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GulvkluderGuld

ADD DD COUNTERPLAY to CV

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17 minutes ago, valrond said:

Another braindead DD player that can't adapt to the CV gameplay. I'm enjoying that there are so many noob CVs nowadays. I'm not playing much, but when I play DDs, I do it quite well now.

You go right on thinking of me as braindead untill we meet in game :cap_popcorn:

 

Unfortunately there isn't much adapting to with IJN torp boats. Afterall, you cant unlock the shima without playing or freeXP'ing the Yugumo.

Show me a replay of 30 plane kills in Yugumo and maybe you can tell me how to play that blasted line in a CV game.

 

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33 minutes ago, who_dares_wins said:

This tactic has three issues:

1: It's useless on low AA DDs. 150% of :etc_swear: all is still next to nothing

 

Yet some DD sometimes kill a squadron of mine, especially  in transit....so this is not right.

Quote

2: On high AA DDs, any decent CV player will kill you anyway. Gearing and Grozovoi are good enough to completely shut down tier VIII CVs, and stop one wave of tier X planes using Def AA. However, the CV will just come back in 30 seconds with a fresh squadron, and then you're dead

 

Yes ? What did you expect immunity ? Not even AA cruisers or CV ( some with 98 AA gun barrels on them...) have that.

Quote

3: If the enemy CV dies, or you get a 0 CV match, other DDs will wreck you because of your bad concealment.

 

Yes ?  What good are dedicated AA cruisers when there is no CV in the match ?  Their performance will be considerable lower. It is a choice you make..... WG sells these as premiums....i have the impression they sold rather well, while without AA targets not being that great ships at all.....

 

Most of these post just want the CV removed from the game or shut down from doing any damage to them/disrupting their little plan.  It is very doubtful WG will ever do that, so you might aswell think of some strategy or tactics that do work with the equipement, captain skills, modules an such you do have....

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51 minutes ago, ColonelPete said:

Looks like you recieved only one strike.

And yes, the AA mechanic is setup in a way that a skilled CV player can get one strike through in that situation, but pays dearly for it.

1 strike on the Neptune (died) then 1 on me and 1 blinddrop in the smoke afterward. The one on me was a blinddrop too btw, but he saw me during the first drop and could guess the position, roughly (still missed all but 1-2 bombs).

 

Dearly? Not really. And not just 1 strike either.

Drop half the bombs in the ocean before going in, and have the planes return safely. Use the last 2 drops. MInimal losses to AA for the damage caused. Rinse repeat easily 4-6 times out of on-deck reserves mixing rockets and dbs and with regeneration there will be full squadrons still on deck afterwards.

 

Meanwhile surface ships dont even get xp or credits for plane kills yet.

 

Sounds like a price worth paying to me for neutralizing the only capping ship on the enemy team.

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7 minutes ago, Beastofwar said:

 

Yet some DD sometimes kill a squadron of mine, especially  in transit....so this is not right.

A toddler could probably sneeze on the keyboard and down a squad of your planes.

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19 minutes ago, ColonelPete said:

If you still think doing DD work in a CV game is a bad idea then yes, you have no idea what you are talking about.

 

Clearly not (last 21 days)

 

Destroyer    76    56.58%    1 632    54 059    1.11    2.93

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6 minutes ago, GulvkluderGuld said:

318 battles issue:Smile_trollface:

318 battles where you are aware of your mistakes is better than 300 "nerf" posts on forum. 

 

You just do not know how to play dd in new meta. Sooner you accept that you will get better. 

 

Crying on forum when weknow that rework is finished will do nothing good for you except you will get trolled. 

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14 minutes ago, GulvkluderGuld said:

Dearly? Not really. And not just 1 strike either.

Then the ships were not setup for AA or the CV player was really good.

8 minutes ago, Zen71_sniper said:

Clearly not (last 21 days)

 

Destroyer    76    56.58%    1 632    54 059    1.11    2.93

Then I wonder what you are talking about.

 

Btw. concerning your claim DD are as rare as CV, my first game of today:

shot-19_04.16_20_21.38-0625.thumb.jpg.47dfb6c1afe0bce741d6dff6048bd9be.jpg

 

 

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Maybe DD's with bad AA should get that fighter calling ability that the CV's have. Call it " Air Cover " consumable or something. I think something  this could even the field a little. Just my 2c's. If this was brought up before, then nvm.

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18 minutes ago, Bear_Necessities said:

A toddler could probably sneeze on the keyboard and down a squad of your planes.

Lmao, those damn toddlers, always wrecking my planes, as  primarily CV player these days, I do actually agre that DD's should get something to counter CV's, I have no idea what as I suck in them, yet love my CV's like nothing else, no other ship class can net me upto 3 to 4k free xp in one game

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2 minutes ago, ColonelPete said:

 

Then I wonder what you are talking about.

 

 

 

What I am talking about is that from an experience of a regular DD player, certain tactics are ineffective because of excessive spotting and ability of CV to one-shot a DD without counterplay (check El2aZer video) . I had to abandon most of the tactics which make DD play or execute them more carefully, to the extent that there is not much point in playing a DD. In the meantime, you played only a few games in a  DD in last 21 days (very badly, if I may add...) and you are trolling that all is good and that I should L2P.

 

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9 minutes ago, Zen71_sniper said:

 

What I am talking about is that from an experience of a regular DD player, certain tactics are ineffective because of excessive spotting and ability of CV to one-shot a DD without counterplay (check El2aZer video) . I had to abandon most of the tactics which make DD play or execute them more carefully, to the extent that there is not much point in playing a DD. In the meantime, you played only a few games in a  DD in last 21 days (very badly, if I may add...) and you are trolling that all is good and that I should L2P.

 

  • It is a L2P issue
  • the rework is older than 21 days
  • I played a lot more than that, but not everything is counted
  • and no, they did not go that bad, but fluctuations like that are normal

Btw. second game of today:

shot-19_04.16_20_54.09-0646.thumb.jpg.08d78f7e4752f157a69a517318d030b8.jpg

Something seems missing...

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11 minutes ago, Zen71_sniper said:

 

What I am talking about is that from an experience of a regular DD player, certain tactics are ineffective because of excessive spotting and ability of CV to one-shot a DD without counterplay (check El2aZer video) . I had to abandon most of the tactics which make DD play or execute them more carefully, to the extent that there is not much point in playing a DD. In the meantime, you played only a few games in a  DD in last 21 days (very badly, if I may add...) and you are trolling that all is good and that I should L2P.

 

Nobody will oneshot you out of detonation. But midway will kill you with 1 squad if you are on open. Same as before3would do Haku with 3 TB.

 

Tactics that worked before rework does not work now. Is DD needed? Yes. It still have 2 km detection range from planes, smoke, radar and/or deff AAA. Still you spot and cap. Still you kill other dds and still there are games without CBS. But not as free as before. You need to have fast exit strategy and only one working is AAA powerhouse near you. 

 

 

 

Good thing is CV can not spot your torps. Rn and ikn cvs don't have HE bombs and dieing to their rockets is much longer process. 

 

This rework changed DDs meta as introduction of radar back in days. 

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19 minutes ago, K82J said:

Maybe DD's with bad AA should get that fighter calling ability that the CV's have. Call it " Air Cover " consumable or something. I think something  this could even the field a little. Just my 2c's. If this was brought up before, then nvm.

That's not a bad idea at all. How would you differentiate it from those ships with catapult fighters already, though?

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DD's are not supposed to be aa ships bar the american ones, their not supposed to be op as they are, they were for most part escorts..... not the death dealing machines they are in this game..

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49 minutes ago, veslingr said:

318 battles where you are aware of your mistakes is better than 300 "nerf" posts on forum. 

 

You just do not know how to play dd in new meta. Sooner you accept that you will get better. 

 

Crying on forum when weknow that rework is finished will do nothing good for you except you will get trolled. 

You mostly play CV, and by adapting to the new meta you mean "dont play DD" and go sealclub lower tiers judging by your own played ships. 

 

Some of us who arn't biased have a different opinion, now go troll somewhere else if you dont have anything constructive to add.

 

Finally i clearly havnt adapted to the new meta during the last 21 days (those are kagero + yugumo stats btw):

image.png

/off sarcasm.

43 minutes ago, ColonelPete said:

Then the ships were not setup for AA or the CV player was really good.

You mean using the useless AA captain perks? I dont know if you have noticed, but only the Minotaur has reliable AA. We are talking tier 8, so the 3 mil AA dpm module isnt available (and mounting it is kinda troll anyways)

 

And no the CV don't have to be very good to do that. As you said, the game is set up in that way. And that is too CV friendly.

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2 minutes ago, Verblonde said:

That's not a bad idea at all. How would you differentiate it from those ships with catapult fighters already, though?

Didnt thought much about the difference between them so far...............but, here is something :  maybe they should " chase " away the planes from a DD while doing a bit damage ( but not as much as " real ones" do ). Maybe " chase "  could mean uncontrollable planes until they leave a fighter's area.  Just some quick " differentiating" thought, share your ideas please.

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6 minutes ago, DreadArchangel said:

DD's are not supposed to be aa ships bar the american ones, their not supposed to be op as they are, they were for most part escorts..... not the death dealing machines they are in this game..

Well, most navies didnt have more BBs than they had DDs and cruisers put together, either :fish_book: 

 

Leaving the realism argument aside (this is an arcade game), both the russian dds and IJN gunboats were introduced as AA dds.

 

More importantly, we are back to square one after the slight aa buffs to DDs during rts cv permaspotting days made permaspotting costly for CVs. 

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4 minutes ago, K82J said:

share your ideas please.

Perhaps give the 'real' ones much longer duration, and perhaps a wider radius of action?

 

You could rationalise this in terms of the 'summoned' ones having to come from somewhere else, so less time/fuel available to chase around after enemy planes...?

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1 hour ago, Zen71_sniper said:

If you play high tier level, you will notice that DDs are as rare as CVs and that is because the only way to SAFELY survive is to play it as a low HP cruiser.

Third game of today....

shot-19_04.16_21_17.32-0397.thumb.jpg.eebb5e200f25ce92c0f33dda9a9fba54.jpg

The picture seems to be missing something, but I do not know what. Can you point it out?

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6 minutes ago, Verblonde said:

Perhaps give the 'real' ones much longer duration, and perhaps a wider radius of action?

 

You could rationalise this in terms of the 'summoned' ones having to come from somewhere else, so less time/fuel available to chase around after enemy planes...?

This could work, too. I dont wanna make DD's invulnerable to CV's either. So it shouldnt last long, maybe like 30-45 sec ? Should be a different then DefAA, too, so maybe less damage and longer duration.

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The main difference as a DD is that in the RTS iteration, air strikes were all or nothing affairs. If you managed to dodge it, you knew you'd cost the CV a significant amount of time and effort. And you'd have time to reposition by the time the cv could cycle their planes.

 

You simply had more room to maneuver. That simply isn't there any more. Once a CV knows the general area you're in, they will manage to wear you down.

 

1 hour ago, Beastofwar said:

Yet some DD sometimes kill a squadron of mine, especially  in transit....so this is not right.

As self-owns go, this one's pretty epic.

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52 minutes ago, GulvkluderGuld said:

You mostly play CV, and by adapting to the new meta you mean "dont play DD" and go sealclub lower tiers judging by your own played ships. 

 

Some of us who arn't biased have a different opinion, now go troll somewhere else if you dont have anything constructive to add.

 

Finally i clearly havnt adapted to the new meta during the last 21 days (those are kagero + yugumo stats btw):

image.png

/off sarcasm.

You mean using the useless AA captain perks? I dont know if you have noticed, but only the Minotaur has reliable AA. We are talking tier 8, so the 3 mil AA dpm module isnt available (and mounting it is kinda troll anyways)

 

And no the CV don't have to be very good to do that. As you said, the game is set up in that way. And that is too CV friendly.

no you are not biased, but you ask for I WIN BUTTOn....you know you have alot ov conter to CV...but you just need to know how to use them...back to LTP in new meta

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1 hour ago, Beastofwar said:

 

Yet some DD sometimes kill a squadron of mine, especially  in transit....so this is not right.

 

Yes ? What did you expect immunity ? Not even AA cruisers or CV ( some with 98 AA gun barrels on them...) have that.

 

Yes ?  What good are dedicated AA cruisers when there is no CV in the match ?  Their performance will be considerable lower. It is a choice you make..... WG sells these as premiums....i have the impression they sold rather well, while without AA targets not being that great ships at all.....

 

Most of these post just want the CV removed from the game or shut down from doing any damage to them/disrupting their little plan.  It is very doubtful WG will ever do that, so you might aswell think of some strategy or tactics that do work with the equipement, captain skills, modules an such you do have....

If you're dying to AA from a normal DD, you're flying into flak. If you're flying into flak on a regular basis, you are not a very good CV player.

 

Where did I say I wanted to be immune to CVs? The point is that only two DDs can actually use your suggested build to any effectiveness, and then only reliably against CVs two tiers lower.

 

There are no "dedicated AA cruisers". There are AA cruisers, but they all have something else for when there is no CV, either very good gun power or a wide array of consumables to provide support with. Meanwhile, DDs built exclusively for AA get completely wrecked by non-AA build DDs because they get outspotted so badly because they don't have CE.

 

Out of curiosity, what build do you run on DDs?

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2 minutes ago, who_dares_wins said:

Out of curiosity, what build do you run on DDs?

My guess? 

Secondary build

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