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Bartleby74

Tier X, all enemies stick together, I have a Cv. What do I do?

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So it's your typical Tier X match, all enemies are sticking together and have their AAA set to "disintegrate anything looking in their direction". Nobody is gonna straggle alone, lone heros are in another match and so you're down to three simple choices for 20 minutes:

 

a) feed squadron upon squadron to the disintegrators. Not funny.

b) attack the edge of the disintegrators so maybe you score a hit and then lose the rest of the squadron. Not funny.

c) ask the community and WG what are you supposed to do as a CV when enemy lemmingtrains camps clusterfucks sticks together and AA kills all your planes for little or no gain, which isn't funny and as far as I know can't be avoided in any way

 

Any other options? Am I doing something wong other than invest on CVs?

 

Edit: yes, there are options. THX to commanders El2aZeR and Cagliostro_chan for enlightening the unknowledgeable. :cap_like:

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I'd like some tips for meh lexi as well on what to do in mostly tier 10 game. Or even when the team blobs into a massive lemming train and leaves and entire flank (or map side exposed). and what i should focus on the most.

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Spot and wait till enenmy dies to cross fire or starts to spilt up to awoid cross fire and kill stragelers,

that is what i try to do :fish_boom:

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4) Ask WG to fix CVs, so other ships dont need to form mega-blobs in order to have any chance to deny CV drops. :fish_book:

RTS CVs, there was no blob meta. People werent bothered by CVs that much (probably because they only were around once every 10 matches or so), but the rework is "forcing" more and more people into playing CVs, thus making it worse and worse for surface ship players.

Its like crap-domino, which keeps getting worse  :cap_fainting:

 

If the only option is "teamplay" then people will play like that. Blame CVs for that :cat_paw:

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Shorten your squad then slingshot.

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8 minutes ago, Bartleby74 said:

So it's your typical Tier X match, all enemies are sticking together and have their AAA set to "disintegrate anything looking in their direction". Nobody is gonna straggle alone, lone heros are in another match and so you're down to three simple choices for 20 minutes:

 

a) feed squadron upon squadron to the disintegrators. Not funny.

b) attack the edge of the disintegrators so maybe you score a hit and then lose the rest of the squadron. Not funny.

c) ask the community and WG what are you supposed to do as a CV when enemy lemmingtrains camps clusterfucks sticks together and AA kills all your planes for little or no gain, which isn't funny and as far as I know can't be avoided in any way

 

Any other options? Am I doing something wong other than invest on CVs?

5

Well, I do not know, all I know is that it is not a fun to play like this for surface ships as well.  But it is often the only counter to CVs. Rework is bad in this way.

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2 minutes ago, DariusJacek said:

Well, I do not know, all I know is that it is not a fun to play like this for surface ships as well.  But it is often the only counter to CVs. Rework is bad in this way.

I too think isn't really fun when you find the straggler or lone hero and dump all hell's fire on him. Yet on those rare occasions I just think of all the times Tier X AAA has wiped out my squadrons and wish I could nuke the guy.

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8 minutes ago, El2aZeR said:

Shorten your squad then slingshot.

What and what? What is "shorten squad?" What is "slingshot"?

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1 minute ago, Bartleby74 said:

What and what? What is "shorten squad?" What is "slingshot"?

Shorten the squad is dropping ordnance in the water (while watching out not to hit allies, so into islands is good). This reduces the amount of runs, but if you planned to only do 1-2 runs before AA would have chewed up whatever planes are left, no reason to bring more attack waves.

 

Slingshot is this:

 

Mind you, this works with dive bombers. Torp bombers you just torp a ship at the edges of the blob, because unless you have insane aim time, this wouldn't ever work with TBs.

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We had a T10 game, i was T9 i think. Our T8 carrier came top with about 500 more points than any of us. It's obviously possible. No idea what he did, I was concentrated on trying to use sonar/radar to flush out and kill dd's! But it was a "woah, nice play - have a +1" moment. 

 

Other than short squad (1st drop as soon as you can after leaving carrier - see Yuro's vid) and slingshot tactics - also as ships get hit by HE they often lose their AA. As the game progresses they get weaker (and their numbers less), so if you've still got planes then you'll be more effective longer it goes on. Meaning don't throw all planes in at start - play a longer game, if it lasts to 10 mins you may well be able to start picking stuff off. 

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34 minutes ago, El2aZeR said:

Shorten your squad then slingshot.

pretty much what i tried today for avg 40-80k games, untill the game disintregrated into a messy skirmish.

 

Unfortunately i still suck with USN BDs and always trigger the attack too early.

 

Also, using islands to mask your approach for AA can work.

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47 minutes ago, Bartleby74 said:

So it's your typical Tier X match, all enemies are sticking together and have their AAA set to "disintegrate anything looking in their direction". Nobody is gonna straggle alone, lone heros are in another match and so you're down to three simple choices for 20 minutes:

 

a) feed squadron upon squadron to the disintegrators. Not funny.

b) attack the edge of the disintegrators so maybe you score a hit and then lose the rest of the squadron. Not funny.

c) ask the community and WG what are you supposed to do as a CV when enemy lemmingtrains camps clusterfucks sticks together and AA kills all your planes for little or no gain, which isn't funny and as far as I know can't be avoided in any way

 

Any other options? Am I doing something wong other than invest on CVs?

d) play spotter and farm spotting damage, eventually someone somewhere will get bored and go for solo yolo adventure

 

28 minutes ago, Bartleby74 said:

What and what? What is "shorten squad?" What is "slingshot"?

Shorten - drop one/two attacks into water, so if you give pilots one way ticket, only 3/6 get it instead entire squadron. Then there is accelerated return - after dropping payload planes get temporary invulnerability AND speed boost. If you F within that period, planes will climb and then return to CV with accelerated speed.

 

Slingshot is what Yuro visualized, tricky to pull off, mostly against stationary targets. But it works.

 

1 minute ago, GulvkluderGuld said:

pretty much what i tried today for avg 40-80k games, untill the game disintregrated into a messy skirmish.

 

Unfortunately i still suck with USN BDs and always trigger the attack too early.

 

Also, using islands to mask your approach for AA can work.

Other way around - attack from the open water, drop and gtfo over cruiser's waifu. Works best with TB as they fly relatively at low altitude. Especially if you enter attack run again for dmg reduction

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7 minutes ago, Panocek said:

Other way around - attack from the open water, drop and gtfo over cruiser's waifu. Works best with TB as they fly relatively at low altitude. Especially if you enter attack run again for dmg reduction

Obviously I'm still new here :Smile_child:

 

I usually only used the last set of planes, often slingshotted into range, so after the drop I just hit F. Does that make sense?

Alternatively your method, but then i imagine I'd slingshot across to ~3-4 km range before using the last set to drop....Do you generally ever not return with F after such a drop?

(i know the cruisers waifu helps the planes reach return height faster, so it is still better).

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5 minutes ago, GulvkluderGuld said:

Obviously I'm still new here :Smile_child:

 

I usually only used the last set of planes, often slingshotted into range, so after the drop I just hit F. Does that make sense?

Alternatively your method, but then i imagine I'd slingshot across to ~3-4 km range before using the last set to drop....Do you generally ever not return with F after such a drop? (i know the cruisers waifu helps the planes reach return height faster, so it is still better).

Sort of makes sense, unless target have considerable short range AA and/or have assistance of other AA powerhouse.

 

Island have to be quite tall to cover DB escape, so it sort of excludes as cruiser's waifu

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52 minutes ago, Cagliostro_chan said:

Shorten the squad is dropping ordnance in the water (while watching out not to hit allies, so into islands is good). This reduces the amount of runs, but if you planned to only do 1-2 runs before AA would have chewed up whatever planes are left, no reason to bring more attack waves.

 

Slingshot is this:

 

Mind you, this works with dive bombers. Torp bombers you just torp a ship at the edges of the blob, because unless you have insane aim time, this wouldn't ever work with TBs.

 

This only works with ijn cv's right? im sure the other planes are too slow? unless im wrong, i havent seen a vid using USN planes yet.

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8 minutes ago, CptBarney said:

 

This only works with ijn cv's right? im sure the other planes are too slow? unless im wrong, i havent seen a vid using USN planes yet.

Works with dive bombers, as they all combine speed boost and short distance from plane to crosshair. Might need some practice though.

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2 hours ago, Panocek said:

Works with dive bombers, as they all combine speed boost and short distance from plane to crosshair. Might need some practice though.

torp bombers don't have immunity zone?

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2 hours ago, CptBarney said:

 

This only works with ijn cv's right? im sure the other planes are too slow? unless im wrong, i havent seen a vid using USN planes yet.

It also works with the Midway, just the slingshot distance is shorter (maybe 7 km?). Anyway I've tested both shortening and slingshoting and WOW, what a difference! Dropping ammo on the sea is far cheaper than losing squadrons (until Greenpeace finds out that we're bombing fishes), so at least now I am on the path to staying in the blacks unless my team losses in 10 minutes... Yet that's just how Tier X has become now; the Peter principle of WoWs states that all idiots climb up to Tier X and stay there forever, so the amount of incompetence at Tier X increases over time.

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40 minutes ago, elblancogringo said:

torp bombers don't have immunity zone?

 

All plane types do but it's very short with TBs and RFs. So much so that it is not worth using.

Immunity time in DBs on the other hand can be manually stretched out as the longer the bombs fall, the more immunity time you get.

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1 hour ago, elblancogringo said:

torp bombers don't have immunity zone?

They do have. But they also have aiming time long enough so you would want to start attack run at the edge of AA anyway, so nothing to be gained from slingshot

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current meta don't leave room to maneuver and very few ships can sail alone anymore (not really but hey some players are really-really good) so while I understand what you're saying (i hate lemmings) when I play bbs (which I slowly started not to) I tend to kinda stay with the pack. It is either that or die fast. Tbh I don't play most of my ships and frequent lower tiers as it is just not worth the stress just to get a good game once in a while. Factor in atrocious mm, 'fixed' slaughter games pitting gurus vs noobers, OP testers sailing beasts vs normal lads, new cv captains against Sun Tzu aficionados and you have it. Difficult to find a good relaxed game to have fun. Still game is still enjoyable and you can do well especially in a cv, I mean I think it is a class that can be very forgiving at higher tiers (to a degree) or they keep it civil as they rarely cry bloody murder in my randoms :) It's usually all the other little fellas getting the shaft repeatedly.     

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@OP nothing, answer is nothing, you can mitigate losses with "predrops" and "slamdunks" but if they really pull through with aa packs through the entire match you can do little especially with a t8 cv and if your speshul surface allies dont find the minos, the woosters and the desmos worth shooting at and dont soften the bbs with some heavy he, what ever you do you will eventually lose planes and end up with crappy damage in that fight its just how aa works, only thing is in most fights sooner or later one enemy makes a mistake and then you have his :etc_swear:

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2 minutes ago, NoobySkooby said:

Nah your missing the point dude, imagine your delight when you spot the CV and you and your team all go wolfpack on him, sheer orgasmic delight, lol

 

Imagine you see the CV, try to kill him, and 99% of the time the game ends because points are full or time is up :cap_tea:

Happens literally everytime, thats why CVs basicly dont die unless they [edited]up themselves.

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3 minutes ago, DFens_666 said:

 

Imagine you see the CV, try to kill him, and 99% of the time the game ends because points are full or time is up :cap_tea:

Happens literally everytime, thats why CVs basicly dont die unless they [edited]up themselves.

I have to disagree with that, when it comes to CV tactics, does one sit right at the back and not move, or does one go full auto pilot and try to follow the battle, I have tried both and often die, sometimes I even get chased around the map by the reds, makes me feel a bit like a fox, lol

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2 minutes ago, NoobySkooby said:

I have to disagree with that, when it comes to CV tactics, does one sit right at the back and not move, or does one go full auto pilot and try to follow the battle, I have tried both and often die, sometimes I even get chased around the map by the reds, makes me feel a bit like a fox, lol

 

I dunno... most of the battles ive played lately (with CVs in it ofc) even when winning the enemy CV survived basicly every time. Only if he made a mistake by not running away / hide in time, he died. Couple of days ago, on sleeping giant, all enemy BBs went to A. So we told our team, just push through C. Voila, enemy CV was infront of us, because he didnt go towards A in time.

Enemies even had the guts to tell us, to report their CV... i told them, you abandoned him by going A collectively, so its their fault - not the fault of the CV so much.

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