Why WoWS creates toxic players and fix

[G01ngToxicCommand0]

For starters: I am very competetively minded and I am not a magnanimous loser. There is nothing I hate more than losing due to other people not caring or being inept/incompetent.
With that in mind I will proceed with the subject in hand.

Barring one battle today I have exclusively played tier 10.

Result after 22 battles played including a win on tier 5: 4 victories and 14 losses for a massive lossrate of 77,78%.
Lossrate for tier 10 exclusively is a whopping 82,35%.

The reason for the lossrate is this:

 

Players like the above playing in tier 10, even had one today with a Yamato with 591 PvP battles under his belt.
 

After such a string of battles I am ready to commit murder on my fellow players. And my tolerance for other human beings is lowered each time I am subjected to the violation from players whose selfish desire for selfgratification to the expence of their fellow players' game experience.

 

World of Warships clearly and logically only has one sole purpose: to grind ships to tier 10. Creating a competetive game where skill matters and having fun is obviously not a priority for Wargaming, otherwise the game would have been structered differently with game mechanics to match a competetive enviroment and e-Sports.

 

The above experience creates substantial friction between the inept, inexperienced and incompetent players on one side and the experienced, competent and good players on the other to the frustration of all.

 

Since I do not believe Wargaming will limit the first group in playing high tier battles or create a skill or league based matchmaking I have a simple suggestion that in no way will affect the game's balance but should, hopefully, orient the players' focus on grinding tech trees without worrying about win/loss rates.
 

What I am suggestion is that Wargaming removes all player stats with the exception of: total battles played, average tier and average XP/battle from the players profile, so that only Wargaming have access to winrates and the rest of the players' stats.
 

With this in mind the players don't have to worry about losing streaks as the only thing that really matters when playing are XP and credits. Sure it will still suck to lose but the individual players will not be cogniscient about it and it wouldn't matter for the game purposes anyway. I assume that some players will still act toxic no matter what meassures are taken to reduce that.

 

With regards to clans the available stats will still clearly show which players are good, average or bad so it will not change anything when recruiting.

Thoughts?

[Floofz]

Youll get a lot of hate from fellow forum users for this.

However I think youre right. I think there should be two separate game modes. One ranked and one random. In ranked stats should be tracked and there should be different leagues etc sort of like in starcraft. In random battles everything should be hidden and not matter. I know I would play a LOT more if I had a relaxing game mode where I didnt constantly worry about getting angry. 

[DFens_666]

I dont understand what id gain from this?

Even if it doesnt show my stats, doesnt make it less bad if i keep losing (like today was such a day f.e.). In the end, i still play to win even if it wouldnt get tracked.

 

For me, grinding was never the most important thing in this game (obviously, i barely have 5 TX silver ships, just FreeXPed the Montana few days ago )

It should be enjoyable, not a chore. But most of the time, its teammates doing some stupid crap which brings down my enjoyment. And i dont need stats telling me that. I can see how they play what will happen. BB reversing in spawn, DD going for the mapborder and ignoring caps, Cruiser going broadside to the mapcenter... Ive seen French/Russian Cruisers steaming to the center, and i call "xx first to die" works like a charm. Its just obvious that they will die the way they play.

 

The only way, to make the game less toxic, is the other option you mentioned. And we both know, WG will never do it.

 

Spoiler

 

Friesland - my team - nuff said.

1. Why would you invest >100€ on a game which you barely played? This is way more than what a normal game costs.

2. WG allowing this is quite obvious "WEEEEH MORE MONEY FOR US"

3. It creates toxicity among other players who care for teamplay. Those people just dont care because the game doesnt even tell them that they are being horrible. Can you blame someone for being bad at a game which he barely played? No. Can you blame him playing the game at a tier where he has no business being at? Nope, dont think so. So its WG who are at fault because they allow this.

[Skitzo_Sam]

The only way to make the game less toxic is to get rid of people like you as it seems you are the Toxic one.

 

I do agree with this tho

 

What I am suggestion is that Wargaming removes all player stats with the exception of: total battles played, average tier and average XP/battle from the players profile, so that only Wargaming have access to winrates and the rest of the players' stats.

[TeaAndTorps]

Ooorrrr, and hear me out, people who start to feel homicidal over a video game could make time in their lives to learn how to process their emotions in a healthier manner?

[Profilus]

1 hour ago, G01ngToxicCommand0 said:

Players like the above playing in tier 10, even had one today with a Yamato with 591 PvP battles under his belt.

You would still be mad at this pkayer even if 0 stats are available because YOU SEE WHAT HE DOES/DOESN'T IN BATTLE WITH HIM. So your solution isn't working at all.

[DanSilverwing]

Basically you want all accounts to be Private by default. And maybe choose to make them Public to flex?

 

As opposed to the default of making all accounts Public, so players who choose to make their accounts Private and hide their stats from view are assumed to be doing so to hide poor performance.

 

Fine.

[TheAlba2014]

1 hour ago, G01ngToxicCommand0 said:

What I am suggestion is that Wargaming removes all player stats with the exception of: total battles played, average tier and average XP/battle from the players profile, so that only Wargaming have access to winrates and the rest of the players' stats.

Perhaps not attach so much importance to your personal or other players stats?

 

Thoughts?

 

Go out for a walk maybe, get help with anger management issues, have something else to focus on other than a game?

[thiextar]

 

1 hour ago, G01ngToxicCommand0 said:

What I am suggestion is that Wargaming removes all player stats with the exception of: total battles played, average tier and average XP/battle from the players profile, so that only Wargaming have access to winrates and the rest of the players' stats.
 

With regards to clans the available stats will still clearly show which players are good, average or bad so it will not change anything when recruiting.

Thoughts?

in no universe is that even close to being enough to tell if a player is good enough to recruit or not. The stats we currently have are barely enough...

 

We need more stats, not less. Specifically we need a stat for percentual damage, so we can work it into pr(instead of raw damage), and i would also love a stat for adjusted winrate(weighing the winrate of all a players ships vs the server average, thus creating an adjusted winrate thats normalised no matter what ships a player plays)

[invicta2012]

2 hours ago, G01ngToxicCommand0 said:

After such a string of battles I am ready to commit murder on my fellow players. And my tolerance for other human beings is lowered each time I am subjected to the violation from players whose selfish desire for selfgratification to the expence of their fellow players' game experience.

 

World of Warships clearly and logically only has one sole purpose: to grind ships to tier 10. Creating a competetive game where skill matters and having fun is obviously not a priority for Wargaming, otherwise the game would have been structered differently with game mechanics to match a competetive enviroment and e-Sports.

We have a competitive environment. It's a PvP game. But single leagues, mixing in the best and the worst, don't work for anyone.

 

Here's a suggestion. Make the Ranked Sprint format a competition in its own right (complete a Sprint at all Tiers, in order) and also qualifier for actual Ranked battles. You don't unlock, say, Tier VII Ranked battles until you've completed Tiers III-VII Ranked Sprints and have a Silver Tech Tree ship of at least Tier VII. Anyone who can't complete the necessary sprints, can't enter into the next Ranked season. That means people can't buy High Tier ships in the shop and try learning to play in high tier competitive events. That will give experienced the competitive  Ranked they want and allow less experienced players to "find their level" in Sprint competition without failing hard in the serious leagues.  

[lovelacebeer]

Not a perfect solution but just my 2 cents input, may I suggest playing on the PTS at weekends, whilst I concede the gameplay on the PTS can be more than a tad odd at times it's still far less frustrating that the standard weekend of teams snatching defeat from the jaws of victory. 

 

As for the whole stats thing I admit I tend not too look at stats. But whether you can see a players stats or not, your still going to be stuck with some right pillocks. All you can do is play at your best and try to compensate for the worst teammates, seeing their stats or not won't change the fact they are out there. Still OP I feel your pain for having such a frustrating day hence my first suggestion try the PTS it's a good escape from weekend gamers. 

[illy]

the weakest link of any online is the player base, in all the games i've ever played it's always been a constant, i played 4 today and lost 4, played decently and just decided to stop as it wasn't fun, plus we had a Stalingrad that decided he had a radar that could detect DDs 20km away......sometimes it's better not to play than get angry about it

[G01ngToxicCommand0]

53 minutes ago, Profilus said:

You would still be mad at this pkayer even if 0 stats are available because YOU SEE WHAT HE DOES/DOESN'T IN BATTLE WITH HIM. So your solution isn't working at all.

That is true, bad players will always be recognised, but while being utterly oblivious to my own winrate I am free to pursue making as much XP as possible without having to worry about winning or losing. And yes that could mean more selfish play from the players but then that wouldn't matter one bit anyway.

I can only speak for myself obviously but from past experience in online games where the only stats where K/D and global rating winning or losing didn't upset or matter that much to me.

That would apply to me as well if the winrate stats were utterly removed from the random battles in WoWS. I would be free just to play and not spend a lot of energy focusing on winning or losing.

I assume that will apply to others as well but to what extent I can't know.

 

[El2aZeR]

WG makes money off of creating a toxic environment, thus they'll never do anything to change that.

[LemonadeWarriorITA]

Understandable, but if you want to be gut play Dota 2 or CS. This is just a game for 50 year old people

[Profilus]

1 hour ago, G01ngToxicCommand0 said:

That is true, bad players will always be recognised, but while being utterly oblivious to my own winrate I am free to pursue making as much XP as possible without having to worry about winning or losing.

Why do stats make YOU care about winning or losing? If all you want is xp then just farm damage and be happy?

Ppl usually dont rage at stats, they rage at stupid stuff made in battle and look stats afterwards to justify raging.

[G01ngToxicCommand0]

3 hours ago, Profilus said:

Why do stats make YOU care about winning or losing? If all you want is xp then just farm damage and be happy?

Ppl usually dont rage at stats, they rage at stupid stuff made in battle and look stats afterwards to justify raging.

I clearly failed to get my message across to you - my fault.

[Talladega_Night]

if you cant take a joke, you should not be playing online games let alone wows.

[Captain_Mackerel]

8 hours ago, G01ngToxicCommand0 said:

For starters: I am very competetively minded and I am not a magnanimous loser. There is nothing I hate more than losing due to other people not caring or being inept/incompetent.
With that in mind I will proceed with the subject in hand.

Barring one battle today I have exclusively played tier 10.

Result after 22 battles played including a win on tier 5: 4 victories and 14 losses for a massive lossrate of 77,78%.
Lossrate for tier 10 exclusively is a whopping 82,35%.

The reason for the lossrate is this:

 

Players like the above playing in tier 10, even had one today with a Yamato with 591 PvP battles under his belt.
 

After such a string of battles I am ready to commit murder on my fellow players. And my tolerance for other human beings is lowered each time I am subjected to the violation from players whose selfish desire for selfgratification to the expence of their fellow players' game experience.

 

World of Warships clearly and logically only has one sole purpose: to grind ships to tier 10. Creating a competetive game where skill matters and having fun is obviously not a priority for Wargaming, otherwise the game would have been structered differently with game mechanics to match a competetive enviroment and e-Sports.

 

The above experience creates substantial friction between the inept, inexperienced and incompetent players on one side and the experienced, competent and good players on the other to the frustration of all.

 

Since I do not believe Wargaming will limit the first group in playing high tier battles or create a skill or league based matchmaking I have a simple suggestion that in no way will affect the game's balance but should, hopefully, orient the players' focus on grinding tech trees without worrying about win/loss rates.
 

What I am suggestion is that Wargaming removes all player stats with the exception of: total battles played, average tier and average XP/battle from the players profile, so that only Wargaming have access to winrates and the rest of the players' stats.
 

With this in mind the players don't have to worry about losing streaks as the only thing that really matters when playing are XP and credits. Sure it will still suck to lose but the individual players will not be cogniscient about it and it wouldn't matter for the game purposes anyway. I assume that some players will still act toxic no matter what meassures are taken to reduce that.

 

With regards to clans the available stats will still clearly show which players are good, average or bad so it will not change anything when recruiting.

Thoughts?

You yourself sound a tad toxic, it is why people turn their chat off,not their fault you take a game way to seriously.

 

It is stats and stats alone that cause the toxicity.

[Captain_Mackerel]

6 hours ago, invicta2012 said:

We have a competitive environment. It's a PvP game. But single leagues, mixing in the best and the worst, don't work for anyone.

 

Here's a suggestion. Make the Ranked Sprint format a competition in its own right (complete a Sprint at all Tiers, in order) and also qualifier for actual Ranked battles. You don't unlock, say, Tier VII Ranked battles until you've completed Tiers III-VII Ranked Sprints and have a Silver Tech Tree ship of at least Tier VII. Anyone who can't complete the necessary sprints, can't enter into the next Ranked season. That means people can't buy High Tier ships in the shop and try learning to play in high tier competitive events. That will give experienced the competitive  Ranked they want and allow less experienced players to "find their level" in Sprint competition without failing hard in the serious leagues.  

Now that is a good idea, I like it.

[The_Angry_Dragon]

I like both options that were offered. I haven't even played Rank battles yet, and I am not sure i will. I have mostly Played Coop and Randoms, and I have a 94% win in one and like 40% in the other. I have never really worried what my win loss was all that much. Well until tonight  when I was playing with a close friend I am trying to get to enjoy the game as much as I do. At which point this A$$hat decided to take it on himself to complain about being in a battle with me and my 40% win loss, when he has a 52% win loss and died in the match. But the part I am trying to understand, is what does the win loss record really matter? Do you get some prize for having a higher win loss in randoms?

[havaduck]

11 hours ago, G01ngToxicCommand0 said:

 

He does have a point - sadly, about how not only abysmal in general the playerbase is; but how simply unfun this game has been made by WG and the playerbase. 

 

However the stats thing I dont support in the least. The last place where the little info we have atm should be concentrated is with WG. If every other justification fails, then to shitpost the (lets honest, more ofthen than not its a) BBotoes and ad a few pics of Pony doing so. 

 

---

 

Nobody likes to loose, but in this case is how abysmally the games are that you get. It maybe one exiting game per a dozen of toxic waste.

 

In this ranked alone my divmate told me about quite a few no camo, no CE, no LS DDs. I even had to take care to not miss my shots and get out-potatoed by them not having LS; and yet the BB players still get all the hate for being the absolute worst from me.

Anyway in this ranked sprint my divmate ranked out and I needed 1 more win for 10.000 coal. I had several days and yet I couldnt muster the strength required to even try once (maybe I still go for it ..... but then again) during a time I could afford to play 12 hrs a day if need be. I remember what I saw during those other games and in the previous T9 ranked as well; it makes me honestly not press the play button again.

 

 

I have a bunch of those T9/10 premiums and I never play them because there in high tiers is where all the worst lurks. IDK if I played my Missouri 10 times outside PVE - but if so then mainly in the last T9 ranked recently; thats how many years?

 

I dont care too much anymore. Every 5 weeks I have 2 weeks I can play (Thats when Narai and Aegis are on) theoretically and I suppose ..... thats it from now on.

 

8 hours ago, El2aZeR said:

WG makes money off of creating a toxic environment, thus they'll never do anything to change that.

 

Another sad true fact.

This includes the playerbase as well ......

 

 

The same thing I have said seeing unimaginable things in this game: I cant be only incompetence or coincidence. At best is consciously not caring just one little bit to give a damn and more often than not its outright premeditated.

[lossi_2018]

I agree, but dis opinion will catch a lot of flak for obvious reasons and from the usual suspects. You are brave though :)

[anonym_8AYJrnybhu0v]

From the other point of view; today enemy CV player called us noobs beacuse we were dying so fast that "he couldnt farm his avg damage". 

So yea there is a lot of people like that, they do not care about the gameplay but stats only. It's just like in the forum, some people care only about their posts count, and like in real life, people care about the things they can show to others and prove they are better or higher in the hierachy. It's not a problem of World of Warships but a problem in the mentality and consciousness of people.

[loppantorkel]

3 hours ago, exylos said:

I like both options that were offered. I haven't even played Rank battles yet, and I am not sure i will. I have mostly Played Coop and Randoms, and I have a 94% win in one and like 40% in the other. I have never really worried what my win loss was all that much. Well until tonight  when I was playing with a close friend I am trying to get to enjoy the game as much as I do. At which point this A$$hat decided to take it on himself to complain about being in a battle with me and my 40% win loss, when he has a 52% win loss and died in the match. But the part I am trying to understand, is what does the win loss record really matter? Do you get some prize for having a higher win loss in randoms?

Your winrate is an indication of your ability to play the game well. If you win only 40% of the Random battles you enter, you're a big liability for your team and have likely still several basic aspects to learn. If you enter high tier battles or Ranked battles, you can expect your team mates to be rather miffed about you being on their team.