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Major_Damage225

Blyskawica ''buff'' on ST

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''Buff'' notes in the spoiler.

 

Spoiler

ST, balance changes

European destroyer Błyskawica, tier VII:

- Main battery reload time was reduced from 6.5 to 6 seconds.

Błyskawica — one of the first premium ships in our game. Since her release, many game tactics have changed and there are new ships played in a similar style. The new reload time will increase damage and strengthen the role of the destroyer in the current meta.

 

Ok it's a minimal ''buff'' but a buff non the less, she needs some looking at, that sayd im not sayng she's weak but she got power and gimmick creeped since her days.

That sayd i do think that the whopping 0.5 seconds of reload is nothing, she could have gotten mabe faster torpedoes or a litle concealment buff instead you know, something more usefull than the 0.5 seconds, i know the diehard fans of her's will keep making magic happen with her even in the current meta.

 

What do you think could use tweaking?

:Smile_honoring:

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They said that Blys is performing fine and is in no need for buffs on reddit 2 weeks ago. 

That they give her 0.5 regardless is very generous so I don't think asking for more will lead to anything. 

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I agree with LOV3_and_PE4CE that we shall be happy that we have gotten anything at all and they considered quality of life improvements rather than direct buffs just a few weeks ago. But hopefully WG have seen the same power creep we in the playerbase noticed a long time ago. 

 

If I could ask for a second small but fully possible buff that might make sense, it would be to improve the HE damage to 1750 to make it the same as the Friesland. Both ships are using Bofors 120 mm guns with 24 kg shells and even after such a buff the HE DPM will be lower than that of Haida. 

 

If I where to ask for a major change it would be for both Blyskawica and Haida to get access to their refit with 102 mm DP guns in twin turrets as a second choice similar to how Harekaze can change between hulls and get different armaments. Let's call it "Hull 1937" and "Hull 1941" to reflect her launch configuration and the current layout she has today as a museum ship. Let the player chose which one they found competetive, sometimes we as players just want Our version of the ship as we know it and even with IFHE these guns would only be able to penetrate 21 mm of armor and that way work similar to the 113 mm on the Jutland and Daring. 

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1 hour ago, affie said:

I agree with LOV3_and_PE4CE that we shall be happy that we have gotten anything at all and they considered quality of life improvements rather than direct buffs just a few weeks ago. But hopefully WG have seen the same power creep we in the playerbase noticed a long time ago. 

 

If I could ask for a second small but fully possible buff that might make sense, it would be to improve the HE damage to 1750 to make it the same as the Friesland. Both ships are using Bofors 120 mm guns with 24 kg shells and even after such a buff the HE DPM will be lower than that of Haida. 

 

If I where to ask for a major change it would be for both Blyskawica and Haida to get access to their refit with 102 mm DP guns in twin turrets as a second choice similar to how Harekaze can change between hulls and get different armaments. Let's call it "Hull 1937" and "Hull 1941" to reflect her launch configuration and the current layout she has today as a museum ship. Let the player chose which one they found competetive, sometimes we as players just want Our version of the ship as we know it and even with IFHE these guns would only be able to penetrate 21 mm of armor and that way work similar to the 113 mm on the Jutland and Daring. 

For Tech Tree Blys 41? 

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Good decision WG.

I have been asking for reload buff for years now ... a bit more of speed would not make her OP either.

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2 hours ago, affie said:

I agree with LOV3_and_PE4CE that we shall be happy that we have gotten anything at all and they considered quality of life improvements rather than direct buffs just a few weeks ago. But hopefully WG have seen the same power creep we in the playerbase noticed a long time ago. 

 

If I could ask for a second small but fully possible buff that might make sense, it would be to improve the HE damage to 1750 to make it the same as the Friesland. Both ships are using Bofors 120 mm guns with 24 kg shells and even after such a buff the HE DPM will be lower than that of Haida. 

 

If I where to ask for a major change it would be for both Blyskawica and Haida to get access to their refit with 102 mm DP guns in twin turrets as a second choice similar to how Harekaze can change between hulls and get different armaments. Let's call it "Hull 1937" and "Hull 1941" to reflect her launch configuration and the current layout she has today as a museum ship. Let the player chose which one they found competetive, sometimes we as players just want Our version of the ship as we know it and even with IFHE these guns would only be able to penetrate 21 mm of armor and that way work similar to the 113 mm on the Jutland and Daring. 

Getting "1941" and then "1952" hulls can backfire at you spectacularly, as with each refit Błyskawica lost some of her speed. While getting "mini Akizuki" sounds fun, you would get one without magic HE pen, without shell velocity and more importantly, without current Błyskawica speed. With first refit, where she got 4x2 102mm, it reduced speed to +-35kts. Last refit, where she got Russian 100mm B-24 guns and other stuff brought speed down to 33kts

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Let me repeat what I wrote in the DevBlog post:

Spoiler

On the surface this looks like a really small buff. But the more I look at the numbers the more I see the net gain for the ship. Here's a breakdown, for anyone not speaking numbers (base stats, no captain skills):

 

Currently Blyska has an HE Alpha of 11900, eclipsed only by Akatsuki's 12900, and this was always a big selling point. The HE DPM is 109837, which is better only than Shiratsuyu, Yudachi, Akatsuki, Z-39. Quite bad for a gunboat.

With the change the HE DPM becomes 119000, making it only inferior to USN and RN-type DDs, which can't hit anything over long range. And only Haida, Mahan, and Sims are much better. Even Leningrad/Minsk will have a worse DPM by exactly 5000. With the buff Blyskawica and Vaquelin are more or less equals.

 

With BFT it gets even better, with a HE DPM of 132209, making it only worse in DPM against Mahan and Haida. And we are talking high alpha strikes here with good velocity.

 

So that "small" buff is actually a game changer, as it moves Blyskawica from being a bad gunboat to being decent again. Not great or OP. Seeing as PanEU DDs are gun heavy ships, this will fit perfectly.

 

I'm a very harsh critic of WG, because they screw up a lot in places they shouldn't. But I understand game design, being involved professionally in game design before. It's not easy to balance things and even small changes can be huge, after players have had the time to tinker with the numbers in ways devs never thought of. Premium ship buffs are permanent, that means the moment this "small" buff hits the live server, it's never going away. So WG cannot go whole hog on making large changes and seeing if they work. I'm optimistic about the change and look forward to playing Blyskawica in the future.

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I've never had too much of an issue with her reload, even with French DDs and their MBRB Blyska can still compete. 

 

I'd really have preferred a buff to her concealment, which is not really up to snuff, or even a QOL increase to her credit gains and captain skill training, but this is not a bad deal. 

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I've only played it a couple of times with a 10 point captain. It's already a good gunboat to me and a great candidate for AFT.

I expect I'll play it a little more in future.

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This reload buff is, I must say, very welcome. I've been arguing for a slight buff to the Blyskawica for a while now, due to the fact that many years of power creep has made her into more of a light cruiser than a serious scout and cap contender. I'd have hoped for a slight buff to her concealment values as well, but I understand and support Wargaming for being careful with buffs to a ship that still performs overall well in the lists.

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7 hours ago, Major_Damage225 said:

 

  Hide contents

ST, balance changes

European destroyer Błyskawica, tier VII:

- Main battery reload time was reduced from 6.5 to 6 seconds.

Błyskawica — one of the first premium ships in our game. Since her release, SHE HAS BEEN POWER CREPT TO F***. The new reload time will increase damage and strengthen the role of the destroyer in the current meta.

 

 

:cap_tea:

 

A welcome buff to be honest.  Something this community has been asking for what? 2 years now?

 

Even a 0.5 reload with go a long way actually. 

 

 

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I will never forget how hated enemy Blyska was with her 10,4km stealthfire...:Smile_smile: 

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I am very happy about a buff on blyska.

It's very clear she got powercreeped if you play her on WoWS Legends.

If I could wish for more small buffs I would ask for rudder shift/turning cyrcle or concealment ( In Legends she gets nice exclusive concealment buffs due to how the captain skills work there and the captain she got)

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Don't think i ever seen this premium, or at least don't remember seeing it.

 

thought it said 5.5 sec reload when i first read it.

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8 hours ago, L0V3_and_PE4CE said:

They said that Blys is performing fine and is in no need for buffs on reddit 2 weeks ago. 

That they give her 0.5 regardless is very generous so I don't think asking for more will lead to anything. 

 

I'm one of those players responsible for generating those stats claiming she is still doing fine....

 

But, when I compare playing Blys in current meta and old meta, it's day and night. Blys used to be the powerfull ship in the game tier for tier, well for me at least. But new additions / powercreep has been more influential as losing stealth fire. There are just to many other ships with ballistics capable of threathening you even at long range ( way to play Blys was always hyper agressive at start -> kill enemy DD, cap, fall back play second line fire support (~starter :Smile_trollface: ). And even without SF this was not that hard to do. But that role, that 'niche' has been filled with other lines, who can do it even better. FR DD plays excellent when working with an allied spotter DD jumping on enemy DD's thinking they picked a favorable fight to them... RN DD's can hold a cap much easier since the almost instant smokes and defensive hydro. 

 

I do think a little ROF increase will make my average damage go up, but I'm not sure if it changes anything in how much influence I can have in a game. 

 

1 hour ago, Redcap375 said:

:cap_tea:

 

A welcome buff to be honest.  Something this community has been asking for what? 2 years now?

 

Even a 0.5 reload with go a long way actually. 

 

How exactly do you envision the added dpm will benefit where Blys will be good at?

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The reload is welcome. She's still too big, slow and clumsy and uptiered. There's more then one reason she's hardly seen, which is a shame.

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1 hour ago, Quetak said:

I will never forget how hated enemy Blyska was with her 10,4km stealthfire...:Smile_smile: 

I remember that time as well - usually in my Blyska :cap_haloween:

Just now, CptBarney said:

Will she get any moar buffs? speed, turn rates, aa, range? maybe even further reload buffs?

No, we think this buff should be enough - everything else should be fine for now, unless we see there is an additional need to help this ship. 8% better reload is already a significant improvement.

10 minutes ago, mtm78 said:

I do think a little ROF increase will make my average damage go up, but I'm not sure if it changes anything in how much influence I can have in a game.

I mean this is basically an 8% buff in rate of fire - which means that in the time you spent raining down shells on the enemies, this will be a significant increase - which leads to a) more regular damage dealt during this time before and b) higher amount of shells hitting the enemy = more hits = more fires within the same time.

 

This will straight up give you a higher average damage, unless you would play this ship as a pure torpedo boat.

 

Greetings, Crysantos

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1 minute ago, CptBarney said:

I dont know how gud miss blyska is but if shes out dated as peeps have said then good on her i guess.

She was doing alright - not great, not terrible.

 

Greetings, Crysantos

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1 minute ago, Crysantos said:

I mean this is basically an 8% buff in rate of fire - which means that in the time you spent raining down shells on the enemies, this will be a significant increase - which leads to a) more regular damage dealt during this time before and b) higher amount of shells hitting the enemy = more hits = more fires within the same time.

 

Yeah I guess the early influence could indeed go up again, it actually seems quite interesting. Looking at just rof is not enough I should have considered the amount of shells and per shell dmg to see the actual difference. 

 

It's just that, when I play Blys now I can already have my ~70k dmg games without that much effort ( probably boasting... but meh :P ), but it means I'm playing light cruiser not destroyer ( I won't play hyper agressive against DD's at start, I will focus on preserving my hitpoints ).  And while I might even get higher average dmg compared to my old stats, I will not be as influential ( the DD battles mostly decide games, dmg is just a bonus ). 

 

That's my issue with some of the balancing btw, numbers will not tell you / dev / WG the whole story ( but you know that :Smile_hiding: )

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5 minutes ago, mtm78 said:

 

Yeah I guess the early influence could indeed go up again, it actually seems quite interesting. Looking at just rof is not enough I should have considered the amount of shells and per shell dmg to see the actual difference. 

 

It's just that, when I play Blys now I can already have my ~70k dmg games without that much effort ( probably boasting... but meh :P ), but it means I'm playing light cruiser not destroyer ( I won't play hyper agressive against DD's at start, I will focus on preserving my hitpoints ).  And while I might even get higher average dmg compared to my old stats, I will not be as influential ( the DD battles mostly decide games, dmg is just a bonus ). 

 

That's my issue with some of the balancing btw, numbers will not tell you / dev / WG the whole story ( but you know that :Smile_hiding: )

Well, our statistics are really in depth and tell a lot about player behavior and performance (for different segments of players, not just pure average). But we know it's not the entire picture, this is why we ask for your feedback and share this early on to get your input on it. For those who already do well in the Blyska they will do even better - and for those who struggled a bit, this will help them. But I personally don't think that the role shifted too much for this ship in particular - it was always best at kiting and not the dominant DD for contest caps - yes with the addition of Hydro-DDs it definitely didn't get better at it, but it always excelled at kiting and using its great guns more than anything. And let's be honest, many of us used the invisi-fire a lot on this ship, which you obviously only can do on range :Smile_Default:

 

Greetings, Crysantos

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36 minutes ago, mtm78 said:

How exactly do you envision the added dpm will benefit where Blys will be good at?

 

Because it's still a buff.

 

What do we really expect WG to do? Bring down the Concealment? They won't. It's suppose to be a gunboat. 

Give it gimmicks to contend? They won't, it's a gunboat supporter.

 

So it getting anything is a start and DPM is one of them. 

 

Does this help the Ship play-style wise? No.  Of course it wont.  People still wont play it because of a 0.5 boost, but it's something. They wont play it because it doesn't change anything as fire rate was never the problem. The sluggish, out-spotted and powercreept nature was. 

 

All it is doing is making something it was already good with better.  But doesn't help the stuff that makes it bad.

 

She also suffers badly when up-tiered alot.

 

But if you wanna play those kinda ships that spam HE, pick a CL instead, they are better at it. 

 

What makes me laugh is that you have gunboat ships like the Cossack with great concealment and then you have this? No balance/continuity what-so-ever. Make up your mind WG. 

 

 

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10 minutes ago, Crysantos said:

Well, our statistics are really in depth and tell a lot about player behavior and performance (for different segments of players, not just pure average). But we know it's not the entire picture, this is why we ask for your feedback and share this early on to get your input on it. For those who already do well in the Blyska they will do even better - and for those who struggled a bit, this will help them. But I personally don't think that the role shifted too much for this ship in particular - it was always best at kiting and not the dominant DD for contest caps - yes with the addition of Hydro-DDs it definitely didn't get better at it, but it always excelled at kiting and using its great guns more than anything. And let's be honest, many of us used the invisi-fire a lot on this ship, which you obviously only can do on range :Smile_Default:

 

 Greetings, Crysantos

 

At least you've admitted it's been power crept.  That's a start. 

 

If you listen from us, you could have done this 2 years ago.

 

 

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1 minute ago, Crysantos said:

Well, our statistics are really in depth and tell a lot about player behavior and performance (for different segments of players, not just pure average). But we know it's not the entire picture, this is why we ask for your feedback and share this early on to get your input on it. For those who already do well in the Blyska they will do even better - and for those who struggled a bit, this will help them. But I personally don't think that the role shifted too much for this ship in particular - it was always best at kiting and not the dominant DD for contest caps - yes with the addition of Hydro-DDs it definitely didn't get better at it, but it always excelled at kiting and using its great guns more than anything. And let's be honest, many of us used the invisi-fire a lot on this ship, which you obviously only can do on range :Smile_Default:

 

Greetings, Crysantos

 

It never was dominant in contesting caps, but I played it mostly like I play my French DD's now -> support your other destroyers in very early game ( they have better concealment ), then when situation is known, you know where ships are located roughly, initial DD engagements are done, then you go pick on isolated enemies or continue with DD engagements. 

 

Kiting directly implies playing reactive, DD's which play reactive are not as influential. 

 

Anyway it's nice to see a buff, don't get me wrong. And I realize it will make the ship better, ofc it will, I am just trying to find a direction in which I could exploit this buff the furthest ;)

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