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Kaseko

What is the Point of all the DD quality of life improvements

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When CVs exist?

 

you made all these chanes like adding a Delay to radars to try and make DDs fun to play, and then you just throw it in the bin by making CVs the godclass of the game that ruins everyones day especially DDs.

it even goes so far as making them virtually unplayable.

 

you should add some sort of delay to plane spotting so the carrier isnt all powerful and has both tools at hand (spotting and massive damage)

 

THE DDs NEED TO GET THEIR ROLE BACK

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Game balance is nowadays mostly like chimps throwning :etc_swear: at the wall, some of it sticks but no-one knows why and there sure as hell is no guiding intelligence behind it.

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Virtuality and reality are two different things.

Reality is that I was finally able to reach unicum WR in DD...

 

The biggest detriment to enjoying DD play are still your teammates that try to avoid caps like the plague. Forcing you to take on the enemy alone, hang back or attack the corner of the map where "they" feel™ safe.

Give me halfway competent teammates and I gladly face CV every match, even in DD that do not have AA to speak of...

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This T8 DD shot 15 heavy  armoured 2380 HP per plane = 35.700 HP worth of  US T10 bombers before he was finally killed, and none of those losses were due to "noob piloted" FLAK hits.... In fact it was almost as effective in killing aircraft then a tier X Des Moines Cruiser ( and that is an AA platform..)  on the other team.

 

 

wo8.jpg

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14 minutes ago, Beastofwar said:

What you see there is a player that obviously knows how to use his ship....unlike many here that come complain.

Hmm, yes. Hence the ludicrous amount of 617 xp. Much skill, such wow.

15 minutes ago, Beastofwar said:

so go figure how strong it's continuous AA was in reality. In fact it was almost as effective in killing aircraft then a tier X Des Moines Cruiser ( and that is an AA platform..)  on the other team.

@El2aZeR Care to do some quick maths for our friend here?

 

18 minutes ago, Beastofwar said:

Anyone complaining about CV is just a "I dont want CV to interfere with my surface battle" activist

image.png.e9bec514152877651673818cd30c3ab9.pngimage.png.9bca1e230e14709dd786c08e4e46af1b.png

Activist huh?

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37 minutes ago, Beastofwar said:

This T8 DD shot 15 heavy  armoured 2380 HP per plane = 35.700 HP worth of  US T10 bombers before he was finally killed, and none of those losses were due to "noob piloted" FLAK hits.... In fact it was almost as effective in killing aircraft then a tier X Des Moines Cruiser ( and that is an AA platform..)  on the other team.

 

Im gonna call fake news on that untill you upload
- replay
- result screen, where it shows which planes have been lost.

 

11 minutes ago, GarrusBrutus said:

Care to do some quick maths for our friend here?

 

He has been given accurate numbers countless times. He ignores it. He is like a paid nuclear lobbiest from the 1940s, claiming that uranium infused tooth pasted is good for the health and saves you money on the energy bill cuz you can read comics in the bed without a light - just open your mouth and smile.

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39 minutes ago, ColonelPete said:

The biggest detriment to enjoying DD play are still your teammates that try to avoid caps like the plague. Forcing you to take on the enemy alone, hang back or attack the corner of the map where "they" feel™ safe.

Give me halfway competent teammates and I gladly face CV every match, even in DD that do not have AA to speak of...

This, although some protection vs CV spotting would be welcome. 

Was farming UK baseXP in Daring today and the level of throw was of truly epic proportions. Due to everpresent CVs, I literally had to take out tryhard swiss-armyknife Mino to get a win.

 

On a side note: Downed 22 planes in Daring one game where unicum CV decided to focus me all game long, survived this long because sorrounding teammates were good.

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41 minutes ago, Beastofwar said:

This T8 DD shot 15 heavy  armoured 2380 HP per plane = 35.700 HP worth of  US T10 bombers before he was finally killed, and none of those losses were due to "noob piloted" FLAK hits.... In fact it was almost as effective in killing aircraft then a tier X Des Moines Cruiser ( and that is an AA platform..)  on the other team.

 

 

wo8.jpg

Yeah, sure gonna buy that this was all continuous damage and certainly not flak and these were expertly conducted air attacks on that DD...

 

Just for comparison:

shot-19_12.28_17_19.10-0911.thumb.jpg.962396f1ef3069ff18ecdfb60832394f.jpg

That is a T8 DD with "decent" AA (as far as T8 DDs go in the AA department. Apart from Kidd they are all kinda crap).

shot-19_12.27_19_53.54-0990.thumb.jpg.0d74df730f4a1c7e8858f76b48d9e919.jpg

This is a T8 CV.

 

Against some of the most fragile T8 planes. And no, these weren't secondary kills, else there'd be more plane kills from shot down CAP.

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7 minutes ago, Sleepy_Bunny said:

Yeah, sure gonna buy that this was all continuous damage and certainly not flak and these were expertly conducted air attacks on that DD...

 

Just for comparison:

shot-19_12.28_17_19.10-0911.thumb.jpg.962396f1ef3069ff18ecdfb60832394f.jpg

That is a T8 DD with "decent" AA (as far as T8 DDs go in the AA department. Apart from Kidd they are all kinda crap).

shot-19_12.27_19_53.54-0990.thumb.jpg.0d74df730f4a1c7e8858f76b48d9e919.jpg

This is a T8 CV.

 

Against some of the most fragile T8 planes. And no, these weren't secondary kills, else there'd be more plane kills from shot down CAP.

 

Just for  comparison....note the remaining HP of my DD and the fact that i not only reached the caps alive, capped and  but also reached  the CV alive in torpedo range. The fact that it yet lives ( killed it by gun fire ) is that i am not a very skilled DD captain...go figure what an actual skilled DD captain can and will do.

 

Anti-Cv whiners ...bah

 

 

wows9.jpg

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2 minutes ago, Beastofwar said:

For comparison....

 

No. for comparision THIS:

 

image.thumb.png.58faa8bec64c4a3193a6b3956f4e4179.png

 

Our team including me fucked up and our CV (I think you might know him from engaging with him in the forums - you should be able to figure our the rest of his nick) had to carry this game 1vs3. Which he did. Lost 93 in the process cuz they sticked together. They had the best AA DD. And did it matter? NOPE! And you wanna tell us something about 15 planes shot down, that matter? LUL. He even capped because he had to. THATS what unicum players do with their power.

Now upload the replay ive requested please.

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8 minutes ago, ForlornSailor said:

THATS what unicum players do with their power.

 

And how is this relevant to "CV are overpowered" ? You merely say FurryFriend and  some others are overpowered as players.

 

Cuss how many of these revered ""unicums" are there ? Certainly not enough for WG to change their game for as that is aimed at the average player.....

 

Do they maybe need to be personally nerfed to become averge players too as MrConway joked ?   :Smile-_tongue:

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12 minutes ago, Beastofwar said:

 

And how is this relevant to "CV are overpowered" ?

 

 

In the fact that even the worst CV player ever can singlehandedly kill a DD no matter said DDs skill level

and the worst part, the DD can't do a single thing to prevent this.

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3 minutes ago, Kaseko said:

In the fact that even the worst CV player ever can singlehandedly kill a DD no matter said DDs skill level

and the worst part, the DD can't do a single thing to prevent this.

 

But i just showed you the worst DD player can kill a CV too....even in 1:1 combat mode.:Smile_teethhappy:

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1 minute ago, Beastofwar said:

And how is this relevant to "CV are overpowered" ?

 

Cuss how many of these revered ""unicums" are there ? Certainly not enough for WG to change their game for..... Do they need to be personally nerfed maybe as MrConway joked ? 

 

You do understand, we are facing a clan with players, that have Winrates in the range of 56 to 60% aswell? I just checked them all through. Their problem was, their CV doesnt live up to the unicum status of the other guys so he couldnt kill our CV while he killed all 3 of them. Thats their DD.

image.png.81e8c7a2d3dc98ce1cf979b581d75175.png

Did he stand a chance?

 

But anyway. You are changing the goalpost again. Ill quote you:

 

Spoiler
5 hours ago, Beastofwar said:

Use the build options given or be obliovious to them and suffer. Easy. 

 

6 hours ago, Beastofwar said:

Certain "guru" individuals on forums or YT campaingning for a "mandatory" build you should have, may be more responsible for "AA not working" then modules or captain skills bing "useless" by WG.

 

7 hours ago, Beastofwar said:

You indeed never hear AA MODULE DESTRUCTION by HE battle damage  is brought up  in AA power argumentation while it for certain has significant effect. It is likely the cause for surface ships getting destroyed far more easily late match, giving the CV it's overpowered reputation.

 

7 hours ago, Beastofwar said:

No logic. It is still about the "i dont want to be disturbed in my surface duel" feeling behind the complaints and only removal of CV will do. Has nothing to do with AA power or AA balance as that is not what compainers seek at all. 

 

And from WG point of view they have given players every tool for every choice of build.....not using them eliminates legitimacy to complain.

10 hours ago, Beastofwar said:

it is being brutally disturbed in your skilled "duel" with enemy surface ships. If griefed by torp bombers they make you turn to evade and take AP broadsides like a noob or sink form aerial torpedos. All bombers can force you out of a hiding hole behind an island, while no enemy surface ships can hit you there. 

 

 

So lets look over your arguments:

- Players are at fault, that they dont build for AA - the guys on my screen sure did.

- You claim, AA-modules will be destroyed in long battles by surface ships, thats why CVs seem OP - besides that point, that if thats what happen all the time its indeed an indicator of beeing OP but nvm because: Since we all died early, we didnt destroy their AA-modules.

- You claim, surface players are annoyed by CVs disturbing them - this was a battle of 3 guys vs only a CV. They can not be disturbed or annoyed by the CV, they had to focus completly on the CV. Yet didnt manage. As Unicums.

- You claim, CVs make surface ships turn broadside or push you out from behind island so they get punished - In our match, there was nobody left to punish the Cruiser, DD and the CV. The BB is the one that I took down and even there the CV helped.

- You claim, ppl cant shoot down planes because they dont build for it and dont play accordingly, since teamplay isnt a thing. This was a clan vs clan. They did build for AA, they did support each other. Obviously, since they shot down 93 planes. AND - IT - DID - NOT - MATTER.

 

And latest point really destroyes everything you are trying to bring up about AA-build and AA-power. Have you never thought about, why you are pretty much the only one, claiming AA is strong? What are you trying to achieve? You think, WG is reading through this forum and think "oh wow, this BeastOfWar, he really must be right, despite everyone saying the exact opposite and our numbers saying something else aswell. Lets buff CVs." lul. The only thing you are doing, is, that you are losing the last bit of credibility connected to your name in this forums. If thats the way you want to go - fine. Your decision. Just dont be surprised if ppl will start to recognize you ingame and make fun of you. Maybe that already happened?

 

Now upload the replay! Or you have something to hide?

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37 minutes ago, Beastofwar said:

 

Just for  comparison....note the remaining HP of my DD and the fact that i not only reached the caps alive, capped and  but also reached  the CV alive in torpedo range. The fact that it yet lives ( killed it by gun fire ) is that i am not a very skilled DD captain...go figure what an actual skilled DD captain can and will do.

 

Anti-Cv whiners ...bah

 

 

wows9.jpg

All this proves is that incapable Implacables exist. We knew that already.

 

Also, if you were to load AP, you'd actually get more done. There is no point shooting HE at the side of an Implacable, it's all 21 mm, unless you were to shoot the superstructure. AP meanwhile at that range would give cit pens.

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20 minutes ago, ForlornSailor said:

Their problem was, their CV doesnt live up to the unicum status of the other guys so he couldnt kill our CV while he killed all 3 of them.

Fankly, imo, Shokaku is a bad pick for this mode. Enterprise would be underwhelming too if it hadn't the fighter.

 

4v4 CB with CV is a mode where you can expect Massachusetts as a BB and AP DBs aren't very useful with that. Lexington for example would be a better pick, because you might not be able to kill the cruiser and a few BBs as fast, but you can reliably wreck any BB and T8 cruisers aren't going to take 6 high damage HE bombs well either. Even for reliably dealing with enemy CV, the Lexington rockets and HE bombers are far better. Enterprise got the stupid fighter though, which makes it a very hard target to deal with and obviously in your screenshot, you can potentially delete a Tirpitz in 2-3 drops (main reason I'd bring Massa over Tirpitz). Kaga is also a good pick, for similar reasons as Lexington, just that instead of good rockets it brings absolutely great torpedo bombers and insane reserves.

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24 minutes ago, Sleepy_Bunny said:

All this proves is that incapable Implacables exist. We knew that already.

 

Also, if you were to load AP, you'd actually get more done. There is no point shooting HE at the side of an Implacable, it's all 21 mm, unless you were to shoot the superstructure. AP meanwhile at that range would give cit pens.

 

As i said, not really an adept DD player......but when i was noticing the shattering i aimed above the belt were it is mere plating.  Just a  few seconds of learning/remembering these are little popguns.  Could spare the HP as you can see.

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2 hours ago, Kaseko said:

THE DDs NEED TO GET THEIR ROLE BACK

DD's still have a role because

 

1: Not every game has a Carrier in it.

 

2: Nor can a carrier have it's planes be everywhere where they might be needed at once.

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9 minutes ago, Sleepy_Bunny said:

Fankly, imo, Shokaku is a bad pick for this mode. Enterprise would be underwhelming too if it hadn't the fighter.

 

4v4 CB with CV is a mode where you can expect Massachusetts as a BB and AP DBs aren't very useful with that. Lexington for example would be a better pick, because you might not be able to kill the cruiser and a few BBs as fast, but you can reliably wreck any BB and T8 cruisers aren't going to take 6 high damage HE bombs well either. Even for reliably dealing with enemy CV, the Lexington rockets and HE bombers are far better. Enterprise got the stupid fighter though, which makes it a very hard target to deal with and obviously in your screenshot, you can potentially delete a Tirpitz in 2-3 drops (main reason I'd bring Massa over Tirpitz). Kaga is also a good pick, for similar reasons as Lexington, just that instead of good rockets it brings absolutely great torpedo bombers and insane reserves.

 

We had the same thoughts and discussions prior to the start of the clan brawl and I actually asked our CV player about Shokaku vs Lexington aswell, since I was under the impression, both arent the best picks but if anything, Id pick Shokaku over Lexington - I stood corrected. And the Massa was just the obvious pick indeed (thats where I had the say ;) ) and indeed because of the AP bombs. But yea, in that screenshot, like I said, their CV player, looking at the stats, wasnt really at the level of the other guys. Maybe they had no other CV player, maybe Shokaku was their/his only option so they had to go with what they had. That 4x4 clan brawl was kinda fun overall (not sure of you and your clan participated aswell, feel free to share experiance) but our DD was complaining a lot because he hardly had a chance to contribute to the outcome. Contesting the objective was hard due to radar/CV and the small maps didnt help.

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1 hour ago, ForlornSailor said:

That 4x4 clan brawl was kinda fun overall (not sure of you and your clan participated aswell, feel free to share experiance) but our DD was complaining a lot because he hardly had a chance to contribute to the outcome. Contesting the objective was hard due to radar/CV and the small maps didnt help.

We did, same lineup as you, but Kaga instead of Enterprise (merely because I don't like playing Enterprise and it was a concession to get me to play). Short of Enterprise, there isn't exactly a lot Kaga cannot deal with, given the bombers are weaker than Lexingtons and the rockets too, but you can spam planes for days. And the bombers still do ok damage on pretty much anything, including one Cleveland that detonated from the first bomb hit (that game also had a Cossack come around a corner to get nuked by Kaga secondaries at super close range, with too few torps to kill me and a Massa that survived on barely any hp before the enemy CV ended my existence). Overall, the mode to me is about as stupid as the 1v1 ranked, just highlighting how stupid CV vs anything else is. The fun thus is limited on my part when I think of how this is just the start of CVs in these modes, something WG stated they absolutely want to have.

 

Also, I typically stopped doing CB and don't get caled upon anymore for this, but I fear that with how few people play CV, if CVs become a staple, I will get pinged more for this crap again when all others are on leave.

 

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