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Des Moines or worcester

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As the title say, i want to start a USN cruiser line, but i don't quite know the differences between those 2 splits, can you guys explain them to me?, can't find lots of videos about it

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Light cruisers have better dpm and smaller citadels, but their shells are small and fly in typical USN rainbow arcs, while AP only hurts at close range.

 

Heavy cruisers have larger citadels and less dpm (but Des Moines still is good dpm for T10), but from T8 on get a bit better armour than the light cruisers and while their arcs aren't railguns like Russians, they are good enough to hit things and deal damage with AP even at medium range. Especially as USN heavy cruisers get improved ricochet angles, so not even angled cruisers are safe from your AP.

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USN light cruisers starting from Dallas onward rely on "quantity over quality", they also suffer from low shell velocity, which makes long range shelling borderline futile, but also allows firing over islands with significant margin of safety, assuming someone does the spotting work. Helena alone is worth the grind, I guess you can't argue with 15gun salvo every 8s:cap_yes: Cleveland is also very solid ship, Seattle is disappointing and IMO so is Worcester - gun layout forces you to show not small amount of broadside to make use of "overwhelming firepower" you're supposed to have. Though when fired from safety of an island, amount of shells she can put out is not to be trifled with. Major flaw of any light cruiser using HE shells is their reliance on IFHE skill - without it, they can't inflict direct damage to hulls of tier 6+ BB and tier 8+ cruisers, leaving you at mercy of fire chance once you deplete superstructure. And not always you have broadside available to put AP shells there for regular penetration damage. 

 

USN heavy cruisers AP shells have improved ricochet angles, allowing them to punch through (cruiser) armor normal shells would ricochet off harmlessly. Pensacola is glass cannon, fragile but 10gun AP salvo at tier 6, even with 15s reload can deliver a lot of hurt. Nope Orlean is slightly less extreme, Baltimore I find to be a keeper, combining decent survivability (27mm plating, 152mm citadel + its relatively low position) and 10s reload on 203mm because reasons. She is also first ship in the line to use AP SHS - SuperHeavyShells, trading shell velocity for additional penetration and damage. With Buffalo you trade reload for 12gun salvo. Des Moines combines heavy cruiser firepower with light cruiser volume of fire - 9x203mm every 4.8s (with Reload upgrade - MBM3) can bury pretty much anything with sheer weight of ordnance and unlike CL, can reliably citadel cruisers at most combat ranges as well isn't forced to take IFHE to make HE shells viable.

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1 hour ago, Panocek said:

USN light cruisers starting from Dallas onward rely on "quantity over quality", they also suffer from low shell velocity, which makes long range shelling borderline futile, but also allows firing over islands with significant margin of safety, assuming someone does the spotting work. Helena alone is worth the grind, I guess you can't argue with 15gun salvo every 8s:cap_yes: Cleveland is also very solid ship, Seattle is disappointing and IMO so is Worcester - gun layout forces you to show not small amount of broadside to make use of "overwhelming firepower" you're supposed to have. Though when fired from safety of an island, amount of shells she can put out is not to be trifled with. Major flaw of any light cruiser using HE shells is their reliance on IFHE skill - without it, they can't inflict direct damage to hulls of tier 6+ BB and tier 8+ cruisers, leaving you at mercy of fire chance once you deplete superstructure. And not always you have broadside available to put AP shells there for regular penetration damage. 

 

USN heavy cruisers AP shells have improved ricochet angles, allowing them to punch through (cruiser) armor normal shells would ricochet off harmlessly. Pensacola is glass cannon, fragile but 10gun AP salvo at tier 6, even with 15s reload can deliver a lot of hurt. Nope Orlean is slightly less extreme, Baltimore I find to be a keeper, combining decent survivability (27mm plating, 152mm citadel + its relatively low position) and 10s reload on 203mm because reasons. She is also first ship in the line to use AP SHS - SuperHeavyShells, trading shell velocity for additional penetration and damage. With Buffalo you trade reload for 12gun salvo. Des Moines combines heavy cruiser firepower with light cruiser volume of fire - 9x203mm every 4.8s (with Reload upgrade - MBM3) can bury pretty much anything with sheer weight of ordnance and unlike CL, can reliably citadel cruisers at most combat ranges as well isn't forced to take IFHE to make HE shells viable.

thx bro, useful info

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19 hours ago, Panocek said:

(...)

Completely agree for everything. The only thing I would like to add is the legendary upgrades.

 

On W00ster you can unlock extra duration on consumables with no direct drawbacks. Sounds pretty sweet, but it uses slot 5. This in turn means you have to sacrifice concealment to use it and this I find to be a very questionable trade-off.

 

On DM you get -10% to Radar duration but you gain 20% rudder shift time and 50% acceleration. If you combine this with the radar upgrade and standard acceleration module, DM becomes the fastest accelerating ship in-game (idk about french DDs yet). Yes, the top speed is still meh, but you reach it so fast, you can bait shots and dodge torps with ease. Imho this upgrade is the best LU in-game as it completely transforms the ship.

 

Other than that - both ships are fairly easy to citadel and sink. They both count on supporting the team with radar and DPM (over islands, usually).

 

PS: Check The Sailing Robin's "TOKYO MEME" vid to have a laugh at what DM can do using the legendary module. And please DO NOT got for a "Des Memes" build (presented by Yuro) - long range shots rarely hit anything and you will be mostly useless for your team.

 

EDIT: 

You might also want to check this topic for DM.

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On 7/1/2019 at 11:14 AM, almitov said:

Completely agree for everything. The only thing I would like to add is the legendary upgrades.

 

On W00ster you can unlock extra duration on consumables with no direct drawbacks. Sounds pretty sweet, but it uses slot 5. This in turn means you have to sacrifice concealment to use it and this I find to be a very questionable trade-off.

 

On DM you get -10% to Radar duration but you gain 20% rudder shift time and 50% acceleration. If you combine this with the radar upgrade and standard acceleration module, DM becomes the fastest accelerating ship in-game (idk about french DDs yet). Yes, the top speed is still meh, but you reach it so fast, you can bait shots and dodge torps with ease. Imho this upgrade is the best LU in-game as it completely transforms the ship.

 

Other than that - both ships are fairly easy to citadel and sink. They both count on supporting the team with radar and DPM (over islands, usually).

 

PS: Check The Sailing Robin's "TOKYO MEME" vid to have a laugh at what DM can do using the legendary module. And please DO NOT got for a "Des Memes" build (presented by Yuro) - long range shots rarely hit anything and you will be mostly useless for your team.

 

EDIT: 

You might also want to check this topic for DM.

Damn was just going for the Yuro build now after watching his hilarious vid, please advise on the correct build for the Des Moines a I have just 10 minutes ago unlocked her

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17 hours ago, NoobySkooby said:

Damn was just going for the Yuro build now after watching his hilarious vid, please advise on the correct build for the Des Moines a I have just 10 minutes ago unlocked her

First, congratulations on unlocking this ship. It is tough at first but is one of the most influential ships on the battlefield if played correctly.

 

For the build, I use these:

image.thumb.png.9da3463f31a5caea210d3d9bbff333a5.png

image.png.edd5f715ccf17e75748e8e2745fb8f9b.png

image.png.ddeb5f48de9b98ccddcbfa95c1dbd8b2.png

image.png.efb17e50432b408365e14153f204b7ab.png

image.png.543b931bc06935ace36cd24752f5c34c.png

image.png.d29b071afa0e72198e8bda2fdad3ecbd.png

 

In combination with this commander skill preset, commander is W. Halsey. For consumables I use DCP, Heal, Hydro and Radar (all premium versions). 

This build I use for Clan Battles, but I also play from time to time in randoms (with high success rate for both). 

 

Before you get the legendary upgrade, I would recommend using the reload module in this slot:

image.png.1fd9533ec5b4a10e682f7b612b926215.png

 

I find the range mod to be mostly useless due to the slow shell speed.

If you are not going to play competitive, you can also go for defensive fire consumable instead of hydro, manual AA on the commander (instead of RPF) and potentially put AA upgrade instead of the accuracy one:

image.png.d9613e518bbf46097e2360a194505cc1.png

 

Personally I don't have that much trouble with CVs in a DM, so I always use my CB build. 

 

I hope this helps :)

 

 

EDIT: I don't seem to be able to delete the duplicate screenshot below :(

image.png

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2 hours ago, almitov said:

First, congratulations on unlocking this ship. It is tough at first but is one of the most influential ships on the battlefield if played correctly.

 

For the build, I use these:

image.thumb.png.9da3463f31a5caea210d3d9bbff333a5.png

image.png.edd5f715ccf17e75748e8e2745fb8f9b.png

image.png.ddeb5f48de9b98ccddcbfa95c1dbd8b2.png

image.png.efb17e50432b408365e14153f204b7ab.png

image.png.543b931bc06935ace36cd24752f5c34c.png

image.png.d29b071afa0e72198e8bda2fdad3ecbd.png

 

In combination with this commander skill preset, commander is W. Halsey. For consumables I use DCP, Heal, Hydro and Radar (all premium versions). 

This build I use for Clan Battles, but I also play from time to time in randoms (with high success rate for both). 

 

Before you get the legendary upgrade, I would recommend using the reload module in this slot:

image.png.1fd9533ec5b4a10e682f7b612b926215.png

 

I find the range mod to be mostly useless due to the slow shell speed.

If you are not going to play competitive, you can also go for defensive fire consumable instead of hydro, manual AA on the commander (instead of RPF) and potentially put AA upgrade instead of the accuracy one:

image.png.d9613e518bbf46097e2360a194505cc1.png

 

Personally I don't have that much trouble with CVs in a DM, so I always use my CB build. 

 

I hope this helps :)

 

 

EDIT: I don't seem to be able to delete the duplicate screenshot below :(

image.png

Thank you for this,it is helpful, I did actually go with Yuro's build from the outset with spotter plane rather than radar, but as she is new, I can change at will, in Co ops I am loving her, odd thing is I am not really a Cruiser or DD guy, but the higher tier ones i seem to enjoy more, like i say just plain odd, lol

 

As for Commander, he  is a mere 10 pointer from my Wichita, not the next question i have here is now I have the Baltimore too, do I really need the Wichita?

 

According to CC vids i have seen the Wichita is no Baltimore, so I am a little confused,sorry to hijack a thread with a daft question on another ship entirely.

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15 minutes ago, NoobySkooby said:

in Co ops I am loving her

In Co-Op pretty much any build works. In Random Battles you cannot really be useful to your team with a Des Memes build. Long range + slow shells means you will mostly be shooting at slow or stationary targets (i.e. BBs). Your damage will come from fires and HE dmg, which is easily healed by them = less reward for you. Also, you will be wasting your time doing this instead of supporting your DDs and cruisers with radar.

DM has great DPM, but the ship's main gimmick is playing close support. I already went through this in a topic that I linked before: click. I hope you find it helpful.

 

19 minutes ago, NoobySkooby said:

the next question i have here is now I have the Baltimore too, do I really need the Wichita?

Wichita is the premium one, right? I would never get rid of a premium ship. Even if money income is not relevant, it can still be used to train your DM captain (and other USN commanders for that matter). Premiums do not require retraining.

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