Jump to content
You need to play a total of 50 battles to post in this section.
Baylor98

DDs are not sacrificial penguins!

37 comments in this topic

Recommended Posts

[CAPT]
Players
40 posts
10,552 battles

I watched a nature program not long ago about penguins. It showed how when a group of penguins were standing on the ice, wondering whether it was safe to dive in the water or whether there was a leopard seal around they would gang up on one of their own kind and push him into the water. If he survived they knew it was safe.

 

As a regular DD player I often feel like that sacrificial penguin. I dutifully head for a zone to capture it at the start, I see on the map that cruisers and some BBs are following and I think 'cool I will get some support for a change!'. However, when I reach the zone and start the cap I find myself after a while getting hunted by enemy DDs and cruisers and attacked by aircraft etc. I look for my support and its sitting just out of useful range, watching to see if I survive I suppose.

 

Anyone else get this feeling playing DDs?

  • Cool 14
  • Funny 4

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[CATS]
Players
28,295 posts
14,932 battles
1 minute ago, Baylor98 said:

I watched a nature program not long ago about penguins. It showed how when a group of penguins were standing on the ice, wondering whether it was safe to dive in the water or whether there was a leopard seal around they would gang up on one of their own kind and push him into the water. If he survived they knew it was safe.

 

As a regular DD player I often feel like that sacrificial penguin. I dutifully head for a zone to capture it at the start, I see on the map that cruisers and some BBs are following and I think 'cool I will get some support for a change!'. However, when I reach the zone and start the cap I find myself after a while getting hunted by enemy DDs and cruisers and attacked by aircraft etc. I look for my support and its sitting just out of useful range, watching to see if I survive I suppose.

 

Anyone else get this feeling playing DDs?

No.

I tend to watch friendly and enemy ships.

When the enemy is closer than the friendlies, I know I have to pull back.

Especially when planes are involved or the enemy DD are higher Tier, you have to be extra careful.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[NOCAP]
Beta Tester
17 posts
14,300 battles

I

6 minutes ago, Baylor98 said:

I watched a nature program not long ago about penguins. It showed how when a group of penguins were standing on the ice, wondering whether it was safe to dive in the water or whether there was a leopard seal around they would gang up on one of their own kind and push him into the water. If he survived they knew it was safe.

 

As a regular DD player I often feel like that sacrificial penguin. I dutifully head for a zone to capture it at the start, I see on the map that cruisers and some BBs are following and I think 'cool I will get some support for a change!'. However, when I reach the zone and start the cap I find myself after a while getting hunted by enemy DDs and cruisers and attacked by aircraft etc. I look for my support and its sitting just out of useful range, watching to see if I survive I suppose.

 

Anyone else get this feeling playing DDs?

In randoms, especially on weekends. You're better off assuming you'll get no support from your team. 

  • Cool 17
  • Funny 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Players
3,101 posts
17,561 battles

No.

 

I never even go to certain caps anymore and if i head for caps, it is to chunk enemy dds. I never try to cap and do try to disengange immediately without usint smoke. If CVs are involved I get more careful still.

 

Obviously cruisers and lemmingtrains usually love the caps i avoid at all costs because they have nearby large islands good for radar ships. As a dd on the other hand, i prefer open water. Which creates a lot of conflicts with BB and cruiser players.  C And D cap on North are cases in point as radar ships love them because they are deathtraps for dds. Obviously I head for the 1-3 line advising my team from the start (communication seems a mixed blessing, but if anyone follows, you know they are somewhat decent players) 

 

The point is, nobody can force you to be the sacrificial penguin, and I never feel that way. I rather sacrifice the team of potentially 11 idiots to stay alive and maybe carry the game.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[GW_KR]
Players
286 posts
13,596 battles

Always assume you get no support from your team. When you do, it’s a pleasant surprise!! 

Never let anyone bully you into doing what they want. Every now and then I get shot at from my team when I don’t do as ”I am told”.

  • Cool 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[TTTX]
[TTTX]
Players
4,608 posts
8,081 battles
14 minutes ago, Baylor98 said:

As a regular DD player I often feel like that sacrificial penguin. I dutifully head for a zone to capture it at the start, I see on the map that cruisers and some BBs are following and I think 'cool I will get some support for a change!'. However, when I reach the zone and start the cap I find myself after a while getting hunted by enemy DDs and cruisers and attacked by aircraft etc. I look for my support and its sitting just out of useful range, watching to see if I survive I suppose.

the solution to that is, as Pete's alluded to, quite simple: Look at your team more regularly. Pay attention to when, where and how they turn out, and play accordingly. Otherwise, sure it may be their fault that they didnt support you - but it's your fault that you went in and died without support early on. Always try to have an escape plan ready.

  • Cool 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[SM0KE]
Players
6,212 posts
14,728 battles
21 minutes ago, Baylor98 said:

I dutifully head for a zone to capture it at the start

There's yer problem - in the current 'CVs and lashings of radar' meta, an early cap is going to get you exploded a lot of the time. As others have alluded to, be circumspect with early game capping - quite apart from anything else, as soon as the cap starts changing colour, you've pretty much telegraphed where you are to the opposing team.

 

Unless you're in a coordinated division, it's better to assume you'll always get zero support, and play accordingly too...

  • Cool 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[CATS]
Players
28,295 posts
14,932 battles

Early caps still work quite well.

Even with CV you have a 33% to 66% chance to not get disturbed by them.

  • Cool 5

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[SM0KE]
Players
6,212 posts
14,728 battles
2 minutes ago, ColonelPete said:

Early caps still work quite well.

Even with CV you have a 33% to 66% chance to not get disturbed by them.

True - I probably should have been a bit more expansive. My approach is to assume I can cap straight off, and then run for cover if/when any warning flags are raised.

 

Much of the time, I want the enemy planes to disturb me, especially early on before any AA gets knocked out - if I can make an initial strike costly, then the CVs sometimes give me a wide berth after that...

  • Cool 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[FJAKA]
Players
2,975 posts
477 battles
1 hour ago, Baylor98 said:

I watched a nature program not long ago about penguins. It showed how when a group of penguins were standing on the ice, wondering whether it was safe to dive in the water or whether there was a leopard seal around they would gang up on one of their own kind and push him into the water. If he survived they knew it was safe.

 

As a regular DD player I often feel like that sacrificial penguin. I dutifully head for a zone to capture it at the start, I see on the map that cruisers and some BBs are following and I think 'cool I will get some support for a change!'. However, when I reach the zone and start the cap I find myself after a while getting hunted by enemy DDs and cruisers and attacked by aircraft etc. I look for my support and its sitting just out of useful range, watching to see if I survive I suppose.

 

Anyone else get this feeling playing DDs?

nobody, except yourself, can help you against radar/hydro/CV combo...dont rely on other peoples in random is best advice any DD captain can get :)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[NWP]
Beta Tester
1,847 posts
17,768 battles

Two things of note:

 

1) When not sure about your back-up and/or the enemy line-up ALWAYS approach any cap in "run-away" mode, i.e. figure out the vector of the most likely enemy attack and position yourself 180° opposed to that as soon as possible.

2) If you have support and your DD has at least decent camo ratings then for gods sake do not stop at the edge of the cap circle and NEVER EVER smoke up in cap without good reason as you will not only blind yourself, but most likely also your team . The window of opportunity for support is limited, especially for cruisers and battleships brave enough to support their DDs. If they get shot up before the enemy spotter (DD) goes down, you will be on your own for the rest of the game.

  • Cool 9

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[NWP]
Players
1,099 posts
10,057 battles

To all the people saying they "never try to cap" or "don't bother going into caps"...

 

I try to cap, especially early, to get points on the board and to force engagement with enemy DDS (depending on tier and shop, of course). And when you don't even attempt to cap, you get abuse in chat - no big deal I know, but you are easily seen as not being a team player or not playing for the win.

 

It's sadly true that, unless in a division, you cannot rely on support ever, but I blame the vulnerability of cruisers for that, not the players themselves.

 

BBs will always hide.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[BHSFL]
Players
3,690 posts
33 minutes ago, ColonelPete said:

Early caps still work quite well.

Even with CV you have a 33% to 66% chance to not get disturbed by them.

 

I know for a fact that is not true per definition.

 

I patrol/bee line all caps at match start. So if there is only 1 DD per side his chance is 100 % caught and attacked. If there is 2 DD only one will get caught, but if he smokes i continue the patrol ( useless to hang around ) so if there's more they will be caught too.

 

Ofcourse i will e back when the smoke clears to have a looksee where that DD went. Missing DD are dangerous for my CV ship.....

 

To OP : don't rush caps unsupported. No nerf is going to keep you alive when you are in a cap unsupported, and that goes for game without CV just the same. Get spotted ( by anything ) and come under atttack. That simple.

When i say "bee line" that is a describtion of how i avoid being shot at by (AA) cruisers. That means if  you stay are near such a cruiser you are safe. Now, if you want to cap and be safe, have that cruiser follow you, or keep near it when it advances to a cap, they usually do.

 

Can't ask for nerfs or removal of CV because this is the way it should work. Rushing to cap unsupported = risk ( or stupidity )

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[CATS]
Players
28,295 posts
14,932 battles
1 minute ago, Beastofwar said:

 

I know for a fact that is not true per definition.

 

I patrol/bee line all caps at match start. So if there is only 1 DD per side his chance is 100 % caught and attacked. If there is 2 DD only one will get caught, but if he smokes i continue the patrol ( useless to hang around ) so if there's more they will be caught too.

 

Ofcourse i will e back when the smoke clears to have a looksee where that DD went. Missing DD are dangerous for my CV ship.....

1 DD is rare.

The average number of DD per team is around 2.5.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[_DIB_]
Players
169 posts
13,813 battles

DD's are scouts  as well as cv's aircraft. A dd ship will most always be ahead of the rest of the fleet. Some sets will be supported and then not in other sets.  The best way to play, is that you have no support when your ahead the fleet. So you take the appropriate precautions to scout, cap and sink the opponent as best a possible.

 

If you have do get a set where you get support the match is much more better, but getting a set with support is few and far in between.  IF no support is there play as if you were alone against the opponent. Taking into account map situation, players on both teams to include type of ships, time of day and also the day of the week (specially weekends) and most important what you can do with your ship, Etc.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Players
3,535 posts
14,238 battles
2 hours ago, Baylor98 said:

I watched a nature program not long ago about penguins. It showed how when a group of penguins were standing on the ice, wondering whether it was safe to dive in the water or whether there was a leopard seal around they would gang up on one of their own kind and push him into the water. If he survived they knew it was safe.

 

As a regular DD player I often feel like that sacrificial penguin. I dutifully head for a zone to capture it at the start, I see on the map that cruisers and some BBs are following and I think 'cool I will get some support for a change!'. However, when I reach the zone and start the cap I find myself after a while getting hunted by enemy DDs and cruisers and attacked by aircraft etc. I look for my support and its sitting just out of useful range, watching to see if I survive I suppose.

 

Anyone else get this feeling playing DDs?

Just learn to ignore you’re team, assume unless you are in a division the rest are red potato’s and play your own game. Works for me. Also love taking an early cap. Forces the enemy to start making mistakes when they try and push back.

 

Also ignore Beast. He has no idea how to play DD’s. There is nothing wrong with going to a cap early. Just be ready to disengage, don’t boost to the cap, you may need it on the way out. Don’t smoke going into a cap as it leaves you blind and pin points precisely where you are. If you sit on the edge moving even at slowest speed you can still leave radar range if a ship pops it. You can also use your capital ships as bait. It may be tempting to sit behind an island in cap but that means you are not spotting and are at risk of getting ambushed as Islands work both ways, you can’t be seen but you can’t see them.

 

If you need any more advice just ask. Or send in replays and we’ll help. We can tell you what you did well, what you didn’t do well, how you can do things better and talk you through finer points.

  • Cool 6

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[NWP]
Players
1,388 posts
11,328 battles
1 hour ago, Baylor98 said:

....... sacrificial penguin .......?

I am a strong proponent of team play. And recently, I developed an affinity for DD play. However, not all of us share the same convictions, or, have the same understanding of game objectives. Don't forget it is a game. So, lets put forward some rules. Games have rules. If you don't want to agree with rules its just fine. Don't read the rest of the post.

 

DD Skipper rule No. 1: Don't Die

DD Skipper rule No. 2: Rule No. 1 applies

 

Having that in mind go get the cap for your team. A cap is a major objective. Holding a cap for three minutes in a Domination game is equivalent to sinking one Battleship. (I did the math)

When your cap is threatened turn around, don't kill that juicy BB that you was licking your lips to rush, instead, turn back to defend your base.

At the late stages of the game, if it is tactically significant, put your ship in danger.

Spot for your team which means you have to be in an advanced position closer to danger.

 

But always observe Rule No. 1

 

In this respect, I strongly believe that you should ask not "if you are a sacrificial penguin", but, rather "how not to die?".

 

Verily, so sayeth the first rule.

 

Regards

Saltface

 

 

  • Cool 5

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[BODEM]
Players
802 posts
7,026 battles

I understand exactly what you say, OP :) Being a DD is hard these days because CA/BB mains think it's like around this time last year, when CVs seemed extinct and only a handful of ships had radar. Now just save yourself first and see if you can do anything useful second. Try to contest caps, but if you can't, staying alive and not capping is preferred above getting the cap, die and then losethe cap again eventually.

  • Cool 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[BHSFL]
Players
3,690 posts

I never heard the option to cooperate with your own sides CV ?

 

Surely with those hated but in this case friendly strike fighters or HE divebombers above your head ready to strike all that pops up in the cap together with your shells and torpedo's will bring victory and a succesfull cap....with or without the occasional fighter consumable deployed to protect you.

 

That is what it means to advance supported too.....can be a formation of cooperating DD, can be a Cruiser, can be CV aircraft....support.

 

But noooo....nerf CV...make them useless because i don't use them and they hurt meeeee....

 

 

 

  • Boring 2
  • Bad 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[SM0KE]
Players
6,212 posts
14,728 battles
3 hours ago, Mr_Tayto said:

To all the people saying they "never try to cap" or "don't bother going into caps"...

Did anyone actually advocate that? The impression I got was more of a resounding chorus of 'be careful'.

 

Early caps are good, if you can get them, but less so if you get blown up getting them, hence the need for caution...

  • Cool 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[TOXIC]
Players
4,786 posts
12,247 battles
4 hours ago, Mr_Tayto said:

To all the people saying they "never try to cap" or "don't bother going into caps"...

It depends.

There are matches where getting into the caps actually is a bad idea. A double CV match with 4 Radar ships on the enemy team? Trying to go for early caps is not likely to be a good idea. This is an extreme case, of course, but you get the general idea :Smile-_tongue:

  • Cool 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Players
4,566 posts
7,604 battles
1 hour ago, eliastion said:

It depends.

There are matches where getting into the caps actually is a bad idea. A double CV match with 4 Radar ships on the enemy team? Trying to go for early caps is not likely to be a good idea. This is an extreme case, of course, but you get the general idea :Smile-_tongue:

 

But then of course there'll be 45% WR BB players whining about "DD not doing their jobs" from 10 km+ behind the front line.

  • Cool 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[SM0KE]
Players
6,212 posts
14,728 battles
19 minutes ago, Capra76 said:

 

But then of course there'll be 45% WR BB players whining about "DD not doing their jobs" from 10 km+ behind the front line.

Valuable bonus?

 

:Smile_trollface:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

×