XVM... for WoWs?

[ammattimies]

 

Well if you wanted to look like someone level headed with a good argument regarding XVM then i believe you just killed your chances pretty much.

Your combo breaker mumbo jumbo and your whole atitude towards other people is the exact Illustration why we dont need more people like you.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Oh I see, you want to start deciding who can play the game and use the forums now? Well isn't that just a swell idea. How about you use XVM or don't, up to you, but leave others alone. It's a good idea not having to have  two displays with the other one to look for player stats while playing

[mtm78]

 

Well if you wanted to look like someone level headed with a good argument regarding XVM then i believe you just killed your chances pretty much.

Your combo breaker mumbo jumbo and your whole atitude towards other people is the exact Illustration why we dont need more people like you.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

You must be either blind, dumb or stupid. Or just purposely trying to troll, but I don't think you are ( from other subjects I know you're not into that disruptive behavior ).

 

But a: you state HellSpunk accused someone of being bad and blame him for doing so, when he clearly showed you by quote that is was not an assumption but something the other guy said about himself. And b: you actually haven't countered the fact that a-holes will be a-holes no matter if they can abuse a tool like XVM to be 'better' a-holes. I use nails and a hammer to hang stuff on my wall, I can also kill my neighbor with a hammer. Should we petition to ban hammers from hardware stores?

hmmm im back, jus to say, that how really cares no1 so lets end this crap as clearly what will be will be,   

 

also hellspunk,  i did take it back what i said prion, as to not ban mods or xvm maybe if u read the whore post instead of just what you want to see like mtm does,  

 

but anyways like a said b4 who really gives a fiddle about any of this, lol   this topic has gone off topic from the original topic post by cattro, 

 

any how dont let me stop you from carrying on,  as i also said b4 no matter what mods are allowed or not allowed were all screwed as we clearly see here 

some like xvm some dont like xvm,   end of, next subject / topic   bye bye to this topic  as its only now trolled 

 

[Ast3lan]

 

You must be either blind, dumb or stupid. Or just purposely trying to troll, but I don't think you are ( from other subjects I know you're not into that disruptive behavior ).

 

But a: you state HellSpunk accused someone of being bad and blame him for doing so, when he clearly showed you by quote that is was not an assumption but something the other guy said about himself. And b: you actually haven't countered the fact that a-holes will be a-holes no matter if they can abuse a tool like XVM to be 'better' a-holes. I use nails and a hammer to hang stuff on my wall, I can also kill my neighbor with a hammer. Should we petition to ban hammers from hardware stores?

 

 

Well for starters i was writting from my phone, wich can be midly challenging with this forum layout, so now that i have the time let me elaborate.

 

My point with hellwhatever was he defends, or seemed to defend, people that use XVM just because while player A said it was a nice fight the feeling got ruined by a remark from player B. Now im ignoring the fact that player A considers himself bad, terribad whatever, i dont know that for a fact neither does hell, neither does anyone at this moment because we are in a beta, so unless player A says he plays that way and thats his very best ( this all confirmed by stats ) then i could somewhat agree that he's a bad player that got beaten.

 

Still that leaves one or two pending questions, one is the fact that just because one player is bad there is absolutely no reason to make such remarks in chat or , unintendedly or not, to start labeling people based on XVM or other mod, i believe we can all agree on that, for one its nice to have stats but on the other side when the mod starts being used here the way it is in WoT then i believe the purpose of the mod is surpassed from being a statistics and somewhat pre game analisys prognosis based on the quality of your team measured against the quality of the enemy team to a im purple ur ready hurr durr quit game, or the usual insults that we all know from WoT and assorted MoBa / Multiplayer games.

 

The reason im saying this to hellspunk is because he might actually not be one of those said players that rip their shirts off , climb the Empire State and start screaming at the red points floating around him , but, he's starting to sound like one of those said people, plus the fact that by disagreeing with him he gives you - rep or comes with combo breaker saving face arguements is subpar to the kind of player he wants to be.

 

If he told me, XVM is good because,

 

- reason A

- reason B

- reason C

 

instead of the usual, " Good players want to improve, bad players dont " , or "i respect the fact that you admit you are a bad player blabla..."

 

 

, then i would say, ok perhaps you are right and seem from that perspective ( reason A, etc ) it might be usefull, but he did not , so , for me he's starting to sound like someone on a holy crusade to bring something into the game just for the sake of it when there are people already saying no to it for one very good reason in my eyes, and that is keeping the comunity friendly as it has been or when there are perhaps better mods that could be put into this game.

 

Its very subjective , at least for me at this point to start saying people with , this this and that are good and so on and the rest are normal , mediocre or noobs, plus the fact that when talking to people be it here or ingame or skype i meen, its somewhat of a stranger and people should pick their words carefully now and then, wether Hellspunk understands it or not he really gave credit indirectly to the B guy wich as good a player as he could be i still wouldnt want to have such an player like that on my team just because of the bad atmosphere these kind of people bring into the game.

 

Thats my point of view on the whole matter.

[delaci76]

 

Well if you wanted to look like someone level headed with a good argument regarding XVM then i believe you just killed your chances pretty much.

Your combo breaker mumbo jumbo and your whole atitude towards other people is the exact Illustration why we dont need more people like you.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Yep. Tbh you are better off ignoring two users here.

 

Most likely kids who think are "cool", "uber" at what is a very basic game to play (in terms of skill/strategy). Doesnt mean though you dont need some ability which actually forces me not to play WOT as much just because the complete and utter lack of brainpower leaves you pulling your hair out sometimes.

 

The game is frustrating enough most of the time it doesnt need the "RED TOMATOES" right at the start, really pisses you off not because you are bad player or that you really care but it ruins the atmosphere in game and who wants to know that he most likely gonna lose a third game in a row due to incompetent teammates? I dont for one. (and yes you can be a good player and lose several in a row, depends on the tank/luck/teammates etc etc...loads of variables).

 

Turning off chat would be great but then sometimes you do need it.

 

[conductiv]

I hope it never gets here, why because XVM seems to ruin more things that it improves.

 

namecalling when your stats are low, people suiciding when the chances are poor, people targeting you when your stats are high, people over-depending on others that have better stats. stat whoring (once they figure out the mechanics about what raises the fictional stat most).

 

now it is supposed to be a tool to tell you how well you are doing, you can do that just fine with the stats provided by WG at the moment. maybe compare it to a friends list of such..but any more then that and we are going to have some massive E-peen d*ck waving around with all the added problems that entails. 

[mtm78]

 

Well for starters i was writting from my phone, wich can be midly challenging with this forum layout, so now that i have the time let me elaborate.

 

My point with hellwhatever was he defends, or seemed to defend, people that use XVM just because while player A said it was a nice fight the feeling got ruined by a remark from player B. Now im ignoring the fact that player A considers himself bad, terribad whatever, i dont know that for a fact neither does hell, neither does anyone at this moment because we are in a beta, so unless player A says he plays that way and thats his very best ( this all confirmed by stats ) then i could somewhat agree that he's a bad player that got beaten.

 

Still that leaves one or two pending questions, one is the fact that just because one player is bad there is absolutely no reason to make such remarks in chat or , unintendedly or not, to start labeling people based on XVM or other mod, i believe we can all agree on that, for one its nice to have stats but on the other side when the mod starts being used here the way it is in WoT then i believe the purpose of the mod is surpassed from being a statistics and somewhat pre game analisys prognosis based on the quality of your team measured against the quality of the enemy team to a im purple ur ready hurr durr quit game, or the usual insults that we all know from WoT and assorted MoBa / Multiplayer games.

 

The reason im saying this to hellspunk is because he might actually not be one of those said players that rip their shirts off , climb the Empire State and start screaming at the red points floating around him , but, he's starting to sound like one of those said people, plus the fact that by disagreeing with him he gives you - rep or comes with combo breaker saving face arguements is subpar to the kind of player he wants to be.

 

If he told me, XVM is good because,

 

- reason A

- reason B

- reason C

 

instead of the usual, " Good players want to improve, bad players dont " , or "i respect the fact that you admit you are a bad player blabla..."

 

 

, then i would say, ok perhaps you are right and seem from that perspective ( reason A, etc ) it might be usefull, but he did not , so , for me he's starting to sound like someone on a holy crusade to bring something into the game just for the sake of it when there are people already saying no to it for one very good reason in my eyes, and that is keeping the comunity friendly as it has been or when there are perhaps better mods that could be put into this game.

 

Its very subjective , at least for me at this point to start saying people with , this this and that are good and so on and the rest are normal , mediocre or noobs, plus the fact that when talking to people be it here or ingame or skype i meen, its somewhat of a stranger and people should pick their words carefully now and then, wether Hellspunk understands it or not he really gave credit indirectly to the B guy wich as good a player as he could be i still wouldnt want to have such an player like that on my team just because of the bad atmosphere these kind of people bring into the game.

 

Thats my point of view on the whole matter.

 

So you're saying it's more a matter of tone then content? In a way I can understand that, the way a message is conveyed is an integrate part of the message itself and content alone can get lost. I must admit this is sometimes the case with me, I try but often I come across people who seem unable to debate based on facts, a q&a exchange followed by a possible reconsideration based on the former. Those people often then resort to ad hominem, and defensive obstruction for which I'm a sucker to get trapped in. Guess neuro typicals have another thing going for them 

 

Personally I don't think HellSpunk is as bad as you picture him to be, I do think that just as many others it get's very very tiresome at times to try to have a sensible exchange of thoughts when there are so many people just trying to convey their opinions as facts, being submissive of anything which contradicts it. In my opinion, that is the source of whatever it is what ticked the wrong boxes with you, not ill intent. If you constantly have to defend yourself one tends to get overly defensive at times. I don't know if that's the case.

 

By the way, why do you think he gives -1 to people who disagree? Maybe it was me giving a -1 to a post where people either failed to read or plainly just refused to enter in a debate other then mocking and dismissing and even slandering the other side. There is a reason a vukkening happened in this thread, and it wasn't HellSpunk ( nor me ). If it was another post, then idk but just wondering why you attribute it directly to someone when the forum doesn't show who either upvoted or downvoted a post?

[Elgerino]

Fact is, if you say I've said something I haven't then you're going to get a snarky response, I don't know why you'd expect anything different. Especially when you tell me I haven't addressed arguments that I've literally addressed twenty times.

 

As for the neg rep, I could say the same thing to you, seeing as one of my responses to you got -1. But I wouldn't, because making a big deal about internet points when I can't even prove you put them on would have been childish. 

 

 

If he told me, XVM is good because,

 

- reason A

- reason B

- reason C

 

instead of the usual, " Good players want to improve, bad players dont " , or "i respect the fact that you admit you are a bad player blabla..."

 

 

It's not up to me to prove that it's useful, it's up to you to prove that it should be removed. Also, the fact that you're pretending my presence in this thread constitutes those two comments as my ''usual'' proves you haven't read the thread at all.

 

 My point with hellwhatever was he defends, or seemed to defend, people that use XVM just because while player A said it was a nice fight the feeling got ruined by a remark from player B. Now im ignoring the fact that player A considers himself bad, terribad whatever, i dont know that for a fact neither does hell, neither does anyone at this moment because we are in a beta, so unless player A says he plays that way and thats his very best ( this all confirmed by stats ) then i could somewhat agree that he's a bad player that got beaten.

 

A load of convoluted rubbish. I didn't defend the guy who ruined it for him, I commended his positive outlook on the matter nothing more. The extent to which you've warped what I said to make it look like I attacked him in some way so you can pretend your initial, poorly thought out post was anything but a prime example of when jumping to conclusions goes horribly wrong, is staggering.

[Corthag]

XVM needs to be in the game, officially by Wargaming, not modders. But each player needs to be able to disable HIS OWN STATS to anyone else. That's the big issue with unicorns getting murdered first, resulting in punishment for good gameplay.

 

However, if Wargaming does not officially take on XVM, it will come from modders again, and that will be an unstoppable plague just like in WoT.

[anonym_Ddnj2LO4cvhq]

XVM is fine, it's just the chance to win that's making people lose hope for each game, most don't even realise you can turn it off

Stats on XVM are fine the way they are, most people i know in WoT, including me are in the red, yellow area and we take that as doing ok but needing to improve and not to give up just because you aren't purple.

 

If you are hell bent on wanting to take away the stats then i guess you can do that in the config file so you just have the view ranges etc.. on the mini map, now that i think about that why dont 99% of players do this on WoT so they stop complaining about colours..

[Bortasqu]

I don't mind XVM at all, I just want to know which of my team mates I can trust my back to, and not tell them things like: "Why is our entire team going to one side of the map...?" which I'm sure a lot of the forumites here have experienced from before.

[Kaptain_Tripps]

How would XVM even work in WoWs?

 

Killing 3 DDs from full health might net you only 30k damage so does that mean someone that killed one BB gets nearly double XVM points?

 

Kills is also difficult to reward as its not uncommon to simply get the last hit.

 

I can't think of a sensible way of handing out XVM points in this game. The system they use in WoT is pretty much bollocks as it doesn't take into account spotting and gold ammo usage ete. In this game it would be even more convoluted and just as damaging.

[anonym_Ddnj2LO4cvhq]

How would XVM even work in WoWs?

 

Killing 3 DDs from full health might net you only 30k damage so does that mean someone that killed one BB gets nearly double XVM points?

 

Kills is also difficult to reward as its not uncommon to simply get the last hit.

 

I can't think of a sensible way of handing out XVM points in this game. The system they use in WoT is pretty much bollocks as it doesn't take into account spotting and gold ammo usage ete. In this game it would be even more convoluted and just as damaging.

 

They will most likely choose from two options:

1. Major Rework for WoWS (taking into account everything done by the player)

2. Get rid of stats completely but keep the enhanced minimap for view ranges etc..

 

I'm betting my money on the first though it will take a while before a build (most likely nightly) is up

 

Wargaming are slowly making XVM obsolete anyways by incorporating stuff like sixth sense and expanded minimap as standard

[OpCentar]

The moment we get in game battle rankings of any kind available in the battle roster is the moment when the gameplay quality drops.

 

Fancy getting focused by every carrier on the enemy team? well that's gonna happen when they see you're the best player on the enemy team.

How about your top tier BB going into the open and raging about MM? well that's gonna happen when he sees the bad players on his team.

 

And so on, in game battle stats are bad for gameplay. But they are good for profit as they enable statpadding which is easiest with hard currency.

 

I don't want it but it's good for business so it's only a matter of time before we get it.

 

 

[Orlunu]

Killing 3 DDs from full health might net you only 30k damage so does that mean someone that killed one BB gets nearly double XVM points?

 

Kills is also difficult to reward as its not uncommon to simply get the last hit.

 

I can't think of a sensible way of handing out XVM points in this game. The system they use in WoT is pretty much bollocks as it doesn't take into account spotting and gold ammo usage ete. In this game it would be even more convoluted and just as damaging.

 

WN8 doesn't just use kills and damage assigned random importances.

 

You can regress all the factors recorded in the API on winrate to see how strongly each one correlates to winrate, and use that to see how important each is.  After that, you can do pretty much the same thing to see how good an indicator of good play.  If the correlation is poor, they won't use it.

 

And WN8 isn't a measure of how skilled a player is, it is a measure of how well they play.  It doesn't take into account what impact gold usage has just as it doesn't take into account what impact good aiming skills have: it isn't intended to.

[DtXpwnz]

Stuff about WN8...

Just one thing to say... spotting. WN8 is bul***t and XVM is ****.

[Orlunu]

Just one thing to say... spotting. WN8 is bul***t and XVM is ****.

 

Just one thing to say: 9% dispersion at 95% confidence over 100 battles.

 

Yes, it isn't perfect.  It's damn good, though.  To the extent that it's far better indicator of how good you are at making a team win than your winrate is, which is what it's for.

[Kaptain_Tripps]

 

Just one thing to say: 9% dispersion at 95% confidence over 100 battles.

 

Yes, it isn't perfect.  It's damn good, though.  To the extent that it's far better indicator of how good you are at making a team win than your winrate is, which is what it's for.

 

Sure it may be an indication of how good a player is at causing damage but for anything else it's little more than epeen. When the T37 came out the expected damage was so low a guy I know went out and played hundreds of battles scoring thousands of WN8 for pretty average games. A recent Ace tanker ELC game of mine netted only 400 WN8 because I only fired my gun once. 

 

People play specific tanks to inflate their WN8 and give crap to people with lower. It causes nothing but drama in games, does anybody like the boohoo 30% at the start of a game? 

 

Getting focused by arty is bad enough, focused by a pair of carriers would be a thousand times worse. 

 

Sure have it as a out of game bragging tool if that's your thing but I really hope it never makes it into the game.

[LMN118]

I've seen far too many people in WoT give up or suicide because of XVM. I've played many a game where someone whines at the start about XVM, dies and then we win the match despite the other team supposedly being better. It doesn't tell you anything useful pre-game and just creates a toxic atmosphere in a game that should be about enjoyment not stress. 

 

 

[Elgerino]

I've seen far too many people blaming XVM for people who give up and suicide, when they were always doing it anyway. 

[Askorti]

I've seen far too many people in WoT give up or suicide because of XVM. I've played many a game where someone whines at the start about XVM, dies and then we win the match despite the other team supposedly being better. It doesn't tell you anything useful pre-game and just creates a toxic atmosphere in a game that should be about enjoyment not stress. 

 

 

 

Blame the user, not the tool.

[radix9]

Since I have uninstalled xvm and disabled in-game chat, my WoT experience got 10 times better. I really hope they don't make xvm for WoWs.

 

[Elgerino]

Since I have uninstalled xvm and disabled in-game chat, my WoT experience got 10 times better. I really hope they don't make xvm for WoWs.

 

 

How does removing XVM when you've already disabled chat improve anything?

[Argysh]

Oh please, No XVM for WoWs I feel it ruined it for WoT and it would be like a cancer for Warships too. This is coming from a person who has above average stats (1700 Wn8 and 52 % for WoT), I still feel it ruins the game by making people prejudice about other stats and worrying about whether they have a "good winrate or not"

 

Why should i listen to you? 1700 and 52%? lol nooob! go home and let the big boys talk!

 

^^^^

that's what xvm does. No thanks, please don't introduce that to WoWs.

[bubo_bubo]

XVM. For people who need to feel pro.

[Elgerino]

 

Why should i listen to you? 1700 and 52%? lol nooob! go home and let the big boys talk!

 

^^^^

that's what xvm does. No thanks, please don't introduce that to WoWs.

 

No, that's what you chose to do.

 

XVM. For people who need to feel pro.

 

That's BS. XVM is the bane of those who act pro, if anything. Ego's are cut down to size easily when their stats are on display.