Nerf Smolensk

[Nexis_Finn]

@tsounts

Why you gave it a "boring"?

 

Am 16.12.2019 um 07:50, ColonelPete sagte:

Woot? 

Smolensk has the perfect guns for DD killing.

One DD-salvo does never onehit a dd. It takes at least 3-5 salvos, depending on how good the bullets do hit the dd.

So it takes at least 13,5 - 22,5 seconds to kill a dd with smolensk. That is much and enough time for the dd to shot torps on the smolensk.

 

Test what you damn before you damn it. It seems you know the "Destroyer vs. Smolensk"-situation only from dd-perspective.

Try the smolensk out, then you will experience that it is not overpowered.

[ColonelPete]

2 hours ago, _Nexis981_ said:

One DD-salvo does never onehit a dd. It takes at least 3-5 salvos, depending on how good the bullets do hit the dd.

So it takes at least 13,5 - 22,5 seconds to kill a dd with smolensk. That is much and enough time for the dd to shot torps on the smolensk.

 

Test what you damn before you damn it. It seems you know the "Destroyer vs. Smolensk"-situation only from dd-perspective.

Try the smolensk out, then you will experience that it is not overpowered.

I can usually do that in a slow firing BB...

And yes, I have seen DD take 9k damage from one Smolensk salvo

[ollonborre]

3 hours ago, _Nexis981_ said:

@tsounts

Why you gave it a "boring"?

 

One DD-salvo does never onehit a dd. It takes at least 3-5 salvos, depending on how good the bullets do hit the dd.

So it takes at least 13,5 - 22,5 seconds to kill a dd with smolensk. That is much and enough time for the dd to shot torps on the smolensk.

 

Test what you damn before you damn it. It seems you know the "Destroyer vs. Smolensk"-situation only from dd-perspective.

Try the smolensk out, then you will experience that it is not overpowered.

The only thing that I have experienced that rip apart a DD faster than a Smolensk is a Minotaur. And the Minotaur has floatier arcs and loose effectiveness once the DD starts turning away, not to mention that AP can't crit as much or set fires.

 

So in a DD killing scenario the Smolensk is quite broken and that is a fact. Sure you can't really selfspot the DD but with all the radars, CV and other DD's that is a moot point. 

[tsounts]

4 hours ago, _Nexis981_ said:

@tsounts

Why you gave it a "boring"?

 

One DD-salvo does never onehit a dd. It takes at least 3-5 salvos, depending on how good the bullets do hit the dd.

So it takes at least 13,5 - 22,5 seconds to kill a dd with smolensk. That is much and enough time for the dd to shot torps on the smolensk.

 

Test what you damn before you damn it. It seems you know the "Destroyer vs. Smolensk"-situation only from dd-perspective.

Try the smolensk out, then you will experience that it is not overpowered.

Trust me if someone knows how to aim and use his guns then HE spamming ship are more effective than AP spamming ones against sinking dds.
You really expect to one shot dds? Try Italian line then but even they need few salvos too at times.

On another note, when you're fighting a dd you expect him to give allow himself getting sunk without trying to hit you? Of course he will torp you, so you should anticipate that, if you don't it's not the ship's problem.

[Nexis_Finn]

Vor 16 Minuten, tsounts sagte:

Trust me if someone knows how to aim and use his guns then HE spamming ship are more effective than AP spamming ones against sinking dds.
You really expect to one shot dds? Try Italian line then but even they need few salvos too at times.

On another note, when you're fighting a dd you expect him to give allow himself getting sunk without trying to hit you? Of course he will torp you, so you should anticipate that, if you don't it's not the ship's problem.

Then you have completely misunderstood me. I am on your side tsounts.

Me do not expect to one-shot a dd with smole. Colonel Pete claims it would be possible to one-shot a dd with smolensk. I doubt that. So no reason to give my previous post (#49) a "boring".

 

What i said in that post is, that it is not possible to oneshot dd's with smolensk. Even if i am a good gunner, i need at least 3-5 salvos to kill a dd. And this is enough time that he can shot his dd-torpedos.

He also complains that a Smolensk would be op against dd's. But it is not op against dd's, he just need to hit the smole with two torps to kill it.

So if he is facing a Smolensk with unready torps, then he will of course lose the battle, because it is tactical not clever to face a smole if his dd has unready torps.

 

Smolensk is not op at all:

Very weak armor, very low torpedo-protection, very low hitpoints (not even twice like a shimakaze), very low base-range (13km on T10!).

He complains the same thing like all mainstream-smolensk-haters: the high firing-rate.

But given the many disadvantages, the high firing-rate is justified.

They should learn to play their classes (dd & bb). To learn tactics could also be advantageous.

 

 

@tsountsEnglish is not my native language, so i think u have just misunderstood my post #49. And i hope i have described it better now.

[ColonelPete]

1 hour ago, _Nexis981_ said:

Me do not expect to one-shot a dd with smole. Colonel Pete claims it would be possible to one-shot a dd with smolensk.

I did not make such a claim. Only under very rare circumstances can a Smolensk oneshot a DD (Detonation).

You were the one claiming that rushing DD mean certain death for Smokensk. I was just surprised by this bold claim. More often it is the other way around...

[Lord_of_Tali]

On 12/16/2019 at 12:14 AM, _Nexis981_ said:

Who says that i use Smolensk with hydro?

And even if i play it sometimes with hydro: who says that it is ready if a whole dd-pack starts rushing?

Sometimes a Smolensk uses hydro to prevent successfull get torped by dd1. If then dd2 comes, hydro has a cooldown.

 

So if a Smolensk get rushed by dd's, it is certainly dead. Because it is not able to kill a dd fast enough. The dd has much time to shot torps before.

A clever Smolensk player with unready hydro does not rush. He can just get unlucky rushed while having a unready hydro.

 

Every clever Smolensk-driver is retreating with a cooling hydro.

If a destoyer-driver is rushing a smolensk which has unready hydro, the smole is very unlucky. Then the smole has no chance.

 

Warships is a tactical shooter like other tactical shooters. You have ever to make the right decisions.

If a retreating Smolensk with unready hydro get rushed by dd, smole will unlucky die. So admittedly it would be a clever dd-move.

But if a dd with unready torps is rushing a smolensk, it will deserved die 

 

So, Wg will not nerf or remove the Smolensk because they do not support untactical moves/playstyle.

 

Because if Smolensk-Battle get rushed by a dd with ready torps, the smolensk will die due to just 2 torps. Because it cannot kill the dd fast enough to prevent torpedo-shooting.

Except the dd is already low-health. But: if a low-health dd is yolo-facing a smole  = -> own fail ... again, because the smole will fire back and deadly 

 

I guess you are dd-driver. So it is on you to evaluate if a smolensk has ready or unready hydro. How to evaluate this? I have no desire and time to be your personal Marine-Tactics-Teacher.

 

Just compare the disadvantages with the advantages, then you will see Smolensk is balanced at all.

 

Disadvantage | Counter/Advantage

Very weak armor | Smoke

Very low hitpoints | Repair

Very low base-range | Very high fire-rate

Very high coal-price (240'000) | ...  ... *scratching head* ... ... ... ... ... *chirping grasshoppers* ... ... ... ... I add it, if i find something 

 

Your opinion is that DDs are the counter for a smolensk? I must have missed the DD line which is able to do that. 

Sure it can eat torps, every ship can eat torps, especially ships who sit in smoke and spam shells - tip for you... to avoid eating torps you should take hydro over AA, since AA is almost useless after recent AA changes. 

 

The only disadvantage is its low HP, but with its range even that is not a problem. 

I did not forget the armour! I dont think it is a disadvantage, because heavy cruisers and BBs will just overpen shooting AP. Try some Training games where you shoot a broadside Smolensk with a BB compared to DM, Mino or Worcester and watch the results. 

For a completely overpowered ship the price is not even high. 

 

I will explain what I meant with counter:

 

A ship that can beat another ship in 1vs1 because of a special ability.... 

like BBs AP overpen, Henri IFHE DPM, DDs Concealment and torps, Smolensk HE DPM

 

In my opinion a Smolensk if played correctly and skilled in the right way,  can beat every other ship in the game. This should be changed! 

 

[kreischendeFruchtfliege]

I hope smolensk will be harder nerfed... it feels not quite good to see it will maybe get 16mm plating instead of 30 on the cassemate.

-This will just get the shells even more not armed.

and 1/2 on the firechance could be even not enough at 200-400 shells per game...

-that just will destroy other builds for other ships

 

they should remove the range-upgrade for the smolensk, that one they removed for khaba years ago.

would be enough

 

[almitov]

Maximum damage for Smolensk HE on a DD is exactly 13728 per salvo. This is if all shells hit and the DD is not damage saturated. In 95% of cases the damage will be less than that. This means that while Smolensk can't 1-shot a DD (except for ammo detonation), it can easily 2-shot it up close. If the DD is not already aiming its torps at the Smolensk, there's a good chance it will not launch any metal fishes at all.

 

Now on the main topic - Smolensk is game breaking and I will be really happy if it is removed from the game. It serves as the ultimate deterrent - no ship wants to get within its range and the game easily becomes a campfest. Another problem with this ship is the overpen exploit - the only way for a BB to delete a broadside Smolensk up close is to load HE. AP just overpenetrates and gives it enough time to hide behind cover. The ship is just too forgiving for mistakes while punishing enemies hard for theirs.

Also, someone mentioned its lack of range as a drawback - it can be boosted by AFT and the range upgrade, reaching over 19km! Of course the shells become quite floaty at such distance but you can still hit BBs somewhat reliably. The ship just has too many strengths and only a few weaknesses that can be mitigated easily.

[kreischendeFruchtfliege]

4 hours ago, almitov said:

Maximum damage for Smolensk HE on a DD is exactly 13728 per salvo. This is if all shells hit and the DD is not damage saturated. In 95% of cases the damage will be less than that. This means that while Smolensk can't 1-shot a DD (except for ammo detonation), it can easily 2-shot it up close. If the DD is not already aiming its torps at the Smolensk, there's a good chance it will not launch any metal fishes at all.

 

Now on the main topic - Smolensk is game breaking and I will be really happy if it is removed from the game. It serves as the ultimate deterrent - no ship wants to get within its range and the game easily becomes a campfest. Another problem with this ship is the overpen exploit - the only way for a BB to delete a broadside Smolensk up close is to load HE. AP just overpenetrates and gives it enough time to hide behind cover. The ship is just too forgiving for mistakes while punishing enemies hard for theirs.

Also, someone mentioned its lack of range as a drawback - it can be boosted by AFT and the range upgrade, reaching over 19km! Of course the shells become quite floaty at such distance but you can still hit BBs somewhat reliably. The ship just has too many strengths and only a few weaknesses that can be mitigated easily.

Not alone the damage per salvo

 

fires,engine smokes,weapons go offline....

prepare for leaving your Destroyer if you see a smolensk....

 

[kreischendeFruchtfliege]

This ship (smolensk) is a nightmare for every class in battle

CV? - enough power to shred cv planes.

DDS? - can spot them,yeah at a range which is uncomfortable to stay.

CA/CL? - yes ,they could do something(Moskwa,Worcester,Des Moines....) but mostly they are detected and have a long time to get death by smolensk IFHE shells.

BBS? - nope,they just burn,or get flooded if they reach the smoke.

[Luke6_31]

GET THE NERF BAT OUT FOR THIS SHIP/REMOVE IT FROM THE GAME/GIVE US THE OPTION TO NEVER PLAY AGINST IT

[Luke6_31]

NERF THIS [edited] SHIP TWATS!!!! REMOVE IFHE FOR IT!! DO SOMETHING TWATBUCKETS!!!

 

[BarskiPatzow]

I think that a 2 sec reload nerf and a 2% chance for fires would be enough to nerf it to a level that is ok. 

Armor is fine, it is in a position that makes other cruisers a counter to it. 

[MRGTB]

On 11/12/2019 at 12:12 PM, Mrs_Ragdoll said:

They need to nerf it hard or remove it from the game.

They won't nerf it as a premium. Reason why Enterprise CV was not nerfed and instead removed from sale. The only way it would be nerfed is when game mechanics change. Like how Graff Zep got nerfed on speed because CV game mechanics was changed.

 

But about HE spam. I'm starting to wonder if not enough people at one point was playing Cruisers, why they have since brought out all these HE spam ones. I was playing a BB yesterday in two games and got wiped off the map with focused Cruiser HE both times. I was annoyed enough second time to jump on my T10 Brit CV next game and went for Cruisers all match.

[ColonelPete]

44 minutes ago, GTB1964 said:

They won't nerf it as a premium. ..

She is not a premium. She is a reward ship.

[MRGTB]

Ah fair enough. So what is the Puerto Rico classed as then? Seeing as it was a comp ship. Is it a proper premium with extra premium earnings built-in. Or just the same as a T10 stock ship with premium camo put on it with earnings.

 

Been looking at it on and off, but want to know if it's just the same as a stock T10 ship with premium camo on earnings. Not worth bothering if it is just the same. Already have 3 T10 stock ships with prem camo on them.

[Pazerna]

deleted this crap ship no fun from play  3 min fight kurfurs and im dead nice balance

 

[anonym_CiIaNdihGZ1A]

pls nerf Smolens and buff the Colbert !!

[Ysterpyp]

Top ships in wr last 28 days by average to good players , Smolensk way at the bottom.

 

Guess mostly bad players play it?

[Pegasus2022]

The most unfun ship to play against. Sits at 16km and spams the HE crap out of you for the next 10 minutes of the game from smoke.

Then evades all your shells etc etc and when it does take two 18" HE broadsides it sits there and takes 7k damage each time like it doesn't care.

 

You could at least try to hide your massive patriotic favritism WG. It's really, really sad that you need to buff everything Russian so much. It's like your making up for somthing. We all know reality.

 

Smolensk should not get hydro and smoke given its HE fireing range and spam. It should not be able to detect torps in its smoke if it wants to be able to spam HE at targets 18km away.

[captain_fonky]

The only nerf to smolensk should be remove its torps. Is someone afraid of a friesland ? No because you can rush him without fear. Same would apply to a smol without torps.

That would be a huge nerf indeed.

[Pegasus2022]

Eeminder this ship needs a nerf

 

Also i'd like o see shell velocity and ddispersion of Smol VS Mino.

 

Why take a Mino when a Smol is better in every way.....

[HaachamaShipping]

On 3/8/2020 at 1:40 AM, Pegasus2022 said:

Then evades all your shells etc etc and when it does take two 18" HE broadsides it sits there and takes 7k damage each time like it doesn't care.

14k damage is almost half its hp pool. Arguing "it doesn't care" is a bit silly.

5 hours ago, Pegasus2022 said:

Why take a Mino when a Smol is better in every way.....

Mino is better vs DDs and has a better chance against cruisers. Also, Mino can stealth torp with 8 torps per side. Minotaur, if it gets to use AP on ships has higher effective dpm, unless Smol has BFT and reload mod (in which case it outdpms Mino very slightly, but half run range mod), but with AP that hits harder and has better ricochet angles.

 

Mino has a higher skill floor.

[tobbelobbe_1]

Friggin BB mains go play sims if all you like is to sail around and shoot twice a minute for 20 min and hide at the end of the map.