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jieyaw

French Destroyers vs Russian destroyers

Which is the better dd?  

22 members have voted

  1. 1. Which is the better dd?

    • Khabarovsk
      6
    • Kleber
      16

31 comments in this topic

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French destroyers vs Russian destroyers

 

I would like to compare these two nations in this post; please comment about which is better.

 

Speed:

French is faster, though Russians still fast. French have improved engine boost.

 

Health:

About the same.

 

Guns:

Khabarovsk: 4x2 130mm, base reload of 5s, base rotation of 20s/180 degrees, base range of 11.24km, 900m/s

Kleber:           4x2 139mm, base reload of 7s, base rotation of 10s/180 degrees, base range of 13.56km 840m/s

 

Kleber has access to main battery reload, as well as improved AP shells, allowing citadels on cruisers at close/medium ranges.

 

Torps:

Kleber has 8km torps. Khabarovsk torps only for emergencies.

 

Concealment:

Khabarovsk: What concealment? (10km base)

Kleber:           Useable (7.98km base)

 

Rudder shift/Turning circle:

Khabarovsk: 11.1s, 760m

Kleber          : 4.8s, 740m

 

Question: Which is the best nation to go for? I know that French can cap more easily, though they don't have smoke. Which is better at open-water gunning and wasd-ing? Which playstyle is more interesting?

 

Please let me know your thoughts.

 

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Khaba. Based on datamined AP penetration, only Zao and Minotaur you can have real chances of citadelling outside of secondary range and even then perfect broadside is going to be needed. 

 

For long range open water shenanigans in randoms... Tashkent/Kiev. Both have more range than Kebab, actually serviceable torpedo armament and with Concealment upgrade alone, which they can take freely they can stealth torp incoming ships while having signature heal. They lack Kebab armor as well ability to eat full pens though:Smile_trollface:

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1 minute ago, OldschoolGaming_YouTube said:

Kind of hard to compare a crap almost no one have tried.

Le Terrible was released late last year, and it's essentially what the whole French DD tree is all about. It's been the testbed of the concept.

 

If I compare Le Terrible and Kiev, after 100+ randoms in both:

  • Both have 8 km torps that hit hard. 
  • Terrible has 6.6 km concealment with buffs, Kiev 7.1 km. Both are bad, but there's a meager window for launching torpedoes from stealth.
  • AA is awful in both.
  • With Sierra Mike signal, Terrible does 45.1 knots and Kiev 44.6 knots. With engine boost, however, Terrible does about 54 knots and Kiev only 49 knots. This is a big thing, since with the special upgrade Terrible is mostly running on turbo whenever speed counts.
  • Kiev guns have about 10 % higher DPS, but Terrible can use the reload boost in the critical moments.
  • Kiev has smoke.

They play very different. Kiev is a fast, gun-heavy DD, but not massively different from other nations. You sit in smoke a lot and spam HE against all targets.

 

Terrible is the best DD hunter. When I see a red DD hiding in smoke, I usually hit turbo and go straight in, with the reload boost ready. The red DD usually has a bad time. With some help from the terrain or friendly smoke, you can use the speed to charge bigger fish as well, dumping torps into them before they have the time to turn their main batteries to fire at you.

In general the French line is all about speed, and the art of aggressive engagement and smart disengagement. Skill floor is very high, but at least Le Terrible has been insanely fun.

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[TORAZ]
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MN DDs have one glaring weakness that imo makes the entire line completely obsolete.

Or to sum it up:

*laughs in Enterprise*

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[FJAKA]
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2 hours ago, jieyaw said:

French destroyers vs Russian destroyers

 

I would like to compare these two nations in this post; please comment about which is better.

 

Speed:

French is faster, though Russians still fast. French have improved engine boost.

 

Health:

About the same.

 

Guns:

Khabarovsk: 4x2 130mm, base reload of 5s, base rotation of 20s/180 degrees, base range of 11.24km, 900m/s

Kleber:           4x2 139mm, base reload of 7s, base rotation of 10s/180 degrees, base range of 13.56km 840m/s

 

Kleber has access to main battery reload, as well as improved AP shells, allowing citadels on cruisers at close/medium ranges.

 

Torps:

Kleber has 8km torps. Khabarovsk torps only for emergencies.

 

Concealment:

Khabarovsk: What concealment? (10km base)

Kleber:           Useable (7.98km base)

 

Rudder shift/Turning circle:

Khabarovsk: 11.1s, 760m

Kleber          : 4.8s, 740m

 

Question: Which is the best nation to go for? I know that French can cap more easily, though they don't have smoke. Which is better at open-water gunning and wasd-ing? Which playstyle is more interesting?

 

Please let me know your thoughts.

 

you forget smoke and heal?....you do not think it is big deal ?

 

in direct duel Khaba would win.....Khaba outdps it.....but can not ambush as good as Kleber...so i wild say they will be totaly different gameplay.I have La Teribble and personaly like it very much

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1 hour ago, El2aZeR said:

MN DDs have one glaring weakness that imo makes the entire line completely obsolete.

Or to sum it up:

*laughs in Enterprise*

after WG basically killed CVs it is not as big disadvantage as it looks in first....we are back to 1 cv per 10 game

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4 minutes ago, veslingr said:

after WG basically killed CVs it is not as big disadvantage as it looks in first....we are back to 1 cv per 10 game

 

That won't matter to me.

Because I'm still one of those 1 in 10 CVs. :Smile_trollface:

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11 minutes ago, veslingr said:

after WG basically killed CVs it is not as big disadvantage as it looks in first....we are back to 1 cv per 10 game

Nah it's still not like on RTS. Another AA buffs incoming. Maybe on 0.8.7 will be same numbers as on RTS. 

 

For me both are good and fun. Kleber has better speed and usable torps plus more maneuverability. Khaba hp restoration , better AA , armed sections. Though it eats BB AP as DDs in the past, it's sluggish and has almost unusable torps. Though I'm having fun in Khaba, I think I'll enjoy the Kleber as well. 

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9 minutes ago, El2aZeR said:

Because I'm still one of those 1 in 10 CVs. :Smile_trollface:

7500 games and I've never seen you, so it's not likely to be a pressing issue. 

 

I think the high tier French DDs are best thought of as hyper-mobile light cruisers, using their speed to execute hit-and-run attacks and run away.  The mid-Tier ones look a bit of a grind, to be honest. I have an Aigle and a Leningrad and I know I'd miss the smoke on both of them so I'm not all convinced it's going to be an enjoyable ride. But all that Free XP has to be saved for Friesland, so no Tier skipping is allowed.

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Well, hard to say for now.

But what is sure, is that the absence of smoke and heal combined with garbage concealment makes the skill floor incredibly high.

You just have no option to easily disengage if you mess with your positionning or had bad map awareness.

I'm already suffering from such mistakes with easy-to-play DDs, so I believe the French DDs will be total garbage or gold depending on who is sailing in.

And I'm not a very good player so I'm afraid I will not be able to show what those ships could do. I hope I'm wrong though.

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19 hours ago, jieyaw said:

Please let me know your thoughts.

No word about 50 mm plating and full damage AP penetrations.

Also Kleber eats less damage in general due to changed mechanic for french destroyers.

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10 hours ago, invicta2012 said:

7500 games and I've never seen you, so it's not likely to be a pressing issue.

 

I have seen him twice in old RTS CVs on enemy team. And I can tell that I don't to see him again ... on enemy team of course.

 

Poll for better ship between two of which one was currently only played by STs and CCs. Maybe I should create a new poll "Which is better between Khaba, Kleber and Capitani Romani (or that new Italian T10 destroyer from leak)?"

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34 minutes ago, fumtu said:

or that new Italian T10 destroyer from leak)?

It's a capitani romani ship, never finished 

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Voted on Kleber as knowing WG policy, new lines are usually OP and it takes a lot of time to many players to learn counter-plays.

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13 hours ago, elblancogringo said:

Well, hard to say for now.

But what is sure, is that the absence of smoke and heal combined with garbage concealment makes the skill floor incredibly high.

You just have no option to easily disengage if you mess with your positionning or had bad map awareness.

It's not as garbage as Khaba (you need the double rudder module to make it moving). Disengage? Speed. 

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Can't ignore smoke + triple heal with (SI and Premium) on khaba, I hope Russian DD's will keep their better velocity and shell arcs, if not, I guess Russian DD's will be slower French DD's without torps or concealment, new ships being superior to old ships seems to be a theme around here.

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Makes me wonder if miss khaba should be buffed if shes that bad, thats always put me off going up the russian dd line too be honest.

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Just now, CptBarney said:

Makes me wonder if miss khaba should be buffed if shes that bad, thats always put me off going up the russian dd line too be honest.

I think the torps should go 7-8km not 6. That's the must useless think on it. 

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4 minutes ago, NikolayKuznetsov said:

Can't ignore smoke + triple heal with (SI and Premium) on khaba, I hope Russian DD's will keep their better velocity and shell arcs, if not, I guess Russian DD's will be slower French DD's without torps or concealment, new ships being superior to old ships seems to be a theme around here.

It doesn't have smoke +triple heal. This things are in Grozo. With SI and premium khaba has 4 heals or 4 smokes. 

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