Yamato Dispersion same as before?

[Aschwell]

Hello guys,

 

I want to know if it´s only me or if more players are experiencing the same thing with the guns of Yamato. I have also had similar issues in my Missouri but the worst by far has been the Yamato.

 

I made a small video of trying to prove what I mean. I have had tons more games with the same experience but it would be enough with one video since believe it or not takes a alot of time making.

 

So what am I on about. Whenever I sail at further ranges and shot with all 3 guns or even the frontal guns the dispersion is always good. As soon as I get Close and this is mostly shooting with the front guns the dispersion get´s horrendous, 10km and closer. Trust me I have made sure that I have been locked on to the targets I shoot since I first thought the problem was with the lock on mechanic.

But either way I do it, it´s really crap 9/10 times.

Please take a look at this and let us all know if you have been having the same experience. Because for me this is not the old Yamato I have been used to.
 

 

[kingzy2013]

i must admit i have certainly experienced some wtf disperision at close range in the yama while bow tanking. i personally think its because the 2 sets of guns shells dont "meet" until a further range. i think at around 15-18km is where i find my best accuracy. where the shells start to meet into a pretty tight group.

 

it likely just comes down to the fact the ships dispersion is built for long range fights. when at close range the shells dont get chance to get to there optimal distance to group. 

 

but yama shells feel very "floaty" even at 10km tbh lol. 

[Aschwell]

1 minute ago, kingzy2013 said:

i must admit i have certainly experienced some wtf disperision at close range in the yama while bow tanking. i personally think its because the 2 sets of guns shells dont "meet" until a further range. i think at around 15-18km is where i find my best accuracy. where the shells start to meet into a pretty tight group.

 

it likely just comes down to the fact the ships dispersion is built for long range fights. when at close range the shells dont get chance to get to there optimal distance to group. 

 

but yama shells feel very "floaty" even at 10km tbh lol. 

Yeah but I never had this experience from some months ago, only in recent time. That´s what I feel is very weird.

[kingzy2013]

19 minutes ago, Aschwell said:

Yeah but I never had this experience from some months ago, only in recent time. That´s what I feel is very weird.

personally i have always had iffy dispersion at close range with it. the horizontal dispersion spreads quite a lot so at close range i suppose you do get more shells fly to the left and right while 1-2 hit the center. 

[kingzy2013]

3 hours ago, ghostbuster_ said:

 i do exrerience the same below 10 km. 15+ km i get god tier dispercion but below 10 km its even worse than GK. Edited

i agree with this. around 15km > 20km you get some amazing tight groupings. even at close range, a broadside targets easy to blap. but if someone bows on at you, i struggle to land more than 1-2 shells :) the other's just go to the left and the right. but... i suppose for a long range ship, what do we expect. 

[Aschwell]

This is Before patch…… Since I clearly mention (I experienced the guns to behave like this in recent months).

 

[Animalul2012]

It is the RNG for you! 

[ironhammer500]

Try the Iowa, feels like a Shotgun  at 5-10km, Is that not the range which wargaming told us battleships should be fighting? Also my Yama sometimes feels like it when facing a Bow target.

[Sambor0]

I just play Yamato and with legendary module is really bad. Dispersion is kind of joke?

[Excavatus]

This topic had almost three pages and look at how much left after the clean up.

It is a nice topic to discuss but please leave personal attacks and individual discussions out of it.

The only thing can come out of it is moderation.. both for users and the topic.

 

Have a great day.

[Marducas91]

Yama dispersion as far as I know has always been like this 

Yeah it has 2.1 sigma but even with the legendary module when ù are at really cose ranges the dispersion elipsis sends the shells everywhere  

 

[Aschwell]

5 minutes ago, Marducas91 said:

Yama dispersion as far as I know has always been like this 

Yeah it has 2.1 sigma but even with the legendary module when ù are at really cose ranges the dispersion elipsis sends the shells everywhere  

 

That´s my case, if you cannot trust a ship and if we want to Think (The closer you get the less of a bad dispersion you should get technically) would make sense right?

Then this will incentive players to play the ships from more afar because thats how they would get better rewarded. Then we go into the territory where most of the playerbase complain about sniping and camping BB players.

This outcome of the dispersion is really not helping the game imo. 

[Marducas91]

@Ashwell yeah you have a point here 

Yama has always been about positioning but imho being one of the first t10 introduced it has been a bit powercrept (hell even the monty has received some "love")

Once u were a nose in fortress but than ifhe spammer came in, AP bombers and so on. Do not get me wrong the ship is still a beast that lolpens everyrhing but if u missposition yourself or u get into brawling distances those guns are not reliable 

[Aschwell]

@Marducas91 Well at least I am not the only one feeling this way.

[piet11111]

I have been having the same issue with Yamato and Mushashi where the 2 front guns derp incredibly hard when up close.

[NothingButTheRain]

On 4/27/2019 at 5:06 PM, ironhammer500 said:

Try the Iowa, feels like a Shotgun  at 5-10km, Is that not the range which wargaming told us battleships should be fighting? Also my Yama sometimes feels like it when facing a Bow target.

I was going to mention Iowa. I have the same issues with Iowa at close range. I even manage to fail citadelling a bot Iowa sailing broadside to me at a whopping 4 (yes four!!!!) km. There's something up, but it hadn't occured to me that it was when using only the front guns.

 

I did make a topic about this dispersion a couple months ago I think? I even had went to training room and showed screenshots of weird dispersion (even some that was close or beyond the theoretical maximum dispersion) but dunno where that topic is right now.

 

I could go into training room with another bunch of tests as now I have a little bit more to go on.

[NothingButTheRain]

15 hours ago, Aschwell said:

@Marducas91 Well at least I am not the only one feeling this way.

There have been complaints about the weird disperion regularly from time to time, but it has always been brushed aside as "just typical BB dispersion" and "RNG", but I've always felt something odd was going on here, but I just could not lay my finger on it as it seemed to irratic to actually test it out and get more reliable (and reproducable!!!) data.

 

EDIT

 

I did find the screenshots I made back then. Here it is. The extrapolated dispersion was so I could compare it to the ones given in for instance the port interface (which mentions dispersion at max range).

Spoiler

Now that I'm curious, I'll go into training room and see if using only front turrets or all will result in different dispersion and report back after I finished testing. Lets just see what happens 

[NothingButTheRain]

On 4/27/2019 at 1:04 PM, Aschwell said:

Hello guys,

 

I want to know if it´s only me or if more players are experiencing the same thing with the guns of Yamato. I have also had similar issues in my Missouri but the worst by far has been the Yamato.

 

I made a small video of trying to prove what I mean. I have had tons more games with the same experience but it would be enough with one video since believe it or not takes a alot of time making.

 

So what am I on about. Whenever I sail at further ranges and shot with all 3 guns or even the frontal guns the dispersion is always good. As soon as I get Close and this is mostly shooting with the front guns the dispersion get´s horrendous, 10km and closer. Trust me I have made sure that I have been locked on to the targets I shoot since I first thought the problem was with the lock on mechanic.

But either way I do it, it´s really crap 9/10 times.

Please take a look at this and let us all know if you have been having the same experience. Because for me this is not the old Yamato I have been used to.
 

 

The second failed dispersion shot, you have any idea why the Repu was shooting at you while you had no enemies locked onto you?

Because if this is a real bug and it's hard to pin down, it will have a higher probability of being a bug which affect only happens in certain circumstances that will be difficult to test if not aware of this (like your dispersion being worse if an enemy that is targetting you has the lockon bug, which I'd reckon won't happen in training room with bots).

 

It's the only thing I can think of right now and which is harder to test in training room when not aware of this, but might be worth a test.

 

I can't seem to get the disperion to get as wonky as in the game I made my screenshotcollection picture. Not in the trainingroom at least with bots that just hold position and don't fire back.

[Aschwell]

@NothingButTheRain In the video I actually locked on and off 2-3x times to really make sure that I was locked on. Trust wont let that fool me.

 

I would just recommend everyone who is unsure to go into test this all turrets vs only front turrets on mostly bow on targets either in randoms or training room to see how it goes! 

[NothingButTheRain]

3 minutes ago, Aschwell said:

@NothingButTheRain In the video I actually locked on and off 2-3x times to really make sure that I was locked on. Trust wont let that fool me.

 

I would just recommend everyone who is unsure to go into test this all turrets vs only front turrets on mostly bow on targets either in randoms or training room to see how it goes! 

I thought you were the one in the Yamato?

If so, then you don't understand.

Perhaps this disperson bug happens when the enemy that is shooting you, is having the lock on bug when trying to shoot you and this causes YOUR dispersion to get wonky. The moment the Repu shot you, you didn't have a single ship locked onto you.

I'm saying this because in training room I was not able to reproduce this (and yes I tried like half an hour ago).

[Sir_Grzegorz]

I was convinced it was always like that, below 10km you have shotgun.

That is why you do not want to brawl, as it is not possible to hit anything.

Just stay 12-15 km from enemy and delete them.

If we would like some nonproven teories I have a feeling that LM is giving much more than what is stated in stats.

[Aschwell]

3 hours ago, NothingButTheRain said:

I thought you were the one in the Yamato?

If so, then you don't understand.

Perhaps this disperson bug happens when the enemy that is shooting you, is having the lock on bug when trying to shoot you and this causes YOUR dispersion to get wonky. The moment the Repu shot you, you didn't have a single ship locked onto you.

I'm saying this because in training room I was not able to reproduce this (and yes I tried like half an hour ago).

Yes I was the one in the vid of course. 

Well that sounds really weird tbh. I´m not gonna dismiss it but it sure does sound far fetched. That your dispersion is dependent on the enemies locking onto you.
I don´t think that is the case.

I just think the game/mechanic/coding has serious issues when trying to mostly shoot bow on targets for whatever reason. But more players also seemed to experience this on broadside targets so.

[NothingButTheRain]

2 hours ago, Aschwell said:

Yes I was the one in the vid of course. 

Well that sounds really weird tbh. I´m not gonna dismiss it but it sure does sound far fetched. That your dispersion is dependent on the enemies locking onto you.
I don´t think that is the case.

I just think the game/mechanic/coding has serious issues when trying to mostly shoot bow on targets for whatever reason. But more players also seemed to experience this on broadside targets so.

It's not as farfetched as you might think. And it could explain (IF this is the case) why it hasn't been consistently reproducable yet.

I mean, go take your Yamato into a trainingroom and try to reproduce your weird dispersion pattern yourself, with bots that don't move and don't shoot back. If you get the normal dispersion and not the weird dispersion in 100% of your attempts, then the weird dispersion must come from some other cause.

I haven't been able to reproduce your dispersion pattern yet in a consistent way, which indicates that your hypothesis cannot be the whole story behind this dispersion 'problem'.

 

I agree with you that there may be some weird dispersion problem at hand. The last halloween had something that appears similar. There was a skill involved which bugged and caused a huuuge dispersion penalty caused by locking onto one of the bosses. But this extreme dispersion would disappear when shooting at the same bosses under the same circumstances when the lockon was manually disabled (pressing 'X' and aiming manually).

This was a clear case of the dispersion being affected negatively by the lockon and it was consistent. This dispersion bug has not been consistent yet.

 

As long as it's not reproducable yet in a consistent way, it means that the cause has not been fully disclosed and alternatives will need to be figured out. It's not the first time buggy code caused a problem with game mechanics or other problems with the client. Another example was this memory leak bug which was very hard to track down for WG, but I'm sure there were other bugs.

[Aschwell]

Yeah I will need to test it out in training room with no moving bots thanks :)

[NothingButTheRain]

45 minutes ago, Aschwell said:

Yeah I will need to test it out in training room with no moving bots thanks :)

Yw :)

 

Btw, I'm running some tests right now (while doing house chores in the mean time) and after having used 'C' to focus on the front turrets while shooting at a near target sideways (I didn't include the aft turret, merely shot it empty inbetween tests), it appears to me that the dispersion is the same as when shooting the front turrets towards a target at the same range towards the front.

It does seem different when not changing camera focus using 'C', but when viewing the dispersion from the front turrets, it seems that the dispersion from Yamato front turrets is the same regardless of the direction of fire.

 

My tests were not very extensive, spend only 25 minutes trying out different stuff I could think of. Dispersion at close range seems pretty bad btw, as if it's significantly worse compared to shooting at much more distant targets.