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MadBadDave

Are Premiums Up-Tiered ?

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Simple enough question, I've had 2 T8 Premium BB's, both encounter far more up tiering than their Tech Tree Brethren, I hadn't really noticed prior to getting the Alabama on Friday, prior to getting the ship I'd been playing Bismarck a lot, which see's a fair mix of opponents, The Bama on the other hand see's far more T9/10's than anything else, I've just had 5 games in her, in 4 games I was bottom Tier and once mid tier, and yet the one game prior to that In Bismarck I was Top Tier.

 

That and another Post by someone else (I am Cursed) got me thinking about all my prems, and each and every one sees more top tier opposition than lower tier like my tech tree ships do, hence those ships have a worse WR , you can see for yourself by looking at my stats Tirp worse than Bis, Shiny Worse than Gneisenau, Sims worse than Mahan, Exeter often facing T7's, Warspite often facing T8 BB's and Cv's, I love Hood and it citadels cruisers for fun, but check out that WR.

 

It seems to me that within WG's Match Making Algorithms, my Premiums get up-tiered almost every time, some ships can soak it up, but others can't, which means WR, PR and enjoyment take a knock.

 

Has anyone else notice this, or are my premiums cursed ?.

 

It could possibly explain why a lot of us experience a similar problem; unable to do well or win in ships, that we like, while doing too well and easy in others and winning without even trying.

 

 

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All ships are treated the same by the matchmaker. it doesn't matter if they are premium or tech tree ships. The MM rules are the same for both.

I'd say this is just an observation bias on your part.

 

You might want to read up on the changed matchmaker rules we recieved with patch 0.8.7 (reading patch notes is generally a good idea).

https://worldofwarships.eu/en/news/game-updates/update-087-french-destroyers-part-2/

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4 minutes ago, Egoleter said:

All ships are treated the same by the matchmaker. it doesn't matter if they are premium or tech tree ships. The MM rules are the same for both.

 

Source?

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2 minutes ago, ForlornSailor said:

 

Source?

 

WG will never lay their algorithm open, but it is common sense and they said so. There was an article about it too, you can find it on their side, when you have the time to search it. Until then, you just have to believe it. You could also check sides/blogs like the armored patrol.

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8 minutes ago, Egoleter said:

I'd say this is just an observation bias on your part.

I agree. Specially if you are having bad games you much more focus on the MM so it could seem you are getting the bad end of the stick.

 

I guess it also depends on the time you were playing, i usually get much worse MM in my tier 8 when i play late at night considering there are far less players online then its not really a surprise.

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5 minutes ago, ForlornSailor said:

Source?

If you don't believe it ask WG again during one of their next Q&As or livestreams.

The question has been asked and answered several times before but I will not look it up for you.

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Actually we have a conspiracy theory in my clan that seems to hold true.

 

Buy a premium, First match you are always top tier.

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2 minutes ago, Fat_Maniac said:

Buy a premium, First match you are always top tier.

 

That's easy to test, And since i am about to get another tier 8 prem. 

 

I am going to wait till 2 in the morning before playing it stacking the odds against it getting top tier mm and if i still get a top tier game i guess you cant call it confirmed since its a small sample size so it could be coincidence, But dont you anyway get like 3 games good matchmaking when you buy any ships doesnt matter if premium or silver. As far as i remember they had something like that in WoT

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30 minutes ago, Egoleter said:

All ships are treated the same by the matchmaker. it doesn't matter if they are premium or tech tree ships. The MM rules are the same for both.

I'd say this is just an observation bias on your part.

 

You might want to read up on the changed matchmaker rules we recieved with patch 0.8.7 (reading patch notes is generally a good idea).

https://worldofwarships.eu/en/news/game-updates/update-087-french-destroyers-part-2/

Deffo not Bias, prior to getting Bama and reading other peoples comments, of which there is a lot about "cursed" ships I thought Hood etc was just unlucky.

 

And playing throughout different times of the day I haven't noticed any real difference MM wise, and you can always tell when good players are playing and when the spuds and weekenders have gone to bed, in a nut shell regardless of what time I play only the standard of player changes, not the MM !.

 

You obviously didn't look at my stats e.g Tirp Vs Bis, Shiny vs Gne etc.        

 

Do you believe everything WG tells you, e.g 5 games 4 in T10, 1 in T9, so when will T6/T7/T8 games occur ?.  Matchmaker is as balanced and efficient as the CV rework.

 

 

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19 minutes ago, Egoleter said:

If you don't believe it ask WG again during one of their next Q&As or livestreams. 

The question has been asked and answered several times before but I will not look it up for you. 

 

That means: you dont have a source. Dont go round throwing things as facts then, when you dont know. Thanks for admitting.

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16 minutes ago, H4d3zZz said:

 

That's easy to test, And since i am about to get another tier 8 prem. 

 

I am going to wait till 2 in the morning before playing it stacking the odds against it getting top tier mm and if i still get a top tier game i guess you cant call it confirmed since its a small sample size so it could be coincidence, But dont you anyway get like 3 games good matchmaking when you buy any ships doesnt matter if premium or silver. As far as i remember they had something like that in WoT

Oooo. I don't know. That could be interesting with T8 MM

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4 minutes ago, MadBadDave said:

Do you believe everything WG tells you, e.g 5 games 4 in T10, 1 in T9, so when will T6/T7/T8 games occur ?.  Matchmaker is as balanced and efficient as the CV rework.

1 minute ago, ForlornSailor said:

That means: you dont have a source. Dont go round throwing things as facts then, when you dont know. Thanks for admitting.

If your goal is just to spread tinfoil hat theories then thanks for now making me aware of it. I'm out of here.

 

I've shown you a way to confirm what I said. If you don't want to make an effort in actually educating yourself about your believes, and if you also do not trust Wargaming as a source, then nothing I say or post would ever change your mind.

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1 minute ago, Egoleter said:

If your goal is just to spread tinfoil hat theories then thanks for now making me aware of it. I'm out of here.

 

If anyone, that describes perfectly what you are doing. But yea, you are now down to name-calling and shaming & putting words in my mouth, since you cant back up your claim. Propaganda 1x1.

I asked for a source. Nothing more, nothing less. Normal in any adult conversation. If you cant take it, I suggest you do follow your own advice.

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5 minutes ago, Egoleter said:

If your goal is just to spread tinfoil hat theories then thanks for now making me aware of it. I'm out of here.

 

I've shown you a way to confirm what I said. If you don't want to make an effort in actually educating yourself about your believes, and if you also do not trust Wargaming as a source, then nothing I say or post would ever change your mind.

No, just seeking answers and clarity, no one has yet stated otherwise; e.g that Prems are not up-tiered more than tech tree ships.   Saying "no because WG says it's all fair and balanced", is not an answer, so when can I expect to face warspite in my Bama, 2 months time ?.

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My questions is a very easy one, and within an hour we could have  fair idea,of whether Prems are up-tiered or not.

 

Do"YOU" have a ship that you always struggle to win in

 

Is it often up-tiered

 

Is it a premium ?.

 

 

I'm just seeking wondering why it is My T8 bb Premium is constantly facing T10's, whilst my T8 tech tree doesn't,  when WG claims to have resolved MM, and whether Prems are treated differently ?.

 

In addition to my own experience and reading a lot of other people asking "why am I crap in this bote" I am curious, could it be just bad luck or something else ?.

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53 minutes ago, H4d3zZz said:

 

That's easy to test, And since i am about to get another tier 8 prem. 

 

I am going to wait till 2 in the morning before playing it stacking the odds against it getting top tier mm and if i still get a top tier game i guess you cant call it confirmed since its a small sample size so it could be coincidence, But dont you anyway get like 3 games good matchmaking when you buy any ships doesnt matter if premium or silver. As far as i remember they had something like that in WoT

Priority for MM is to cut queue times as much as possible. And if it cant give you "first impression" battle, then it will discard such fancy rules and flush you with whatever available. Also I think divisioning also throws away such rules.o

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44 minutes ago, ForlornSailor said:

 

That means: you dont have a source. Dont go round throwing things as facts then, when you dont know. Thanks for admitting.

Do you have any source to prove your statment?

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3 minutes ago, Panocek said:

Priority for MM is to cut queue times as much as possible. And if it cant give you "first impression" battle, then it will discard such fancy rules and flush you with whatever available. Also I think divisioning also throws away such rules.o

Do you have a cursed ship ?.

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22 minutes ago, Egoleter said:

If you don't believe it ask WG again during one of their next Q&As or livestreams.

The question has been asked and answered several times before but I will not look it up for you.

There will always be a "margin of error" as long as you dont have their algorithm, but you could rely on the data we had so far. There were some samples from a lot of players, even though it is not a big amount of data to give a better result.

 

21 minutes ago, Fat_Maniac said:

Buy a premium, First match you are always top tier.

I was always lowtier in my new tank or ship (well, ok, i can remember 2 times where that was not the case). Dont forget that it always depends on the time and day when you play.

 

2 minutes ago, ForlornSailor said:

That means: you dont have a source. Dont go round throwing things as facts then, when you dont know. Thanks for admitting.

 I think it was common sense that we are not speaking about facts here. If you would understand mathematics then you would understand there is always a margin of error, when you dont have the algorithm. You only could try to analyze the data there is and draw a conclusion from that.

14 minutes ago, ForlornSailor said:

If anyone, that describes perfectly what you are doing. But yea, you are now down to name-calling and shaming & putting words in my mouth, since you cant back up your claim. Propaganda 1x1.

I asked for a source. Nothing more, nothing less. Normal in any adult conversation. If you cant take it, I suggest you do follow your own advice.

 You are asking for something that can no one tell you for sure, i mean for like 100% sure. I think i explained it very well, so you better dont ask for a source or for the algorithm, and if you want to have it ask WG or search for yourself, if you really want to know. You also just believe what you want. :Smile_trollface: As long as we dont know the exact mathematics is your guess as good as mine or you could listen to the people for their experience instead of blaiming them, that they dont want to invest their precious time to look for the news and articles where the MM is mentioned...which you easily could on your own.

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1 minute ago, MadBadDave said:

Do you have a cursed ship ?.

Conqueror, though that might have something to do with using her as intended - long range HE slinger with no gameplay impact:cap_book:

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5 minutes ago, Hanse77SWE said:

Do you have any source to prove your statment?

 

What statement? Are you capable of comprehending english language?

 

edit: from your reactions, I take it, you are not. Please dont quote me any more if you dont possess the necessary skills to understand what im saying. thanks.

 

5 minutes ago, blindhai said:

You are asking for something that can no one tell you for sure, i mean for like 100% sure. 

 

Exactly. So, if anything, you support my side. Which you dont, since you are tricked into belieaving, I said something, which I didnt.

 

5 minutes ago, blindhai said:

news and articles where the MM is mentioned

 

A) such things dont exist to my knowledge B) that is not proof either. Proof is, looking at the actual matchmaking scripts/server files. Or looking at acutal evidence, f.e. patents WG is holding about matchmaking. Which I did, but I think the vocal guys here didnt.

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22 minutes ago, MadBadDave said:

Do you have a cursed ship ?.

For me its the Monty doesn't matter what i do i will most certainly do no damage and lose the game lol. Also my first tier 10 ships.

 

Didn't play it for years, took it out for a spin a couple of weeks ago and yeap still cursed

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5 minutes ago, H4d3zZz said:

For me its the Monty doesn't matter what i do i will most certainly do no damage and lose the game lol. Also my first tier 10 ships.

 

Didn't play it for years, took it out for a spin a couple of weeks ago and yeap still cursed

Thanks, that's the only  reason why i ask in order to get some sort of answer, because if a lot of people did notice a particular trend, maybe WG could do something about it, and that cursed bote sees better MM and consequently better results etc.   If people are honest and it turns out that tech tree and Prems suffer the same MM fate, it is just down to bad luck.

 

I can only go on my very limited and below average gameplay, and from my perspective my Tech Tree's seem to get better MM luck than the ones that cost money.

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Mathematically it means that for everyone getting uptiered someone has to get downtiered and vice versa and I have yet to see someone complaining that he get too many games when he's top tier.

 

I see no evidence that premiumships get better MM and I have so far seen nothing that will change my opinion on that. Feel free to try but it would require at least a couple of thousand games of statistics, from different players, just to make me begin to shift.

 

My cursed ship is the Alabama.

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