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Muppeteer

Co-op divisions - why are they capped? Question from Steam forums

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Hi,

 

With the recent recruitment drive from WG trying to get new players, there are a fair few new ppl playing WoWs through Steam. Maintaining top 100 status on the platform and numbers are growing.

 

This thread from worldwide WoWs Steam forum made me think WG should have a think about improving quality of life for new people:

https://steamcommunity.com/app/552990/discussions/0/1640916564835383305/

 

Is fairly lengthy and goes off topic at times, so the TLDR is, four new people (who all sound like they enjoy the game) would like to be able to division together in co-op. Is there a reason for a cap on numbers for coop divisions?

 

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@Crysantos

 

This initially came up on Reddit, and the workaround is to use two double divisions simultaneously hitting the battle button, which is not ideal. The guy has new friends playing who are not at a stage yet to play in operations.

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4 minutes ago, DanSilverwing said:

@Crysantos

 

This initially came up on Reddit, and the workaround is to use two double divisions simultaneously hitting the battle button, which is not ideal. The guy has new friends playing who are not at a stage yet to play in operations.

Yeah the sync thing was suggested but is ofc not ideal. Seems a simple thing to change, unless there is a good reason why not?

 

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1 hour ago, Muppeteer said:

Yeah the sync thing was suggested but is ofc not ideal. Seems a simple thing to change, unless there is a good reason why not?

 

 

I guess you could farm too much while playing a full Coop div. Since boni are % based, the more base XP you make, the higher your total XP/cptn XP/FreeXP would rise.

For me personaly, i wouldnt care for such a thing if there would be a bunch of people who would like to waste each others time (well, technically its not wasted, as the individual reward would be higher by using Camo+flags only when its your turn to farm), but maybe WG sees it differently, as they potentially might earn less money.

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44 minutes ago, DFens_666 said:

 

I guess you could farm too much while playing a full Coop div. Since boni are % based, the more base XP you make, the higher your total XP/cptn XP/FreeXP would rise.

For me personaly, i wouldnt care for such a thing if there would be a bunch of people who would like to waste each others time (well, technically its not wasted, as the individual reward would be higher by using Camo+flags only when its your turn to farm), but maybe WG sees it differently, as they potentially might earn less money.

But coop is pretty much auto win anyway, so why would a bigger division size be a problem?

 

Its not an issue for me, but seems a change that might help in retaining new people who want that play on same team experience before they have ships for ops/cw etc.

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While I'm sure there's no major balance or game mechanic reason to limit divisions in co-op, there's something to be said about sharing limits like that with other modes. Bigger divisions in co-op would make the transition to PvP worse if you're used to playing in bigger groups and I'm sure WG prefers to see players transition to PvP at some point.

Also I can see a potential issue with large divisions in a small team when the few players outside the division get less action than the division players who might be working together.

 

I think that operations is the ideal place to play PvE in larger pre-made groups. That's still a thing, right?

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4 minutes ago, Muppeteer said:

But coop is pretty much auto win anyway, so why would a bigger division size be a problem?

 

True, but even a good game will usually not give you much more than 500-600 BaseXP, because the rest of your teammates will accomplish atleast something. Using flags for that is... not that great. Ive had really awesome games with 700-800 BaseXP, and i believe, you could go beyond that if you could farm everything by yourself.

Maybe you could get 1k BaseXP, and then using flags+camos actually becomes viable. Its not worse what you can get in a decent loss either.

 

2 minutes ago, Nechrom said:

I think that operations is the ideal place to play PvE in larger pre-made groups. That's still a thing, right?

 

Ofc. sadly tho, with only 4 OPs in rotation right now, the only usefull one is Narai. The T6 ones are actually too hard to complete with 4 People (Narai is possible), and the results are bad. Narai with 4 guys gets you awesome baseXP.

Probably still better than Coop, but limited to T6+7 atm.

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38 minutes ago, Nechrom said:

While I'm sure there's no major balance or game mechanic reason to limit divisions in co-op, there's something to be said about sharing limits like that with other modes. Bigger divisions in co-op would make the transition to PvP worse if you're used to playing in bigger groups and I'm sure WG prefers to see players transition to PvP at some point.

Also I can see a potential issue with large divisions in a small team when the few players outside the division get less action than the division players who might be working together.

 

I think that operations is the ideal place to play PvE in larger pre-made groups. That's still a thing, right?

As mentioned above, the people in question are sub 100 games level new. WG has done well getting people in, and some look for a mode to learn the game together it seems.

 

Also think it highly likely the ones who aren't in the large division will say "hi" and probably end up in the division next match. More player retention as new ppl team up. :cap_money:

 

 

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4 hours ago, DFens_666 said:

True, but even a good game will usually not give you much more than 500-600 BaseXP, because the rest of your teammates will accomplish atleast something. Using flags for that is... not that great. Ive had really awesome games with 700-800 BaseXP, and i believe, you could go beyond that if you could farm everything by yourself.

Maybe you could get 1k BaseXP, and then using flags+camos actually becomes viable. Its not worse what you can get in a decent loss either.

Only the best player in the team will get > 500 base XP, the rest will usually get less, because there is not enought XP to be farmed by everyone. 

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11 hours ago, Muppeteer said:

. Is there a reason for a cap on numbers for coop divisions?

 

 

Perhaps WG have it in mind that game rigging for rewards or prizes would be more common if the odds were any better than they already are? On a human note it's selfish, it would be great for the four players in a division, but have a thought for the two players that aren't and who get elbowed out of the action, given they've flown just as many signals and have just as much a right to the rewards for playing well.

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12 hours ago, DanSilverwing said:

@Crysantos

 

This initially came up on Reddit, and the workaround is to use two double divisions simultaneously hitting the battle button, which is not ideal. The guy has new friends playing who are not at a stage yet to play in operations.

Hey,

 

Actually a good point - I will doublecheck!

 

Greetings, Crysantos

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14 hours ago, Crysantos said:

Hey,

 

Actually a good point - I will doublecheck!

 

Greetings, Crysantos

Cheers @Crysantos. For co-op only tho pls ;)

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Need more Operations for a wider range of tiers… 

That'll help. 

 

The issue with larger divisions is the effect on the players who are not in the division. They can be shut down by an active division, and I don't mean deliberately either.

 

Divisions might be great for mutual support and teaching new players, but often they are too focused on their own division and not on the needs of the team. I assume that this is often because they spawn together.

 

When a good division is out to farm, perhaps for a directive, then this lack of team focus might be deliberate. This rarely happens in Coop but in Operations it is extremely frustrating.

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9 hours ago, Muppeteer said:

Cheers @Crysantos. For co-op only tho pls ;)

Agreed, for PvP this would be too impactful :Smile_honoring:

 

52 minutes ago, Cambera_1 said:

Need more Operations for a wider range of tiers… 

That'll help. 

 

The issue with larger divisions is the effect on the players who are not in the division. They can be shut down by an active division, and I don't mean deliberately either.

 

Divisions might be great for mutual support and teaching new players, but often they are too focused on their own division and not on the needs of the team. I assume that this is often because they spawn together.

 

When a good division is out to farm, perhaps for a directive, then this lack of team focus might be deliberate. This rarely happens in Coop but in Operations it is extremely frustrating.

Well at least given my limited coop experience there is far less communication going on than in random battles. I also wouldn't expect this to be a very general thing, since you mostly find solo players there - so it's rather giving the option to team up with more. But nothing has been decided yet, I forwarded the request and we'll see.

 

Greetings, Cysantos

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1 minute ago, Crysantos said:

Agreed, for PvP this would be too impactful :Smile_honoring:

 

Well at least given my limited coop experience there is far less communication going on than in random battles. I also wouldn't expect this to be a very general thing, since you mostly find solo players there - so it's rather giving the option to team up with more. But nothing has been decided yet, I forwarded the request and we'll see.

 

Greetings, Cysantos

 

How about Operations? Any more coming? 

You have soooooo much options to do them... 

Take Port Arthur, it would given the lower tiers something to do. 

I'd get Dreadnought for it if it is any interesting. Mikasa, maybe. 

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Ah! Lower tier Operations, another opportunity to get on my hobby horse and plug the idea of revamping Operation Dynamo

 

Balanced for T4, T5, and T6 British and French destroyers (which are all quite close in combat capabilities) as a nod to the historical participants.

 

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12 hours ago, Crysantos said:

Agreed, for PvP this would be too impactful :Smile_honoring:

 

Well at least given my limited coop experience there is far less communication going on than in random battles. I also wouldn't expect this to be a very general thing, since you mostly find solo players there - so it's rather giving the option to team up with more. But nothing has been decided yet, I forwarded the request and we'll see.

 

Greetings, Cysantos

Thank you for passing it on. Seems a worthy request considering the recruitment drive :) Groups of new ppl wanting to learn the game together when starting out would seem to also encourage player retention (not least when they can form clans and shift to pvp). 

 

Cheers.

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23 hours ago, BLUB__BLUB said:

 

How about Operations? Any more coming? 

You have soooooo much options to do them... 

Take Port Arthur, it would given the lower tiers something to do. 

I'd get Dreadnought for it if it is any interesting. Mikasa, maybe. 

Not in the near future but we'll keep you posted when a new operation is on the horizont.

 

Greetings, Crysantos

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On 7/15/2019 at 9:18 AM, Crysantos said:

Hey,

 

Actually a good point - I will doublecheck!

 

Greetings, Crysantos

Hi @Crysantos, just chasing this one up. Any feedback to share from the developers when this was raised with them?

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