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The_EURL_Guy

Naval Legends: U.S.S. Iowa Versus Yamato and Tirpitz

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I'd say it is pretty onesided. Most commentary is from former Iowa crewman, only once did we hear a japanese point of view. The japanese one was far more balanced and detailed then the US navymen ones, which literally in all cases was: "Yeah, we'd win of course". Which is then taken as the final answer for the opening question.


A more detailed Wargaming video on Iowa can be found on their Youtube channel. Still very much onesided but far better then this piece and more then twice as long. Almost all content in the above linked new video is included in the old one.

 

Not a good video. Nothing I'd recommend.

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1 minute ago, Egoleter said:

I'd say it is pretty onesided. Most commentary is from former Iowa crewman, only once did we hear a japanese point of view. The japanese one was far more balanced and detailed then the US navymen ones, which literally in all cases was: "Yeah, we'd win of course". Which is then taken as the final answer for the opening question.

 

Not a good video. Nothing I'd recommend.

 

Nothing new, the Iowa vs. Yamato is an old and often biased discussion.

 

Could anyone post here the immunity zones of these two ships vs. each other?

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From the in game news article

 

"...she was the only superbattleship that managed to survive World War II."

 

Is Wargaming really that sloppy when it comes to research? Wisconsin, Missouri and New Jersey all survived as well.

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13 minutes ago, StarbuckTheThird said:

From the in game news article

 

"...she was the only superbattleship that managed to survive World War II."

 

Is Wargaming really that sloppy when it comes to research? Wisconsin, Missouri and New Jersey all survived as well.

Don't be too salty. They said: "out of the three (...) Iowa had survived."

Obviously they must know about something about the class especially after they (WG NA) had a series of meetings/parties on all surviving WW2 ships around USA and Canada this year...

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didn't they do that video few months ago or I'm the only one who has noticed that? Why do they put the same video again? Working: Wargaming level...

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what about... nagato vs bismarck vs roma vs vangaurd vs richelieu vs stalin in a rowing boat using wg russian bias?
even-though nagato is much older than the others, she does posses 16.3 inch guns with hard-hitting shells and good accuracy and has ok-ish armour

i think it would be a fair fight

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2 hours ago, LonesomePolecat said:

Don't be too salty. They said: "out of the three (...) Iowa had survived."

Obviously they must know about something about the class especially after they (WG NA) had a series of meetings/parties on all surviving WW2 ships around USA and Canada this year...

What part of the word only don't you understand?

btw - there were FOUR Iowa's...

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Yeah, the video is very one sided... And to say the Tirpitz would not be able to do damge is... Well I think it would have been able to do damage, and the german guns were very good and accurate,and that is one thing I think would be an advantage. That and Tirpitz was not a slow ship either, so just dismissing her offhand is a bit strange imo...

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4 hours ago, DarthDon49 said:

What part of the word only don't you understand?

btw - there were FOUR Iowa's...

Saltiness intensifies. Once again: they said: "Out of the three (- aka mentioned in the vid. So Tirpitz Iowa and Yamato) only Iowa had survived".

They not talking about the Iowa class they talking about these 3 ships. Hope that's clear this time...

 

 

(p.s.: have you heard about USS Kentucky BB66? ;) ...)

(p.s.2.: before you comit hate crime on me, yes I know she's never commissioned and yes I know Illinois dismantled on the slipway...but at least Kentucky's bow survived on USS Wisconsin to these days...)

 

Hf&Gl  

 

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12 minutes ago, Otowi said:

Yeah, the video is very one sided... And to say the Tirpitz would not be able to do damge is... Well I think it would have been able to do damage, and the german guns were very good and accurate,and that is one thing I think would be an advantage. That and Tirpitz was not a slow ship either, so just dismissing her offhand is a bit strange imo...

 

Unlike the Bismark & Tirpitz interpretation in the game,  where the guns are very poor at a distance ( which they shouldn't be)  when the enemy ship is angled the shell grouping doesn't work well,  and one hit per salvo is why the ships are not used by players, any T8 cruiser can hit you with 6 shells every time twice as fast.   Apart from that, Bismarcks can take T10's apart at close quarters in a brawl but that will also make you a quick and easy target.

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Someday there will be a highly accurate computer simulation taking into account the entirety of the ship design and the tactics that both ships would use and will do this battle a thousand times over and then we might have an accurate answer to this question.

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10 hours ago, TheRonson said:

 

Unlike the Bismark & Tirpitz interpretation in the game,  where the guns are very poor at a distance ( which they shouldn't be)  when the enemy ship is angled the shell grouping doesn't work well,  and one hit per salvo is why the ships are not used by players, any T8 cruiser can hit you with 6 shells every time twice as fast.   Apart from that, Bismarcks can take T10's apart at close quarters in a brawl but that will also make you a quick and easy target.

Was not talking about in-game but rather IRL like the video here, wich is one sided, and they basically dismiss Tirpitz like she was not even a thing...

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14 hours ago, LonesomePolecat said:

Saltiness intensifies. Once again: they said: "Out of the three (- aka mentioned in the vid. So Tirpitz Iowa and Yamato) only Iowa had survived".

They not talking about the Iowa class they talking about these 3 ships. Hope that's clear this time...

 

 

(p.s.: have you heard about USS Kentucky BB66? ;) ...)

(p.s.2.: before you comit hate crime on me, yes I know she's never commissioned and yes I know Illinois dismantled on the slipway...but at least Kentucky's bow survived on USS Wisconsin to these days...)

 

Hf&Gl  

 

Facts are not salt. Their description also calls them super battleships when the proper term is super dreadnaught. And Yes, I know about the other Iowa's not completed (I am a U.S. Navy Veteran and have been a member of the United States Naval Institute for decades). I started naval wargaming in the early '70's with Avalon Hill's Jutland and later graduated to 1:1200 scale waterline models using Alnavco's  Seapower rules in the late 1970's and have an extensive naval history library. Please educate me....:cap_haloween:

p.s. Unlike many other WW-II BB's the Bismarck and Yamato still exist (albeit as wrecks), so, technically they are wrong ethier way you try to slant it.:Smile_glasses:

Edited by DarthDon49
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1 hour ago, DarthDon49 said:

Facts are not salt. Their description also calls them super battleships when the proper term is super dreadnaught. And Yes, I know about the other Iowa's not completed (I am a U.S. Navy Veteran and have been a member of the United States Naval Institute for decades). I started naval wargaming in the early '70's with Avalon Hill's Jutland and later graduated to 1:1200 scale waterline models using Alnavco's  Seapower rules in the late 1970's and have an extensive naval history library. Please educate me....:cap_haloween:

p.s. Unlike many other WW-II BB's the Bismarck and Yamato still exist (albeit as wrecks), so, technically they are wrong ethier way you try to slant it.:Smile_glasses:

Oh please. I'm not trying to slant anything. I appreciate all your efforts here. Also your experience. But. My only sin here is I was trying to hilite something was misunderstood by someone. I did not want to educate, re-educate or even correct anybody.

And here we are. The whole thing drifted away. And that's the problem with these kind of forums. Kind of impersonal and one sided. Everyone thinks s/he knows everything right and only s/he knows everything right. And everyone else is nothing but a noisy kid.   But this is getting off topic now I recon...

 

p.s.:

1 hour ago, DarthDon49 said:

Unlike many other WW-II BB's the Bismarck and Yamato still exist

I strongly agree with this

 

Best regards

 

GL&HF

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On 8/6/2019 at 5:49 AM, piet11111 said:

Someday there will be a highly accurate computer simulation taking into account the entirety of the ship design and the tactics that both ships would use and will do this battle a thousand times over and then we might have an accurate answer to this question.

will computers also simulate every drop in the ocean?

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2 hours ago, victorem said:

will computers also simulate every drop in the ocean?

 

Battle environment obviously just a simple sea map would be boring.

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On ‎8‎/‎7‎/‎2019 at 11:56 PM, victorem said:

will computers also simulate every drop in the ocean?

In many games, water is being procedurally generated. As this gets better, it might as well be every drop.

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On ‎8‎/‎6‎/‎2019 at 10:37 AM, LonesomePolecat said:

Everyone thinks s/he knows everything right and only s/he knows everything right.

 

PC rears its ugly head! (NOT putting you down.) Instead of the s/he, his/her garbage, use the singular they - Everyone thinks they know, the ship's captain steered their ship into my torps, etc

 

p.s. before you say my English teacher said this was wrong they were incorrect, Shakespeare used it.:Smile_Default:

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22 hours ago, DarthDon49 said:

PC rears its ugly head! (NOT putting you down.) Instead of the s/he, his/her garbage, use the singular they - Everyone thinks they know, the ship's captain steered their ship into my torps, etc

 

p.s. before you say my English teacher said this was wrong they were incorrect, Shakespeare used it.:Smile_Default:

...:Smile_facepalm:

 

(funny thou , your absolutely right. I'll try next time... ;) )

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Who cares what some daft old people say as we have this WOWS-simulator where anybody can see for themselves which ship would win!

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On 8/11/2019 at 4:30 PM, DarthDon49 said:

before you say my English teacher said this was wrong they were incorrect, Shakespeare used it.:Smile_Default:

cool!! As people cant even speak english at all....    let´s use 16th century english to make it all more interesting....

Shakespeares English in Wows Forums... :Smile_veryhappy:

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12 hours ago, victorem said:

cool!! As people cant even speak english at all....    let´s use 16th century english to make it all more interesting....

Shakespeares English in Wows Forums... :Smile_veryhappy:

Well, YOU seem to be English challenged, as you don't seem to know the difference between cant (an angle or slant), and can't (cannot).

 

Be that as it may, the singular they is becoming more and more used as publications don't want to run afoul of the PC crowd and at the same time don't want to waste ink (or the cyber equivalent) with the clumsy alternates,  such as his/her instead of their.:Smile_glasses:

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