Excessive Criticism

[bratisla_boy]

Il y a 2 heures, MerchantPrince a dit :

Maybe a mod? It's actually not a bad idea, it also frustrates me (like fools following you to port-harass you in chat because you NEED to know they're better than you, in their eyes) even though it's a bit stupid.
Anyway, we play the game for the ships and the fun, so we should just learn to ignore the foolishness :)

I will look if there are UI resources available from WG, and begin to think about it. A mod *removing* an information from UI should not be too hard to validate with WG, and not too hard ...

 

Let me just some months, the amount of work I have nowadays is too damn high !

[mtm78]

Most of my compliments actually go to enemy players  

[250swb]

8 hours ago, mtm78 said:

 

 

Coming back to that comprehension issue again, seems you keep failing to understand the report option is there by design and for a reason. If you don't like it, that's fine. Complain about it all you want, but stop making stuff up.

 

 

Alongside power comes responsibility.

 

If you can't moderate your inclinations for reporting players who aren't conforming to your plan maybe playing team games isn't for you? Being frustrated with other people's actions is perfectly normal. But when you know before every battle that you'll have players in your team well below your own skill level (probably most of them) surely you have to adjust your expectations because nine times out of ten they won't deserve being reported because they simply aren't as skillful and never will be despite your nagging and reporting.

[El2aZeR]

9 minutes ago, 250swb said:

Alongside power comes responsibility.

 

Again, what power?

Most report options do literally nothing but influence karma which in itself might as well not exist as it does nothing but increase the amount of reports/compliments you can dish out.

Reporting for misbehavior in chat can yield a one day chatban, hardly something to fret over.

[mtm78]

8 minutes ago, 250swb said:

If you can't moderate your inclinations for reporting players who aren't conforming to your plan maybe playing team games isn't for you?

 

If people's feelings are to sensitive in dealing with getting reported for the exact reason the report option gives to players: playing poorly, maybe this team game is to hard for them?

 

9 minutes ago, 250swb said:

 But when you know before every battle that you'll have players in your team well below your own skill level (probably most of them) surely you have to adjust your expectations 

You make it sound like I report every bad move I see in game. That's not possible and also not the intent of the system. I am also pretty often far from the best player in my team, I don't think I ever been in a random team where I'd be the worst though. My stats are old, I'm coming back from a break, and I have to get used to a lot of new content and some meta changes. I'd say currently I'm far from being the same player my stats show I was. 

 

10 minutes ago, 250swb said:

because nine times out of ten they won't deserve being reported because they simply aren't as skillful and never will be

But 'plays poorly' is an outlet, for the 4th time already it's not about me expecting skill it's WG letting players vent some frustration without it being actually toxic to the recipient. Yes I do HOPE people I report actually do some self analysis and conclude they should have done things differently, and even try doing things differently the very next moment they find themselves in the same situation. But I don't expect this. 

 

Sadly as said earlier, the moment OBT started the common response to being helpful in chat is being called names and people doing the opposite on purpose just out of spite. 

 

 

[LoveYouTooBuddy]

Had few games today, not very good performance on my part. But the chat was quite friendly and nice from what I remember. 

Maybe the thing you are complaining about here is over? Maybe I just mastered the power to read between the lines...

I predict sunshine and rainbows from now on. 

The future is bright, enjoy!

[NothingButTheRain]

On 9/2/2019 at 8:54 PM, illy said:

you can usually tell when you're having a good game is when you start getting slagged off by other players

The best compliment anyone can give you as a gamer, is if they firmly believe that you are hacking 

Obviously only eligable if there's no hacking involved 

[mariouus]

46 minutes ago, 250swb said:

Alongside power comes responsibility.

 

If you can't moderate your inclinations for reporting players who aren't conforming to your plan maybe playing team games isn't for you? Being frustrated with other people's actions is perfectly normal. But when you know before every battle that you'll have players in your team well below your own skill level (probably most of them) surely you have to adjust your expectations because nine times out of ten they won't deserve being reported because they simply aren't as skillful and never will be despite your nagging and reporting.

Like it has been sayed before - Reporting is venting tool. So people just push reporting button, rather than Rage in in-game/port chat.

 

And in case of players playing baddly, it does what it is designed for. There is no real issues - reporting bad player for bad gameplay is essentially fair. In a case, when that player is looking at the Karma rating, might even understand that he/she needes do improve. 

 

Not do mention, that in Randoms, it fairly uncommon do get reported, unless you are really visibly bad. Just like in Randoms, you have do be visibly good do be Complimented. And obviously, there are situations, where Reporter is too dumb do understand, that person he/she reported was actually doing correctly.

 

Problem of the current Karma system, is that it allowes Spite reporting. This might cause confusion - when new/inexperienced player has a very good battle and gets Spite reports, he/she might think he played it wrongly. 

 

Like I sayed before. Getting reported for being bad, when actually being bad - is not an issue. Being reported for being bad, while actually playing well - is a problem. (While Karma system is utterly pointless, being reported for playing well, kind of sends the wrong message)

 

 

 

 

[Ronchabale]

On 9/2/2019 at 8:32 AM, Butterfield8 said:

Lately I have noticed quite a bit of excessive criticism during game play. "Report this person!" appears to be many players favorite commentary on other's abilities and play. This is a game! It is not life and death! I like to win as much as the next guy but when you act this way you are taking the fun out of it for yourself and those who may be playing with you! "Pull down your pants and slide on the ice!"

Report the player complaining about others, that might just make him shut it

 

I do like the complementing more tho, plays well / worthy adversary

[Alfa_Tau]

On ‎9‎/‎2‎/‎2019 at 8:32 AM, Butterfield8 said:

Lately I have noticed quite a bit of excessive criticism during game play. "Report this person!" appears to be many players favorite commentary on other's abilities and play. This is a game! It is not life and death! I like to win as much as the next guy but when you act this way you are taking the fun out of it for yourself and those who may be playing with you! "Pull down your pants and slide on the ice!"

Have to say on one hand I agree with you. The toxicity is increasing as this game is more and more populated by teens . 

However on the other hand I am seeing too many battles like the one below. Which is also a sign that the average skill level is decreasing instead of increasing. 

 

[Alfa_Tau]

43 minutes ago, mariouus said:

Spite reporting

What does it mean? I am confused. 

Thanks

[mariouus]

12 minutes ago, Alfa_Tau said:

What does it mean? I am confused. 

Thanks

It means, for example, enemy reporting you for defeting them.

[Ze_Reckless]

6 hours ago, Europizza said:

I'm just not a very friendly person. Hmmmmm. Maybe that explains my karma score

That or I'm not polish enough 

Rename yourself to Europierogi. 

[_HomTanks_]

 

And we know this one sided approach of the game design has not changed for years and will not change. Hence, the toxicity will not end.  

[Alfa_Tau]

12 hours ago, mariouus said:

It means, for example, enemy reporting you for defeting them.

Ah ok it happened to me a lot in the past week. 

thanks

[anonym_WQDIB9XrzbSp]

I noticed towards the end of ranked season that the opening comments in chat were people outing the win rate of other players.

 

Not on the enemy team with a view to taking advantage of a 17% Iowa WR in Randoms, but targeted at our own team!

 

It's a surefire way to ruin a ranked game because everyone people started behaving differently. Notably a certain Yugumo player who, upon deciding during countdown that his team is not worthy of him, outed people every game and then buggers off to the edges, avoids capping and farms damage and star.

[250swb]

On 9/3/2019 at 8:23 PM, mtm78 said:

 

If people's feelings are to sensitive in dealing with getting reported for the exact reason the report option gives to players: playing poorly, maybe this team game is to hard for them?

 

When I first started playing WoWs the overall feedback from the community was that it was way more civilised than WoT and that you'd be treated fairly aside from the obvious trolls. But from this thread, and what I've witnessed in chat, it is obvious the insidious nature of WoT runs deep but is absorbed by the Karma system, and the fundamental instincts of some special players to degrade and humiliate other players is still rife.

 

So you want to talk about 'sensitivity', well by what parameters are you going to decree what is being too sensitive? By your own parameters, have you invented a self created 'rule' for when you can abuse other players with a report? It is common for people with no comprehension of empathy to decree anybody else is 'sensitive' as it suits them. So where are you on this, you get a gut feeling about reporting anybody that doesn't meet your requirements in a battle, or is it scientific and you have a formula to express your empathy?

[mariouus]

1 hour ago, 250swb said:

So you want to talk about 'sensitivity', well by what parameters are you going to decree what is being too sensitive? By your own parameters, have you invented a self created 'rule' for when you can abuse other players with a report? It is common for people with no comprehension of empathy to decree anybody else is 'sensitive' as it suits them. So where are you on this, you get a gut feeling about reporting anybody that doesn't meet your requirements in a battle, or is it scientific and you have a formula to express your empathy?

Firstly: Stating the fact, that somebody is playing baddly, using the in-game reporting system - is not abuse nor is it lack of ephathy. It is essentially a grade, that other player give to another player. 

 

For example, I only report player for being bad, when their repeted action is against basic common sense AND when those actions directly looses the game. I do not expect players do be "good", but I expect them do use atleast basic common sense.

 

Secondly: It is a TEAM game. Player who did those basic repeted mistakes. Lost the game for 5-11 other players. Nullifing all their hardwork. And many-many players do it alot, on daily basis. Completly ignoring and refusing do learn even the most basic gameplay "features" (even if it is pointed out do him/her). Where is Empathy in Screwing-over 5-11 of teammates on dailybasis?

 

 Yes, Karma system is heavily-flawed. But ability do report a player who is playing baddly - for playing baddly- is not one of those flaws,

[Hanse77SWE]

I had a game not long ago with this conversation in chatt.

 

Red Player: "Report XXXX!" (A guy on the red team.)

Me: "Why?"

Red Player: "He's AFK!"

 

At this point I thought "Good for my team then!" but also "I can't see that for myself and I'm not gonna report someone just bc someone tells me to." A while later we can see the guy and he's sitting at the spawnpoint, haven't moved an inch (2.54 cm).

 

Me: "He's not AFK, he's disconected."

Red Player: "Report him!"

Me: "I'm not gonna report someone just bc his internet, computer or client crashed."

Green Player: "Do you want to get your game ruined by AFK players?"

Me: "No, but I don't think it's right to punish someone for something that he can't control."

 

Yes, he could have gone AFK but some sort of crash is just as likely and the you have to give him the benefit of the doubt. Anything can happen that forces you to leave the keybord. "Sh1t happens"

 

AND I see far to many players doing things that deserves a report more than that almost every game, actively! I save my reports for them.

[mtm78]

1 hour ago, 250swb said:

By your own parameters, have you invented a self created 'rule' for when you can abuse other players with a report?

 

I told you before to stop making stuff up it's getting boring. There is nothing self invented about options which were implemented by design by the game developers 

 

1 hour ago, 250swb said:

When I first started playing WoWs the overall feedback from the community was that it was way more civilised than WoT

It is. Especially before OBT started tho. 

 

It can still be, when people ask questions, get answers and accept them. It's mostly when people go around claiming things about the game which are only true in their perception when it get's less civilized. Those people keep making things up, like arbitrary rules that people shouldn't be using report options on other players just because he thinks it's not needed. 

 

1 hour ago, 250swb said:

So where are you on this, you get a gut feeling about reporting anybody that doesn't meet your requirements in a battle, or is it scientific and you have a formula to express your empathy?

Why would empathy have anything to do with it? Karma means nothing and is a heavily flawed system,  and if people do care about it they should take into account things which lower their karma. 

 

[mtm78]

2 minutes ago, Hanse77SWE said:

I had a game not long ago with this conversation in chatt.

 

Red Player: "Report XXXX!" (A guy on the red team.)

Me: "Why?"

Red Player: "He's AFK!"

 

At this point I thought "Good for my team then!" but also "I can't see that for myself and I'm not gonna report someone just bc someone tells me to." A while later we can see the guy and he's sitting at the spawnpoint, haven't moved an inch (2.54 cm).

 

Me: "He's not AFK, he's disconected."

Red Player: "Report him!"

Me: "I'm not gonna report someone just bc his internet, computer or client crashed."

Green Player: "Do you want to get your game ruined by AFK players?"

Me: "No, but I don't think it's right to punish someone for something that he can't control."

 

Yes, he could have gone AFK but some sort of crash is just as likely and the you have to give him the benefit of the doubt. Anything can happen that forces you to leave the keybord. "Sh1t happens"

 

AND I see far to many players doing things that deserves a report more than that almost every game, actively! I save my reports for them.

If the turrets are not in starting position, he was connected to the game. Him sitting in his spawn point means nothing, I seen plenty of people who seemingly pressed battle and 'didn't notice they got in a battle until 10m in'.... and you can recognize them by their turrets being on one axis, and no longer in starting position. 

 

 

[Hanse77SWE]

5 minutes ago, mtm78 said:

If the turrets are not in starting position, he was connected to the game. Him sitting in his spawn point means nothing, I seen plenty of people who seemingly pressed battle and 'didn't notice they got in a battle until 10m in'.... and you can recognize them by their turrets being on one axis, and no longer in starting position.

They were in the starting position. I tried to keep it somewhat short but now you forced my hand.

 

EDIT: And the crash could have come after the match had started.

[250swb]

12 hours ago, mariouus said:

Firstly: Stating the fact, that somebody is playing baddly, using the in-game reporting system - is not abuse nor is it lack of ephathy. It is essentially a grade, that other player give to another player. 

 

You will be able to explain then what lesson another player learns from getting a report? Where in the report can you possibly tell them what it is they did wrong? No, you can't can you? So it's a fiction to pretend you are telling somebody about what they did that you didn't like, you can only intimate there was 'something' you didn't like. 

 

Which is why the idea of lessons and learning things through reports is just an excuse for better players to weaponise Karma and treat it as summary justice, no discussion, no comeback, no lesson learnt. This is why this thread is infested with self righteousness, people really do imagine they are explaining to people what they did wrong by habitually using the reporting system. 

[mtm78]

You really should complain to the developers not the players :)

[GarrusBrutus]

People use the report system to vent. "Oh no I got reported, what am I gonna do?" said no one ever....