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Fast_Free_Shipping

Kidd or Loyang?

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Hello everybody

 

Im fairly new at the game and im looking to buy my first premium soon since we get the 25% off coupon tomorrow.

I really like the USN DDs so these seem to be a good option, i just dont know wich one to buy.

 

What would you guys advice?

 

Thanks

 

EDIT: Im holding off buying a tier 8 premium right now, would you guys recommend any tier 7 destroyer?

 

 

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If you like gunboats go for Kidd, if you like sneaky smoke, hydro and torpedos go for Lo Yang... Don't forget that Lo Yang have almost OP hydro :crab:

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If you're going up the USN DD line then go with the Kidd, a good captain trainer and great little gunboat at Tier 8.

 

Lo Yang is also a great DD, I actually prefer it to the Kidd. But if you don't have the captain for it don't bother, it needs a 14 point captain to really work.

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1 minute ago, Fast_Free_Shipping said:

Im fairly new at the game and im looking to buy my first premium soon since we get the 25% off coupon tomorrow.

I really like the USN DDs so these seem to be a good option, i just dont know wich one to buy.

 

What would you guys advice?

First bit of advice is the usual 'high tier premiums are a bad idea early in your playing career', which I'll assume you'll be ignoring - well. it *is* 25% off after all!

 

They're both really good ships; when making your decision, perhaps think about the following:

  • *If* you know how to use it, Loyang's smoke/hydro combo is excellent (the latter is basically cruiser hydro - 5.5 km detection range for ships); the down-side is that a lot of higher tier players know how to counter this (Loyang was monstrous in competitive until people worked it out; now it's simply just good) and there's no shortage of radar about these days. Mount the hydro mod (for coal) in slot 2 - it'll increase your hydro run time to 132 secss.
  • Kidd's USP is the AA (for which you lose a bank of torps) and the heal; the former includes DefAA (load the coal upgrade in slot 2 to maximise run time), and the latter gives you exceptional survivability.
  • In terms of dakka, they're similar, although Kidd gets an extra turret (she's a T8 Fletcher after all, and Loyang is a C-hull Benson - *the* Benson).
  • Kidd only has one bank of torps (they're the upgraded Benson torps), versus two for Loyang; the latter has the option of either the same torps as Kidd (two launchers), or faster/shorter range 'YOLO' torps which are riskier to use, but harder to evade. I run the YOLO ones FWIW. Unlike the silver PA ships, Loyang doesn't have DWT of course.
  • Both are good trainers for their respective silver lines.
  • In my view, Loyang perhaps works rather better if your team is hopeless, as she can do plenty of her own damage; Kidd's reduced torp set means she needs supporting ships to do a lot of her damage, and you have to break stealth to use the guns - does one or other play style suit you better.

Which one to pick will depend on your own preferences, and whether you have the silver line for each (it's easier to get a good captain for both if you can maximise daily win bonuses with more than one ship); how you play and in which mode will also be relevant e.g. Loyang is very good for competitive modes, whilst Kidd is excellent any time there are planes present (she holds my personal record for plane kills in a single game), and so on...

 

 

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my advice? dont go anywhere near T8 premiums yet. You haven't even reached that high on silver ships yet, so although you are doing quite well in the ships you do have (props for that by the way, with such a low battle count!), chances are you're gonna get horribly slaughtered even in such relatively strong T8 ships as the Kidd and LongWang once you run into Darings, Harugumos, Grozovois and the like. The coupon isnt going anywhere anytime soon - save yourself the frustration and wait a bit before making that jump.

 

Once you do, advice from the other fine folk in here should help with your decision :cap_like:

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5 minutes ago, Tyrendian89 said:

my advice? dont go anywhere near T8 premiums yet.

 

8 minutes ago, Verblonde said:

First bit of advice is the usual 'high tier premiums are a bad idea early in your playing career', which I'll assume you'll be ignoring - well. it *is* 25% off after all!

 

You guys are right, i almost reached tier 8 so i thought it would be a good moment to buy one. But i think i should wait till i have some more games in.

 

So if i were to buy a tier 7 prem dd, wich one would you advice? Im currently grinding the USN DDs so im thinking about the sims, but im also hearing a lot of good things about the haida...

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That early I world suggest some T6-7. You don't have T8 ship yet, you don't know what's on T10 MM. 

On T6 I suggest T-61. It'll be ok with 10 point commender. Pretty nice DD. 

After you get the Benson and you see how to play on such tiers - grab the Kidd. It'll be very useful for you. Great close fighter. The heal helps a lot that you can fight some (just some!) T10 DDs. Plus Def AA against CVs. Especially good against the lower tiers CVs.

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1 hour ago, Fast_Free_Shipping said:

Hello everybody

 

Im fairly new at the game and im looking to buy my first premium soon since we get the 25% off coupon tomorrow.

I really like the USN DDs so these seem to be a good option, i just dont know wich one to buy.

 

What would you guys advice?

 

Thanks

Take some advice?

 

Forget buying a Tier VIII premium ship because with only 509 battles you are by no means ready for the storm to come...

 

I made that mistake buying Scharnhorst and Tirpitz before I was ready.... it was not an enjoyable experience for me and I can assure you it was no fun for the team either.. There were some very irate players rightly venting their frustrations at my very, very, poor performance...

 

Don't try to run the Marathon before you have even learned to walk... it will not end well.

 

If you disregard my advice stay in Co-oP with your purchase....

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4 minutes ago, Migantium_Mashum said:

Take some advice?

 

Forget buying a Tier VIII premium ship because with only 509 battles you are by no means ready for the storm to come...

 

I made that mistake buying Scharnhorst and Tirpitz before I was ready.... it was not an enjoyable experience for me and I can assure you it was no fun for the team either.. There were some very irate players rightly venting their frustrations at my very, very, poor performance...

 

Don't try to run the Marathon before you have even learned to walk... it will not end well.

 

If you disregard my advice stay in Co-oP with your purchase....

You are right, i wont buy a tier 8 premium. Any recommendations for a tier 7 dd?

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6 minutes ago, Fast_Free_Shipping said:

So if i were to buy a tier 7 prem dd, wich one would you advice? Im currently grinding the USN DDs so im thinking about the sims, but im also hearing a lot of good things about the haida...

Same notes about premiums that match your silver lines apply, which is a point in favour of Sims by the sound of it - Sims is pretty good in a high CV environment (with an AA build - AA Guns Mod 1 still works on her), but her mediocre stealth can be annoying when there aren't CVs about. If it ever returns, she used to be glorious in Dynamo (the Op) too. Slow torps (49 knots) take a bit of getting used to, although a recent buff to their range (now 10.5 km) makes them a lot more usable. You also have a YOLO torp option as well, but I don't run it.

 

Haida is one of my favourite ships in the game (one of only two - I think - DDs with a secondary armament, which can be a giggle), although I'm biased as the real thing is parked about half an hour from where I live. She is very stealthy for her tier, and a very worthwhile gunboat. Single bank of torps, although (unlike Kidd) she can single fire, which mitigates this with some practice. She also has creeping smoke, which can be very useful at times. AA is okay, but unremarkable (Haida is a later Tribal, so doesn't have Cossack's appalling AA). The defensive hydro makes you functionally immune to torps (assuming you can dodge) for a mighty 216 secs with the coal mod mounted! Speaking of coal mods, I also mount the smoke one too. The crucial down-side to Haida is that she's a Commonwealth ship i.e. hopeless as a captain trainer, and you really want at least a 10-pointer in her to work properly.

 

The other T7 premium DD I would flag up is Z-39: she has the same hydro/smoke combination as Loyang (5 km range, and two minute run time with coal mod) and is a good trainer for the silver KM DDs. AA is okay for a DD, and her stealth is surprisingly good thanks to being able to mount the Concealment Mod a tier early. Something to have on the radar: she has 150 mm guns, so BFT captains won't improve your main battery ROF.

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Sims.  She's a bit of a puzzle but lots of fun. Quite different to Mahan but they're both keepers. 

 

Haida, Leningrad and Blyskawica are fun at Tier VII but you need 10pt+ captains.

 

I would play through the silver German DDs before trying Z-39; T-61 is a better all round bet. Don't look past Tier VI premiums, you can get a lot of mileage out them in Operations.

 

As far as Tier VIIIs go... Kidd and Cossack do something specific, well: AA and gunboating, respectively. Asashio does, too (and I might well spend my 25% voucher on her).

 

Lo Yang? On paper I don't quite see what she brings over Benson or Hsien Yang.

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25 minutes ago, Fast_Free_Shipping said:

You are right, i wont buy a tier 8 premium. Any recommendations for a tier 7 dd?

Really depends on how you want to play a DD..

 

 

Silver Line I would say Shiratsuyu because with a level 10 captain you can get concealment down to 5.8km and you can choose Torpedo Reload Booster which means within 15 seconds you can have 2 salvos of torpedoes heading to your target....

 

 

 

 

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1 minute ago, invicta2012 said:

Lo Yang? On paper I don't quite see what she brings over Benson or Hsien Yang.

Smoke/hydro combo.

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43 minutes ago, Tyrendian89 said:

my advice? dont go anywhere near T8 premiums yet. You haven't even reached that high on silver ships yet, so although you are doing quite well in the ships you do have (props for that by the way, with such a low battle count!), chances are you're gonna get horribly slaughtered even in such relatively strong T8 ships as the Kidd and LongWang once you run into Darings, Harugumos, Grozovois and the like. The coupon isnt going anywhere anytime soon - save yourself the frustration and wait a bit before making that jump.

 

Once you do, advice from the other fine folk in here should help with your decision :cap_like:

Gr8 advice, the problem is MM, while Kidd and Lo are great you’ll meet Gearings, Fletchers, Jutland, Daring, And Khabas etc, not to forget Shimi’s. I hated benson and fletcher for that reason but loved gearing (top tier). I love the fushun and gadjah Mada, but then they have better MM

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6 minutes ago, invicta2012 said:

Sims.  She's a bit of a puzzle but lots of fun. Quite different to Mahan but they're both keepers. 

n at Tier VII but you need 10pt+ captains.

 

 

Good bote better than Mahan, but dire torps, great AA and manoeuvrability 

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8 minutes ago, MadBadDave said:

Good bote better than Mahan, but dire torps, great AA and manoeuvrability 

I like Mahan. I don't really trust a destroyer that doesn't have enough torpedoes to wipe out an onrushing enemy, but Mahan always has another set of torps ready to go. That's why Sims is a puzzle... she doesn't quite have the oomph of the Silver ship, but I never regret playing her.

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2 hours ago, Fast_Free_Shipping said:

What would you guys advice?

Thanks

 

EDIT: Im holding off buying a tier 8 premium right now, would you guys recommend any tier 7 destroyer?

 

First off, well done to you for having so good stats already! :)

Since you seem to like DDs: There are two DD metas depending on tiers.

 

Playing tier 7 and below (=mid tiers) (max tier 6 ship since +2 MM means they see tier 8 games) provides you with a fairly safe zone to learn how DDs work, which nations have what quirks, and generally how to deal with bigger ships (positioning for torpedo attacks etc). Ships in general have fairly anemic guns and insta-gib potantial so most likely getting spotted will only set you back some hp's, not outright get you blapped. Offensively you only have to contend with hydro, and pretty short ranged hydro at that. Defensively there are no radars to make life incredibly difficult and although CVs will still be a pain, most CVs are pretty bad at killing DDs.

 

Playing tier 8 and above (= high tier): Anything spots you and you can say goodbye to half you hp, if not outright sent back to port.  From tier 8 ships get the radar consumable and they start having the DPM to really kill a dd inside one  radar duration. The range of radar is from 10 km (USN) to 12 km (RU) with some odd lower ranged radars thrown in (9 km on USN CLs and 9,5 on Missouri) which forces DDs to play very circumspect. Add CVs and the fact most DDs are gunboats with incredible DPM at tier X and any spotted tier 8 DD out of position is quickly toast. Having fun playing at this level requires knowledge of which dds mount radar or hydro (and the range can be 7,5 or 6 km respectively), which have the gunpower to evaporate your dd and also what CVs and radarships can do and how to deal with them. Unless you respect those limits BEFORE searching for prey, games may be very inconsistent and possibly with an early frustrating end to them.

 

DDs to consider

Buying a Tier 6 DD: will introduce you to radars occasionally, but generally be fun to fool around in and use it as credit earner and crew trainer.

Buying tier 7:  You will see Radar ships most games and it will teach you how to deal with them without exposing you constantly to it. However, getting uptiered into tier 9 could mean as many as 4 or 5 radar ships, making the games pretty tough.

If you like USN dds, you should buy a USN DD for crew training. Forget Kidd (long story short, it's for unicums). Sims might work although I dont have one myself. 

Another option would be trying Royal Navy DDs. They're quite similar and their guns pack a bit more of a punch, they have 2nd best concealment in the game (after IJN) plus hydro makes them pretty safe vs torps.

Tier 7: One rule for a competitive DD: it must have at least 8 km torps and servicable guns. Not many tier 6 or 7 dds are particularly special (like the tier 8) though. 

Tier 8: special "worthwhile" dds to consider if you plan to save the coupon is:

Cossack (best guns+concealment+hydro+almost best torps = a bit OP), Asashio (best concealment +Deep water torpedoes to harvest BBaby tears) and Lo Yang (see below)

 

 

40 minutes ago, invicta2012 said:

Lo Yang? On paper I don't quite see what she brings over Benson or Hsien Yang.

5,5 km range hydro - best hydro in the game short of Tier X german hydro?

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33 minutes ago, GulvkluderGuld said:

5,5 km range hydro - best hydro in the game short of Tier X german hydro?

Indeed. But nothing of interest to me, at least. Tier VIII and above is dull.

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22 minutes ago, invicta2012 said:

Indeed. But nothing of interest to me, at least. Tier VIII and above is dull.

If you dont care about Ranked aswell, I see your point. Tier 8 Ranked happens once in a while and LY is the best dd pick for that :)

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5 minutes ago, GulvkluderGuld said:

If you dont care about Ranked aswell, I see your point. Tier 8 Ranked happens once in a while and LY is the best dd pick for that :)

We have a Ranked Sprint at Tier VIII coming up. But I've gone off that mode, to be honest, and Tier VIII is going to be a catastrophe.

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5 minutes ago, invicta2012 said:

We have a Ranked Sprint at Tier VIII coming up. But I've gone off that mode, to be honest, and Tier VIII is going to be a catastrophe.

My Saipan is ready to disagree with you :Smile_trollface:

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The coupon will be there for some time so you wont be in any rush to use it before it expires as far as I have understood.

 

I have Sims and Blyskawica and both are bringing their own flavour to the game even if the latter has been a bit power crept. 

 

If you grind the USN DD line and like it I would recommend the Sims. She will have the same firepower as the Loyang and good AA to counter those pesky planes as well as better MM. The major thing she loses out on to Loyang is the concealment due to the fact T7 and below cant mount the Concealment upgrade and the hydro which has quite a high skill ceiling. 

 

Other decent picks I myself are looking at are T-61 even if I would recommend you trying the German destroyers above T6 before spending you money (also valid for Loyang). 

 

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2 hours ago, invicta2012 said:

Lo Yang? On paper I don't quite see what she brings over Benson or Hsien Yang.

5.5 km hydro. Plus the option for faster torps (68knt) but you have 0.9km concealment window. Better to stay on 9.2km 55knt. 

In fact she's a mix of German gimmick (hydro) in American DD which is Pan-Asian. 

T8+ dull? Get the Friesland first. 

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@OP There is the high tier premium issue in general that people already mentioned, that said I would hardly recommend any T7 premium apart from maybe Haida due to bad concealment and the fact that T8 can mount the concealment module, You should be able to get away with a Cossack at T8 as long as you remember not to gunboat every dd you see when not top tier she is quite user friendly

 

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11 hours ago, Fast_Free_Shipping said:

So if i were to buy a tier 7 prem dd, wich one would you advice? Im currently grinding the USN DDs so im thinking about the sims, but im also hearing a lot of good things about the haida...

I would advice you to get either the Haida or the T-61 (the latter is a tier VI, but never mind). In fact, I would advice you to get them both - they are both good ships, but they offer two completely different play styles.

 

The Haida has great concealment, very good guns, and a surprisingly effective combination of short-ranged but long-lasting hydro and creeping smoke, which all combine to make her perhaps the best gunboat destroyer hunter at her tier. These strengths are compensated for by her having only a single torpedo launcher, but this drawback is in turn somewhat mitigated by the fact that you can fire them single shot. Least but not last, she's a beautiful ship with a fascinating irl history, her exploits during WW2 having earned her enduring fame as "the fightingest ship in the Royal Canadinan Navy". All in all, she's one of the best premiums Wargaming has constructed.

 

The T-61 is probably the most versatile all-round destroyer at her tier. She has good values overall, with a blisteringly fast torpedo reload that lets you put an impressive amount of metal fish in the water. Her hydro grants an advantage in games of hide and seek, and this is a much-needed perk since her guns are somewhat on the weak side and can't be readily relied upon as a sole means of winning battles with other destroyers. She rewards careful play, but can punish mistakes severely. I like her very much; she has made me into a better destroyer captain than I was when I first got her.

 

Best of luck in your future engagements, Captain!

:Smile_honoring:

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