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MrFingers

HMS Hawkins & HMS London (County Class) heavy cruisers teased on Facebook.

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Please be a new techtree (branch). The premiums are already oversaturated!

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Hmmm.... I like that they're potentially on the way and I too hope they will be silver ships.

 

BUT. Here's the problem I foresee. 

 

Hawkins with 7.5inch guns is probably on a par with Furotaka at T5. York (Exeter basically) could possibly sit at T6 with some modification. London/Kent/County could be T7-8 - although 8-gun CAs aren't exactly powerhouses (currently suffering through the Hipper at the moment). T9 and T10 would have to be paper. CAs weren't considered much of a priority for the Royal Navy (far better to police the Empire with lots of CLs than a few bigger CAs) so I'm not sure where you'd begin to look for design material. 

 

You could make the T9-10 supercruisers or BCs in the same line as the Siegfried. Maybe a what-if refit of the Renown could sit at T9.... I think a 'stats-adjusted' Admiral-class running around with decent ROF, good accuracy and 4x2 15inch guns might be fun at T10.*

 

*This is just random theory-crafting/brain-farts at this point. 

 

 

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4 hours ago, Gvozdika said:

You could make the T9-10 supercruisers or BCs in the same line as the Siegfried. Maybe a what-if refit of the Renown could sit at T9....

Renown got a quick refit between December 1943 and January 1944 when she was with the home fleet. They removed the catapults (no fighters) and stuck on deck mounted torpedo tubes and more Oerlikons. Dimensionally she's a bit smaller than Alaska; she'd be a great fit as a Super Cruiser, now that Siegfried has made it possible for a super cruiser to have larger than 305mm main guns. Radar and DefAA, like Kronstadt, I expect.

 

Here's hoping!

 

Super Cruiser stats:

  Renown '44 Alaska Kronshtadt Siegfried
Length 242.0m 246.4m 250.5m 256m
Beam 27.4m 27.8m 31.6m 30m
Draft 9.7m 9.7m 9.45m 8.02m
Displacement 36,660t 30,257t 25,250t 35,968t
Speed 31knots 33knots 33.5knots 33.5knots
Armament 6x381mm 9x305mm 9x305mm 6x380mm
  20x114mm 12x127mm 8x100mm 14x128mm
  8x533mm torps   8x152mm 8x533mm torps
AA 61x20mm 34x20mm 12x12.7mm 48x20mm
  28x40mm 56x40mm 28x37mm 16x55mm
  20x114mm 12x127mm 8x100mm 14x128mm

 

17-3594392-hms-renown-1944b.thumb.jpg.5a2ef2b03d4c273821e9d737f9b43a2a.jpg

Edited by DanSilverwing
Revised AA as of final configuration December 1943. Source: Maurice P. Northcott Renown and Repulse 1978
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14 minutes ago, Gvozdika said:

CAs weren't considered much of a priority for the Royal Navy (far better to police the Empire with lots of CLs than a few bigger CAs) so I'm not sure where you'd begin to look for design material. 

There were a series of design studies in the 30s and 40s for Heavy Cruisers with both 8" and 9.2" main batteries which could populate the upper tiers.

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13 minutes ago, Gvozdika said:

Hmmm.... I like that they're potentially on the way and I too hope they will be silver ships.

 

BUT. Here's the problem I foresee. 

 

Hawkins with 7.5inch guns is probably on a par with Furotaka at T5. York (Exeter basically) could possibly sit at T6 with some modification. London/Kent/County could be T7-8 - although 8-gun CAs aren't exactly powerhouses (currently suffering through the Hipper at the moment). T9 and T10 would have to be paper. CAs weren't considered much of a priority for the Royal Navy (far better to police the Empire with lots of CLs than a few bigger CAs) so I'm not sure where you'd begin to look for design material. 

 

You could make the T9-10 supercruisers or BCs in the same line as the Siegfried. Maybe a what-if refit of the Renown could sit at T9.... I think a 'stats-adjusted' Admiral-class running around with decent ROF, good accuracy and 4x2 15inch guns might be fun at T10.*

 

*This is just random theory-crafting/brain-farts at this point. 

 

 

Admiral and churchill heavy cruisers fam got ya covered.

 

image.thumb.png.1cf797f9a396a555bf20be7f0f1b8a33.png

 

image.thumb.png.68439b9e2845e227f140a4c68d803eab.png

 

Defo would be gud for both tier 9 and 10

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38 minutes ago, MrFingers said:

Please be a new techtree (branch). The premiums are already oversaturated!

They will be premiums, because:

-The player base asked for RN heavy cruisers several times. So WG knows they will sell.

-Creating a silver line does not generate a profit.

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1 minute ago, Aragathor said:

They will be premiums, because:

-The player base asked for RN heavy cruisers several times. So WG knows they will sell.

-Creating a silver line does not generate a profit.

They don't have a camo shown on the preview, which makes me hope they are a new techtree.

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7 minutes ago, CptBarney said:

Admiral and churchill heavy cruisers fam got ya covered.

 

image.thumb.png.1cf797f9a396a555bf20be7f0f1b8a33.png

 

image.thumb.png.68439b9e2845e227f140a4c68d803eab.png

 

Defo would be gud for both tier 9 and 10

and here is the Tier 8Bildergebnis für surrey class cruiser

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Just now, Kaseko said:

and here is the Tier 8Bildergebnis für surrey class cruiser

ye, i would love seeing these in game. And frankly her drawings are what made me start my own designs in the first place (still learning doe).

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I wouldn't be surprised if we see most as a tech tree (or branch, a la the US split), plus one higher tier premium: WG are running out of new content - witness submarines and more paper ships - so if they want to look like the game isn't stagnating, they need to introduce at least a few new trees now and again...

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1 minute ago, CptBarney said:

ye, i would love seeing these in game. And frankly her drawings are what made me start my own designs in the first place (still learning doe).

they are actual designs redrawn in this specific style so yes they were real

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15 minutes ago, zFireWyvern said:

There were a series of design studies in the 30s and 40s for Heavy Cruisers with both 8" and 9.2" main batteries which could populate the upper tiers.

I stand corrected. In a good way!

 

The 9.2" option sounds interesting - presumably this is pre-Washington?

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1 minute ago, Gvozdika said:

I stand corrected. In a good way!

 

The 9.2" option sounds interesting - presumably this is pre-Washington?

Dunno but thats the churchill super cruiser with 234mm's in 3 quads. Plus 178mm belt.

 

admiral class has 204mm (or 203mm) in 3 triple turrets and 114mm belt.

 

so churchill would be a pretty well armed and armoured heavy cruiser.

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For the Churchill:

Quote

During the early years of the Second World War, in 1939-40 First Lord of the Admirality Winston Churchill proposed a cruiser design which could effectively battle the other navies similar ships. He wanted a cruiser with 9.2inch guns and protection against 8inch shells. Two proposal were born one with 9 the other with 12 guns in triple or quad turrets, though the quad favoured. The design quickly grow to a large size and heavy mass for a cruiser, so does their cost! The project abandoned when the calculations showed that 4 such cruiser would cost more then 3 Vanguard class Battleships

 

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Hoping theyr working on a RN heavy cruiser branch and not a few premiums, would be a welcome addition :cap_yes:

Edited by Major_Damage225
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2 hours ago, MrFingers said:

Please be a new techtree (branch). The premiums are already oversaturated!

 

Can't imagine Hawkins or a refit London being premium candidates, esp not at the same time. (That's the new superstructure on London right?)

It makes sense they're the only two spoiled, everything else will be paper (cold war crap has pushed everything down a tier and paper is so much cheaper) Here's what I think the line will look like.

 

Tier 5: Hawkins (Exeter)

Tier 6: London (A premium like Norfolk??)

Tier 7: Surrey

Tier 8: 10 gun Surrey

Tier 9Admiral

Tier 10: Churchill

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I hope they don't try and get Hawkins into Tier V. She'd be more painful than Emerald - thinner armour, fewer, slower guns, no torpedoes... eek.  I'd rather she was pushed down to IV and allowed to use her size and big guns to push other cruisers around, St Louis style. London at Tier VI would be nice, though. 

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2 hours ago, Aragathor said:

-Creating a silver line does not generate a profit.

So no new silver lines at all?

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sheesh... now I am back to being all excited because back when the first RN cruiser techtree started getting teased (so before we knew it'd be CLs only), there were murmurings that the T10 would have some sort of upgraded/finished/actually working version of these babies that the RN studied during WW1: http://www.navweaps.com/Weapons/WNRussian_16-45_m1914.php#8"%2F120_(20.5_cm)_sub-caliber_Mark_I (and a further development of the concept a few years later)

 

Essentially a 12" gun firing 8" projectiles, what is called Sub-Caliber - can lead to hilarious muzzle velocities; NavWeaps has almost 1500m/s for these which would put paid to every single "Russian Bias Railgun" meme quicker than Dreadnought put paid to... you know... every single capital ship that came before her :Smile_teethhappy:

 

I dont think that's gonna happen, but... well, one can hope^^

 

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I do hope it's the beginnings of a British heavy cruiser sub branch seeing as they teased more than one ship I'm less inclined to think they will be premiums.

 

In regards to using the Renown though I think that's unlikely she was a proper battlecruiser rather than what could be called a super cruiser like Alaska or Kronstadt. I recon Renown will make her way into the game either as a BB split of battlecruisers or as a premium like Hood.

 

Still only time will tell. 

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18 minutes ago, B0Tato said:

So no new silver lines at all?

That's not what I said and you know it. There are no heavy cruisers T4 and below, so WG can just release the ships that existed as premiums and claim that not enough material exists to go any further.

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3 hours ago, DanSilverwing said:

Renown got a quick refit between December 1943 and January 1944 when she was with the home fleet. They removed the catapults (no fighters) and stuck on deck mounted torpedo tubes and more Oerlikons. Dimensionally she's a bit smaller than Alaska; she'd be a great fit as a Super Cruiser, now that Siegfried has made it possible for a super cruiser to have larger than 305mm main guns. Radar and DefAA, like Kronstadt, I expect.

 

Here's hoping!

 

Super Cruiser stats:

  Renown '44 Alaska Kronshtadt Siegfried
Length 242.0m 246.4m 250.5m 256m
Beam 27.4m 27.8m 31.6m 30m
Draft 9.7m 9.7m 9.45m 8.02m
Displacement 36,660t 30,257t 25,250t 35,968t
Speed 31knots 33knots 33.5knots 33.5knots
Armament 6x381mm 9x305mm 9x305mm 6x380mm
  20x114mm 12x127mm 8x100mm 14x128mm
  8x533mm torps   8x152mm 8x533mm torps
AA 16x12.7mm 34x20mm 12x12.7mm 48x20mm
  24x40mm 56x40mm 28x37mm 16x55mm
  20x114mm 12x127mm 8x100mm 14x128mm

 

17-3594392-hms-renown-1944b.thumb.jpg.5a2ef2b03d4c273821e9d737f9b43a2a.jpg

Keep in mind Renown AA in her best refit was merely comparable to what we have in game at Queen Elizabeth already in terms of AA mounts.

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3 minutes ago, Panocek said:

Keep in mind Renown AA in her best refit was merely comparable to what we have in game at Queen Elizabeth already in terms of AA mounts.

If you have the final numbers, please share. I'm still trying to hunt them down. Will update as and when.

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25 minutes ago, Aragathor said:

There are no heavy cruisers T4 and below

Sure there are.... Tier III would be Warrior, then Hawkins, York/Cornwall, Berwick, Surrey, 1935 Heavy Cruiser (think Town class with twin 8 inch guns), Admiral, Design X/XY/Z 1941 (US influenced large cruiser design with 3 x 3 8in turrets). You might have to get a little fanciful with the Tier X and presume that the US might have shared their automatic loading 8inch guns as seen in Des Moines, or otherwise rely on heavy guns in a smaller, manoeuvrable ship.

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1 minute ago, DanSilverwing said:

If you have the final numbers, please share. I'm still trying to hunt them down. Will update as and when.

https://www.naval-history.net/xGM-Chrono-02BC-Renown.htm

I've read very briefly, but final config would be something like 10x twin 4.5" (114mm), 3x octuple pom pom and 1x quadruple for a total of 28 barrels with something like 60odd 20mm Oerlikons

 

So in game terms, it would mean average long range, crappy mid and dangerous short range.

But then, WG no longer applies dps on "per mount" basis but whenever there is vodka in the fridge so ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

 

 

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