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HSF Harekaze vs Asashio

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Hello

 

HSF Harekaze  vs  Asashio  which one is better?

 

HSF Harekaze is more (to) expensive. Is she worth it

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It's not even remotely a contest. 

 

Harekaze is superior across the board.

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Incomparable ships, Asashio is extremely specialized BB-CV countership and Harekaze is one of the most universal DDs with great guns (only 100 mm variant is good from three possible builds), great torps and superior concealment.

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5 minutes ago, lafeel said:

It's not even remotely a contest. 

 

Harekaze is superior across the board.

Is she a must buy unique ship

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Just now, Puffin_ said:

Is she a must buy unique ship

If you want the best IJN dd trainer, look no further, you've found it.

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Asashio if you are an absolute muppet, Harekaze if you have a brain. Asashio basically does one job and it does it well, but when that job is no longer needed, it's garbage. "But it can spot and it can shoot things still" some may say, but guess what, every other DD can do that too and ships like Harekaze are just better at it. Harekaze meanwhile is versatile, specialised at nothing except stealth. It has vastly more tools to deal with a variety of situations. It has way less issues defending its ground. Unlike Asashio, Harekaze has to work a bit more for the BB kill (which is truely not the hard part of DD life, is it now?), but will find way fewer times where it is shut out and where it can make impactful plays.

2 minutes ago, Max_Kammerer said:

Incomparable ships, Asashio is extremely specialized BB-CV countership and Harekaze is one of the most universal DDs with great guns (only 100 mm variant is good from three possible builds), great torps and superior concealment.

Keep an obstacle between hull and where Asashio or its torps were last seen and you are pretty much fine. Asashio meanwhile has trouble defending even against T6 CVs that are absolutely stupid, because short of the CV missing, the Asashio has neither flak nor meaningful dps. You can put a fighter overhead and it has issues shooting it down, whereas a Kagero or most other DDs would still kill it. So, yeah, that anti-CV part is a bit questionable and I'd never buy it for anti-CV qualities.

2 minutes ago, Puffin_ said:

Is she a must buy unique ship

No ship is. But Harekaze can be fun.

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They're fairly different. Concealment and maneuverability-wise they're similar enough that the differences won't be noticed. They're both basically Kagero hulls.

 

Depending on which hull you choose, Harekaze is either a slightly worse Kagero, the love child of Kagero and Akizuki or some kind of Japanese-American weirdo hybrid. The 100mm gun option is arguably the best choice after they were buffed to 1/4 calibre HE pen, though. High rate of fire, good ballistics, dual purpose for additional AA power (not that you won't get spanked by any determined CV, but that's just how life is after CV reeeeeework). She's a lot like an Akizuki that trades a gun turret for an additional torpedo tube.

 

Asashio is a potatofarming trolibote that's in most respects identical to Kagero. Same guns (slightly longer maximum range than Kagero, though), same speed and maneuverability. She farms straightlining BBs like nobody else and that's her niche.

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Harekaze is simply a Kagero in better and Asashio is a Kagero with 20km DWT that can only hit BB's and CV's.

IJN DD's had always the issue, that their guns are crap in low and midtier. Harekaze can mount 3 Akizuki turrets and migate somehow those disadvantage. Your Torpedoes are the stock ones from Kagero, but still very potent when they hit. The only drawback is from the 100mm guns they have only a 9.4km base range which is very poor.
Like all IJN Torpedoes you spot them from eternity.
It's a good ship and can be fun for sure and is clearly better in all ways then the Asashio.

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7 minutes ago, Elypse201 said:

IJN DD's had always the issue, that their guns are crap in low and midtier.

Honestly, the 127mm 50/type 3 guns are seriously underrated. While the turrets they're mounted in tend to be rather sluggish (requiring some forethought), the guns are just fine. Good ballistics and excellent HE alpha mean that if you know how to work them you can easily make "better" gunboat DDs regret coming after you. At least from Fubuki and upwards the gun power of IJN "torpedo" DDs is not to be sniffed at.

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14 minutes ago, Elypse201 said:

Harekaze is simply a Kagero in better and Asashio is a Kagero with 20km DWT that can only hit BB's and CV's.

IJN DD's had always the issue, that their guns are crap in low and midtier. Harekaze can mount 3 Akizuki turrets and migate somehow those disadvantage. Your Torpedoes are the stock ones from Kagero, but still very potent when they hit.
Like all IJN Torpedoes you spot them from eternity.
It's a good ship and can be fun for sure and is clearly better in all ways then the Asashio.

In my first Asashio game I had only 30k damage just because red BBs had a brain and avoided all my torps. We still won and I gunned down 2 enemy DDs but if back then there was Harekaze in a shop I'd take it instead of Asashio. It's not even contest.  Asashio still works very good in randoms as a BB tear farmer and area denial ship and spotter skill but if there is CV it's challenging. At least it still has smoke and TRB.  Take Harekaze now while you can, Asashio will remain in the shop probably for a long time.

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30 minutes ago, Puffin_ said:

HSF Harekaze  vs  Asashio  which one is better?

If you're only going to buy one, make it the Harekaze: she's far more versatile, and works well against a much wider range of targets.

 

Harekaze is essentially a Kagero, with better guns (at the expense of having the stock torps), and less embarrassing AA; you also have the option of the different bonuses on the 'cat' cammo.

 

This is from someone who has both; also, Asashio is my most played ship, and I like her enough to also have the Black Friday version as well...

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One more point: While Asashio can work with a standard IJN torp boat skipper, ideally you want a separate captain for her with torpedo acceleration. So she's not a very good trainer.

 

Meanwhile, Harekaze can easily work as a trainer for captains intended for both IJN DD tech tree lines.

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1 minute ago, Puffin_ said:

Do I not need to spend 4 points on ifhe after The 100mm gun option  were buffed to 1/4 calibre HE pen

It makes life easier if you do - I run my IJN 'dakka' DD captain (currently on the T9) with IFHE and it works admirably.

 

Someone who actually remembers armour thicknesses and thresholds can probably easily tell you which extra things get penned with IFHE (I seem to recall that it's less of a slam-dunk skill than it used to be though)...

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BTW - probably a statement of the bleedin' obvious - you need to remember to switch off the AA on Harekaze, whereas you don't on Asashio. Very minor point.

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Another point is that a fun value of DDs went down the drain IMHO since the reeework.

With more and more CV matches  it's increasingly hard to do well and since there are no counters exept very passive gameplay against a good CV, so you will be on the mercy of a MM most of the time. And last weeks looks like there are more and more CV games but it may be related to directives.

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16 minutes ago, Uglesett said:

Good ballistics and excellent HE alpha mean that if you know how to work them you can easily make "better" gunboat DDs regret coming after you. At least from Fubuki and upwards the gun power of IJN "torpedo" DDs is not to be sniffed at. 

From T5 to 8 they have great HE alpha and such but their reload and turret traverse is just way to crap a USN DD will always crap on you in knife fights.
Only Yuugumo and Shima have really good guns imo.

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2 minutes ago, DariusJacek said:

Another point is that a fun value of DDs went down the drain IMHO since the reeework.

With more and more CV matches  it's increasingly hard to do well and since there are no counters exept very passive gameplay against a good CV, so you will be on the mercy of a MM most of the time. And last weeks looks like there are more and more CV games but it may be related to directives.

That's why you play the superior DD line RN DD's

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7 minutes ago, Elypse201 said:

That's why you play the superior DD line RN DD's

Smoke on request is nice, but then it from CV point of view it's perfect timing, you spot DD, he'll smoke, you drop fighter, then quickly drop the ordinance on whatever and come back with a new squadron exactly when the smoke will dissipate.  But then TRB Kagero or Yugumo (I loved them) are shafted way more...

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4 minutes ago, Elypse201 said:

From T5 to 8 they have great HE alpha and such but their reload and turret traverse is just way to crap a USN DD will always crap on you in knife fights.
Only Yuugumo and Shima have really good guns imo.

I disagree.

 

Sure, if you get caught with your pants down close up, you can usually kiss your behind goodbye. You don't want to get into knife fights, though. You want to keep the range open and make use of the better ballistics of the IJN guns. If you play it carefully and manage to bait the enemy into chasing you, you can often trade favourably simply by virtue of actually hitting where floaty US shells have a harder time connecting to a fleeing target.

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9 minutes ago, Elypse201 said:

their reload and turret traverse is just way to crap

As a matter of interest, does anyone use EM on their IJN torp captains?

I was idly wondering about this when re-grinding the line recently, but decided against it...

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30 minutes ago, Elypse201 said:

From T5 to 8 they have great HE alpha and such but their reload and turret traverse is just way to crap a USN DD will always crap on you in knife fights.
Only Yuugumo and Shima have really good guns imo.

Shinonome and Akatsuki do have some solid gunpower for their tier. Sure, in a knife fight you are toast, but so is a Yuugumo vs a Fletcher too. An Akatsuki can put up a very decent fight when it can use its ballistics advantage, same as Yuugumo and Shima.

 

It's like saying a Zao has crap guns, because close up a Des Moines outdpms it and has better turret traverse.

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As many have already stated, Harekaze all the way, it is (in my opinion) the best IJN perm DD, i would be so bold as to say it is the best all round IJN DD not counting Kamikaze. 

:Smile_honoring:

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1 hour ago, Verblonde said:

you also have the option of the different bonuses on the 'cat' cammo.

Which, while it does have a very high weeb factor on an already fairly weeby ship, also does make her better as a trainer due to having an extra commander exp bonus instead of the free exp bonus that the more normal permacamos for her have.

 

For maximum weebness, do like me and have Isoroku (the cat) as one of your IJN DD skippers (I have him on Akizuki currently), and then put him on Harekaze with the Isoroku camo.

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