[GAH93] KapitaenvonMueller Players 42 posts 14,451 battles Report post #1 Posted March 20, 2019 The Mikasa is the only pre-dreadnought battleship and is a tier II battleship. Would it not be a good idea to include more pre-dreadnought battleships in the tech tree to create a little chance for the Mikasa? For example, I thought of the german Pommern,the british HMS Canopus,the russian Slawa,the french Danton or the amerikan USS Oregon. I think it would be a good start for the battleship tech trees of those nations as T2´s. And the Mikasa would not be alone anymore... 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
[CHEFT] DFens_666 Players 13,162 posts 11,029 battles Report post #2 Posted March 20, 2019 I dont think, WG will release techtree BBs on T2, because it seems very logical to me, that on every new tier you get a new class T1 Cruisers only T2 DD line starting T3 BB line starting T4 CV line starting So they might release T2 premium BBs but... i dont think that its worth for WG to invest time to make some cheap lowtier premiums. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
[SM0KE] Verblonde Players 9,787 posts 20,664 battles Report post #3 Posted March 20, 2019 I vaguely recall reading that part of the problem is that pre-dreadnoughts (pretty much by definition) have mixed-calibre main armaments, which the game currently can't cope with...? 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Floofz ∞ Players 1,246 posts 7,392 battles Report post #4 Posted March 20, 2019 1 minute ago, Verblonde said: I vaguely recall reading that part of the problem is that pre-dreadnoughts (pretty much by definition) have mixed-calibre main armaments, which the game currently can't cope with...? Most BBs have secondaries of different calibers. The issue is that tier 2 BBs are completely useless. They cant hit anything cause they are inaccurate, long reload and slow guns and at the same time sloooow. Think my damagerecord in Mikasa is something like 30k. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
[FAILS] BruceRKF Players 1,077 posts 27,211 battles Report post #5 Posted March 20, 2019 Two things that stand in the way: One is the tier system, constraining WW1 and pre-WW1 ships essentially to three tiers (2 to 4, and at t4 you even already get inter war or WW2 refits). The other is the secondary gun game mechanics. Pre-dreadnoughts in most cases had 2x2 "main" battery guns, but lots of other guns of various calibres which would be secondary guns in the game and therefore pretty useless. There are some interesting and very pretty ships that are left out because of that. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
[SM0KE] Verblonde Players 9,787 posts 20,664 battles Report post #6 Posted March 20, 2019 11 minutes ago, AdmiralDing3Ling said: Most BBs have secondaries of different calibers. They do. I don't think that's the issue here though. On pre-dreadnoughts, the main armament* wasn't consistent calibres; the main in-game implication for that being you have to pick one of the main gun calibres for the player controlled part, and the rest get lumped in with the secondaries. This results in very few player-controlled guns (four, typically?) and an awful lot of secondaries. I can see this being fun (I actually quite like Mikasa - in small doses), but it does make rather a lot of the gameplay of such ships AI controlled, which could be perceived as undesirable...? *Edit: using the term loosely. Edit2: a quick Google suggests that I'm lumping the actual main armament in with an 'intermediate' armament... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
[SM0KE] Verblonde Players 9,787 posts 20,664 battles Report post #7 Posted March 20, 2019 Post-script: I would love it if pre-dreadnoughts could be made to work though; the aesthetics of a lot of them are glorious... 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
[GAH93] KapitaenvonMueller Players 42 posts 14,451 battles Report post #8 Posted March 20, 2019 Vor 24 Minuten, AdmiralDing3Ling sagte: The issue is that tier 2 BBs are completely useless. They cant hit anything cause they are inaccurate, long reload and slow guns and at the same time sloooow. On the other hand, the first bigger naval battles of the 20th century were also beaten with pre-dreadnoughts like the naval battles of Port Arthur and especially Tsushima. And also at the legendary battle of Jutland have participated pre-dreadnoughts... 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
gustywinds Players 444 posts 5,582 battles Report post #9 Posted March 20, 2019 2 hours ago, KapitaenvonMueller said: french Danton Some friends of mine were on the ship that discovered the wreck of Danton. 4 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
[S-E] FixCVs_Nautical_Metaphor Players 3,532 posts 29,240 battles Report post #10 Posted March 20, 2019 Vor 3 Stunden, AdmiralDing3Ling sagte: Most BBs have secondaries of different calibers. Well, for Mikasa, WG chose to solve the issue by treating all the smaller guns as secondaries, with much shorter range. Conceivably, it would be also possible to treat them as main guns with different ballistic characteristics. That would be confusing and difficult, you would basically keep being switched automatically from the 12-inch turret to a St. Louis strapped to the side... however, the balancing would then at least be based on some kind of skill. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
[DEH] hellhound666 Beta Tester 1,978 posts Report post #11 Posted March 20, 2019 possible gain of that is very little and there are more urgent issues to fix than create load of t2 bb's which will be ignored by most of the players 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Skurfa Beta Tester 809 posts Report post #12 Posted March 20, 2019 I still see a game where you'd be able to control your secondaries directly (while waiting for your mains to reload). It seems odd DD's have the same guns, but being more accurate than the ones sitting on larger (more stable) ships... Then we could revert some of the torp-nerfs and so on as well. Just so BB's are not totally overpowered. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BlueMoon51 Beta Tester 951 posts Report post #13 Posted March 20, 2019 I always thought it would be a cool idea to have them lockable behind tier 10 essentially tier 11 would be a pre-t1 class just for the one group of ships 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Capra76 Players 5,001 posts 7,787 battles Report post #14 Posted March 20, 2019 31 minutes ago, Skurfa said: I still see a game where you'd be able to control your secondaries directly (while waiting for your mains to reload). It seems odd DD's have the same guns, but being more accurate than the ones sitting on larger (more stable) ships... Then we could revert some of the torp-nerfs and so on as well. Just so BB's are not totally overpowered. Who would suffer most from improved secondary guns? Cruisers. Who would benefit most from torpedo buffs? Destroyers. Welcome back to game meta 2015/16, 5 BB every game dodging walls of skill from 5 DD every game with 1 or 2 confused cruisers hiding behind islands wondering what the they were supposed to do in the game. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Skurfa Beta Tester 809 posts Report post #15 Posted March 20, 2019 2 minutes ago, Capra76 said: Who would suffer most from improved secondary guns? Cruisers. Who would benefit most from torpedo buffs? Destroyers. Welcome back to game meta 2015/16, 5 BB every game dodging walls of skill from 5 DD every game with 1 or 2 confused cruisers hiding behind islands wondering what the they were supposed to do in the game. I can see we have quite different opinions of how the game was back in 15/16 But that's fair enough, I did like it though Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Nishi_Kinuyo Players 249 posts 1,721 battles Report post #16 Posted March 20, 2019 While valid arguements, the only reason Mikasa is even in the game is, afaik, the fact it still exists. 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Panocek Players 13,176 posts 13,617 battles Report post #17 Posted March 21, 2019 7 hours ago, Skurfa said: I still see a game where you'd be able to control your secondaries directly (while waiting for your mains to reload). It seems odd DD's have the same guns, but being more accurate than the ones sitting on larger (more stable) ships... Then we could revert some of the torp-nerfs and so on as well. Just so BB's are not totally overpowered. You mean WoWs Blitz? 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
[RODS] Ronchabale Players 3,002 posts 10,002 battles Report post #18 Posted March 21, 2019 Yeah it would be nice if the Mikasa had something to shoot at Dupuy de lome Charles Martell Retvisan Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jss78 Players 1,292 posts 12,874 battles Report post #19 Posted March 21, 2019 They'd be essentially limited to one tier, so there's little room to explore these ships. With premiums I imagine the problem is economical. These would be very complex modelling jobs, which at T2 you'd have to sell for like 5 EUR... I'd love a spin-off game that completely focuses around 1900-1920 or so. Start with pre dreadnoughts, work in great detail through WW1, and close with designs such as Ersatz Yorck at T10. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
[BYOB] Aragathor Players 7,047 posts 32,333 battles Report post #20 Posted March 21, 2019 Last year there was some info posted about the T2 Borodino, with some pictures and soft stats. Can't remember if the ship was shelved or dropped. The image looked as if the ship model was done. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
[S-E] FixCVs_Nautical_Metaphor Players 3,532 posts 29,240 battles Report post #21 Posted March 21, 2019 Vor 12 Stunden, Skurfa sagte: It seems odd DD's have the same guns, but being more accurate than the ones sitting on larger (more stable) ships... Quite right, but it's just a minor one of so many oddities, like for example the terrible dispersion on the BBs when in fact they were historically among the most accurate rifles ever. I frankly don't see a way around that without disrupting game balance. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
[N_R_A] Hopeless_Guppy Players 3,753 posts Report post #22 Posted March 21, 2019 Can we have a HMS Thunderchild please? 3 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
[FTR] zFireWyvern Modder, Alpha Tester 1,879 posts 1,162 battles Report post #23 Posted March 21, 2019 4 hours ago, Aragathor said: Last year there was some info posted about the T2 Borodino, with some pictures and soft stats. Can't remember if the ship was shelved or dropped. The image looked as if the ship model was done. Given that said info was only ever shared on one site, that nothing has been heard since and that the news was dropped on April 1st I'd say it was probably just a pretty well done April Fool's joke. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CptBarney Players 8,127 posts 245 battles Report post #24 Posted March 21, 2019 14 hours ago, Nishi_Kinuyo said: While valid arguements, the only reason Mikasa is even in the game is, afaik, the fact it still exists. EH russian bb’s will soon be in the game sooooooooo. Yeah they could just plonk something at tier 2 and call it ‘Little tsar’ *pats smoll nishi on the ead* Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CptBarney Players 8,127 posts 245 battles Report post #25 Posted March 21, 2019 OH here is that borodino ship that the guy above was talking about. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Borodino-class_battleship soz for double post pls dont buli. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
