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Alfa_Tau

13th Ranked Season: is the game "pay to win"

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Perhaps some players dont use det flags, because they need them for CBs?

 

Perhaps some are better in a Roon than in an Alaska? 

 

Ranked = Randoms, so play it like Randoms.

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I haven't played since 1st week. Tried today .... I have no idea what's wrong with all that people.

  • DD goes inactive - Missouri kills him ... -40 points
  • JB stays on the map border 1st 10 min while the team was slaughtered , then do the YOLO and dies  by nose citadels from Musashi
  • Mogador go on a flanking mission , and leave a Yugomo on the flank of 3 BBs
  • Musashi tryung to snipe from 24  km as if he is Yoshino

...and this is just from 4 battles.

 

Rip brain , I will stay at R10.

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6 hours ago, Alfa_Tau said:

Currently I am playing at Rank 7, already full of Black. I already feel disadvantaged in my Jutland. But at least I have good guns good torps and Heal. 

I'd just as soon have Jutland as Black in the top bracket. Black is only good paired with Kitakaze and they are the only ship focused even harder than Kitas. 

Jutland is far more survivable in a DD heavy meta.

 

Also Black started out as a reward ship for winning Ranked x 5. No P2W there, just hard grind.

 

These days, everybody with a bit of steel gets it, so depressing.

6 hours ago, SgtTincan said:

Black was earned with coal iirc so ........ 

See above.

6 hours ago, CaptStevSmith said:

Black is a Steel ship, if she was for coal I would have one.

True nowadays, see above.

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17 hours ago, Verblonde said:

That was the pair that did most of the heavy lifting for me; the impression (possibly wrong) that I came away with was that Black is superior if your team-mates are functioning as an actual team, whereas Jutland perhaps has the edge for 'army of one' stuff...?

 

For sure - with a few possible exceptions - you need the team to be in a position to take advantage of whatever you light up.

The jutland has a heal and enough dpm for you to be able to play aggressively (well once or twice per game anyway!)

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18 hours ago, CaptStevSmith said:

Jutland is a very strong boat, I am not sure but since I last played Her I think she may of been buffed ??? not sure

 

Enlighten me on her being buffed please ( I stopped playing British ships last year excluding a few premier to get the daily win bonus on ) 

So alongside the IJN and USN line then the British is a good line to go up for the DD's?

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1 hour ago, NoobySkooby said:

So alongside the IJN and USN line then the British is a good line to go up for the DD's?

Sure, T8-T10 RN DDs are great ships, especially Jutland is fine (Daring is very slow...)

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3 hours ago, NoobySkooby said:

So alongside the IJN and USN line then the British is a good line to go up for the DD's?

I'm up to T9 so far, and have been enjoying them a lot; if you've learned to shoot with the US line already, the guns shouldn't present you with much difficulty.

 

BTW it's worth putting the hydro mod on any higher tier keepers, as it makes your hydro run time gloriously absurd - 216 secs!

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In the current Ranked meta I have been using the Chung-Mu a lot. At certain times you get up to 5 BBs and the torps really help while the decent concealment and good guns are good against most DDs. I played the Kita in the last season, where it did fine. Mostly cause it was Arms Race mode and it would heal. But then again guns will expose you and in normal Ranked that can be a problem. Most DDs get destroyed sitting in smoke. I'd probably go for Jutland or Black if I had them.

 

Radar is as important as ever, so I wouldn't say supercruisers dominate. It's just that 2 out of the 3 available have radar and the tankiness to live through getting closer. I'd prefer a Buffalo or Donskoi over the Azuma. It is not Azuma's meta. CAs need to be able to support their DDs and an Azuma, as well as Roon, Ibuki, Saint Louis cannot do that effectively, while the CA on the other team prospectively can. Alaska can be very strong with it's long radar and universal damage potential but many Alaska players I saw just play it wrong, stay at distance, leave their DDs and get caught in the open by BBs.

 

JB is decent, but i doubt you get enough broadsides to punish below rank 6. Musashi is a bit too sluggish, but can be good, if you know to aim and get few DDs.

 

I wouldn't say Ranked is anything like P2W. The idea is to earn back what you spend by performing. At best you trade flags for steel, which will help you get a ship that earns flags back. You don't need a premium ship as long as you make a reasonable choice. Flags and consumables i would recommend to take what makes sense. When you get below rank 6 you may reconsider putting on additional "luxury".

 

Edit: Oh, yeah and: Epicenter sucks!

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1 hour ago, HMS_Kilinowski said:

Oh, yeah and: Epicenter sucks!

Epicenter is not a mode for players who do not understand the basic concept of map control or prefer to sit in the back to save a star. Unfortunately, the game is full of those nowadays. 

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10 minutes ago, Episparh said:

Epicenter is not a mode for players who do not understand the basic concept of map control or prefer to sit in the back to save a star. Unfortunately, the game is full of those nowadays. 

That is certainly true. Especially the new system, where you cap individual rings, takes more awareness on behalf of BBs and cruisers, cause one DD can no longer block 3 zones. Unfortunately you see players hanging out on the flanks, not even putting pressure on the enemy team, whilethe good players try to manage their positions so no ring is abandoned.

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Alle 19/8/2019 alle 15:54, Alfa_Tau ha scritto:

Hello everyone

Let me tell you right now that I do not believe that ranked are pay to win per se. Although some ships have an obvious advantage. 

However there are a few aspects of the competitive tournment that require people to invest resources. If you are NOT ready to do so please DO NOT PLAY RANKED! :Smile_hiding:

 

Consumables MUST be premium;

 

Flags are essential especially the DETONATION flag: today I lost 2 team mates in 2 different battles cause were NOT using the flag.

 

CAMO  :Smile-angry: It's unbelievable to see a DD without CAMO in ranked. I can understrand a BB, won't make much difference but not a DD.

 

Last but not least the special upgrade (radar, hydro, etc) 

 

I understand that especially for those who doesn't have premium time or are not using one of the premium ships (I m using a Jutland) the silver cost is considerable but please UNDERSTAND if you don't use the above items, you are putting not only yourself in disdvantage but the Whole team. 

Finally when you chose a ship ask yourself the simple question: "what does this ship bring to my team". This is exactly what players do in Clan Battles. So I don't see how can be different in ranked. 

Considering now you have Supercruiser to pick a ROON is :etc_swear:… . ridicolous choice. 

I know people will rage back to this point but thats the reality NOW. Currently I am playing at Rank 7, already full of Black. I already feel disadvantaged in my Jutland. But at least I have good guns good torps and Heal. 

 

Thanks 

 

 

I'm playing with FDG now, and before sleeping yesterday night I full broadsided a Missouri with 30K damage and sank her to the abyss.There was no flag that could save her from that doom :)

 Btw, if it's true you can influence a little more the outcome of ranked battles (since there are inevitably less players per battle), it is still true that:
i) there are battles where you CANNOT win
ii) there are battles where you CANNOT lose
iii) there are battles where your contribution CAN make the difference, and this difference will not be given by flags, premium ships, etc. These may help, but unless you get detonated all the others are not really critical for WINNING the match with your team. They might for your personal battle performance, but overall they influece little the whole outcome of the battle.

Do not fear about ships, with your jutland you can do excellent job, as me with my poor FDG (at the bottom of all t9 bbs together with Izumo, lol) 

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1 hour ago, EiricBloodgun said:

iii) there are battles where your contribution CAN make the difference, and this difference will not be given by flags, premium ships, etc. These may help, but unless you get detonated all the others are not really critical for WINNING the match with your team. They might for your personal battle performance, but overall they influece little the whole outcome of the battle.

But if they do you still are pretty happy to have used them. Just today the Kronshtadt on my team took a lot of damage and finally two perma-fires. The fires stopped at 200 HP. I smoked the guy and he repeatedly healed, In the end we won the battle closely. Now did he pick the India Yankee flag? I didn't pay attention. If so, that might have saved the whole team. So, is it worth gambling? You decide.

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On ‎8‎/‎19‎/‎2019 at 10:26 PM, LemonadeWarrior said:

Perhaps some players dont use det flags, because they need them for CBs?

 

Perhaps some are better in a Roon than in an Alaska? 

 

Ranked = Randoms, so play it like Randoms.

point 1 = In CB you play with friends: you can decide the team formation BEFORE entering the battle. in Ranked you face the "unknown" so imo it's even more important to have ship at its most .

points 2 & 3 = Yes some my have better performance in roon. However in ranked you need to be as much of support for your team as possible. In ranked there are only 6 players per team while in random 15. If you don't have Radar someone else will for sure. 

Random is COMPLETELY different from ranked so if this is your idea is ok for me. But I firmly believe you are wrong. 

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14 hours ago, EiricBloodgun said:

Btw, if it's true you can influence a little more the outcome of ranked battles (since there are inevitably less players per battle), it is still true that:
i) there are battles where you CANNOT win
ii) there are battles where you CANNOT lose

all battles can be win or lost. I personally have experienced incredibly "thrown away " victories that I could not believe my eyes :Smile-angry:

14 hours ago, EiricBloodgun said:

iii) there are battles where your contribution CAN make the difference, and this difference will not be given by flags, premium ships, etc. These may help, but unless you get detonated all the others are not really critical for WINNING the match with your team. They might for your personal battle performance, but overall they influece little the whole outcome of the battle.

Of course a single player performance can decide the result of the battle . We are or should be aware of RNG. Thats why having the detonation flag in particular, is a MUST for me. Because no matter how good you are, you CANNOT control RNG. So this flags protect you from incredibly bad luck!! To be clear I don't use it often in random BUT I Always use it in ranked and CB. 

Another example: Endurance flag increase the amount of damage you can heal. And I can keep going. Yes none of them give you a "victory awards, but for sure they can help. 

It's up to you to use or not but people should at least be aware of the fact they are giving away an advantage. 

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17 hours ago, HMS_Kilinowski said:

But if they do you still are pretty happy to have used them. Just today the Kronshtadt on my team took a lot of damage and finally two perma-fires. The fires stopped at 200 HP. I smoked the guy and he repeatedly healed, In the end we won the battle closely. Now did he pick the India Yankee flag? I didn't pay attention. If so, that might have saved the whole team. So, is it worth gambling? You decide.

Bravo this is exactly my point. Who ever have played enough has experienced situation like this. For example a DD left for dead with only a  few hundrends HP , killing a full HP BB. This is also why is important to secure kills everytime yuo can. 

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6 hours ago, Alfa_Tau said:

point 1 = In CB you play with friends: you can decide the team formation BEFORE entering the battle. in Ranked you face the "unknown" so imo it's even more important to have ship at its most .

points 2 & 3 = Yes some my have better performance in roon. However in ranked you need to be as much of support for your team as possible. In ranked there are only 6 players per team while in random 15. If you don't have Radar someone else will for sure. 

Random is COMPLETELY different from ranked so if this is your idea is ok for me. But I firmly believe you are wrong. 

Point 1: So because I used my flags to play with Random folks I am not allowed to play with my friends anymore. Sounds a bit weird to me.

Point 2/3: sure, whatever floats your boat.

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1 minute ago, LemonadeWarrior said:

Point 1: So because I used my flags to play with Random folks I am not allowed to play with my friends anymore. Sounds a bit weird to me.

Excuse me where did I say you are not allowed to do something??? 

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1 minute ago, Alfa_Tau said:

Excuse me where did I say you are not allowed to do something??? 

Playing without detonation flags is not allowed in CB's for us.

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6 hours ago, Alfa_Tau said:

To be clear I don't use it often in random BUT I Always use it in ranked and CB

I wrote the above. . 

1 minute ago, LemonadeWarrior said:

Playing without detonation flags is not allowed in CB's for us.

If this is some kind of obligation your clan require, I don't argue with that. 

Remember anyway thst you can buy the detonation flag in armory for SILVER or COAL and those are among the cheapest ones. 

So FOR ME it's Worth the expense. 

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An interesting thread, @Alfa_Tau!

 

Here are my two cents on the subject.

 

There are a few basic moral tenets, that I think most WoWs players can more or less agree on:

  1. World of Warships is a team playing game. If you take part in it, you have an obligation to play as well as you can, and to behave decently towards the other players (allies and enemies alike).
  2. Deliberately ruining the game for others, or other forms of misbehaviour, is not allowed. Not trying to actually win the battle is a form of passive sabotage in this context.
  3. Barring acts of deliberate sabotage or other forms of bad behaviour, everyone should be allowed to try to win the battle in whatever way he or she sees fit.

OP raises an interesting question with relation to the above tenets, namely how one should view the choices of modules, consumables and signal flags that can augment a ship's performance in the game. Is there an imperative to always use at least a basic camouflage with the relevant bonuses to concealment and dispersion? Should it be considered disloyal to one's team to enter a battle without a full set of modules and premium consumables?

 

I don't set out to provide an answer for everyone. But as I see it, the matter is fairly simple. The conditions for being allowed to enter a battle are built into the game. As long as it is mechanically possible to click the 'Battle' button with a naked ship, or with a ship with no mounted modules or signal flags whatsoever, it is also in accordance with the rules to do so. And given that camouflage patterns, modules, consumables and signal flags all cost resources, I can hardly see how it could be otherwise. Thus, I would never come down on someone in chat, or report him for playing badly or any such thing, simply on account of how he has fitted out his ship.

 

This being said, deliberately taking your ship into battle without such available in-game resources that can help you attain a win - in other words, to wilfully lessen your chances for a victory - could certainly be thought of as going somewhat against the spirit of the game. As long as we are talking about resources that are easily available for in-game credits, and making allowances so that no one should be forced to run a premium account or otherwise spend real money, it would make sense to outfit your ship with at least the basic set of consumables before going into battle. This is especially so if that battle is on a level, or in a game mode, that requires some amount of dedication to take a serious part in. Accidentally entering the lists in a ranked battle without a proper camouflage pattern on my destroyer, for instance, would make me blush like the proverbial tomato.

 

It should perhaps be added that clans are of course free to set up any membership rules they wish concerning such things as uniform and equipment. It's not mandatory to be in a clan, after all.

 

Cheers!

:Smile_honoring:

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3 minutes ago, Procrastes said:

I don't set out to provide an answer for everyone. But as I see it, the matter is fairly simple. The conditions for being allowed to enter a battle are built into the game. As long as it is mechanically possible to click the 'Battle' button with a naked ship, or with a ship with no mounted modules or signal flags whatsoever, it is also in accordance with the rules to do so. And given that camouflage patterns, modules and consumables all cost resources, I can hardly see how it could be otherwise. Thus, I would never come down on someone in chat, or report him for playing badly or any such thing, simply on account on how he has fitted out his ship.

Hello Procastes

thanks  for your very well adressed reply. Not easy for me to point out all points as I don't master english like you, but I will try.

First of all as I said to Others in my previous replys, the title of my post was deliberately provoking. I want to drag the attention in particular of those many relative new players that I see doing choiches that in my opinion are wrong (in my opinion).

Sure everybody is free to chose the prefered set up for its ship. And I am glad the game offer this opportunity. My point is aimed to underline the difference between a random battle and a ranked one. For example I have played 5 random battles today and lost 3 of them. I don't care much. I was alone and everytime did my best to win. Defeat = less XP and less silver/free XP. No worries I was playing Always with premium ship so still making my earnings. 

BUT in ranked is different . Defeat means often a step back and considering the lengh of the grind is quite a pain in the :etc_swear:

This is why i think in ranked the economy must be put aside. You shouldn't really care about it. Also consider this: what is the value of steel? you can't buy it. You can't get it in container.

Ok time to stop or I go too long.

thanks for your observation

cheers

:Smile_honoring:

 

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1 hour ago, Alfa_Tau said:

Sure everybody is free to chose the prefered set up for its ship. And I am glad the game offer this opportunity. My point is aimed to underline the difference between a random battle and a ranked one. For example I have played 5 random battles today and lost 3 of them. I don't care much. I was alone and everytime did my best to win. Defeat = less XP and less silver/free XP. No worries I was playing Always with premium ship so still making my earnings. 

BUT in ranked is different . Defeat means often a step back and considering the lengh of the grind is quite a pain in the :etc_swear:

These points are all valid. There is a fairly big difference as to what is at stake in a ranked battle, compared to an ordinary random one. When you know that many of your team mates will likely have put in a lot of time and effort, doing less than your best is somewhat disrespectful.

 

On the other hand, it is important to hold in mind that a battle in WoWs - even a ranked one - is still just a game. It is not worth losing sleep or getting into a fight - online or otherwise - over!* :Smile_Default:

 

* As I keep repeating to myself, between clenched teeth, far more often than I'd care to admit.

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1 hour ago, Procrastes said:

It is not worth losing sleep or getting into a fight - online or otherwise - over

Totally Agree with you. I just reached rank 5 after 2 win. I am now far down to where I expected to be. So I am playing at my best but also with the mindset that I have really nothing to lose. 

:Smile_honoring:

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