Class call system

[SmokyButtons]

I have an idea to help out the MM, and give some the less played tiers a help i low pop times,

I kinda stole the idea from WoW!

The concept is that players kan que up in multiple ships once,

up to 5 ships at once, but only one ship quede per tier, and one per class,

so if you que all 5 you have to cue one in each class, and one in 5 diffrent tiers!

players have to cue at least 3 ships, and you get +10% credits, and +50% free XP,

times number ships you que up with,

For a total of 50% credits and 250% free XP at 5 ships,

Further more all ships are locked until end of battle to awoid exploids!

 

If suscesfull it massively help the MM, and may give capacity for doing a better MM!

 

there can also be an extra bonus for queing up whit an elite ship, thinking 2X normal bonus,

can also making a class call system, where there bonus for queing in some class and tier combi!

 

[El2aZeR]

The last thing this game needs is some kind of system that increases rewards.

Again, rewards need to be heavily nerfed, not increased.

[JimmyThePirate]

I've never really had an issue with certain tiers not getting into matches.

[SmokyButtons]

1 minute ago, JimmyThePirate said:

I've never really had an issue with certain tiers not getting into matches.

More aimed towards give the MM enough players to better matchmaking, like short players for skill 🤔😎

[El2aZeR]

1 minute ago, SmokyButtons said:

More aimed towards give the MM enough players to better matchmaking, like short players for skill 🤔😎

 

The fundamental problem is that the playerbase is way too small. Allowing people to queue multiple times does not solve that issue.

[Caughtintherain]

6 minutes ago, El2aZeR said:

The last thing this game needs is some kind of system that increases rewards.

Again, rewards need to be heavily nerfed, not increased.

 

Queuing up multiple ships reduces your credit and XP income for that game by 20%. Nailed it. I'm off for beer.

[SmokyButtons]

5 minutes ago, El2aZeR said:

The last thing this game needs is some kind of system that increases rewards.

Again, rewards need to be heavily nerfed, not increased.

For once I kinda agree with you, to some extent, nerfing rewards a bit would make this more attractive, and effective 🤔

 

Still think your kinda elitist views are worrisome 😑

[SmokyButtons]

2 minutes ago, El2aZeR said:

 

The fundamental problem is that the playerbase is way too small. Allowing people to queue multiple times does not solve that issue.

Well this act as force multiplier in player population, as each player doing this will be available in multiple roles and tiers 🤔

[little_rowboat]

The only thing I could imagine to improve matchmaking is adding the radar paramater to even out on teams if possible.. could probably be easier implemented.

Get a group of 24; even tiers of this group; even radar parameter if possible; mix both teams even on average winrate.

 

Like mentioned somewhere else, matchmaking isn't that bad as it is considered to be... really good players can extend or turn around stomps (last example is in the greatest achievement thread).

If the really good players sit on the stomping side they mostly extend games just to get a bit more out of a game.

 

Stomps happen in most cases when average players are ignorant to given situations.. e.g. like being behind in games and are losing and run to corners of the map instead of reacting to it.

Most average players on the losing tend to get their ship full hp out of games instead of at least trying to extend the game.

 

It's like in reality.. average mankind isn't smart, might be a product of our times.. generation playstation not able to think analytically, not knowing basics of natural sciences, not able to read several complex informations, conclude them to a picture and make a decision out of that facts. No matchmaking will turn average intelligent poeple into smart ones.. this game isn't about physical skills, it is only about the former mentioned abilities to capture information and to make (smart) decisions. If you are able to do that you can get (super)unicum in stock boats with 3 point captains because you are more capable than 90 % of the average human mankind which the playerbase here is a share of.

 

Simple as that..  as sad as it is..

[SmokyButtons]

5 minutes ago, Caughtintherain said:

 

Queuing up multiple ships reduces your credit and XP income for that game by 20%. Nailed it. I'm off for beer.

Not really,  you will earn more per match, yes the ships you que with are unavailable until it done, so if die early those will unavailable till the match is done,  but most have more than 5 ships,  and can play on of those 🤔

[El2aZeR]

5 minutes ago, SmokyButtons said:

Still think your kinda elitist views are worrisome 😑

 

Even WG admits that they've ed up the economy amd made it far too forgiving. It's not elitist, it is objectively the best and only solution to the current issue.

 

3 minutes ago, SmokyButtons said:

Well this act as force multiplier in player population, as each player doing this will be available in multiple roles and tiers 🤔

 

No it doesn't. Because regardless actual player numbers don't change.

[Caughtintherain]

2 minutes ago, SmokyButtons said:

Not really,  you will earn more per match, yes the ships you que with are unavailable until it done, so if die early those will unavailable till the match is done,  but most have more than 5 ships,  and can play on of those 🤔

 

My comment was more for comedic effect than a real suggestion.

[SmokyButtons]

2 minutes ago, l_m_just_lucky said:

The only thing I could imagine to improve matchmaking is adding the radar paramater to even out on teams if possible.. could probably be easier implemented.

Get a group of 24; even tiers of this group; even radar parameter if possible; mix both teams even on average winrate.

 

Like mentioned somewhere else, matchmaking isn't that bad as it is considered to be... really good players can extend or turn around stomps (last example is in the greatest achievement thread).

If the really good players sits on the stomping side they mostly extend games just to get a bit more out of a game.

 

Stomps happen in most cases when average players are ignorant to given situations.. e.g. like being behind in games and are losing and run to corners of the map instead of reacting to it.

Most average players on the losing tend to get their ship full hp out of games instead of at least trying to extend the game.

 

It's like in reality.. average mankind isn't smart, might be a product of our times.. generation playstation not able to think analytically, not knowing basics of natural sciences, not able to read several complex informations, conclude them to a picture and make a decision out of that facts. No matchmaking will turn average intelligent poeple into smart ones.. this game isn't about physical skills, it is only about the former mentioned abilities to capture information and to make (smart) decisions. If you are able to do that you can get (super)unicum in stock boats with 3 point captains because you are more capable than 90 % of the average human mankind which the playerbase here is a share of.

 

Simple as that..  as sad as it is..

You right in most what you said,  still think the MM could much better,  but be a problem with it having enough population to work with! 

A better MM , would give new and weak players to learn and grow,  and elite players would have more fun as they would have a better teammates 🤔😊

[CptBarney]

Does that mean i can call in El2azer when my team are transforming into tomatoes in his entrepresents?

 

although, a harsher economy (along with decent mandatory tuts with good prizes) would help as well.

[Caughtintherain]

5 minutes ago, l_m_just_lucky said:

mix both teams even on average winrate.

 

Doing this results in individual skill being cancelled out by having tougher games. Right now a 60% player has an equal chance of being matched with a 60% player or a 40% player on his team. Under averaged matchmaking the 60% player will always be matched with the 40% player against another pair of 60% and 40% players.

 

The instinctive reaction to this is to claim that the "better" 60% player will win the game. This only applies mathematically, in reality WoWS is a team based game so it always depends on the actions of the 40% players as you need to use the rest of your team to play well and perform your role. If your 40% players randomly find themselves in the right position you will win, if the other guy's 40% players randomly find themselves in the right position he will win. Then there's the rock-paper-scissors-esque game mode (everyone shut up) where if it does somehow come down to a 1v1 between 60% players it's just a crapshoot on which is in the counter class to the other. A DD will usually beat a BB (caps, spotting), a radar cruiser will usually beat a DD and a BB will usually beat a radar cruiser. Even if they're in the same class an Akizuki will usually beat a Kagero, <some battleship> will usually beat <some battleship> etc. The ultimate effect of all these contextual considerations is that all win rates degenerate to 50% unless you dedicate yourself to playing a hard carry ship.

 

This is bad because I want to measure my progress and random variety in games is fun, some are really hard, some are really easy, either way it can be a pleasant surprise.

[little_rowboat]

Vor 8 Minuten, Caughtintherain sagte:

 

Doing this results in individual skill being cancelled out by having tougher games. Right now a 60% player has an equal chance of being matched with a 60% player or a 40% player on his team. Under averaged matchmaking the 60% player will always be matched with the 40% player against another pair of 60% and 40% players.

 

The instinctive reaction to this is to claim that the "better" 60% player will win the game. This only applies mathematically, in reality WoWS is a team based game so it always depends on the actions of the 40% players as you need to use the rest of your team to play well and perform your role. If your 40% players randomly find themselves in the right position you will win, if the other guy's 40% players randomly find themselves in the right position he will win. Then there's the rock-paper-scissors-esque game mode (everyone shut up) where if it does somehow come down to a 1v1 between 60% players it's just a crapshoot on which is in the counter class to the other. A DD will usually beat a BB (caps, spotting), a radar cruiser will usually beat a DD and a BB will usually beat a radar cruiser. Even if they're in the same class an Akizuki will usually beat a Kagero, <some battleship> will usually beat <some battleship> etc. The ultimate effect of all these contextual considerations is that all win rates degenerate to 50% unless you dedicate yourself to playing a hard carry ship.

 

This is bad because I want to measure my progress and random variety in games is fun, some are really hard, some are really easy, either way it can be a pleasant surprise.

It was only a simplified assumption how matchmaking might work actually and where to implement the step to even out radar parameter. Was neither a suggestion on how it should work nor a claim that MM works like this.

If you read it like that, my bad.

 

There is no doubt that 60% players are not like 60% players. Some do it solo, some do it mainly tier 1-5.. that's tought to even out.

The only thing I'd suggest is to even out radar if possible. The rest on MM is fine for me, because - like written before - it's nothing you can solve with matchmaking algorithms.

[Caughtintherain]

Just now, l_m_just_lucky said:

It was only a simplified assumption how matchmaking might work actually and where to implement the step to even out radar parameter. Was neither a suggestion on how it should work nor a claim that MM works like this.

If you read it like that, my bad.

 

There is no doubt that 60% players are not like 60% players. Some do it solo, some do it mainly tier 1-5.. that's tought to even out.

The only thing I'd suggest is to even out radar if possible. The rest on MM is fine for me, becuase like written before it's nothing you can solve with matchmaking algorithms.

 

When I'm playing DDs I enjoy the possibility of poaching all of the radars for my team and leaving the enemy with none, though I do accept that it's a flaw that is easy to fix. I'd be happy to see radar balanced MM.

[SmokyButtons]

9 minutes ago, El2aZeR said:

 

Even WG admits that they've ed up the economy amd made it far too forgiving. It's not elitist, it is objectively the best and only solution to the current issue.

 

 

No it doesn't. Because regardless actual player numbers don't change.

Yes you right the economy is f... up, but we differ on your view on how, 

and the definition of a elitist system, is a system that gives the playerbase there is ahead on skill an even bigger advance then allready have,  and making the gad even harder to close!

 

Furthermore  you offet and repeatedly expressed that you think, the lowere 50% skilled players should quit the game and delete their account !

If that's not elitist view, I don't know what is! 😑 

 

Yes you right there will the same amount of players,  but the way they are distributed will much better, effectively making it easier for the MM to do it's job, hence why it's a force multiplier 🤗

[El2aZeR]

9 minutes ago, SmokyButtons said:

and the definition of a elitist system, is a system that gives the playerbase there is ahead on skill an even bigger advance then allready have,  and making the gad even harder to close

 

Which a harsher economy wouldn't.

 

9 minutes ago, SmokyButtons said:

Furthermore  you offet and repeatedly expressed that you think, the lowere 50% skilled players should quit the game and delete their account !

 

No, I said the game is better off without players who would quit just because they can't constantly sabotage high tier matches.

 

10 minutes ago, SmokyButtons said:

Yes you right there will the same amount of players,  but the way they are distributed will much better, effectively making it easier for the MM to do it's job, hence why it's a force multiplier 🤗

 

No, because you're still dealing with a player shortage.

[SmokyButtons]

2 minutes ago, El2aZeR said:

 

Which a harsher economy wouldn't.

 

 

No, I said the game is better off without players who would quit just because they can't constantly sabotage high tier matches.

 

 

No, because you're still dealing with a player shortage.

Yarh but your definition of players "sabotaging" is the lower 50% 😁

 

No we are dealing with uneven distribution of players,  if more equal distributed, there would be more than enough players for doing a better MM!

Imo

[El2aZeR]

8 minutes ago, SmokyButtons said:

Yarh but your definition of players "sabotaging" is the lower 50% 😁

 

*citation needed*

 

9 minutes ago, SmokyButtons said:

No we are dealing with uneven distribution of players,  if more equal distributed, there would be more than enough players for doing a better MM!

Imo

 

In your own calculation if everyone played the same tier with a desirable class distribution etc. we would only get a pathetic 25 full matches for the whole region.

A bit of MM tweaking is not going to fix that.

[DFens_666]

11 minutes ago, SmokyButtons said:

Yes you right the economy is f... up, but we differ on your view on how, 

and the definition of a elitist system, is a system that gives the playerbase there is ahead on skill an even bigger advance then allready have,  and making the gad even harder to close!

 

Furthermore  you offet and repeatedly expressed that you think, the lowere 50% skilled players should quit the game and delete their account !

If that's not elitist view, I don't know what is! 😑 

 

Yes you right there will the same amount of players,  but the way they are distributed will much better, effectively making it easier for the MM to do it's job, hence why it's a force multiplier 🤗

 

I think the problem is (same as what @El2aZeR 's opinion is imo), that the game is too easy to play (maintain) especially on hightiers. You can get by simply by "drooling" over your keyboard by playing a premium ship, earning credits, XP and what not..

You can even see that in forums sometimes, when people complain that they dont get enough credits (even ignoring wins for that)

 

We really dont need those 40% TX players doing nothing but playing TX all day long, because they think its some kinda endgame content. If the economy would be harsher for them, they would get forced back to midtiers and, god forbid, actually learn to play properly.

[SmokyButtons]

8 minutes ago, DFens_666 said:

 

I think the problem is (same as what @El2aZeR 's opinion is imo), that the game is too easy to play (maintain) especially on hightiers. You can get by simply by "drooling" over your keyboard by playing a premium ship, earning credits, XP and what not..

You can even see that in forums sometimes, when people complain that they dont get enough credits (even ignoring wins for that)

 

We really dont need those 40% TX players doing nothing but playing TX all day long, because they think its some kinda endgame content. If the economy would be harsher for them, they would get forced back to midtiers and, god forbid, actually learn to play properly.

I do understand,  where you guys are comming from,  you are part of the elite players, and I assume you spend lots of hours each week playing the game!  But not everyone can do that or has the skill to do that! 

I just think the game should be for everyone,  that we should help the weaker players among us to get better and have fun!

You don't help anyone by beating them down,  it is just cruel, 

Are we not better than just seeing new and struggling players as something that has be punished?  😢

[SmokyButtons]

22 minutes ago, El2aZeR said:

 

*citation needed*

 

If I got your opinion wrong I am truly sorry 😶 

So you do not believe that the lower 50% is sabotaging the game?  

What are you opinions on the low skill and struggling players of wows? ☺🤔

[El2aZeR]

32 minutes ago, SmokyButtons said:

You don't help anyone by beating them down,  it is just cruel, 

 

No, it's not. The better you are, the better the rewards. However in high tiers even if you get a pretty good match you should at best break even. This does not discriminate against low skilled players.

So you either git gud or you spend time playing mid tiers and building up credits so you can play a few high tier matches. Either way problem solved.

 

26 minutes ago, SmokyButtons said:

What are you opinions on the low skill and struggling players of wows?

 

That they should be forced to git gud if they want to constantly play high tiers.