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StBg17

USS Helena Build.

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So I recently got Helena, and was wondering whats the best way to fit her out? I've looked for other forum posts about such a question but none seem to give much in the way of a straight forward answer.

 

Currently thinking for the Cmdr. Skills being:

 

1) Priority Target

2) Adrenalin Rush 

3) Superintendent or Demolition Expert   

4) Inertia Fuse for HE Shells

5) Commencement Expert

6) Advanced Fire Training

7) Preventative Maintenance 

 

Upgrade Modules being 

 

Slot 1: Main Armaments Modification 1

Slot 2: Damage Control System Modification 1 or Steering Gear Modification 1

Slot 3: Aiming Systems Modification 1 or AA Guns Modification 1

Slot 4: Damage Control Modification 2 or Steering Gears Modification 2  

 

Thoughts, Criticisms any pointers to utilise the Helena properly are appreciated.

Cheers. 

 

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not sure why you picked AFT? If you want to improve your AA, Manual tends to be the better choice these days - particularly considering Helena's Flak puffs arent all that impressive. Alternatively, you could also forego a third 4pt skill and Preventative Maintenance and take, say, another 3ptr of your choice (could be Superintendent/DE or even BFT if you still want an AA boost) plus Expert Marksman to improve turret rotation a bit.

Modules look solid.

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I'd take CE over AFT, otherwise nothing really stands out in a bad way.

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PT, AR, Demo/SI, IFHE, CE. In roughly that order. 

 

IFHE can be postponed if you stick Narai Queen to Operations only, though it helps her dispatching two BB you will encounter there.

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I use my Helena captain as well as for my Atlanta and I am fine with that:

Spoiler

1039058316_USN-7-HelenaAtlanta(19).thumb.jpg.d74192713fe944fcf0c25ca1c1e01e55.jpg

The Atlanta needs the AFT.

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2 minutes ago, principat121 said:

I use my Helena captain as well as for my Atlanta and I am fine with that:

  Hide contents

1039058316_USN-7-HelenaAtlanta(19).thumb.jpg.d74192713fe944fcf0c25ca1c1e01e55.jpg

The Atlanta needs the AFT.

That's Atlanta skipper taking his day off on Helena:cap_tea:

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I wonder why anyone never takes the  manual fire control for AA ?  According to Notser and LWM it makes a lot of difference in influencing both displayed and hidden AA stats.

 

Yet there is a lot of complaining AA is too weak....isn't that a logic consequence when you don't take the skills to make it better ? All stock values are not the best.....the ones you need you will have to improve.

 

Also...concealment...isn't that wildly overrated ? Yes you can slip back into concealment sooner using  the classic kiting tactics, but that is in matches with no CV spotting the entirety of the map regularly.

 

Concealment Expert  therefore has no value when aircraft are nearby and lighting you up, where manual fire control could have value. I am not under the impression 10 % better concealment works well on searching aircraft, they travel that 10 % in a few seconds anyway. It doesn't even save DD, only makes you need to come around at best.

 

So it comes down to how much CV matches do you see, and how often/long do these CV focus on you or are near enough to spot you ?

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PT-AR-DE-IFHE-CE-SE or BFT 

 

Last 2 points EM or whatever you wish

 

Counting 2 much on AA will end in tears. your main adversary wull be t8 cvs and they dont give a f for t7 aa

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54 minutes ago, Tyrendian89 said:

not sure why you picked AFT? If you want to improve your AA, Manual tends to be the better choice these days - particularly considering Helena's Flak puffs arent all that impressive. Alternatively, you could also forego a third 4pt skill and Preventative Maintenance and take, say, another 3ptr of your choice (could be Superintendent/DE or even BFT if you still want an AA boost) plus Expert Marksman to improve turret rotation a bit.

Modules look solid.

Was debating between AFT and Manual AA, most likely would change it to Manual AA, that or I'll forego both and PM and just go for SI or Demo which ever I don't go for first and EM like you said.

 

Guessing Aiming Systems over AA guns Mod?

May go Damage Con 1 and Steering 2 if that would work.

57 minutes ago, lafeel said:

I'd take CE over AFT, otherwise nothing really stands out in a bad way.

I'll most likely drop AFT and go for Manual AA or spec them points into other skills like in my reply to Tyrendian89 above :)

 

30 minutes ago, Panocek said:

PT, AR, Demo/SI, IFHE, CE. In roughly that order. 

 

IFHE can be postponed if you stick Narai Queen to Operations only, though it helps her dispatching two BB you will encounter there.

Exactly the way I was thinking. :)

 

30 minutes ago, principat121 said:

I use my Helena captain as well as for my Atlanta and I am fine with that:

  Hide contents

1039058316_USN-7-HelenaAtlanta(19).thumb.jpg.d74192713fe944fcf0c25ca1c1e01e55.jpg

The Atlanta needs the AFT.

Pretty much how I was going to build my Atlanta too. :) 

 

5 minutes ago, Beastofwar said:

wonder why anyone never takes the  manual fire control for AA ?  According to Notser and LWM it makes a lot of difference in influencing both displayed and hidden AA stats.

I always tend to put Manual AA over AFT for some reason here I seemed to have a brain fart, I would normally go Manual AA. 

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5 minutes ago, Beastofwar said:

I wonder why anyone never takes the  manual fire control for AA ?  According to Notser and LWM it makes a lot of difference in influencing both displayed and hidden AA stats.

 

Yet there is a lot of complaining AA is too weak....isn't that a logic consequence when you don't take the skills to make it better ? All stock values are not the best.....the ones you need you will have to improve.

 

Also...concealment...isn't that wildly overrated ? Yes you can slip back into concealment sooner with the classic kiting tactics, but that is in matches with no CV spotting the entirety of the map regularly.

 

Concealment Expert  therefore has no value when aircraft are nearby and lighting you up, where manual fire control will have value. I am not under the impression 10 % better concealment works well on searching aircraft, they travel that 10 % in a few seconds anyway.

 

So it comes down to how much CV matches do you see, and how often/long do these CV focus on you or are near enough to spot you ?

its just useful for ships that need concealment or so that you can get closer with some bb's that have good concealment fire yer gunz. And then go back undetected and then repeat (easier said than though and certain cituations might require you to actually keep firing).

 

obviously against cv's it's delying the inevitable but still can sort of useful in some situations.

 

it's still a useful skill though especially for dd's and squishy cruisers.

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6 minutes ago, Beastofwar said:

I wonder why anyone never takes the  manual fire control for AA ?  According to Notser and LWM it makes a lot of difference in influencing both displayed and hidden AA stats.

 

Yet there is a lot of complaining AA is too weak....isn't that a logic consequence when you don't take the skills to make it better ? All stock values are not the best.....the ones you need you will have to improve.

 

Also...concealment...isn't that wildly overrated ? Yes you can slip back into concealment sooner with the classic kiting tactics, but that is in matches with no CV spotting the entirety of the map regularly.

 

Concealment Expert  therefore has no value when aircraft are nearby and lighting you up, where manual fire control will have value. I am not under the impression 10 % better concealment works well on searching aircraft, they travel that 10 % in a few seconds anyway. It doesn't even save DD, only makes you need to come around at best.

 

So it comes down to how much CV matches do you see, and how often/long do these CV focus on you or are near enough to spot you ?

CE is somewhat useful when CVs are nearby, and hands down the best skill in the game in ALL other situations (barring some very rare and peculiar instances). That's why everyone takes it.

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19 minutes ago, Yedwy said:

PT-AR-DE-IFHE-CE-SE or BFT 

 

Last 2 points EM or whatever you wish

 

Counting 2 much on AA will end in tears. your main adversary wull be t8 cvs and they dont give a f for t7 aa

Fair Point, think I'll drop AFT/Manual AA and PM instead go for DE/SI and EM.

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A genuine question, because i do not know but only suspect : does target aquisistion system 1 not negate both concealment skill and concealment module effects ? ( the 20 % concealment )

 

It says :

 

-  spotting range 20 % ( wiki says : Surface Detectability Range: This is the range at which a ship will be detected by an enemy ship. A Line of Sight (LoS) is required between the spotting ship and the ship being spotted. A ship will not be spotted if there are no enemy ships within this range. ) I therefore take it it is not 20 % extra line of sight ( Useles as many BB can already see the whole map ) but 20 % earlier detection.....

 

- aqusition of torpedos + 20 % ( usefull for hunting DD )

 

- Assured detection range + 50 % ( i use this to feed my BB secondaries with smoke hiding DD, and to hunt DD with cruisers )

 

I take it you guys go for concealment modifiction 1 which gives you another 10 % = 20 % with skill. And ofcourse 5 % dispersion which might be the best feature of it. Which might do nothing with concealment if other players ( like me ) installed the other module.....

 

And yes i know T7 do not mount these modules...but for the ships after....

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14 minutes ago, StBg17 said:

Fair Point, think I'll drop AFT/Manual AA and PM instead go for DE/SI and EM.

I wouldn't pick SI unless you plan to use the captain for the higher tier ships (extra radar and heals), you tend to have enough fighters, hydro and DefAA to last you a match imo.

If that captain is meant to go on the Worchester in the end don't use EM (i don't really consider it too useful on any of the CLs but it's certainly an option), i'd recommend JAT instead if you plant to pick DE.

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3 minutes ago, Beastofwar said:

-  spotting range 20 % ( wiki says : Surface Detectability Range: This is the range at which a ship will be detected by an enemy ship. A Line of Sight (LoS) is required between the spotting ship and the ship being spotted. A ship will not be spotted if there are no enemy ships within this range. )

You misinterpreted that (the wiki is poorly worded in this regard).

The spotting range (not detectability range) referenced for the upgrade refers to you maximum viewing (i.e. render-) range

(think the length/size of your viewing cone on the minimap).

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8 minutes ago, Beastofwar said:

A genuine question, because i do not know but only suspect : does target aquisistion system 1 not negate both concealment skill and concealment module effects ? ( the 20 % concealment )

 

It says :

 

-  spotting range 20 % ( wiki says : Surface Detectability Range: This is the range at which a ship will be detected by an enemy ship. A Line of Sight (LoS) is required between the spotting ship and the ship being spotted. A ship will not be spotted if there are no enemy ships within this range. ) I therefore take it it is not 20 % extra line of sight ( Useles as many BB can already see the whole map ) but 20 % earlier detection.....

 

- aqusition of torpedos + 20 % ( usefull for hunting DD )

 

- Assured detection range + 50 % ( i use this to feed my BB secondaries with smoke hiding DD, and to hunt DD with cruisers )

 

I take it you guys go for concealment modifiction 1 which gives you another 10 % = 20 % with skill. And ofcourse 5 % dispersion which might be the best feature of it. Which might do nothing with concealment if other players ( like me ) installed the other module.....

 

And yes i know T7 do not mount these modules...but for the ships after....

 

1 minute ago, rnat said:

You misinterpreted that (the wiki is poorly worded in this regard).

The spotting range (not detectability range) referenced for the upgrade refers to you maximum viewing (i.e. render-) range

(think the length/size of your viewing cone on the minimap).

This.

 

Only case where you could possibly need extra drawing range is Shimakaze with 20km torps and you absolutely positively want to snipe people with them across the map:cap_tea:

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21 minutes ago, rnat said:

You misinterpreted that (the wiki is poorly worded in this regard).

The spotting range (not detectability range) referenced for the upgrade refers to you maximum viewing (i.e. render-) range

(think the length/size of your viewing cone on the minimap).

 

Damn...tested it in training room and you are absolutely right.

 

Now i am torn if the 50 % more assured detection range and 20 % earlier torpedo spotting ( hunting DD alone ) is worth trading closer supporting allied DD near caps ( you can be closer to the enemy ) for.

 

It is certainly more usefull flanking and kiting while burning down large ships or citadelling other cruisers.

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23 minutes ago, rnat said:

I wouldn't pick SI unless you plan to use the captain for the higher tier ships (extra radar and heals), you tend to have enough fighters, hydro and DefAA to last you a match imo.

If that captain is meant to go on the Worchester in the end don't use EM (i don't really consider it too useful on any of the CLs but it's certainly an option), i'd recommend JAT instead if you plant to pick DE.

Nah this is going to be Helena's Captain won't go on any other ship. What do you recommend over SI as I will be getting Demo Expert, if I go with JoAT I would be left with 1 point I guess I could spec that into PM.

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5 minutes ago, StBg17 said:

Nah this is going to be Helena's Captain won't go on any other ship. What do you recommend over SI as I will be getting Demo Expert, if I go with JoAT I would be left with 1 point I guess I could spec that into PM.

havent played the Helena myself, so no idea how much that thing loses its turrets...

Incoming Fire Alert has always been a skill that's completely down to player preference - some swear by it, some dont value it at all... might be another option for that leftover point? Expert Loader isnt terribly good on a mostly longer-range light cruiser most of the time, but can come in veeeeery handy every now and then...

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2 minutes ago, StBg17 said:

Nah this is going to be Helena's Captain won't go on any other ship. What do you recommend over SI as I will be getting Demo Expert, if I go with JoAT I would be left with 1 point I guess I could spec that into PM.

I'd say either PM or direction center, depending on your preferences and how often CVs want to eat you.

EL is another option if you find yourself ambushing cruisers or farming broadside BBs at under 12km frequently.

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7 minutes ago, Tyrendian89 said:

havent played the Helena myself, so no idea how much that thing loses its turrets...

Incoming Fire Alert has always been a skill that's completely down to player preference - some swear by it, some dont value it at all... might be another option for that leftover point? Expert Loader isnt terribly good on a mostly longer-range light cruiser most of the time, but can come in veeeeery handy every now and then...

 

Helena does have a fighter.....you can assured kill +1 more attacking aircraft ( killing 4 aircraft in a squadron ) spending 1 point, making killing the rest easier for your ships AA.

 

But i guess that is worth it only if you are actually sunk by aircraft a lot, or want to screen other ships with AA with it.

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5 minutes ago, Tyrendian89 said:

havent played the Helena myself, so no idea how much that thing loses its turrets...

Incoming Fire Alert has always been a skill that's completely down to player preference - some swear by it, some dont value it at all... might be another option for that leftover point? Expert Loader isnt terribly good on a mostly longer-range light cruiser most of the time, but can come in veeeeery handy every now and then...

True about EL,, I'll have plenty of time to find out if I go PM or Incoming Fire Alert as the Commander is not yet Level 19.

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1 minute ago, Beastofwar said:

Helena does have a fighter.....you can assured kill +1 more attacking aircraft ( killing 4 aircraft in a squadron ) spending 1 point.

 

But i guess that is worth it only if you are actually sunk by aircraft a lot.

That is another option personally I found the Dallas fighter came in handy a lot and was up most games I played in her, so having more in the air at once would most likely be pretty useful.

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8 minutes ago, rnat said:

I'd say either PM or direction center, depending on your preferences and how often CVs want to eat you.

EL is another option if you find yourself ambushing cruisers or farming broadside BBs at under 12km frequently.

I found, T6 at least left me alone after they lost most of their squadrons, that being said an extra fighter going up I could see as being pretty useful, I can see PM probably being more useful to me than EL, although I did find myself switching ammo a lot in Dallas between different targets, I'll have plenty of time to work that one out as the Commander isn't 19 points yet.

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Did you fiddle around with this yet ( Wargaming tool ) https://worldofwarships.com/en/content/captains-skills/?skills=&ship=Cruiser

 

Not that it matter if you can't decide, but it can save you retraining costs not taking something you will have too few points for higher up in the skill tree.

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