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willkham

Why everyone hate CV players ?

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Everytime we lose it's always in the chat "idiot CV" or "noob CV".

I can be the first of my team on the leadboard, getting kraken or being the first at everything people will still say it's my fault or that I'm brain dead or something.

 

Why everyone hate CV ? I don't get it.

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You know there was this great idea from WG to change CV's from RTS to .... something else. Before the 30.01.19 it was more a type of Real Time Strategy Game then World of Warships. Was kind hard to get used to it and the skill gap was very huge. Also it was the least populated class by far.

To solve those problems WG reworked the CV to make them more casual and more populated. At release they were.....a little bit OP that's why everyone played them and the AA was not existend.

WG made some changes to the AA and CV's but the main problems are not solved that's for some point : You have no Downtime, in the old CV's everytime a squadron came back it needed time that you can use it again. Nowadays you can just use them again. Also the new CV's got rocket planes which everybody loves and are not strong or brainless at all.

Tl;dr

New CV's are way more casual and DMG focused then the old ones and way easier to play, to a variety of different planes and no downtimes. Also unlike the old CV's you can't protect teammates very well for enemy planes except the dumb NPC Fighters.

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Long story short:

 

CV rework is hated by most.  And as such, CV captains are getting the brunt of it.

 

They are classed as too strong with broken AA mechanics, people don't like being droped on with or without  AA.  Add the fact that WG has said they are finished with tweaking them has added fuel to the fire as they are far far far from being balanced and fixed. it's a selfish ship that more often then not focus on damage farming.  For the first time, either side likes CV's, neither friend or foe. 

 

Then you have CV's like the OP Enterprise and tier 4 seal clubber Hosh which just adds to the pot of hate

 

You simply have to get used to it mate IMHO.  It isnt going to ease up.  Oh you will have people say this and that, normally those that are currently mopping the floor with them with increased WR's but generally, they are hated. Just the way it is. 

 

People don't like getting hit by things they cant stop. 

 

People also remember the old RTS and expect to stop planes stone dead when AA spec and they cant anymore without blobbing into like 3-4 ships. So you also have old RST players unhappy with the way things turned out.

 

Don't let any of that stop you playing them though, it's your time.  But you have to understand and expect why you are hated by most, read this forum might give you a good idea. 

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Well the myth is still out there that surface ships can't do anything against CVs. 

They can group up, play with their AA focus, whether to turn it on at all, use def AA on some ships, dodge and everything, but people think its unfair that you should have to play against a CV while you generally can't see the CV ship itself in battle. 

They kind of forget that the aircraft are basically the ship for the CV player. The ship is just an extra mechanic of taking the player out, but when you shoot down a squad of aircraft, that squad won't deal any damage anymore. 

Of course you can then deploy a new squad, but that ends at some point. Problem is that most people don't realise that you can actually run out of aircraft. 

And basically thats why some people hate CVs. 
 

Edit: okay, some people seem to not like that i say this, yet i truly find that i hardly ever struggle with playing AGAINST CVs and i am definitely a surface ship main. 
But please, elaborate what your problems are with CVs then, am i completely wrong or whats up with you guys?

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I see you just started playing (about 300 battles ago)? And you're currently on the T4 carriers?

 

Well ... the more you learn about the game the more you see which mechanics allow for a counter mechanic and which mechanics do not. In general it is to keep mechanics that have no (or only very little) counter mechanics as low as possible (e.g. detonation, sure there's a signal to stop detonation, but quite a lot players don't have the means to get such a signal - or run out of these signals).

 

CV's tend to fall in the later category. You can deal damage for your team, you can spot, you can kill off any (but primarily low HP) targets low HP targets. But you can not protect your team mates (e.g. denying the enemy CV a strike). CV's tend to be played rather egoistical. And if you farm damage slower than your enemy in his CV, your team will fall death to a long "death of a thousand cuts".

 

In short: One can say there are two games: Surface ships interacting with each other, and CV's falling prey onto all surface ships, without any (or at least only with very little) chance for the surface ships to do something against the CV.

 

Hence why a lot of players feel rather uncomfortable (to word it nicely) to even have a CV in the game.

 

 

Then they see on youtube that Super Unicums in a CV can turn around games for them whereas a Super Unicum in any other ship class could've not been able to pull that off. Which indicates how powerfull CV's can be.

 

 

So either your team mates are salty that you are not as good as a Super Unicum in your CV to grant them a win. OR they are salty because you're playing a class that they feel adds nothing but misery to the game.

 

 

Either way: Decide for yourself if you can live with the salt or not. Albeit from reporting them via the ingame system, there's little you can do, as quite a lot players hate CV's on principle.

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2 minutes ago, Allied_Winter said:

ou can deal damage for your team, you can spot, you can kill off low HP targets.

or just dev strike with AP bombs in the first minutes some cruisers because you give a ffffff about Anti Air

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1 minute ago, Elypse201 said:

or just dev strike with AP bombs in the first minutes some cruisers because you give a ffffff about Anti Air

True ... will reword my post.

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It's not that everyone hates CVs but the rework has done a lot to increase the hate towards CVs. This is in part due to the fact that CVs now are pure damage dealers players do not really feel assisted by the friendly CVs. 

 

Bad balancing by WG (although that does swing back and forth with various patches) who rushed the rework onto the live server has done nothing to help the situation either, take the current state of Hosho as an example. 

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7 minutes ago, Redcap375 said:

Long story short:

 

CV rework is hated by most.  And as such, CV captains are getting the brunt of it.

 

They are classed as too strong with broken AA mechanics, people don't like being droped on with or without  AA.  Add the fact that WG has said they are finished with tweaking them has added fuel to the fire as they are far far far from being balanced and fixed. it's a selfish ship that more often then not focus on damage farming.  For the first time, either side likes CV's, neither friend or foe. 

 

Then you have CV's like the OP Enterprise and tier 4 seal clubber Hosh which just adds to the pot of hate

 

You simply have to get used to it mate IMHO.  It isnt going to ease up.  Oh you will have people say this and that, normally those that are currently mopping the floor with them with increased WR's but generally, they are hated. Just the way it is. 

 

People don't like getting hit by things they cant stop. 

In my experience, as a CV player but obviously surface main (roughly 82% surface vs 18% CV) AA is definitely on the strong side at the moment, it is not at all weak. 

Initially AA was weak, but now there are complete no-fly zones again, there are even single ships that you cannot engage at all- i got a HuangHe two days ago and most tier 8 carriers don't get near it, while it doesnt have that great AA- but AA is in a good spot now. 

It is such that a lone BB , low AA cruiser or DD can easily be hurt by a CV with little losses, although even the weakest destroyers will still take aircraft down. But it is also such that if you think about AA as a surface ship player you can easily go the entire battle without taking any significant damage whatsoever. 

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CVs were always hated, its just the "Jugement of heaven" approach that tics people off I guess...

 

In both RTS and rework:

1. If enemy cv drops your ally - its your fault for not preventing it

2. If you kill an enemy - "frag stealer"

3. If you dont kill an enemy - "usless noob"

4. If you die quick becouse you pushed - "a brainded moron"

5. If you are last alive - "camping :etc_swear:"

...

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58 minutes ago, Isoruku_Yamamoto said:

In my experience, as a CV player but obviously surface main (roughly 82% surface vs 18% CV) AA is definitely on the strong side at the moment, it is not at all weak. 

 

Apologises but i simply stopped reading there because it's BS. Sorry if that sounds harsh. 

 

When i'm getting dropped with AP Haka (or tier 8 Enterprise for that matter) bombs that strip 1/2 my health off with 2 salvos drops.  All whilst i'm running full AA spec with defensive AA running with mods and captain skills and sector, you know something is wrong, really wrong.

 

You dropped AP bombs on the Mino? Nasty and you ALWAYS get the drop.  Been there, done that. 

 

Unlike as before (RTS) when a fully AA spec Des would SHRED planes.  People like to know that their captains skills they pick make a difference, they currently don't. 

 

but of course, you know that. :cap_like:

 

 

 

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3 minutes ago, Isoruku_Yamamoto said:

In my experience, as a CV player but obviously surface main (roughly 82% surface vs 18% CV) AA is definitely on the strong side at the moment, it is not at all weak. 

AA is the weakest it has been since early 0.8.0 versions. It's laughable how garbage it is.

5 minutes ago, Isoruku_Yamamoto said:

Initially AA was weak, but now there are complete no-fly zones again, there are even single ships that you cannot engage at all- i got a HuangHe two days ago and most tier 8 carriers don't get near it, while it doesnt have that great AA- but AA is in a good spot now. 

No, most CVs are just terrible.

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Now before everybody gets off the rails: I shall remind you that this post is NOT to discuss why CV's are good/bad/OP/UP/immune to AA/not immune to AA. That's what the general CV discussion thread is for.

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7 minutes ago, Allied_Winter said:

Now before everybody gets off the rails: I shall remind you that this post is NOT to discuss why CV's are good/bad/OP/UP/immune to AA/not immune to AA. That's what the general CV discussion thread is for.

 

@Allied_Winter as a moderator, you have to except that one will always lead to the other.

 

He is asking why, and we are explaining it to him honestly.  You can not separate the two.

 

You also have to except that many see that "CV discussion" as nothing more than a trash bin, there to stop threads like this appearing too much as It doesn't show a great corporate image does it?

 

If it gets out of control then fine, but right now it's harmless. 

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As someone harshly wrote on reddit:

 

Quote
https://www.reddit.com/r/WorldOfWarships/comments/dc2wvm/this_has_been_on_my_mind_for_awhile/f25v5h4/

 

Imagine you're a man fighting another man in a bar fight. This is fairly even terms and an engagement that you can either avoid or participate in - you have a choice here and some counter play. All of a sudden, while you have your hands full, some snitch from the corner sneaks in and steals your wallet. That sad snitch taking cheap shots is the carrier gameplay. You think people are going to pass up the chance to delete the annoying thing that has been niggling them all game?

You can angle, you can change ammo types, you can maybe use concealment to your advantage. As a unicum, I will take almost any 1v1 engagement with confidence. I can't run from planes, I can't stealth up, they're too fast. I can only hope to shoot them down with the vast array of costly and 90% useless AA Skills on offer.

WG are happy with this, they just changed the amount from $1 per attack to 20c per attack. Because they balance their spreadsheet on numbers, and you can't measure frustration. Either way it's still cheap, cheesy and gutless, and WG realise they need a griefing mechanic to cater for the bottom of the society who want all the benefits but commit to half of the risk so they can feel powerful at one stage of the day in their meaningless lives.

  1. CVs have too much power and not enough weaknesses. Have you sprung a CV in bad spot in a DD and tried to kill it with guns? It's almost impossible before easy drool-on-your-keyboard Rockets kill you. Imagine being superman with the power to help everyone, but he lets your family member die. You play CV, you take on this responsibility.

"over extending" is just "flanking" when there isn't a CV in game. The fact that the presence of one ship in the game ruins a whole state of play and makes 50% of the positions on a whole map unviable should tell you how ridiculously busted this class is.

  • Biggest threat hmm. You can spot A cap then D cap within 20 seconds of each other, or with a fighter you can do it simultaneously while remaining full health and realistically entertaining no risk at all.

You can strike me and I hit defensive AA. You might lose planes. So you come back 30 seconds later with another full squad of a different type when I have no defensive AA anymore. Which, by the way, is a useless consumable because it's been nerfed. Heaven forbid, a CV would be punished for mistakes like a surface ship gets!

You get to strike who you like when you like, on terms that you dictate. Me as a DD, I have to wait a minute for my torps to come back up, get in a spot with a firing solution, hope I don't get radared or spotted by enemy DD. You in a CV, press 1 twice, count to 30, and hit a Worcester with Rockets for 7k damage. Imagine a DD being radared and shot by 5 ships and pressing F to recall his ship to spawn, losing 5% of his health while being magically teleported to the sky. What a ridiculously retarded concept this is. I made a mistake and got surprised by a Minotaur aura and now I can get out of jail almost for free. The audacity to have this mechanic implemented in a game!

Sure it might cost you, but it costs you no health or your team no points overall. While your planes are regenerating (I don't really care how slow it is, it's still retarded) you send out another squad. You get to accumulate free damage on ships who are trying to play a different game on the surface.

People hate CVs because they are subject to different parameters to every other ship in the game. You are subject to different laws for the dictation of engagements, the dealing of damage, and the receiving of damage. By any objective context, the way CV's are implemented is disgusting and they don't belong.

Imagine being Mike Tyson and turning up to your boxing match and you're fighting 11 disabled children. And then imagine not even feeling bad about it, like a real c*nt, as you ruin the next 20 minutes for people who are just trying to shoot some boats.

Understand that even if you do 19k damage in a midway, and score bottom of the team, you have made the game miserable - AUTOMATICALLY - for a significant percentage of the players in that game SIMPLY BY QUEUEING IN A CV. Because the enemy has to face a spot bot, and your team has to face the one that queued against you.

Consider all of this and then you're wondering why people are mad at you...

 

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30 minutes ago, willkham said:

I can be the first of my team on the leadboard, getting kraken or being the first at everything people will still say it's my fault or that I'm brain dead or something.

 

Average playerbase has the map awareness like a slice of bread... meaning, they cant comprehend anyway what happened in the game. But they still wanna blame someone, and if they get screwed by the enemy CV, they gonna blame you since you are playing CV aswell, so you are part of the problem why they have to deal with a CV.

 

On the other hand, maybe they are right and you are doing the wrong stuff? getting a kraken doesnt mean that you did the right things. Maybe you killed a target, which was under heavy fire/burning and would have died anyway. Instead, you could have hunted that DD who was torping your teammates. Just guessing, but these things do happen.

 

Ive recently played Enterprise in Sprint, and didnt get any hate so far from my team. On the contrary, some thanked me. And got more hate from the enemy team :Smile_teethhappy:

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Very simple: most CV captains are actually fairly crap but they get to make mistake after mistake and somehow still get to play up to the end of the round. The speed of planes makes being spotted by them unpredictable so reliable stealth gameplay can be disrupted by just a fluke and random chance.

For some bizarre reason CV's are exempt from being punished for their mistakes. They take very litttle skill to operate, are boring to play and are disruptive with even the biggest nub on it's helm. They have magic repairs, magic fighters magic armor, magic fire resistance, all to make sure even the biggest idiot can stay afloat. Why keeping idiots afloat seems to be important to WG is beyond me.

 

The CV rework has been the biggest failure gameplay wise, lower tiers are unplayable due to 4 and 6 carrier games and WG is silent on the problems that arose.

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6 minutes ago, MrFingers said:

As someone harshly wrote on reddit:

 

Some of the best accurate stuff I have read for a long time. Harsh but fair.

 

He/she is spot on and EVERYONE should read this, regardless of your feelings. 

 

OP, it sums it up nicely. 

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If you are bottom tier a CV can take you out of the game very quickly. Not fair, the MM put you as CV fodder.

A good CV player can influence the game outcome as much as a bad CV player.

When someone gets the bad CV player in their team it is just infuriating.

CVs are usually the last to die, here is where things get pretty stupid very quickly.

 

And 4 CV battles when your team gets the TWO BAD players...

 

Personally I just can't bear CVs, they change the game too much and there is not real counter like grouping, etc, that does not last and it depends a lot on having, not a good team but an excellent team behind.

 

I give +1 to the good CV captain and make sure the bad one gets a -1 in karma every single time, so they learn their lesson. Be good or use another ship. 

 

That's why I do not play CVs anymore, is boring and I was very bad at them :)

 

 

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22 minutes ago, lovelacebeer said:

It's not that everyone hates CVs but the rework has done a lot to increase the hate towards CVs. This is in part due to the fact that CVs now are pure damage dealers players do not really feel assisted by the friendly CVs. 

 

Bad balancing by WG (although that does swing back and forth with various patches) who rushed the rework onto the live server has done nothing to help the situation either, take the current state of Hosho as an example. 

I agree here, it's frustrating how little cvs can now deal with enemy planes. Most just drop fighters as a bullet sponge to protect their attack groups. I used to love c.v play and the change meant I was no longer a team or strategic player, so all my c.v lines were cashed in. 

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38 minutes ago, willkham said:

Everytime we lose it's always in the chat "idiot CV" or "noob CV".

I can be the first of my team on the leadboard, getting kraken or being the first at everything people will still say it's my fault or that I'm brain dead or something.

 

Why everyone hate CV ? I don't get it.

Been playing DDs a fair bit recently and its amazing how easy it is for a CV to rape  DD at the start of every game, unless they use a smoke to hide and hope the endless supply of planes goes away to do something else..... because that's exactly what your smoke is for - to hide in the 2nd minute of the game from certain death like all other ships have to. 

I mean, look at the CV< right from the first second of the game it has to worry about being instantly deleted in a fun and engaging manner by "tiny tims" or other aimless rocket systems..and its not like DDs have anything else to do for the team is it?

Or the "specialised AA crusiers" that cant even defend themselves from normal or slingshot attacks... let alone protect other ships from the, literally, endless supply of planes the "its dangerous at the back" CV is constantly streaming out.

Or the CV player that says "Look Im at the top of the score sheet", ignoring the fact that he/she ahs had the most time to actually cause damage as its the rest of the team getting hammered by the enemy CV and not him.. because his CV "is the safest by far of any ship in the game from air attack" - oh the irony.

Having bene away from the game for the entirety of the CV changes, coming back to the current state is absolutely hilarious in so far as "WG fixed CVs"....

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For me the matter is rather simple. When I want to attack someone in a cruiser, or a battleship or a destroyer I have to face the fact that I can be attacked in return. There's always a risk versus reward factor to take into consideration with every action. CV's seem to be mostly if not completely exempt from that. They can reach out and touch pretty much anyone on the map with little to no risk to themselves. 

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4 minutes ago, DFens_666 said:

 

Ive recently played Enterprise in Sprint, and didnt get any hate so far from my team. On the contrary, some thanked me. And got more hate from the enemy team :Smile_teethhappy:

This is the comedy irony - play a CV well and you get more compliments than in anything else

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38 minutes ago, Isoruku_Yamamoto said:

They can group up

 

Yea? Thats the propper way to play? Look at the "funny things with screenshots" topic - you will regulary see posts, where one entire team blobbs up on the corner of the map. Such awesome gameplay. Ignoring the objetives, giving up control over 95% of the map and losing the game within 6 mins - BUT SURVIVED - THANK GOD!! Seriously, if thats the direction the game is going, im going to deinstall. Waste of time.

 

 

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