submarines SUBMARINES - discussion, feedback, opinions

[BLUB__BLUB]

8 minutes ago, Procrastes said:

Having a mechanic where a successful depth charge hit can force a submarine to the surface, should definitely be worth looking into! 

IMO that would be better, as in, when the sub has damage he can only repair it at the surface. 

 

[Nexis_Finn]

Vor 42 Minuten, Procrastes sagte:

Good points! Having a mechanic where a successful depth charge hit can force a submarine to the surface, should definitely be worth looking into! 

Yes, why not  It would just be more authentic. In real many german submarines got sunk by a bomber-plane.

Vor 1 Stunde, invicta2012 sagte:

The only BB ever to have sunk a submarine with its spotter plane. WG should definitely add this to the game.

Even the german BB Bismarck had in real waterbombs as counter against submarines. I am sure there are more examples if wg would search in the archives. So WG could think about it, to add anti-submarine thingys to a few battleships. It would made some BB's special. 

 

Same at cruisers.

If we look as example the optic of the Mikojan, we can see that it has rails which leading for dropping depth-charges at it's stern.

The smolensk has the same rails for depthcharges and even additional 6 hedge-hog throwers at its stern.

Hedge-hog was the new asw-weapon at the end of the war btw.. Depth-charges were intended by damaging a submarine with a shockwave. But hedge-hogs only exploded on contact with a submarine and mostly destroyed submarines directly.

 

That were only two examples, but there are sure more.

 

And yes, Mikojan is T5 and Smole is T10, but i think they would create even submarines for this tier's later.

 

 

@BLUB__BLUB Hm, it would not be authentic. At least we germans could repair submarines underwater.

But i would agree if the submarines need to undive for reloading the battery. That was also the case in reality, because reloading battery was only possible by using the diesel-engines. And using the diesel was not possible underwater, without fresh air and without the possibility to dump the exhaust gases.

Later on the war german submarines had a snorkel, so that they could exchange gases at least on surface-depth. A snorkel could become a ship-upgrade on later tiers.

[BLUB__BLUB]

9 minutes ago, _Nexis981_ said:

 

@BLUB__BLUB Hm, it would not be authentic. At least we germans could repair submarines underwater.

But i would agree if the submarines need to undive for reloading the battery. That was also the case in reality, because reloading battery was only possible by using the diesel-engines. And using the diesel was not possible underwater, without fresh air and without the possibility to dump the exhaust gases.

Yes, at least until T8/9 (where subs would get snorkel installation). Then they should be at periscope depth.

But no sub could repair "outside damage" (like rudder) under water. 

 

As for the BBs, yes Bismarck had waterbombs. 

And most should have ASW planes. Hydro is another option. 

 

 

[Smoketoi]

Played a few games I the sub-battles and beside all the technical issues or historical issues I mainly looked at the gameplay. Are these battles fun to play? And to be honest I don't think that playing a sub is contributing at the gameplay in WoW, at least not for me.

Playing surface ships in this mode is not much of a difference then other battles except that as soon a sub is detected the whole dd-fleet is throwing themselves on a that sub to sink it.

 

So on the question if I will play subs in the future? I don't think I will. 

[BLUB__BLUB]

17 minutes ago, Smoketoi said:

Played a few games I the sub-battles and beside all the technical issues or historical issues I mainly looked at the gameplay. Are these battles fun to play? And to be honest I don't think that playing a sub is contributing at the gameplay in WoW, at least not for me.

Playing surface ships in this mode is not much of a difference then other battles except that as soon a sub is detected the whole dd-fleet is throwing themselves on a that sub to sink it.

 

So on the question if I will play subs in the future? I don't think I will. 

I tried them on the test server, and I don't like them much. 

But indeed... DDs go at them like shark-attack. As in real life... 

Well new task for cruisers, too: protect your sub. Shoot DDs!

[Nexis_Finn]

Vor 23 Minuten, Smoketoi sagte:

beside all the technical issues

Do you have also very long loading time and massive desync-lags?

Often the game does not start an eternal time for me, and if it finally starts, the game was already running for 1-2 minutes.

I had never that issues before, only since yesterday. My game is installed on a external ssd ... it worked fine, until yesterday.

 

 

About the subs:
i think many sub-players are wasting their time by torping dodgy dd's and cruisers. They should more focus the enemy submarines. It is not very hard to kill submarines with a submarine.

[steveraptor]

The current state of Subs in the live game is the forshadowing of whats going to happen to the game if they get released at their current state.

 

BBs and CVs are worthless against subs to the point of no reliable counter play (CV) and no counter play at all (BB).

From CV perspective, the mind set is "I'm going to attack other ships and hope my team can kill the subs".

You can easily see it by having 0-1 BB per team in a sub battle.

 

People will stop playing BBs and soon after CVs as well.

 

So cruisers will reign supreme and will make DDs life miserable.

 

Eventually both classes will die out and the game will go into a death spiral....

 

[BLUB__BLUB]

CVs are quite useful. here's a game where I trolled some subs in a cap. 

In Ryujo. I wonder what Masterrrrr @El2aZeR thinks of my torp skilzzz. 

 

True it needs some stuff changed. But IMO they have something fun here.

Now hope they don't FF it up.

20200528_001350_PJSA106-Ryujo_42_Neighbors_Sub.wowsreplay

[Nexis_Finn]

Vor 4 Minuten, steveraptor sagte:

So cruisers will reign supreme and makes DDs life miserable.

Yes. It needs definetely some changes.

 

Actually if all dd's of the team died, and if you then also be unlucky to have not one of the four cruisers with depth-charges in team, enemy subs are on the top of the food-chain.
I had this situation a few minutes ago.

 

We need definetely more cruisers with depth-charges. And also asw for a few cv's and bb's.

[arcticstorm123]

It was kind of disappointing they removed the surfacing for air thing they had in the Halloween event, this made them a lot more challenging to play and was a bit more realistic (after all these aren't nuclear subs), ok you can have snorkels for tier 8 -10 later period subs, but the having to manage air thing did reduce the invulnerability factor of subs in general.

 

In a BB, CL or DD a mistake will get you deleted fairly easily, you can't just press a button and dive out of harms way, submarines (and cv's) need to share the same weakness normal surface ships have to cope with to make it fair

 

 

 

[ImTryingButYouDontHelp]

2 minutes ago, _Nexis981_ said:

Yes. It needs definetely some changes.

 

Actually if all dd's of the team died, and if you then also be unlucky to have not one of the four cruisers with depth-charges in team, enemy subs are on the top of the food-chain.
I had this situation a few minutes ago.

 

We need definetely more cruisers with depth-charges. And also asw for a few cv's and bb's.

All ships need ASW.

[TunaRoll]

 

I think that with subs the dependency of the team on the DDs has increased significantly, that means that if the DDs commit suicide or the team cannot protect them, you are inferior to the opposing team relatively quickly. Even more than before, imo. Why? More spotting, more torps and even more passive playing BBs / camping cruisers. Overall, I just don't see any benefit. With the amount of torps floating around, as a BB I will definitely not be able to play my tanking role. As we all know, the MM ist quite random, so winning in bad teams will be even harder than before. Also the subs need a lot of balancing, f.e. their torpedo speed and the damage of perfectly, central shot torps is just too much. Im quite sure i didnt download World of Torpedos. :/

[BLUB__BLUB]

1 minute ago, Miblogdegolf said:

All ships need ASW.

No man. Finally a way to "nerf" Belfast and Smolensk and Russian OP crap. 

[ImTryingButYouDontHelp]

2 minutes ago, BLUB__BLUB said:

No man. Finally a way to "nerf" Belfast and Smolensk and Russian OP crap. 

 

Well, that's what you would do, but reality is that most ships would pay the high price to not have any way of killing subs, and that, for me, is inacceptable in a game like this.

[BLUB__BLUB]

4 minutes ago, arcticstorm123 said:

I was kind of disappointing they removed the surfacing for air thing they had in the Halloween event, this made them a lot more challenging to play and was a bit more realistic (after all these aren't nuclear subs), ok you can have snorkels for tier 8 -10 later period subs, but the having to manage air thing did reduce the invulnerability factor of subs in general.

I think same. WG might have something good here. Now watch if they don't stuff it up.

 

4 minutes ago, arcticstorm123 said:

In a BB, CL or DD a mistake will get you deleted fairly easily, you can't just press a button and dive out of harms way, submarines (and cv's) need to share the same weakness normal surface ships have to cope with to make it fair

For CVs this is already visible. Subs will go for the CV, there is no hiding behind island anymore. 

[BLUB__BLUB]

1 minute ago, Miblogdegolf said:

Well, that's what you would do, but reality is that most ships would pay the high price to not have any way of killing subs, and that, for me, is inacceptable in a game like this.

OK then maybe given them 1 depthcharge with a reload of 5 minutes....

Well no but I guess this is a way of getting a re-balance for those ships. 

[arcticstorm123]

11 minutes ago, BLUB__BLUB said:

For CVs this is already visible. Subs will go for the CV, there is no hiding behind island anymore. 

This is the only reason I can think of to look favourably on subs, which is to give the cv something to worry about, not hating on cv's I enjoy playing them, but they don't tend to experience the same fear of being suddenly deleted that other ship classes have, mind you cv's would need to have some way of detecting and killing subs to make it fair

 

Even close in they have a large health pool as evidenced by the Graf Zepplin secondary builds I've seen, laugh a minute I'll admit.

 

To be honest I'd prefer to forget about subs and make it easier for cv's to attack each other, with RTS (who's passing I don't mourn) one of the joys was hunting down and killing the opposing teams cv, I'd love to see the return of cv vs cv as a regular thing and forget about the subs

[BLUB__BLUB]

10 minutes ago, arcticstorm123 said:

This is the only reason I can think of to look favourably on subs, which is to give the cv something to worry about, not hating on cv's I enjoy playing them, but they don't tend to experience the same fear of being suddenly deleted that other ship classes have, mind you cv's would need to have some way of detecting and killing subs to make it fair

They have a way... 20200528_001350_PJSA106-Ryujo_42_Neighbors_Sub.wowsreplay

Note that Ark Royal is even better (clusterbombs, 3 torps and better rockets). 

 

10 minutes ago, arcticstorm123 said:

Even close in they have a large health pool as evidenced by the Graf Zepplin secondary builds I've seen, laugh a minute I'll admit.

yes but doesn;t help much, if you can't see them. 

I think CVs need ASW planes (change the rockets... or make it a choice). 

 

10 minutes ago, arcticstorm123 said:

To be honest I'd prefer to forget about subs and make it easier for cv's to attack each other, with RTS (who's passing I don't mourn) one of the joys was hunting down and killing the opposing teams cv, I'd love to see the return of cv vs cv as a regular thing and forget about the subs

CVs already can attack eachother. I often do, when they are the best target. 

However detecting them and give BBs something to do is better. 

[arcticstorm123]

1 minute ago, BLUB__BLUB said:

They have a way... 20200528_001350_PJSA106-Ryujo_42_Neighbors_Sub.wowsreplay

Note that Ark Royal is even better (clusterbombs, 3 torps and better rockets). 

 

yes but doesn;t help much, if you can't see them. 

I think CVs need ASW planes (change the rockets... or make it a choice). 

 

CVs already can attack eachother. I often do, when they are the best target. 

However detecting them and give BBs something to do is better. 

Sure, but you don't see it that often, mind you that's random's across the board in all classes  

[Smoketoi]

44 minutes ago, _Nexis981_ said:

Do you have also very long loading time and massive desync-lags?

Often the game does not start an eternal time for me, and if it finally starts, the game was already running for 1-2 minutes.

I had never that issues before, only since yesterday. My game is installed on a external ssd ... it worked fine, until yesterday.

 

 

About the subs:
i think many sub-players are wasting their time by torping dodgy dd's and cruisers. They should more focus the enemy submarines. It is not very hard to kill submarines with a submarine.

Yes since yesterday everything is loading dead slow. I also lost connection with the server a couple of times

[BLUB__BLUB]

Just now, arcticstorm123 said:

Sure, but you don't see it that often, mind you that's random's across the board in all classes  

Well I think I'll have a fun time chasing subs. Check the replay it is hilarious. 

[Smeggo]

Submarine-gamemode now also count for the dailies. 

[Procrastes]

2 hours ago, _Nexis981_ said:

If we look as example the optic of the Mikojan, we can see that it has rails which leading for dropping depth-charges at it's stern.

The smolensk has the same rails for depthcharges and even additional 6 hedge-hog throwers at its stern.

Hedge-hog was the new asw-weapon at the end of the war btw.. Depth-charges were intended by damaging a submarine with a shockwave. But hedge-hogs only exploded on contact with a submarine and mostly destroyed submarines directly.

 

That were only two examples, but there are sure more.

And on certain destroyers, such as the Friesland and the Halland, there are forward-firing depth charge mortars mounted (I don't know if that's what they are called, strictly speaking, but they are a form of ASW). I expect them to become fully operational some time in the near future! 

[arcticstorm123]

33 minutes ago, BLUB__BLUB said:

Well I think I'll have a fun time chasing subs. Check the replay it is hilarious. 

Yeah, had a look, rockets don't do anywhere near the damage I expected, but congrats on the torp hit 

[invicta2012]

8 minutes ago, Procrastes said:

(I don't know if that's what they are called, strictly speaking, but they are a form of ASW). I expect them to become fully operational some time in the near future! 

That would make a massive difference. WW2 things like Hedgehog and Limbo would make DDs lives so much easier. Havant class destroyers when?