are not BB for the beginning or bad BB player. That was communicated often enough.

 

I hope you are playing the ship fully upgraded and are not complaining about a stock ship?

[Rhineheart_Thor]

27 minutes ago, cimmerian_steel said:

And yes, my WR is terrible, and my stats are terrible and everything about me is terrible (as a player).

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 You stats are not that bad in it @cimmerian_steel  you had a Kraken in it.

 

 

 

with all that armour, and them 406,s,  The Fire, spammers are bound to " Prioritise "  it, its Floating XP Food

 

 

 

[cimmerian_steel]

5 minutes ago, ColonelPete said:

This is your pencil:

http://maplesyrup.sweet.coocan.jp/wows/ranking/20200111/eu_2month/average_ship.html

If it does not work for you, use something else to write. The average player does more than fine with it.

And yes, the RU BB are not BB for the beginning or bad BB player. That was communicated often enough.

 

I hope you are playing the ship fully upgraded and are not complaining about a stock ship?

 

1st of all thank you for taking the time to respond. 

2nd, your response is the kind I would prefer not to get as it isn't helpful. 

3rd, I would choose something else, but I gotta grind through to the Kremlin, right, that is the crux of the game if I am not mistaken?

4th, my stats from my game page are : 

181 battles, 50% WR, 1388 XP, 0.75 destruction ratio with 48650 average damage.  

So not far off from what the average player base is doing given that I only played 180 or so battles with it. 

Having said that, just because I am on low battles with it and a bit off (considering) the average numbers, that doesn't invalidate my comments on the ship. 

I have 8160 battles overall, I don't think that I am far off with my opinion even if I am a very bad player I have seen enough to have some understanding of what I am seeing skills non withstanding. 

 

Thank you nonetheless 

 

 

[cimmerian_steel]

3 minutes ago, Barracuda_111 said:

 

 You stats are not that bad in it @cimmerian_steel  you had a Kraken in it.

 

 

 

with all that armour, and them 406,s,  The Fire, spammers are bound to " Prioritise "  it, its Floating XP Food

 

 

 

 

 

Yes, thank you I have noticed how a lot of people will prioritize over other ships to hit you with HE. What I am saying is that it also responds worse than other tier 9 BBs to HE. Essentially you look at it the wrong way, it'll catch fire. 

 

To be clear, I am only writing this thread, to let (who I don't know) someone know that the Sov.Soyuz to me, at least, is not a fun ship to play. It is very frustrating and a dog to get any joy out of . 

 

 

[Rhineheart_Thor]

3 minutes ago, cimmerian_steel said:

 

 

Yes, thank you I have noticed how a lot of people will prioritize over other ships to hit you with HE. What I am saying is that it also responds worse than other tier 9 BBs to HE. Essentially you look at it the wrong way, it'll catch fire. 

 

To be clear, I am only writing this thread, to let (who I don't know) someone know that the Sov.Soyuz to me, at least, is not a fun ship to play. It is very frustrating and a dog to get any joy out of . 

 

 

 

I can not remember why I got rid of it.

 

Izmail I won in a box, other wise that would not be in my fleet either.

 

I was thinking about re doing them in the Research Bureau, if WG make it worth my while, right now I am not impressed with the work / reward calculations 

 

[cimmerian_steel]

5 minutes ago, Barracuda_111 said:

 

I can not remember why I got rid of it.

 

Izmail I won in a box, other wise that would not be in my fleet either.

 

I was thinking about re doing them in the Research Bureau, if WG make it worth my while, right now I am not impressed with the work / reward calculations 

 

 

Yeah, that doesn't look so appealing . 

[Rhineheart_Thor]

8 minutes ago, cimmerian_steel said:

 

Yeah, that doesn't look so appealing . 

My T9 go to tends to be Georgia I like movement and firepower

 

 

 

I also like 19 Pt Captains 

[cimmerian_steel]

1 minute ago, Barracuda_111 said:

My T9 go to tends to be Georgia I like movement and firepower

 

 

 

I regret not getting the Georgia now I think...

[ColonelPete]

19 minutes ago, cimmerian_steel said:

 

1st of all thank you for taking the time to respond. 

2nd, your response is the kind I would prefer not to get as it isn't helpful. 

3rd, I would choose something else, but I gotta grind through to the Kremlin, right, that is the crux of the game if I am not mistaken?

4th, my stats from my game page are : 

181 battles, 50% WR, 1388 XP, 0.75 destruction ratio with 48650 average damage.  

So not far off from what the average player base is doing given that I only played 180 or so battles with it. 

Having said that, just because I am on low battles with it and a bit off (considering) the average numbers, that doesn't invalidate my comments on the ship. 

I have 8160 battles overall, I don't think that I am far off with my opinion even if I am a very bad player I have seen enough to have some understanding of what I am seeing skills non withstanding. 

 

Thank you nonetheless 

You will have the same problems with Kremlin. If you cannot handle a playstile, going up a Tier will not help.

Considering that Sojuz outperforms ANY other silver ship, your comments do not matter.

[Rhineheart_Thor]

Just now, ColonelPete said:

You will have the same problems with Kremlin. If you cannot handle a playstile, going up a Tier will not help.

Considering that Sojuz outperforms ANY other silver ship, your comments do not matter.

Of course his Opinion / comments matter !!!! 

[cimmerian_steel]

2 minutes ago, ColonelPete said:

You will have the same problems with Kremlin. If you cannot handle a playstile, going up a Tier will not help.

Considering that Sojuz outperforms ANY other silver ship, your comments do not matter.

 

I would think I am not going up a tier, I would think I am getting a different ship. I didn't complain about the ship before the Sov. Soyuz did I nor the ship before that either...

  

[Rhineheart_Thor]

[KillStealBoss]

1 minute ago, Barracuda_111 said:

Not worth any cent.

[ColonelPete]

3 minutes ago, Barracuda_111 said:

Of course his Opinion / comments matter !!!! 

Regarding the strength of the ship? No.

 

It does not matter how weak you judge a ship. If it outperforms all others, your opinion is not relevant.

 

 

[cimmerian_steel]

Just now, MacArthur92 said:

Not worth any cent.

Man I would kill for them secondaries alone. 

[cimmerian_steel]

Just now, ColonelPete said:

Regarding the strength of the ship? No.

 

It does not matter how weak you judge a ship. If it outperforms all others, your opinion is not relevant.

 

 

 

Did not say the ship is weak. I said the ship is terrible and frustrating and hard to get any joy out of and that it is a disappointment. 

[Rhineheart_Thor]

1 minute ago, ColonelPete said:

Regarding the strength of the ship? No.

 

It does not matter how weak you judge a ship. If it outperforms all others, your opinion is not relevant.

 

 

Pete, with all due respect, ever player / forum members opinion matters, thats how we learn from each other, and one of the ways "WE" forward the game.

 

Not ever one can get on with ever ship.

 

Do your stats factor in hidden stats?

[KillStealBoss]

12 hours ago, ColonelPete said:

Regarding the strength of the ship? No.

 

It does not matter how weak you judge a ship. If it outperforms all others, your opinion is not relevant.

 

 

Well... It does matter. We have different tastes and we like to play different ships. My mate loves the Shchors while I hate it, though I really like to play Lazo. Even though it's +/- same gameplay. Don't know. Same with Wukong and Siliwangi that many CCs disliked I see them ok/good. Although with Siliwangi I had some bad luck few times (cluster radar, Harugumo in close range, CV spotted me and then blapped by Vlad...)

You won't be coming here and tell people what opinion is good or not. Opinion is not a fact. Maybe for him is weak and for majority is not. 

[BruceRKF]

8 hours ago, cimmerian_steel said:

I would choose something else, but I gotta grind through to the Kremlin, right, that is the crux of the game if I am not mistaken?

I don't really want to participate in the discussion about whether Soyuz is too weak or strong apart from saying that I think she is fine, probably even a bit too strong.

However, thinking that getting the tier 10s is the "crux" of the game is the wrong mindset, imo. For example, I have not bought Harugumo or Kremlin yet despite having the xp on the previous ships, enough credits and open portslots, as well as plenty of captain xp to get a decent captain on them. Simply because I don't have any intention of playing them any time soon. I also only recently bought the Kurfürst while I had that line completed for over a year. It's not about getting all the tier 10s, but having fun and playing the ships you like. I have kept or rebought many of the lower tier ships in several tech trees for that reason and my average tier played is 7.1. Playing mid tiers just as much as high tiers gives much more variety as well and might not wear you out as much.

You can also grind slowly if you don't like a ship, but still want to get the next one at some point: Play the respective ship until you get the daily win bonus (mabye put xp camos and signals on if you have them) and then go play something you like instead of playing the same ship over and over again. The grind will be slow, but you won't have your mood ruined by one ship.

[Miragetank90]

10 hours ago, cimmerian_steel said:

And yes, it does burn like a matchbox, and no, not all tier 9 ships burn like it. 

 

Correcting you here, since this bit is no longer within the realm of opinion. The facts are thus: 

 

[cimmerian_steel]

8 hours ago, BruceRKF said:

I don't really want to participate in the discussion about whether Soyuz is too weak or strong apart from saying that I think she is fine, probably even a bit too strong.

However, thinking that getting the tier 10s is the "crux" of the game is the wrong mindset, imo. For example, I have not bought Harugumo or Kremlin yet despite having the xp on the previous ships, enough credits and open portslots, as well as plenty of captain xp to get a decent captain on them. Simply because I don't have any intention of playing them any time soon. I also only recently bought the Kurfürst while I had that line completed for over a year. It's not about getting all the tier 10s, but having fun and playing the ships you like. I have kept or rebought many of the lower tier ships in several tech trees for that reason and my average tier played is 7.1. Playing mid tiers just as much as high tiers gives much more variety as well and might not wear you out as much.

You can also grind slowly if you don't like a ship, but still want to get the next one at some point: Play the respective ship until you get the daily win bonus (mabye put xp camos and signals on if you have them) and then go play something you like instead of playing the same ship over and over again. The grind will be slow, but you won't have your mood ruined by one ship.

There is a lot of wisdom in this post and I can't argue with it. I am guilty of simply going through the motions on a lot of games simply to just get the XP so I can put a "ship I don't like past me" and move to the next one. This more than anything ruins my stats which I really don't care about.

But I do care about having fun and my frustration with that ship made me start the thread.  I have a Jean Bart, I am not good with it, but I when I play it, I know it is going to reward me consistently. The Sov. Soyuz is not even guaranteed to reward a full broadside on a non moving ship. You never know where the shells will fly or what kind of damage they will do. I can't, I just can't... I even liked the Colorado more.. 

 

[BruceRKF]

14 minutes ago, cimmerian_steel said:

There is a lot of wisdom in this post and I can't argue with it. I am guilty of simply going through the motions on a lot of games simply to just get the XP so I can put a "ship I don't like past me" and move to the next one. This more than anything ruins my stats which I really don't care about.

But I do care about having fun and my frustration with that ship made me start the thread.  I have a Jean Bart, I am not good with it, but I when I play it, I know it is going to reward me consistently. The Sov. Soyuz is not even guaranteed to reward a full broadside on a non moving ship. You never know where the shells will fly or what kind of damage they will do. I can't, I just can't... I even liked the Colorado more..

Consistency in the guns is something that is hard to come by in BBs. Even if on paper the accuracy is top-notch, dispersion for BBs is always quite high and can troll you hard, so I can relate. Just roll with it and don't let it bother you.

Also, by all means, try as many ships as you want, but don't force yourself to play those that are not fun for you. The goal is not to get all the tier ten ships, but to play the ships you like the most and keep learning. Which is also something that can be done more easily by switching ships around and experience the variety; btw: not caring about your stats is a very promising start

[cimmerian_steel]

46 minutes ago, BruceRKF said:

Consistency in the guns is something that is hard to come by in BBs. Even if on paper the accuracy is top-notch, dispersion for BBs is always quite high and can troll you hard, so I can relate. Just roll with it and don't let it bother you.

Also, by all means, try as many ships as you want, but don't force yourself to play those that are not fun for you. The goal is not to get all the tier ten ships, but to play the ships you like the most and keep learning. Which is also something that can be done more easily by switching ships around and experience the variety; btw: not caring about your stats is a very promising start

 

You are right, I shouldn't have let it bother me to begin with. I think just sticking with the same ship for a number of days possibly got to me.