Tier7 is the new Tier8

[T3ddyBear]

Well it would seem that tier 7's now have the arse end of the MM, all week trying to grind a couple of tier 7's and all we see is tier 9 battles, beyond a joke.

 

I wouldn't mind so much but the top tiers have been awful, 30% players, with 100's of battles in their tier 9's and still no clue what they are doing, just a depressing place to be right now.

 

Tier9's at the bottom of the results screen every game with the tie r7's at the top, what has happened to the player base?

 

TB.

[ColonelPete]

You see Tier IX no more than 40% of the time.

[LordTareq]

Tier 7 is in no way or shape as bad mm-wise as tier 8. There is a big power jump between tier 9 and 10, making it far harder to do well when you are bottom tier as tier 8.

[Bear__Necessities]

1 hour ago, ColonelPete said:

You see Tier IX no more than 40% of the time.

You’d think that. But even I see a huge MM change when playing T7.

 

1 hour ago, LordTareq said:

Tier 7 is in no way or shape as bad mm-wise as tier 8. There is a big power jump between tier 9 and 10, making it far harder to do well when you are bottom tier as tier 8.

 

Yes it is. T8’s against T10 at least had viable consumables and access to modules like concelement. T7’s lack all of that and the cruisers by Boise and Fiji have no heals. Meaning every other cruiser goes up against BB’s and Cruisers all at T9 with heals. Hell, some of the DD’s have  heals and can out DPM and T7 cruiser.

[veslingr]

1 hour ago, ColonelPete said:

You see Tier IX no more than 40% of the time.

I just sont buy this MM statement. In this case it would mean that 60% of games t7 do not see single t 9 ship. I just dont have feeling it is the truth. No hard data but feeling. 

[loppantorkel]

4 minutes ago, Bear_Necessities said:

You’d think that. But even I see a huge MM change when playing T7.

 

 

Yes it is. T8’s against T10 at least had viable consumables and access to modules like concelement. T7’s lack all of that and the cruisers by Boise and Fiji have no heals. Meaning every other cruiser goes up against BB’s and Cruisers all at T9 with heals. Hell, some of the DD’s have  heals and can out DPM and T7 cruiser.

Yea, New Orleans vs Musashis doesn't work as well as one would have hoped. ..and Kitakaze just craps on every possible dd under her. I have to agree to some extent that tier 7 seems to be the new crap tier to avoid now.

[the_crow_96]

You should do at least 20 battles with a ship to calibrate the MM, but overall I see a very good improvement

[MrWastee]

1 hour ago, LordTareq said:

Tier 7 is in no way or shape as bad mm-wise as tier 8. There is a big power jump between tier 9 and 10, making it far harder to do well when you are bottom tier as tier 8.

lolwut?! t8 never really struggled gainst t10, its been the players! also, the jump from t9 to 10 is kinda laughably in comparison to f.e. from t7 to t8... if it's hard for u to prevail as t8 bottom u're doin it wrong imho...

 

@ op:

yeeee.... i dont guess so...

[Endorphin187]

When u are lowtier focus on lategame and dont be target #1 in a combat.

[ColonelPete]

27 minutes ago, veslingr said:

I just sont buy this MM statement. In this case it would mean that 60% of games t7 do not see single t 9 ship. I just dont have feeling it is the truth. No hard data but feeling. 

That is why you should make a list, when you distrust the system...

[veslingr]

Just now, ColonelPete said:

That is why you should make a list, when you distrust the system...

Agreed. 

[DFens_666]

Yep, predicted that when they first announced that change.

 

56 minutes ago, Bear_Necessities said:

Yes it is. T8’s against T10 at least had viable consumables and access to modules like concelement. T7’s lack all of that and the cruisers by Boise and Fiji have no heals. Meaning every other cruiser goes up against BB’s and Cruisers all at T9 with heals. Hell, some of the DD’s have  heals and can out DPM and T7 cruiser.

 

Ive been trying to make this point for years (?)... no, they wont understand this. T6 vs T8 is the worst, followed by T7 vs T9. But sure, average Derpitz player doesnt care - he wants to play his Derpitz to stomp on T6 ships

[illy]

but they fixed the MM.........

[StringWitch]

"T7 is the new T8" has been a common sentiment for the good part of a year already.

[Miscommunication_dept]

The big  armour changes between tier 7 and 8 make it far worse to be a bottom tier tier 7 than tier 8.

At tier 7 every battleship overmatched you but at tier 8 only two can.

 

Cruiser armour increases mean a bottom tier tier 7 will face cruisers that 381mm guns cannot overmatch.

 

I suggested this outcome and that perhaps tier 8 ships are best equipped to deal with being bottom tier due to the way plating stays the same to tier 10.

 

Many didn’t agree, matchmaking changes were made. Now you will be bottom tier in a tier 7 almost as much as a tier 8 but be far less capable of dealing with it.

[Major_Damage225]

19 minutes ago, DFens_666 said:

average Derpitz player doesnt care - he wants to play his Derpitz to stomp on T6 ships

Untill he get's obliterated by a T-61 

[DrMechano]

19 minutes ago, gopher31 said:

The big  armour changes between tier 7 and 8 make it far worse to be a bottom tier tier 7 than tier 8.

At tier 7 every battleship overmatched you but at tier 8 only two can.

 

Cruiser armour increases mean a bottom tier tier 7 will face cruisers that 381mm guns cannot overmatch.

 

I suggested this outcome and that perhaps tier 8 ships are best equipped to deal with being bottom tier due to the way plating stays the same to tier 10.

 

Many didn’t agree, matchmaking changes were made. Now you will be bottom tier in a tier 7 almost as much as a tier 8 but be far less capable of dealing with it.

 

That is a fair point but the problem was that while tier 8 can handle itself well in a tier 10 game it was that tier 8 constantly got thrown into tier 10 matches. This has been sort of resolved (maybe?) but now what you're seeing is that because the tier 9 premiums (musashi, Jean Bart, Missouri, Kron, Alaska, Georgia etc.) are being played because of their credit earning potential being higher than their tier 10 counterparts that more tier 7s are being sucked into tier 9 matches.

[Miscommunication_dept]

Sounds right. Another change Wargaming made was to increase the amount of single tier games. That went a long way towards preventing the games where you would be the only tier 8 in a game of tier 10s.

 

Wargaming have improved this as well as they can but that has made tier 7 a little less fun.

 

 

[Hopeless_Guppy]

I must admit when i see t 9's I i just want to give up,T 7 ships are so weak compared to t9 ships

[Verblonde]

Not an original thought, but for DDs anyway, the issue is the concealment module, or its lack - I've been re-grinding the IJN torp boats lately, and (IMO) the T7 is perhaps the hardest to do well with - compared to the others - as it has about the worst concealment for the line, compared to common opponents.

 

Are there equivalents for the other classes too?

[ColonelPete]

21 minutes ago, Inappropriate_noob said:

I must admit when i see t 9's I i just want to give up,T 7 ships are so weak compared to t9 ships

Yeah, so weak.

[Cambera_1]

59 minutes ago, ColonelPete said:

Yeah, so weak.

There are always exceptions... Even a Zara can perform on occasion!

Being up-tiered in a T7 to a T9 stinks, but no more than a T6 to T8.

 

Still remember the first time I faced an Edinburgh in a Leander:-

Quote

Goose: Didn’t everybody?

Hollywood: Hell no, man. We got our butts kicked.
Wolfman: Thirty seconds. We went like this, he went like that. I said to Hollywood, “Where’d he go?” Hollywood says, “Where’d who go?”
Hollywood: Yeah, and he’s laughing at us, right on the radio, he’s laughing at us.

…

Goose: The defense department regrets to inform you that your sons are dead because they were stupid.

 

[ForlornSailor]

6 minutes ago, Cambera_1 said:

There are always exceptions... Even a Zara can perform on occasion! 

 

Waaaait... waaaaaaait. Only YESTERDAY you have said this:

 

6 minutes ago, Cambera_1 said:

@_HMS_RICHY has shown that a T8 DD with crap AA can survive and thrive in some matches with CVs. His screen shot has shown that at least.

 

So - Yesterday, when it fit the narrative you were pushing, one screenshot was perfectly fine and enough to call out everyone thats disagrees. Now, when it doesnt fit your narrative, one screenshot is "an exception" and worth nothing.

 

You just showed, you are totaly dishonest in any discussion and turn the tables the way you need them. Aint working like that, cought ya.

[Cambera_1]

Just now, ForlornSailor said:

 

Waaaait... waaaaaaait. Only YESTERDAY you have said this:

 

 

So - Yesterday, when it fit the narrative you were pushing, one screenshot was perfectly fine and enough to call out everyone thats disagrees. Now, when it doesnt fit your narrative, one screenshot is "an exception" and worth nothing.

 

You just showed, you are totaly dishonest in any discussion and turn the tables the way you need them. Aint working like that, cought ya.

Sorry - just how is this thread linked to that thread. Other than these screenshots are exceptions to the main thrust of the arguments.

Both the screenshots show nothing that proves a generality, (be that T7s are OP vs T9 or that DDs are OP vs CVs)

A screenshot shows a single instance, point in time.

 

I think you need to look closely at the words you snipped from my comment in relation to the yesterday's thread (Key Words - "Some" and "at least") and the general thrusts of both threads and my contributions to those threads.

You will find that they are consistent. DDs can thrive in some matches with CVs and T7s can do well against T9s. Where is the tension? Where is the contradiction?

 

No can you please explain how your intervention is adding to the discussion about T7s?

[ForlornSailor]

13 minutes ago, Cambera_1 said:

Sorry - just how is this thread linked to that thread.
No can you please explain how your intervention is adding to the discussion about T7s?

 

Ah driving to divert from your bias?

Here is, according to your own ogic from yesterday, you should have said to @ColonelPete:

 

14 minutes ago, Cambera_1 said:

@ColonelPete has shown that a T7 Cruiser can survive and thrive in some matches with T9s. His screen shot has shown that at least.

 

But you didnt.