Does anyone else feel like the IJN BB line has been power creeped?

[DrMechano]

So just a general question, it feels like that the IJN BB line, while it ends in the Yamato which still has a unique property (460mm guns) the rest of the line feels somewhat...eh...

 

The Russian BB line usually outclasses them tier for tier, the US line got their citadels lowered a touch, the RN line...eh...now they've raised the citadels on everything tier 7 and up....ok yeah they're not as mighty as they once were (if the KGV was really ever...mighty...) so I'd say they're probably on par with the IJN line. The German line is...an odd duck but it is much tougher than the IJN line (though I imagine most Kreigsmarine players would trade toughness for better gun accuracy).

 

Thinking about it, it IS mainly the RU BB line that is the problem, the Izmail is like the Fuso and New Mex but...well better (ish), I would say the Sinop far outclasses any BB of its tier.

[DFens_666]

I dont think its limited to IJN BBs.

Ive heard, Izumo is better than it used to be because it got buffed so... Might not even be true for every ship.

 

But mostly problem is with Russian Biasboats. They just combine IJN/German BBs and are even better in those areas: Better accuracy (short-midrange) and extremely tanky. Unless you think "broadside bestside", russian BBs are the way to go.

[Ubertron_X]

Kongo solid and with great speed for T5.

Fuso still good as far as I can tell but has lost its 12 gun uniqueness.

Nagato (and Colorado) powercreeped by 406mm gun inflation on T7.

Amagi still seems a decent 10 gun flanker/sniper.

Izumo the odd duck it always was because of the suboptimal turret placement.

 

Trumped by glorious Soviet blue water navy? Yes. Obsolete? No.

 

 

[ColonelPete]

• Kawachi and Myogi were always weak ships and Myogi got signifikant improvements of the years. Nothing changed.
• Kongo is still the benchmark for Tier V BB and the ARP sisters show what you can do with experience and a decent captain.
• Fuso is the strongest silver Tier VI at the moment. See no problem there.
• Nagato is the weakest Tier VII BB, thx to her armor, but that is not new either.
• Amagi is a solid Tier VIII, she is just not that easy to play, no problem there.
• Izumo was always weak and got significant improvements over the years, which makes her a kinda solid performer, but her turret layout just hurts.
• Yamato was the strongest silver Tier X for a long time, but she is the one who got power creeped bit, but still belongs to the stronger Tier X.

[NothingButTheRain]

Kongo is still a good ship, but it has gotten stiff competition by Cesare and Veliky.

Fuso and Nagato I haven't played ina  long while, so I can't really tell

Amagi is still a good ship and I'm not toughing Izumo 

Yamato has been powercrept as well, particularly by ships approaching the Yamato gun caliber (along with its pen abilities and without Yamato weaknesses) and even the unique gun sound is no longer restricted to Yamato and Musashi anymore (Ohio).

[El2aZeR]

In so far that glorious "legendary" BBs made out of pure stalinium have powercreeped everything, yes.

[ColonelPete]

10 minutes ago, El2aZeR said:

In so far that glorious "legendary" BBs made out of pure stalinium have powercreeped everything, yes.

Looks like some RU BB did not get the memo...

[howardxu_23]

Nagato and Colorado now needs 27mm all round plates or 30mm central plating, or less”hp” in its parts so that they saturate faster and bleed less hp overall. Yamato is still capable of outright edited* RN and french BBs, which even kerml cannot do. Would agree that the pen of certain ships is negating her punishing broadside armored targets ability, along with 30mm overmatch before all the 457mm armed BB came(when it’s just her, monty, and GK, she is the only ship to hold that advantage.) 

 

Edit: Please be careful about the language.

[DJ_Die]

Izumo is actually a great ship to teach you have to play Yamato, you simply have to forget the third turret is there 95% of the time. The buffs also made it tanky as hell due to its strong deck and minimal superstructure. 

[Panocek]

6 hours ago, Ubertron_X said:

Nagato (and Colorado) powercreeped by 406mm gun inflation on T7.

Rather they're powercrept by Sinop, as she is 3rd 406mm armed battleship at tier 7, excluding premium Nelson. KGV, Gneisenau and Lyon have smaller guns

[KillStealBoss]

8 hours ago, Ubertron_X said:

Fuso still good as far as I can tell but has lost its 12 gun uniqueness

But that reload still the best on this tier as a 12 gun BB 

[Isoruku_Yamamoto]

I dont feel the Yamato has necessarily been powercrept. Instead whats going on is that we now have to compare it to: 

- Montana (as always)

- GK 
- Conq
- Republique
- Kreml

Where the Montana has its things going for it that the Yamato doesnt, the Yamatos playstyle can be easily used to make it stronger in the fight- same goes the other way around though. But i'd say the Yamato is a tad stronger in terms of guns. 
The GK is no match for a Yamato, except it can murder it in a close combat brawl. Something the Yamato should then avoid. But when not facing eachother, a Yamato has much better guns to deal damage with while GK is meh. 
Conq is nice but while the HE shells actually are better than that of Yamato, the AP certainly is not. Try oneshotting a Hindenburg in a Conq. 
Republique is a tad weaker than yamato overall IMO, but with far superior secondaries

Real problem: the Kreml. A Kreml has better armour, better gun handling within its firing range, but its firing range is relatively short at just under 21km (compared to 26.5 on yamato). While the 457mm are strong, they have one small problem: 457mm does not overmatch 32mm armour, whereas 460mm (yamato guns) does. So while i'd say that a Kreml can beat a Yamato most of the times 1 vs 1, the Yamato definitely has a cutting edge when it comes to facing other BBs (especially not tier X) and cruisers. 

The Kreml being able to oneshot pretty much any battleship it faces as long as its broadside is pretty ridiculous. The USSR BBs were supposed to become really inaccurate, but have become far too accurate IMO. Nerf the sigma down to texas levels- or preferably even worse. So these ships will do amazing at sub-6km ranges, and pretty bad at anything above 12km.

 

Grtz I_Y

[KillStealBoss]

If something was powercreeped in this line - the Nagato. 

[Ubertron_X]

1 hour ago, Panocek said:

Rather they're powercrept by Sinop, as she is 3rd 406mm armed battleship at tier 7, excluding premium Nelson. KGV, Gneisenau and Lyon have smaller guns

Well, yes and no. For a long time Nagato stood unchallenged as the "typical" go-to tier 7 BB. High HP, reasonable speed, few but big guns, which even higher tier BB will notice and which can easily overmatch most cruisers. Colorado while having better armor simply is too slow (and lacking HP) and Gneisenau while faster and boosting better secondary armament and torps was no match in raw ranged firepower, sporting only 6x 38cm cannons. Then came the Nelson with its monster heal and better gun layout, later the the Lyon, who while boasting smaller caliber guns ist still faster than the Nagato and will give you a never-gets-old 16 gun salute. The Sinop also sporting 406mm guns (should we rename the big 7 into the big 8?) was the final nail in the coffin, placing Nagato from a top spot to the bottom half of the available T7 BB pool.

[NothingButTheRain]

46 minutes ago, MacArthur92 said:

But that reload still the best on this tier as a 12 gun BB 

Fusos awesome range will probably also help out a little bit here 

[FishDogFoodShack]

Not powercreeped so much as invalidated by the new Soviet BBs, but that applies to almost every BB line in the game right now.

[invicta2012]

Of course they have... The Japanese actually built the largest and greatest battleships the world will ever see. So they should be top dog. 

 

Power creep by made up ships is easy to solve... Any ship never actually laid down should have a 5% chance of vanishing in any particular game. Destroyed by its own internal contradictions. 

[Lebedjev]

39 minutes ago, invicta2012 said:

The Japanese actually built the largest and greatest battleships the world will ever see. So they should be top dog.

 

That is the dumbest statement a weabo can make.

And with this reasoning, we end up with ship like the guilo...

 

[HaachamaShipping]

1 hour ago, Ubertron_X said:

Colorado while having better armor simply is too slow (and lacking HP) 

Slow, yes, lacking hp, no. Colorado was the first USN BB to get the improved heal which allowed it to compare quite well to the Nagato in terms of how much hp it can bring. Add the better citadel protection and the longer damage control and you have a ship that is more survivable, provided neither ship has the option to retreat.

[ColonelPete]

Only weekly stats, but that is Dez 2016:

 

Nagato looks like this for a long time.

 

[Ubertron_X]

4 minutes ago, ColonelPete said:

Only weekly stats, but that is Dez 2016:

  

Nagato looks like this for a long time.

 

@ColonelPete

 

Though WG has teached me to never doubt the wisdom that is hidden in spreadsheets could you please also include the battle count when you post these? Thanks!

[Redcap375]

Look, the Russian BB line has totally power crept everything to be honest.

 

What is their more to say.

 

The Sinop was the BB of tier 7 ranked, the Vlad is BY FAR the strongest in tier 8 CB and the Krem will be everywere in tier 10 CB's.

 

That's no including the Pyotr which is simply stupid at tier 5.

 

Other ships are strong but the Russian ones are simply top dog.

 

Russian bias is fully here now, was only a matter of time i suppose (already hit WoT and Warthunder).  We got to get to grips with that.

 

 

[Redcap375]

Oh and never, and i mean never doubt WG spread sheets.  Because they are completely accurate, totally.

 

Coming from the same country that cheated on the Euro vision song contest for god sake. 

 

[lossi_2018]

yes

[Lebedjev]

7 minutes ago, Redcap375 said:

Coming from the same country that cheated on the Euro vision song contest for god sake. 

 

And hacked all the democratic election ?

Like we are still talking about ship ? :=