aa rework Feedback on the new AA System.

[Sunleader]

Meanwhile I was a bit Worried to Start my Journey on the T8 British CV.

After all People keep saying British CVs are sooo bad and unplayable etc etc.....

But Yeah....

Why was I even Worried. Given how Ridiculously Overpowered CVs are right now there was never any Question how this was going to end was there.....

As Expected. The only Reason people bought up British CVs was because it was a CV line I did not have yet so they could waste my Time again.....

Now that I am on British CVs. I guess I can wait for them to Claim that US CVs are Underpowered and cant do anything. Because I dont have it so I cant just go ahead and prove them wrong immediately again....

 

 

Just so you Guys Know.

Even After the Battle. My Captain has not Finished Retraining.... So she is getting Reduced Efficiency on all its Skills....

And the Ship is completely Stock. With not a Single Module Upgraded.

 

Spoiler

 

 

And ?

I come into T9 Battle right away. And see how much I care....

Who said that I should Play British T8 CV because it was so Impossible to Play and gets his Squadrons Deleted etc etc the usual Bullcrab that CV Apologists keep Spouting despite being proven wrong over and over ???

 

Spoiler

 

For those who Care feel Free to Watch me Dropping Equal Tier Ships Three times with Stock Planes and Higher Tier AA Cruisers Twice ....

I already know the CV Apologists will just keep repeating their Claims regardless and not even Watch the Replay in the First Place.

But for those actually wanting to know the Truth its pretty Interesting what even a Stock CV can do so easily to higher Tier Ships meant to be Countering them.....

 

 

20190906_142751_PBSA108-Implacable_14_Atlantic.wowsreplay

 

 

Sure looked very Scary when that Neptune Dished out so much Black Puffs didnt it ?

Just didnt really do anything beyond looking scary........

[B051LjKo]

8 hours ago, Sunleader said:

 

 

I  see that your coming with the usual Excuse of Average Damage which tells you absolutely nothing if you dont place the Damage in Context.

If you Place the Damage in Context you notice. CVs have 1600-2200 Average Experience. BBs meanwhile only have 1200-1700 Average Experience.

In case you dont know. The Reason for that is really Simple. Damage on DDs is worth 4 times as much as Damage on BBs. Because Killing Enemy DDs has a much higher Influence on the Match.

Good CVs Focus Enemy DDs. So they wont get such Super High Damage Numbers. But they will Win the Game.

Excuse me, but who cares about XP? What value does that bring into the game?! How does the fact that you have accumulated 30% more XP than the next ship in the list influence the outcome of that game? The way you are describing it, if you take a crappy tier 7 ship like Colorado, give it a XP x 3 modifier for the fun, and throw it in a Tier 9 exclusive game against Musashis, Georgias Soyuses and Alsaces, given your criteria, Colorao would be OP as hell? Do you realize that that makes no sense at all.

 

If CVs are earnin way to much XP, nerf the earnings, I have absolutely nothing against that. 

8 hours ago, Sunleader said:

What I dont see however is any Replays to actually back up the Ridiculous Claims you make.

As such I will Proceed to Ignore your Post.

No Offense Intended. But you have been Repeating your Claims and Opinions over and over. And over and over I as well as others have Proven you wrong with Facts backed up by Replays and Screenshots.

I see no Reason to pay any further Attention to your claims when you wont even bother trying to back them up and instead just keep repeating them senselessly despite them being proven wrong.

Found it. Disregard the game that was crap, as I was on the phone distracted for most of the time, but you can see how effective ''Tier5-6'' AA of Friesland is. 

20190904_195243_PBSA108-Implacable_44_Path_warrior.wowsreplay

[El2aZeR]

5 minutes ago, B051LjKo said:

Excuse me, but who cares about XP?

 

Exp earnings are a basic indicator of how much effective damage you deal since you earn more exp per percentage of damage dealt.

There is an issue with the individual exp modifiers of specific classes and some ships, but since we know CV earnings = BB earnings, as per official post, that CVs earn more exp than BBs on average means effective damage dealt is higher. This is also reflected in a better kills per match ratio.

 

11 minutes ago, B051LjKo said:

Found it. Disregard the game that was crap, as I was on the phone distracted for most of the time, but you can see how effective ''Tier5-6'' AA of Friesland is. 

 

You're not even trying to dodge flak. No wonder.

[B051LjKo]

45 minutes ago, El2aZeR said:

 

Exp earnings are a basic indicator of how much effective damage you deal since you earn more exp per percentage of damage dealt.

There is an issue with the individual exp modifiers of specific classes and some ships, but since we know CV earnings = BB earnings, as per official post, that CVs earn more exp than BBs on average means effective damage dealt is higher. This is also reflected in a better kills per match ratio.

Well no surprises there, as it is much easier for a CV do deal damage to DDs, and they can ick targets and chose to finish one on low health, no surprise that will end up with more XP at the end of the round. You can add another redicolous argument, where CV kill to death ration is a sure sign how OP they are.

Quote

 

You're not even trying to dodge flak. No wonder.

The first one, no, I wasnt, as I said, was completely distracted with a phone call, but later on where Friesland started to harass me, I did focus on him, and did deal damage, but he was far from ''Tier 5 useless AA''.

[Sunleader]

25 minutes ago, B051LjKo said:

Excuse me, but who cares about XP? What value does that bring into the game?! How does the fact that you have accumulated 30% more XP than the next ship in the list influence the outcome of that game? The way you are describing it, if you take a crappy tier 7 ship like Colorado, give it a XP x 3 modifier for the fun, and throw it in a Tier 9 exclusive game against Musashis, Georgias Soyuses and Alsaces, given your criteria, Colorao would be OP as hell? Do you realize that that makes no sense at all.

 

If CVs are earnin way to much XP, nerf the earnings, I have absolutely nothing against that. 

Found it. Disregard the game that was crap, as I was on the phone distracted for most of the time, but you can see how effective ''Tier5-6'' AA of Friesland is. 

20190904_195243_PBSA108-Implacable_44_Path_warrior.wowsreplay

 

1.

Exp is a Direct Indicator of your Contribution to the Match.

Damage has assigned Different Values to it. So has other meaningful Actions like Spotting and Tanking Enemy Damage etc etc.

 

Now the thing is. Damage against Importand Targets that are Hard to Hit like DDs and Cruisers is rated much higher than Damage on BBs.

The reason why CVs Experience is so much higher. Is because they will Generally Focus DDs and Cruisers and not Battleships.

Battleships can give you tons of Damage because they are easy to hit, easy to put on fire or flooding and will take alot of damage from fires and flooding.

 

But Damage on them is mostly meaningless because they have so much HP.

20k Damage on a DD is worth roughly as much as 80k Damage on a BB.

Because lets face it. For an Enemy DD getting a 10k Rocket Hit at the Start of the Match basicly means he will do this Match with Half HP he will be at Severe Disadvantage in any Cap Fight and his chance of Survival if spotted is reduced by an extreme margin. 

For a BB taking 10k Hit at the Start of the Match is about 10% of his HP and he can Heal some of it. Its just Annoying a bit. But no real Issue. He wont lose any Fighting Capacity from it.

 

Thats why CV is actually the most Importand Factor when you want to Consider how much Influence a Class has in Battle.

Because Generally the more Average Exp a Ship/Class gets. The more it tends to do Decide Matches.

 

On DDs and Cruisers you would need to take some Modificators to the Exp Gain into Account and Calculate out the Factors.

But CVs and BBs actually have the Same Exp Factor. Meaning that if they did Equally well in Battles. They would receive the same Reward.

Which also means that CVs are currently doing MUCH MUCH better in Battles than BBs :)

 

2.

Well then. You said the Game was Crab. And I agree.

Now pls note. i wont blame you for the Loss. There is not much one can do when the Entire Team decides to go Lemming Train to one Side while the DDs are alone at the other Areas...

 

But if your Generally Playing like this I am starting to get an Idea why you got so much Trouble with AA.

 

A.

Why do you not use the Motorboost more ? Your mostly not using the Consumables at all. Your Flying Slowly around the Battlefield only using the Boost very Scarcely.

You not only take forever for each Strike but you also make your Aircraft a very Easy to hit Target for Heavy AA.

 

What your doing is basicly like Driving your DD on Half Engine Power and only using Full Engine Power when Attacking.

 

B.

Why the Hell do you always only Start Maneuvering your Squadron into Position for Attack AFTER you have Entered Enemy AA Range ???

Its like your trying to get hit by AA on Purpose. You could easily Maneuver BEFORE you enter into Enemy AA Range.

 

What your doing is like your playing a DD and wont get into position for a Torpedo Run before he starts firing at you....

 

C.

Why do you keep sending Home Half Squadrons ?

You constantly keep Sending Home Squads which easily could have Finished another Attack Run.  This is not only causing you Losses because you F out easy Targets in Enemy Range. But its also Greatly Reducing your Attack Potential and your Spotting.

 

Your basicly a BB going for a Push and then trying to Pull 180 Degree when he is 8km from the Enemy. If you Attack you Attack. Pull through with it.

 

 

3.

Now for the Actual Part of the Friesland.

 

A.

No that Friesland did actually not have any AA decent enough to Threaten you.

And you actually Proved that yourself.

Because with your First Rocket Squadron Attacking the Friesland. You easily Punch it for Good Damage.

Just that as Described above. You then Simply Break off the Attack despite having 3 Planes left which would easily have been able to do another Attack Run.

 

Your Second Attack with the HE Bombers was the Same. You easily went through the Enemy AA and Landed Bombs on the Friesland for Good Damage.

Apparently no Problem at all.

 

B.

You got 3 Squadrons Wiped by that Friesland.

 

The First one was rather Obvious. You were (just as you constantly did during that Match) going at Slow Speed towards the Enemy.

The Friesland next to you Activated DFAA and of course with your Planes going slowly in a Straight line they immediately got Hit.

After that I assume you Panicked. Because instead of either Heading Right for Target or Right away from Target you instead First keep Strafing Diagonal making yourself an Easy Target for the Frieslands AA.

This then Results in your Squadron being hit by another Barrage and going Down entirely.

 

The Second HE Bomber Squadron you lost was you using a Half Dead Squadron and apparently you wanted to go for a Different Target. The Friesland once more Opened up on your Squadron while you were going nice and slow Diagonally.

Result being not Surprising...

 

The Third was 3 Rocket Planes which you Panicked with. Instead of just Repeating what you did on your First Attack Run. And just Boosting through with Minimal Evasive Movement. You got Scared and kept moving eratically which slowed you down and caused you to have no chance of landing an Attack.

 

 

 

 

 

Verdict.

Sorry Mate.

But your Video does at no Point Show that a Friesland is a no Fly Zone.

The Friesland in fact has rather Weak AA given that despite you not being a very Good CV Player. You could have Dropped it Twice with your First Rocket Squadron.

 

 

You abandoning Functional Attack Wings instead of Pressing the Attack.

And you Slowly Strafing Heavy AA Diagonal is not really making AA Overpowered.

 

If Wargaming Balanced the Game according to this Logic. We would need to Remove Citadels from Cruisers. Because what your doing is the same as Going Half Speed with a Cruiser while Giving Broadside to an Enemy Ship 6km away....

But pls note. In that Case we would need to also Nerf CVs Heavily. Because we have to Balance the Game assuming that other Ships will just Broadside Torpedo Bombers and Drive a Straight Line towards AP Dive Bombers.

So we need to Nerf Damage of all CV Weapons by roughly 75% and remove AP Bombs to avoid Stupid People being Citadelled by them.

[Sunleader]

4 minutes ago, B051LjKo said:

Well no surprises there, as it is much easier for a CV do deal damage to DDs, and they can ick targets and chose to finish one on low health, no surprise that will end up with more XP at the end of the round. You can add another redicolous argument, where CV kill to death ration is a sure sign how OP they are.

The first one, no, I wasnt, as I said, was completely distracted with a phone call, but later on where Friesland started to harass me, I did focus on him, and did deal damage, but he was far from ''Tier 5 useless AA''.

1.

Mate no Offense.

But yes Exactly.

 

And Guess what. That is an Incredible HUGE Advantage of CVs.

Nice of you to Point that out lol.

 

Just it doesnt seem you Understand just how Overpowered that Ability is.

 

Imagine Enemy BBs could do this.

Imagine Enemy BBs could just Spot their own Targets 30km away and Reliably Hit it.

 

How long do you think you as a CV would Survive if BBs got this Ability that you so easily Brush aside as not being Relevant on CVs ? :)

 

2.

Actually its was pretty useless AA.

No Offense to you Mate. But you Succesfully Dropped it with your First Attack extremely Easily.

You then Sending Home the other Half of the Remaining Squadron instead of going for a Second Attack Run. Is not exactly the AAs Fault.

The AA actually Killed ONE of your Rocket Planes there. So out of 6 you lost 1 Plane to Enemy AA and 2 Dropped their Load. You had 3 left and were close to the Target meaning the Second Attack would have been Easier.

Yet instead of Attacking again you just Send your Squadron Home.

 

I mean no Offense. But If you refuse to Attack despite being next to the Enemy. Then any Ship becomes useless you know.

 

 

[Molly_Delaney]

Having read this thread and observed what happens in my games, I think that 

if you know how to play CVs then you are almost unstoppable, which is correct a good (or even excellent) player should be tough to beat

BUT

the vast majority cannot play CVs so are getting deplaned very quickly.

 

This basically means everyone's right, those who mainly drive CVs are doing a ton of damage and those who encounter CV drivers who don't specialise are shooting down a ton of planes.

 

Last night I dodged 3 successive rocket attacks in my Akatzuki (I think one rocket may have hit) by 'generating a miss each' time. But I doubt this would have happened against any of the CV drivers in this thread because they would have probably predicted my movements better thus stopping my 'generating a miss'.

 

Just my opinion based on what I have observed & read above. CVs are a special skill; some have it, some don't.

[El2aZeR]

23 minutes ago, B051LjKo said:

Well no surprises there, as it is much easier for a CV do deal damage to DDs, and they can ick targets and chose to finish one on low health, no surprise that will end up with more XP at the end of the round.

 

Which is quite a significant advantage, therefore invalidating your point of average damage as it proves not all damage is equal.

 

23 minutes ago, B051LjKo said:

The first one, no, I wasnt, as I said, was completely distracted with a phone call, but later on where Friesland started to harass me, I did focus on him, and did deal damage, but he was far from ''Tier 5 useless AA''.

 

Almost all of your losses where due to flak. There'd be practically no difference had you attacked any other ship with DFAA equipped.

In the few instances where your aircraft didn't immediately lose all their HP to flak DPS output was actually quite bad.

[CptBarney]

@Sunleader Hey if you ever get bored with current CV's you can always spam wargaming for dis!

 

https://browse.startpage.com/do/show_picture.pl?l=english&rais=1&oiu=https%3A%2F%2Fvignette.wikia.nocookie.net%2Fwarships5757%2Fimages%2F1%2F1c%2FProject_722.png%2Frevision%2Flatest%3Fcb%3D20180202213119&sp=503afd9ce17e65d3c361c390eeb14c57&t=default

 

Noice balans comrade!

[B051LjKo]

1 hour ago, El2aZeR said:

 

Which is quite a significant advantage, therefore invalidating your point of average damage as it proves not all damage is equal.

Well, Yamatos 460 mm overmatch power is a significant advantage as well, so is kremlins 100k+ HP and stupid armor, so is 12km radar + everything else on the Stalingrad, etc. Every ship class has its trait. 

1 hour ago, El2aZeR said:

Almost all of your losses where due to flak. There'd be practically no difference had you attacked any other ship with DFAA equipped.

In the few instances where your aircraft didn't immediately lose all their HP to flak DPS output was actually quite bad.

Except that any other ship with DFAA can not spam 8 flak clouds on its own. That makes a big difference. You seem to ignore flak as a factor compleatly, I disagree on that one. 

[El2aZeR]

15 minutes ago, B051LjKo said:

Every ship class has its trait. 

 

And yet some are significantly better traits to have than others.

This isn't really something against CVs, it is inevitable when you have an asymmetrical role distribution and applies to many other games. However such advantages are usually made up with equally significant weaknesses. Reworked CVs don't really have those.

 

15 minutes ago, B051LjKo said:

Except that any other ship with DFAA can not spam 8 flak clouds on its own. That makes a big difference. You seem to ignore flak as a factor compleatly, I disagree on that one. 

 

Flak in your replay would've been easy to dodge had you even applied the most basic principles.

Due to the way flak is generated it honestly doesn't matter how many flak bursts are spawned, as such flak can in fact be completely ignored.

[Sunleader]

4 minutes ago, B051LjKo said:

Well, Yamatos 460 mm overmatch power is a significant advantage as well, so is kremlins 100k+ HP and stupid armor, so is 12km radar + everything else on the Stalingrad, etc. Every ship class has its trait. 

Except that any other ship with DFAA can not spam 8 flak clouds on its own. That makes a big difference. You seem to ignore flak as a factor compleatly, I disagree on that one. 

 

1.

Sure thats Advantages. But none of them is worth even 20% of the Ability to Freely Choose, Spot and Accurately Hit a Target 30km away from your Ship.

See Mate. Even if you gave a DD with his Puny Cannons the ability to Freely Choose a Target 30km away and Accurate keep hitting it with his Tiny Guns. He would become ridiculously Overpowered.

Because you cant do anything about constantly being hit like this.

 

2.

Thats also Factually wrong again.

There is actually a whole Number of Ships which can do this.

All of which have Superior AA to the Friesland by the way.

 

Just to Give you some Examples straight away.

T8 Admiral Hipper, T9 Roon, T10 Hindenburg all can Spam you with DFAA and 8 or more Flak Clouds.

 

Friesland Starts with 6 Flak Clouds and DFAA. (The 2 Extra Flak Clouds come from a Module everyone can Use)

This is Good for a DD. But in General its actually pretty Weak.

 

 

 

More Importand however is that you dont understand how DFAA works.

DFAA Increases the DPS from Flak Clouds when you get Hit. It does not Increase the Number of Flak Clouds Spawned.

Neither does it make them more Accurate.

So the Flak Clouds are actually not really affected by DFAA that much.

 

As Good CV Players evade Flak Clouds entirely. They dont care at all about DFAA because its not mattering to them.

its like using Smoke when Spotted by a Radar Cruiser.

 

 

North Carolina. A Tier 7 Battleship actually Starts with 8 Flak Clouds so it will Spam 10 Flak Clouds if it Adds the Module.

 

 

 

 

You wanna know a Joke.

In this Replay I actually Bomb a Neptune Twice with a Stock Squadron of the Same CV.

And for your Info. A Neptune can Spam 11 Flak Clouds.....

Looks very Scary when you watch my Replay. And then you notice its doing absolutely nothing....

 

20190906_142751_PBSA108-Implacable_14_Atlantic.wowsreplay

 

 

 

 

 

See Mate.

You keep Saying that we have to make AA so weak because otherwise Bad Players like you cant get through.

But with all Due Respect. Then we have to use this Approach for all Ships.

 

So Ships should only be Hit by Aircraft Attacks if they completely Braindead and Sail in a Straight Line.

 

Thats easy to Do. We just need to use the Older RTS System.

You have to Predict the Target on Attack Run roughly 10 Seconds beforehand.

So basicly you need to Hit the Enemy crap with the Grey Target Marker. And after you have Started the Attack. You cannot make any Course Corrections or Timing Corrections.

Your Bombs/Torpedoes/Rockets will Drop on that Grey Marker once your Squadron Arrives there.

 

And if the Ship in the Meantime Changed Course. Well bad luck for you.

[B051LjKo]

16 minutes ago, Sunleader said:

1.

Sure thats Advantages. But none of them is worth even 20% of the Ability to Freely Choose, Spot and Accurately Hit a Target 30km away from your Ship.

See Mate. Even if you gave a DD with his Puny Cannons the ability to Freely Choose a Target 30km away and Accurate keep hitting it with his Tiny Guns. He would become ridiculously Overpowered.

Well that is your opinion, and you know what they say about opinions, everyone has one. The most important aspects of winning the game is contesting caps, and CV has almost no ability to do so. So yes, I think it is well balanced.

16 minutes ago, Sunleader said:

Because you cant do anything about constantly being hit like this.

Yes you can, WASD hax works, so does smoke, so does blobing up. If CVs are so powerful how come they do not average 100+ k of damage and 3 kills per game?

16 minutes ago, Sunleader said:

2.

Thats also Factually wrong again.

There is actually a whole Number of Ships which can do this.

All of which have Superior AA to the Friesland by the way.

Since Friesland is not the only AA ship in the game, I would say that is as expected.

16 minutes ago, Sunleader said:

Just to Give you some Examples straight away.

T8 Admiral Hipper, T9 Roon, T10 Hindenburg all can Spam you with DFAA and 8 or more Flak Clouds.

 

Friesland Starts with 6 Flak Clouds and DFAA. (The 2 Extra Flak Clouds come from a Module everyone can Use)

This is Good for a DD. But in General its actually pretty Weak.

8 flank clouds in not weak at all, consider two Frieslans sailing together, that is 16 of them. 

16 minutes ago, Sunleader said:

More Importand however is that you dont understand how DFAA works.

DFAA Increases the DPS from Flak Clouds when you get Hit. It does not Increase the Number of Flak Clouds Spawned.

I am well aware of that

16 minutes ago, Sunleader said:

Neither does it make them more Accurate.

So the Flak Clouds are actually not really affected by DFAA that much.

 

As Good CV Players evade Flak Clouds entirely. They dont care at all about DFAA because its not mattering to them.

its like using Smoke when Spotted by a Radar Cruiser.

Well in real life it is not that easy to evade them, and not all players are good. The game should not be balanced as per unicum players, so again, I do not see an issue here. They've tried with extreme AA in 8.6, and that lead up to no CVs in the game at all. Dont you think that tells you something?

Well a

16 minutes ago, Sunleader said:

See Mate.

You keep Saying that we have to make AA so weak because otherwise Bad Players like you cant get through.

But with all Due Respect. Then we have to use this Approach for all Ships.

Well, perhaps they should change the way flank works, as if some players can evade them completely, that is not good at all.

16 minutes ago, Sunleader said:

Thats easy to Do. We just need to use the Older RTS System.

Well, no one is stopping you from opening a chinese account and playing the old rts over there. Or just do not play CVs if you find them overpowered. Lately I am playing either CVs or DDs, and have no issues with CVs when in a DD. You just adopt and enjoy the game.

16 minutes ago, Sunleader said:

 Well bad luck for you.

Bad luck for me? Why, I like the game at this current stage. I do not see any bad luck there.

[Sunleader]

5 minutes ago, B051LjKo said:

Well that is your opinion, and you know what they say about opinions, everyone has one. The most important aspects of winning the game is contesting caps, and CV has almost no ability to do so. So yes, I think it is well balanced.

Yes you can, WASD hax works, so does smoke, so does blobing up. If CVs are so powerful how come they do not average 100+ k of damage and 3 kills per game?

Since Friesland is not the only AA ship in the game, I would say that is as expected.

8 flank clouds in not weak at all, consider two Frieslans sailing together, that is 16 of them. 

I am well aware of that

Well in real life it is not that easy to evade them, and not all players are good. The game should not be balanced as per unicum players, so again, I do not see an issue here. They've tried with extreme AA in 8.6, and that lead up to no CVs in the game at all. Dont you think that tells you something?

Well a

Well, perhaps they should change the way flank works, as if some players can evade them completely, that is not good at all.

Well, no one is stopping you from opening a chinese account and playing the old rts over there. Or just do not play CVs if you find them overpowered. Lately I am playing either CVs or DDs, and have no issues with CVs when in a DD. You just adopt and enjoy the game.

Bad luck for me? Why, I like the game at this current stage. I do not see any bad luck there.

 

1.

Its an Opinion which is Backed up by the Fact that CVs currently earn nearly Twice the Experience of any other Class.

2.

I said if the DD can Reliably Hit like a CV. Against a CV WASD is useless because the CV can just Adjust his Aim till the last Second.

And well. Same Reason why Kremlin doesnt do it. Because you always have Potatoes which without Engine Boost just decide to Strafe Enemy Ships and get Fired at by AA without doing anything about it. :)

3.

If your not Surprised by it then please dont make such Claims in the First Place.

Friesland is not an AA Ship. Its an DD with above Average AA for an DD. And below Average AA for a Cruiser.

4.

Actually it is. Because Flak Clouds all Spawn in the same Pattern. And more Flak Clouds Spawning is not really changing where the Flak Clouds Spawn. Meaning your Chances to be Hit actually dont Increase so much.

Also again. Neptune Spawns 11 Flak Clouds lol.

Can still Bomb it Twice with the Same Squadron easily.

5.

Again. Then dont make such Claims for Heavens Sake...

6.

Erm. Actually it is. As proven several Times by Various Players here including me lol.

And well. Actually it Should be Balanced by Good Players. (Not Unicum Players but Good Players). Because as I said. If you Balance based on Potatoes. Then you have to also Balance other Ships Accordingly.

Meaning you need to Nerf Damage from your Air Attacks because most People do not have the Skills to even Reduce the Damage they take from Them. You have to Remove Citadels etc etc etc because People cant be Expected to not Sail Broadside.

7.

Yes. And thats exactly why in 0.8.6 the Game was so much Better. Because the actual Damage Dealing AA was Continues DPS and could not be Evaded.

Which is why this current Update has Nerfed AA into being Useless and thus Made CVs Overpowered as Hell.

Which is what we keep telling you.

8+9.

If you dont Read the Statement dont try to Answer it. You only make yourself look like Boris Johnson.

 

 

[B051LjKo]

38 minutes ago, Sunleader said:

1.

Its an Opinion which is Backed up by the Fact that CVs currently earn nearly Twice the Experience of any other Class.

I do agree with you that we need to include a  x 0.7 XP modifier for CVs to put them in line with everyone else. Or even 0.5 for that matter if that will make you happy.  

38 minutes ago, Sunleader said:

2.

I said if the DD can Reliably Hit like a CV. Against a CV WASD is useless because the CV can just Adjust his Aim till the last Second.

Well then, how come you do not average 3 kills per game, at least? If it is so easy to strike, you should be swimming in kills and damage, and yet, that does not seem to be the case?

38 minutes ago, Sunleader said:

And well. Same Reason why Kremlin doesnt do it. Because you always have Potatoes which without Engine Boost just decide to Strafe Enemy Ships and get Fired at by AA without doing anything about it. :)

Nothing wrong with potatos strafing, up to them to choose their tactics.

38 minutes ago, Sunleader said:

3.

If your not Surprised by it then please dont make such Claims in the First Place.

Friesland is not an AA Ship. Its an DD with above Average AA for an DD. And below Average AA for a Cruiser.

I would say it is an AA ship, as it has DFAA  and above average AA.

38 minutes ago, Sunleader said:

4.

Actually it is. Because Flak Clouds all Spawn in the same Pattern. And more Flak Clouds Spawning is not really changing where the Flak Clouds Spawn. Meaning your Chances to be Hit actually dont Increase so much.

Also again. Neptune Spawns 11 Flak Clouds lol.

Well then, focus your energy on telling WG to change the pattern flak clouds are generated and make it more random. Or at least set several patterns to make them more difficult to dodge, I have no issues with that.

38 minutes ago, Sunleader said:

Can still Bomb it Twice with the Same Squadron easily.

Good, as it should be.

38 minutes ago, Sunleader said:

6.

Erm. Actually it is. As proven several Times by Various Players here including me lol.

And well. Actually it Should be Balanced by Good Players. (Not Unicum Players but Good Players). Because as I said. If you Balance based on Potatoes. Then you have to also Balance other Ships Accordingly.

Meaning you need to Nerf Damage from your Air Attacks because most People do not have the Skills to even Reduce the Damage they take from Them. You have to Remove Citadels etc etc etc because People cant be Expected to not Sail Broadside.

well most Soviet ships and almost all steel ones are balanced for potatos and OP in general. Do not tell me you think that Kremlin or Stalingrad are well balanced? Take a potato, and put it in Stalin grad. And then take another potato, and put it in a Zao, and let me know which one will perform better.

38 minutes ago, Sunleader said:

7.

Yes. And thats exactly why in 0.8.6 the Game was so much Better. Because the actual Damage Dealing AA was Continues DPS and could not be Evaded.

Which is why this current Update has Nerfed AA into being Useless and thus Made CVs Overpowered as Hell.

Which is what we keep telling you.

How could the game be better when AA was s strong that there was no CVs left in the game? Every 5th game you would see a CV, if you were lucky. Noone was specing AA as there was no CV to fight against. how can yo ucall that better, a game with no diversity what so ever. Also, how can a  continuous DPS that can not be avoided be good for the game? Imagine secondariesguns doing 400 dps to any ship in the renge? how stupid would that be? 

 

[Sunleader]

43 minutes ago, B051LjKo said:

I do agree with you that we need to include a  x 0.7 XP modifier for CVs to put them in line with everyone else. Or even 0.5 for that matter if that will make you happy.  

Well then, how come you do not average 3 kills per game, at least? If it is so easy to strike, you should be swimming in kills and damage, and yet, that does not seem to be the case?

Nothing wrong with potatos strafing, up to them to choose their tactics.

I would say it is an AA ship, as it has DFAA  and above average AA.

Well then, focus your energy on telling WG to change the pattern flak clouds are generated and make it more random. Or at least set several patterns to make them more difficult to dodge, I have no issues with that.

Good, as it should be.

well most Soviet ships and almost all steel ones are balanced for potatos and OP in general. Do not tell me you think that Kremlin or Stalingrad are well balanced? Take a potato, and put it in Stalin grad. And then take another potato, and put it in a Zao, and let me know which one will perform better.

How could the game be better when AA was s strong that there was no CVs left in the game? Every 5th game you would see a CV, if you were lucky. Noone was specing AA as there was no CV to fight against. how can yo ucall that better, a game with no diversity what so ever. Also, how can a  continuous DPS that can not be avoided be good for the game? Imagine secondariesguns doing 400 dps to any ship in the renge? how stupid would that be? 

 

 

1.

That would mean Wargaming Admits CVs are Overpowered.

But I want to have CVs not be Overpowered.

Reducing the Reward of Overpowered Ships will not alleviate the frustration currently causes by them.

2.

Because I am playing for the Win.

Not to Farm Kills.

I dont waste a Drop on some Guy I shot down to 400 HP.

I just drop some Fighters and let Team kill him.

So I can do 70-100% Winrate. Which I consider more Importand than doing 150k Damage and 3 Kills.

3.

As I said.

Then Balance entire Game based on Potatoes.

Nerf CV Damage so a Potato DD who cant evade Torpedoes wont be killed by CVs.

4.

Well its one possible Suggestion lol.

It wont change that CVs are Overpowered right now.

How we change this isnt importand.

Just THAT we change it.

5.

No not Good at all.

Neptune is a Higher Tier AA Cruiser.

If a Lower Tier CV can Bomb it so easily then something is wrong.

6.

Cant Speak on Stalin as its so rare I dont meet it often enough.

 

Kremlin is clearly Overpowered.

Not as OP as CVs. But certainly not Balanced.

7.

Secondaries cant be Evaded either and actually I am not sure my Graf Zeppelin would have a Hard time doing this.

Since Hits get more common with closing the range it actually works just like Continues AA.

I think many DDs that snuck up on me and then got 2-3k hits every 2 Seconds would be Happy if I got reduced to 400dps.

 

And yes it was Better.

Because it meant CVs had to choose Targets based on them being vulnearble.

Like all other Ships have to.

[B051LjKo]

1 hour ago, Sunleader said:

 

1.

That would mean Wargaming Admits CVs are Overpowered.

But I want to have CVs not be Overpowered.

Reducing the Reward of Overpowered Ships will not alleviate the frustration currently causes by them.

Not really, it is called balancing, and they do it on a regular basis.

1 hour ago, Sunleader said:

2.

Because I am playing for the Win.

Not to Farm Kills.

I dont waste a Drop on some Guy I shot down to 400 HP.

I just drop some Fighters and let Team kill him.

So I can do 70-100% Winrate. Which I consider more Importand than doing 150k Damage and 3 Kills.

So If I understand you well, you choose not to kill enemy DDs as that is the best route towards 100% winrate. 

 

I am looking at your stats and do not understand the logic, 

 

GZ you have PR 2165, 59,72% win rate with 1.14 frags

Kaga you have PR 2089 59.01% win rate with 1.23 frags

 

Both are decent and above average. So, if you went for more DD kills (which you can do, as they can not dodge you), you expect your winrate to go down? 

 

I must say I do not understand the logic, just as an example, I can post my stats on my favorite carrier. As per your analysis, I am struggling a lot with the AA, I do not use my consumables, and and interrupting attack not using their full potential. In general, definition of a potato, and in line with my avatar,

 

So with Saipan, I have a PR 3024, 70,14% win rate with 1.76 frags per game. 

 

So basically I am doing completely opposite from what you are doing, am having trouble at hitting DDs as I do believe they can successfully dodge the attacks, and yet still manage to get better results than you. Now isn't that strange?

1 hour ago, Sunleader said:

3.

As I said.

Then Balance entire Game based on Potatoes.

Nerf CV Damage so a Potato DD who cant evade Torpedoes wont be killed by CVs.

Well, I personally think they should focus the balance around aiming. Your circle should go the size of a death start against AA cruiser with DFAA. So instead of turning planes into wrecks, maybe just making them miss would be a better approach. They should ditch this stupid ''infinite'' planes this (as they are not infinite to begin with), make the same regeneration to work like ''getting the planes on the deck'', and making sure that the planes are strong enough to have sufficient number unless really stupid. And make aiming skill count. 

1 hour ago, Sunleader said:

4.

Well its one possible Suggestion lol.

It wont change that CVs are Overpowered right now.

How we change this isnt importand.

Just THAT we change it.

Well, if they are so crazy OP, why are the average numbers so low? Players in general want to play strong ships, and yet, CV population is still poor.

1 hour ago, Sunleader said:

5.

No not Good at all.

Neptune is a Higher Tier AA Cruiser.

If a Lower Tier CV can Bomb it so easily then something is wrong.

So if we translate this to other classes, if a cruiser charges a BB, a BB has full right to expect that cruiser to die in just 2 salvos. If the cruiser does not die but comes on the forum with the ''OMG, I just managed to do 10 salvos against a BB before he killed me, this Wooster is OP as fu*ck I should not be able to do that as my place is behind the island'', that would be the definite proof that Wooster is OP as hell? Or your ''melt down'' rule applies only to planes.?

1 hour ago, Sunleader said:

6.

Cant Speak on Stalin as its so rare I dont meet it often enough.

Just take a look at Wows numbers

1 hour ago, Sunleader said:

7.

Secondaries cant be Evaded either and actually I am not sure my Graf Zeppelin would have a Hard time doing this.

Since Hits get more common with closing the range it actually works just like Continues AA.

I think many DDs that snuck up on me and then got 2-3k hits every 2 Seconds would be Happy if I got reduced to 400dps.

So if I understood you well, if Shima gets in close range with your GZ, it will go from full health to dead in 10 seconds? Did I understood that well?

1 hour ago, Sunleader said:

And yes it was Better.

Because it meant CVs had to choose Targets based on them being vulnearble.

Like all other Ships have to.

For whom it was better? For the guys that did not plays CVs at all, or for the AA spec ships that were getting their [edited]spanked by the non AA speced ships, as their specialization was useless with no CVs around?

[gslick]

15 hours ago, Chiledip said:

How effective CVs are seems to have little  effect on WG's balance. That seems to be CV population. If population is not X%, CVs are made more OP and AA nerfed until population reaches said X%. This seemed to be the message coming from the CC conference.

It seems that WG is willing to lose people playing surface ship players just to increase the percentage of the CV population.  If for every 100 players only 4 play CV for only 4%,  then they can drive 50 surface ships to quit playing they can claim success because now twice as many of the ships (8%)  are now CVs.   WG can then claim it was a rousing success.

[Sunleader]

⁹

1 hour ago, B051LjKo said:

Not really, it is called balancing, and they do it on a regular basis.

So If I understand you well, you choose not to kill enemy DDs as that is the best route towards 100% winrate. 

 

I am looking at your stats and do not understand the logic, 

 

GZ you have PR 2165, 59,72% win rate with 1.14 frags

Kaga you have PR 2089 59.01% win rate with 1.23 frags

 

Both are decent and above average. So, if you went for more DD kills (which you can do, as they can not dodge you), you expect your winrate to go down? 

 

I must say I do not understand the logic, just as an example, I can post my stats on my favorite carrier. As per your analysis, I am struggling a lot with the AA, I do not use my consumables, and and interrupting attack not using their full potential. In general, definition of a potato, and in line with my avatar,

 

So with Saipan, I have a PR 3024, 70,14% win rate with 1.76 frags per game. 

 

So basically I am doing completely opposite from what you are doing, am having trouble at hitting DDs as I do believe they can successfully dodge the attacks, and yet still manage to get better results than you. Now isn't that strange?

Well, I personally think they should focus the balance around aiming. Your circle should go the size of a death start against AA cruiser with DFAA. So instead of turning planes into wrecks, maybe just making them miss would be a better approach. They should ditch this stupid ''infinite'' planes this (as they are not infinite to begin with), make the same regeneration to work like ''getting the planes on the deck'', and making sure that the planes are strong enough to have sufficient number unless really stupid. And make aiming skill count. 

Well, if they are so crazy OP, why are the average numbers so low? Players in general want to play strong ships, and yet, CV population is still poor.

So if we translate this to other classes, if a cruiser charges a BB, a BB has full right to expect that cruiser to die in just 2 salvos. If the cruiser does not die but comes on the forum with the ''OMG, I just managed to do 10 salvos against a BB before he killed me, this Wooster is OP as fu*ck I should not be able to do that as my place is behind the island'', that would be the definite proof that Wooster is OP as hell? Or your ''melt down'' rule applies only to planes.?

Just take a look at Wows numbers

So if I understood you well, if Shima gets in close range with your GZ, it will go from full health to dead in 10 seconds? Did I understood that well?

For whom it was better? For the guys that did not plays CVs at all, or for the AA spec ships that were getting their [edited]spanked by the non AA speced ships, as their specialization was useless with no CVs around?

 

1.

No.

Its done when WG gives up on Balancing.

 

2.

Nope.

Dont Forget this is Total Stats.

It Includes 0.8.5 were CVs were Balanced.

 

But we dont have that anymore.

For the Current Update I got you have to take the Games actually done during this Update.

 

Graf Zeppelin, 70% WR, 3k PR, 103k Damage and 2 Kills.

 

Kaga, 66% WR, 2.4k PR, 88k Damage and 2 Kills.

 

Implacable (Stock) 100% WR, 2.2k PR, 83k Damage and 1 Kill.

 

Furious, 66% WR, 2.6k PR, 80k Damage and 1.4 Kills.

 

Hakuryu, 100% WR, 2.3k PR, 116k Damage and 1.2 Kills.

 

Total for CVs in the Current Update is.

74% WR, 2.6k PR, 95k Damage and 1.6 Kills.

 

 

 

 

And Mate.

Read Properly.

I want DDs to Die. That doesnt mean I have to be the one Who Kills em.

I just need to get them Killed.

 

CVs can do way more than just Drop Bombs.

 

 

 

As for you doing Better.

No Idea.

When CVs were Balanced in 0.8.5 you stopped playing.

And in current Update you Played only 4 Games with CVs.

 

Now I would read out all the Stats.

But Stat Shaming is Prohibited.

 

 

3.

Fine with that honestly.

I want CVs Balanced.

I dont mind which Direction we use for that.

I actually made a Suggestion on this as well which did not include DPS Buffs either.

 

4.

What are you Smoking?

Low Tier CV Numbers DOUBLED in the First Week after 0.8.7

And likely High Tier will Follow this week.

 

5.

No Offense. But this is how things are most of the Time.

If a T8 Cruiser just Charges at a T9 BB like that it will usually get Deleted extremely Fast.

Same for a T8 DD charging a T9 Cruiser

Or a T8 BB charging a T9 DD.

 

If you charge the Class Supposed to Counter you without any extra Strategies.

You usually get Deleted extremely fast.

 

6.

Stalin is a Limited Ship.

It has a high Bar for getting it.

So Average Player in Stalin ist Head and Shoulders above Average Player of Free to own Ships.

So Average Numbers are worthless here.

 

7.

Mate no Offense.

But have you not watched any of my Replays????

I had posted several Occassions where my Graf Zeppelin just Melted Enemy DDs that tought Firing their Guns at me was a Good Idea.

 

Check my Replay earlier in this Topic where I got 6 Kills.

Amd See what Happens to that Z-Class DD when he comes into my Secondary Range for but a few Seconds.

 

You can also do the Math.

I got 8x15cm per Side Firing 1700 Damage HE Shells every 7.5 Seconds.

 

With the 1/3 Pen Damage that alone is 600 DPS.

 

The 12x10,5cm atop fire 1200 Damage each every 3.35 Seconds.

 

Again 1/3 for HE Pen Damage thats 1400 DPS.

 

So my CV has a Potential DPS of 2k per Second.

If you check the Stats.

My GZ Secondaries got a 33% Hitratio.

So a bit over 660 DPS actually Hit the Target.

 

And as DD dont have Armor to Shatter or Bounce HE.

You can basicly say that I have 600 DPS against DDs.

 

Of course on Max Range it will be less as more Shells Miss.

On Shorter Range it will be even more as more Shells Hit.

 

 

 

 

You can also test it yoursel.

Just put a GZ into Test Room and Drive up to its Broadside with a DD.

 

Of course as Bots dont get the Upgrades you have to Drive 5km close to it.

But you could make a Game of it.

Trying to Drive one Full Circle around the GZ on less than 5km Distance.

 

 

Check out my Replays or here Watch this.

 

 

If your in Secondary Range of a Graf Zeppelin you basicly got 2 DDs and a Light Cruiser Firing at you.....

[B051LjKo]

4 hours ago, Sunleader said:

1.

No.

Its done when WG gives up on Balancing.

Unless it is a magnificant Soviet paper beast, they stop when they find it balanced. At least for silver ships. Buy to win premiums is another story.

4 hours ago, Sunleader said:

2.

Nope.

Dont Forget this is Total Stats.

It Includes 0.8.5 were CVs were Balanced.

Balanced? You mean so fu*ked up that 80% of the population decided to stop playing them, and CV games would happen every 5 rounds?

4 hours ago, Sunleader said:

 

But we dont have that anymore.

For the Current Update I got you have to take the Games actually done during this Update.

 

Graf Zeppelin, 70% WR, 3k PR, 103k Damage and 2 Kills.

 

Kaga, 66% WR, 2.4k PR, 88k Damage and 2 Kills.

 

Implacable (Stock) 100% WR, 2.2k PR, 83k Damage and 1 Kill.

 

Furious, 66% WR, 2.6k PR, 80k Damage and 1.4 Kills.

 

Hakuryu, 100% WR, 2.3k PR, 116k Damage and 1.2 Kills.

 

Total for CVs in the Current Update is.

74% WR, 2.6k PR, 95k Damage and 1.6 Kills.

Well, statistical sample is to small. A lot of people still do not know how to use priority sectorn The bigger picture is much more relevant.

4 hours ago, Sunleader said:

And Mate.

Read Properly.

I want DDs to Die. That doesnt mean I have to be the one Who Kills em.

I just need to get them Killed.

Well, a post ago you state that CV gets to pick the targets, not other ships. So if you have  s ship that needs to die, why would you leave it to someone else to finish? If it is so easy to kill him?

4 hours ago, Sunleader said:

CVs can do way more than just Drop Bombs.

So can a DD, even more. It can spot, support and contest caps. CVs can do just the first two.

4 hours ago, Sunleader said:

As for you doing Better.

No Idea.

When CVs were Balanced in 0.8.5 you stopped playing.

And in current Update you Played only 4 Games with CVs.

Not only me but vast majority of the population. I did not appritiate the route game was heading, so I've stopped. It worked, as WG saw that they fuc*ed up with 8.5 & 8.6, and changed it again, and the player base loves it apart from the few of you on the forums.

4 hours ago, Sunleader said:

4.

What are you Smoking?

Low Tier CV Numbers DOUBLED in the First Week after 0.8.7

And likely High Tier will Follow this week.

Well that is good news, and to be honest, not a huge achievement. If something is as low as 3%, and then it doubles, it is still a minority.

4 hours ago, Sunleader said:

5.

No Offense. But this is how things are most of the Time.

If a T8 Cruiser just Charges at a T9 BB like that it will usually get Deleted extremely Fast.

Same for a T8 DD charging a T9 Cruiser

Or a T8 BB charging a T9 DD.

Correct so will a plane squadron if it attacks an AA cruiser. But you seem to hate the fact that you can actually rop your ordenance on a cruiser before your planes get deleted. Imagine a post from a BB player that demands to delete the cruiser before he takes the second savlo from it.

 

''OMG.  I got charged by a Cleveland in my Iowa, and you know what, it managed to fire on me TWICE before I sunk her. That is bulshit, cruiser should not do that She is one tier lower and a cruiser. I demand balance, I want to one shot that cruiser as it dared to charge me. I do not want her shooting at me twice or more before dead. That is just not right''

4 hours ago, Sunleader said:

If you charge the Class Supposed to Counter you without any extra Strategies.

You usually get Deleted extremely fast.

So do your planes as well, just in this patch they can drop the bombs as well. Before you would lose a squadron to make a single run, now it makes more sense. 

4 hours ago, Sunleader said:

6.

Stalin is a Limited Ship.

It has a high Bar for getting it.

So Average Player in Stalin ist Head and Shoulders above Average Player of Free to own Ships.

So Average Numbers are worthless here.

You seem to use ''number are worthless'' every time they do not work in your favor. 

4 hours ago, Sunleader said:

7.

Mate no Offense.

But have you not watched any of my Replays????

I had posted several Occassions where my Graf Zeppelin just Melted Enemy DDs that tought Firing their Guns at me was a Good Idea.

 

Oh come on, GZ secondary build is a Meme build. That either dont work, or works only against total potatos.

[mtm78]

First page I was reading some bs about low aa cruisers being buffed and thus this not being a buff to BB's again.

 

Just stop. 

 

BB's are buffed, cruisers and destroyers are more vulnerable. That's exactly the point of the reework, since WG thinks battleships attract the most players and generate the most income. No more dev strikes against badly played isolated battleships... instead, we got rocketplanes being undodgeable lolibote finishers when on low hp... totally skillless no counterplay [edited]. The same they wanted to remove from BB players... whaa whaa I went on flank alone then I got dev struck whaa whaaa.... So uncle WG removes that ability from CV's and make them MORE EFFECTIVE against other targets.

 

Well done WG, well done. Gives hope on your submarine implementation.

 

Ow and those 'bad aa' cruisers ( say Aoba ) is because they are flankers, not escort cruisers. But hey, maybe game design from years back can all be thrown out of the window turning this game into the pile of ... it is now. 

 

Now on to my morning coffee.. I need one. 

[Sunleader]

8 hours ago, B051LjKo said:

Unless it is a magnificant Soviet paper beast, they stop when they find it balanced. At least for silver ships. Buy to win premiums is another story.

Balanced? You mean so fu*ked up that 80% of the population decided to stop playing them, and CV games would happen every 5 rounds?

Well, statistical sample is to small. A lot of people still do not know how to use priority sectorn The bigger picture is much more relevant.

Well, a post ago you state that CV gets to pick the targets, not other ships. So if you have  s ship that needs to die, why would you leave it to someone else to finish? If it is so easy to kill him?

So can a DD, even more. It can spot, support and contest caps. CVs can do just the first two.

Not only me but vast majority of the population. I did not appritiate the route game was heading, so I've stopped. It worked, as WG saw that they fuc*ed up with 8.5 & 8.6, and changed it again, and the player base loves it apart from the few of you on the forums.

Well that is good news, and to be honest, not a huge achievement. If something is as low as 3%, and then it doubles, it is still a minority.

Correct so will a plane squadron if it attacks an AA cruiser. But you seem to hate the fact that you can actually rop your ordenance on a cruiser before your planes get deleted. Imagine a post from a BB player that demands to delete the cruiser before he takes the second savlo from it.

 

''OMG.  I got charged by a Cleveland in my Iowa, and you know what, it managed to fire on me TWICE before I sunk her. That is bulshit, cruiser should not do that She is one tier lower and a cruiser. I demand balance, I want to one shot that cruiser as it dared to charge me. I do not want her shooting at me twice or more before dead. That is just not right''

So do your planes as well, just in this patch they can drop the bombs as well. Before you would lose a squadron to make a single run, now it makes more sense. 

You seem to use ''number are worthless'' every time they do not work in your favor. 

Oh come on, GZ secondary build is a Meme build. That either dont work, or works only against total potatos.

 

1.

....

2.

Well Mate. Anyone with some Actual Skill had no Problems which is like it Should be.

Because the Original Idea of the Game is being Competetive. So if your a Bad Player you lose.

A DD doesnt get any Free Damage Grants or Second Tries either. If he is stupid and just Yoloes he will leave the Match with 0 Contribution.

3.

With over 40 Games on CVs since the Update the Sample is Big enough to be Pretty Clear Mate.

4.

There you go again playing yourself as Stupid as possible and outright Refusing to follow the Statement.

You can Choose and Kill Targets. Thats a Huge Advantage.

But why would you waste a Drop on a DD that has 400hp left when you can Just scout it for your Teammates which are in Range of it ?

If the DD was out of range or behind an Island where the Team cant reach it. I would drop it of course to take it out of the Game.

But if Spotting it is enough to get it Killed and I can instead Attack a Target still posing a Threat. Then it would be Stupid to waste a Drop on that already Dead Target just to get a Kill.

5.

The CV can do it Better, Faster and without any Risk to himself. The DD has to do it with his Ship and thus will be Killed very Fast if he messes up.

If you mess up (like you did in your Replay several Times entering Enemy AA accidently) in a CV it doesnt matter. At worst you lose some Planes.

A DD would have been Dead if he Played like that.

6.

Well Mate. Now the other Classes are Losing Players Massively. So Great Success I guess. While CV Players in Low Tier Raised from 1000 to 2000. The DD Players Dropped from 7000 to 5000....

So Wargaming Successfully Converted 1000 DD Players to CVs and caused 1000 DD Players to Leave the Game.

(And Yes this is not Accurate. The other Classes lost Players as well. Albeit nowhere close to that Numbers. So Total Number is likely that we lost something around 2-3k Players in Exchange for getting 1k Players into CVs.... )

7.

Except it isnt lol. As I said Mate. Maybe Watch my Replays. I can without any Trouble Charge a T10 AA Cruiser in my T8 CV Drop my Load. Then Turn a Circle inside his AA and Drop it again.

I wanna see you Charge a Cruiser in a DD turn a Circle around him and then Attack him again.

If you Charge a T10 Cruiser in a T8 DD you will be Dead before you even managed to get to him Halfway. You can at best hope to somehow wheel around to the side and Drop your Torpedoes before you Die.

That was how Aircraft worked in 0.8.5 as well. When you Attacked an AA Cruiser 2 Tiers Higher than You. You had to get the Drop Done before your Squadron gets Killed.

 

So No. This is completely Crab now.

Right now AA basicly does not Exist.

8.

I had no Trouble Dropping Bombs on Higher Tier Ships in any Patch so Far.

As Proven Countless Times by Screenshots and Replays from me as well as others.

 

There was some Noobs who had Trouble Dropping Bombs if they tried to Drop on High Calibre AA Ships.

But thats how its Supposed to be.

As this Patch Proves Nicely. If you Balance one Class based on Potatoes then it Results in the Good Players becoming Godmode because you cant Stop them anymore.

9.

I am merely Stating the Facts Mate.

The Stalin is a Ship that is Only Available to a Small Portion of the Players who have already Proven their Skills in High Tier Ships and Earned an Absurd amount of Ressources. Meaning any Player who actually Owns that Ship is already a Ranked Veteran likely having Played Thousands of Battles.

Comparing the Average Statistics of this Ship. To a Ship which any Noob can have without even knowing what Ranked is and having Played maybe 1000 Battles assuming he is really Bad and Died his way up.

Is simply not going to tell you anything Mate.

Its like your holding a Softair Tournament and then Compare the Statistics of Softair Guns. Just that a Special Forces Unit which Joined got one of the Guns while the other Guns were all Given out to Random Players some of which never even Played Softair before.

Its not Hard to See that the Gun which was given to the Special Forces Unit will have a Vastly higher Average than the other Guns.

10.

Well Mate. I Posted several Replays Proving this to be Wrong. And my Stats Say Pretty Clearly that I got a Decent Number of Kills with my Secondaries on GZ.

Having a 9.5km Zone around your CV where DDs and Light Cruiser cant enter if they dont want to be Showered with HE Shells from an amount of Guns Equivalent to a Light Cruiser and 2 DDs.

Is a Pretty Handy Fact. Even if the Enemy Knows about your Secondaries and thus will try to kill you from outside it. Thus you not going to get any Damage out of your Secondaries. The Enemy in exchange had to Limit itself and stay outside your Range thus Greatly Reducing his own Ability to Torpedo You.

 

 

4 hours ago, mtm78 said:

First page I was reading some bs about low aa cruisers being buffed and thus this not being a buff to BB's again.

 

Just stop. 

 

BB's are buffed, cruisers and destroyers are more vulnerable. That's exactly the point of the reework, since WG thinks battleships attract the most players and generate the most income. No more dev strikes against badly played isolated battleships... instead, we got rocketplanes being undodgeable lolibote finishers when on low hp... totally skillless no counterplay [edited]. The same they wanted to remove from BB players... whaa whaa I went on flank alone then I got dev struck whaa whaaa.... So uncle WG removes that ability from CV's and make them MORE EFFECTIVE against other targets.

 

Well done WG, well done. Gives hope on your submarine implementation.

 

Ow and those 'bad aa' cruisers ( say Aoba ) is because they are flankers, not escort cruisers. But hey, maybe game design from years back can all be thrown out of the window turning this game into the pile of ... it is now. 

 

Now on to my morning coffee.. I need one. 

 

 

Then please Explain to me why I can Drop most BBs 3 Times with the Same Squadron while I can Drop AA Cruisers only 2 Times...

 

Could you guys Pls stop trying to somehow Shift the Topic around ?

 

Guys the Fact is that AA has been Nerfed to a point where I can take my CV and have less Resistance to Attacks than I have using other Ships in Coop Battles...

[mtm78]

1 hour ago, Sunleader said:

Guys the Fact is that AA has been Nerfed to a point where I can take my CV and have less Resistance to Attacks than I have using other Ships in Coop Battles...

 

So this thread was meant to point out AA is a joke this patch? If so, I commend your efforts even while I'd assume this is already widely known. 

 

1 hour ago, Sunleader said:

Then please Explain to me why I can Drop most BBs 3 Times with the Same Squadron while I can Drop AA Cruisers only 2 Times...

You mean you haven't yet found a way to play around DFAA? And if dps on BB's is higher and this patch continuous dps is more important as flak, BB's got buffed or did I get this wrong? 

 

1 hour ago, Sunleader said:

Could you guys Pls stop trying to somehow Shift the Topic around ?

Wait, so it's perfectly fine to point out AAA is crap, but it's not ok according to you to point out that it's again favoring one particular class over all others? Let's just focus on what we agree on then, AAA is crap. 

 

Carry on

[Sunleader]

7 minutes ago, mtm78 said:

 

So this thread was meant to point out AA is a joke this patch? If so, I commend your efforts even while I'd assume this is already widely known. 

 

You mean you haven't yet found a way to play around DFAA? And if dps on BB's is higher and this patch continuous dps is more important as flak, BB's got buffed or did I get this wrong? 

 

Wait, so it's perfectly fine to point out AAA is crap, but it's not ok according to you to point out that it's again favoring one particular class over all others? 

 

1.

Mate. This Topic is Feedback on the Current AA Rework. So you would Expect it to make an Opinion on AA in this Update No ???

2.

You do Realize that Continues DPS of AA Cruisers is Generally higher than most BBs but that most BBs have quite Large Numbers of Heavy AA Right.

So your Argument is Self Defeating because if your right the ones harder to Bomb would be Battleships as they got way more Heavy AA.

3.

Mate this Topic is about the AA Rework. Not about a Specific Ship Class. I could not care less if Ship A AA was Nerfed Harder than Ship B AA. The Problem is AA got Nerfed so Hard that CVs are basicly Godmode and can Bomb whoever they want without any Effort. So what if BB AA was only Nerfed by 10% and Cruiser AA by 40% BB AA was already weak before the Patch so that didnt really change anything. Thing is Cruiser AA in Total was Nerfed into Oblivion.

[mtm78]

Ow hey Mate, I didn't see you there mate sorry I bumped into you mate.

 

1. Go right ahead, didn't realize the CV rework thread wasn't sufficient and it wasn't sufficiently known to the people who should know that AAA is crap this patch. It was already said before patch went live, people expected it even. 
2. I did not care enough to actually read all the patch notes, I am aware that flak is basically useless against good players and DPS is what will shoot down some planes correct me if wrong. And the difference between heavy and light is range, since we exclude anything besides dps, so you're saying BB will do more damage to the planes for longer since it's high damage aura is bigger and the planes will stay in longer? So when I said BB got buffed, that was actually correct? I haven't checked the dps values of all my cruisers, you're saying they should have higher base dps and not just higher dps during DFAA boost? What do you call AAA cruisers then? How many cruisers does this exclude? And those cruisers, they should be easy prey for CV's, easier as battleships? Because DFAA doesn't disrupt drop patterns... not that that matters much with these small drops, but hey we had to make sure BB's couldn't get dev struck anymore even if they misplayed. 
3. Mate I can talk about this rework having impacts and effects all I want, just as you can talk all you want. If I say that BB's got buffed in comparison with other classes that's not only correct if I understand things correctly, it's also relevant and I could not care less if you could not care less. Yeah that reads about the same as I read your sentence so I guess it's alright. 

And yes, CV reework imho is a total disaster gameplay wise, the impact is rather nauseating at times.   

 

24 minutes ago, Sunleader said:

So what if BB AA was only Nerfed by 10% and Cruiser AA by 40% BB AA was already weak before the Patch so that didnt really change anything.

Wait, so why again should BB's be more competent in dealing with CV's as cruisers again? Gameplay wise, not historical. Because if they should not be competent to deal with CV's on their own, you know, requiring some synergy and teamwork, why is it irrelevant their AAA changes positively compared with the class which is supposed to be of importance to battleship players because if they do not support them they get farmed by enemy CV?

 

It's rather puzzling, removing escort need from BB's and letting them do everything even better on their own, and then saying we will add submarines so DD's will have to hunt those ( to protect the battleships from getting torped ofc ). 

 

No, this is all perfectly relevant to AA rework and CV rework in general, I don't really see a need to 'just focus on AA being crap'. DFAA should be more important, disrupting drop patterns should be more important, BB's shouldn't be able to ignore cruiser support. Rework entire experience system so it actually rewards teamplay oriented actions and force players to be less selfish in game by negatively reward people not using their abilities to aid the team. AA rework or CV rework sadly has past the point where this would even be a point of discussion though so I guess I'm that lone mad guy screaming in the dessert at fata morgana's. 

 

As I said, carry on.