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Cadelanne

Does someone have any success with CV since rework ?

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The title is self explanatory. I have no clue on how I'm supposed to achieve basically anything. Since I came back after a 2-years break to test this assassination rework I have something like 30k damage average on Shokaku ... it feels unplayable. Had a baltimore wiping a full DB squad out of the sky in litteraly less than 2 seconds.

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Yes, however you need practically the same amount of knowledge of the previous iteration (you only need to discard the control scheme and fighter play, everything else still applies) in addition to knowledge on how to perform in reworked CVs specifically.

 

Aka CVs have actually become more difficult to play and master with the rework.

If you can pull that off though then reworked CVs have actually higher game influence potential than their predecessors at least in high tiers.

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51 minutes ago, El2aZeR said:

Yes, however you need practically the same amount of knowledge of the previous iteration (you only need to discard the control scheme and fighter play, everything else still applies) in addition to knowledge on how to perform in reworked CVs specifically.

 

Aka CVs have actually become more difficult to play and master with the rework.

If you can pull that off though then reworked CVs have actually higher game influence potential than their predecessors at least in high tiers.

 

Ok and do you have any advice to at least feel relevent ? What should I do ?

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20 minutes ago, Cadelanne said:

 

Ok and do you have any advice to at least feel relevent ? What should I do ?

Start with rockets, try to spot as many as possible ships to give rough idea who goes where, any singled out DDs or low AA ships you can harass. If enemy is packed to the brim with AA and/or refuse to split into convenient single targets, you play glorified spotter until enemies scatter. And get used to bleeding planes from cruisers when doing so, WG balancing at its finest

 

Important - when planes are in "ready to attack", or known as green reticle, they gain 30% damage reduction because magic, combined with full boost its one way of getting through AA relatively intact. Works fabulously on TB, okay on rockets BUT doesn't work on dive bombers, as they spend a lot of time prepping attack for only few seconds of shield.

 

AP bombers are anti cruiser and anti German BB tool first and foremost. To avoid overpen you need to drop bombs late, when planes exit their dive. Bombs can ricochet off so try to not overdo.

 

(IJN) torpedo bombers when stacked with max concealment can carry out quick Boom and Zoom basically. Start attack run preferably undetected at +-8km away from broadside target at full speed, so when planes enter AA they already enjoy damage reduction. Drop ordnance whenever you're sure it connects and zoom away from any AA range, preferably entering 2nd "attack run" as soon as possible for the same reason. Avoid turning around within AA range, unless situation critical or target is very weak in AA, beware of flak though.

 

Islands are your friend and foe - they screw up attack runs when flying over them, but if you start on open water, drop ordnance and fly over (tall) island it can give you cover from AA, modus operandi against island camping cruisers

 

That and practice practice practice on torpedo and especially AP bomb drops. Spending few hours in training room against bots is not bad idea at all, especially if you want to learn who you can citadel reliably with bombs.

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11 minutes ago, Cadelanne said:

What should I do ?

 

First of all, switch to the USN line. IJN is pretty meh right now at best.

(Don't sell the IJN CVs tho. You never know what WG does next.)

 

Then learn how to use DBs. These are going to be your primary damage dealers against pretty much everything but they're especially effective against DDs at T8+.

 

After that it's the usual stuff of going after exposed DDs first and foremost while avoiding no fly zones like the plague unless you're sure you can take them out (if e.g. they're sitting behind an island you can abuse) or you're otherwise forced to attack them. Gamble the DoT system as hard as you can against BBs to give you massive damage totals. Learn how to use torps but don't rely on them too much. RF nerf hit their utility against DDs hard so you may want to use TiTs from T8+ onward to have another source of fire damage against BBs and cruisers while reserving your DBs for use against DDs.

And finally, learn how to dodge flak. Instead of avoiding them after they spawn however you should redirect them towards where you don't actually wanna go. Flak always spawns in the direction you're flying at set intervals, that means if you preemptively use WASD flak practically always misses.

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3 hours ago, El2aZeR said:

 

First of all, switch to the USN line. IJN is pretty meh right now at best.

(Don't sell the IJN CVs tho. You never know what WG does next.)

 

Then learn how to use DBs. These are going to be your primary damage dealers against pretty much everything but they're especially effective against DDs at T8+.

 

After that it's the usual stuff of going after exposed DDs first and foremost while avoiding no fly zones like the plague unless you're sure you can take them out (if e.g. they're sitting behind an island you can abuse) or you're otherwise forced to attack them. Gamble the DoT system as hard as you can against BBs to give you massive damage totals. Learn how to use torps but don't rely on them too much. RF nerf hit their utility against DDs hard so you may want to use TiTs from T8+ onward to have another source of fire damage against BBs and cruisers while reserving your DBs for use against DDs.

And finally, learn how to dodge flak. Instead of avoiding them after they spawn however you should redirect them towards where you don't actually wanna go. Flak always spawns in the direction you're flying at set intervals, that means if you preemptively use WASD flak practically always misses.

 

Flak didn't seem really dodgeable to now. No matter how frequently I turn and slow down I still get shredded. How does it works exactly ? Am I supposed to do longer turns or something ?

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16 minutes ago, Cadelanne said:

 

Flak didn't seem really dodgeable to now. No matter how frequently I turn and slow down I still get shredded. How does it works exactly ? Am I supposed to do longer turns or something ?

Certain amount of flak (5 I think?) spawn in front of squadron with lead dependent on squadron speed, any extra flak spawns left and right, which if enough high AA ships are present, can create unavoidable wall of flak.

 

Some food for eyes from certain Enterpleb fanboy:Smile_trollface:

 

 

IIRC its initial 0.8.0 release, which had FATAL flak damage but continous dps was very weak, also returning squadrons (F key) was straight up cheese to evade pretty much anything. Which is why now you need to combine AD keys with W to gtfo asap out of range and if you want to recall planes, do so outside of any AA as even puny IJN DD will be able to shred some planes by spawning flak on their way home

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26 minutes ago, Cadelanne said:

Flak didn't seem really dodgeable to now. No matter how frequently I turn and slow down I still get shredded. How does it works exactly ? Am I supposed to do longer turns or something ?

 

Flak always gives you the same time to react regardless of your speed. That means you need to go into AA fast, then slow down. Then repeat that at the set intervals flak spawns in while using A and D to misdirect flak into shooting where you do not want to go.

 

See here for a more in-depth explanation:

https://forum.worldofwarships.com/topic/180535-how-to-play-cv-rework-my-compilationguide-of-what-to-expect-and-how-to-play/

(Under 5-4. Abusing Flak Spawns)

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14 hours ago, El2aZeR said:

 

Flak always gives you the same time to react regardless of your speed. That means you need to go into AA fast, then slow down. Then repeat that at the set intervals flak spawns in while using A and D to misdirect flak into shooting where you do not want to go.

 

See here for a more in-depth explanation:

https://forum.worldofwarships.com/topic/180535-how-to-play-cv-rework-my-compilationguide-of-what-to-expect-and-how-to-play/

(Under 5-4. Abusing Flak Spawns)

I'm trying it but wether I get hit or not seems to be totally random, sometimes I'll be doing this and it'll work but at some point I'll take a flak hit that'll take 5 planes done for some reason.

 

Besides that the autopilot couldn't be worse, on some map I spawn in such a way that I can never ever move because autopilot being so bad.

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Very welcome buffs are coming to IJN CVs and carriers in general, just in time as I'm close to getting Hakuryu myself:Smile_trollface:

 

Big change is air concealment ≥ AA range on cruisers, combined with max camo IJN TB you can once more, stalk Woosters and Minotaurs undetected

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6 minutes ago, Panocek said:

Very welcome buffs are coming to IJN CVs and carriers in general, just in time as I'm close to getting Hakuryu myself:Smile_trollface:

 

Big change is air concealment ≥ AA range on cruisers, combined with max camo IJN TB you can once more, stalk Woosters and Minotaurs undetected

Really? What and when? Isnthwre a Source?

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30 minutes ago, Panocek said:

 

Thanks. So I see:

 

- slightly better torp aim on Shokaku and Hakuryu

- a nerf to Kaga’s DBs and TB recovery 

- a nerf to GZ’s torpedoes 

- a fix to stealth AA cruisers 

 

It is something but doesn’t address the AA topics such as:

- excessive overlapping AA

- overbuffed Constant AA DPS

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Just now, 1MajorKoenig said:

 

Thanks. So I see:

 

- slightly better torp aim on Shokaku and Hakuryu

- a nerf to Kaga’s DBs and TB recovery 

- a nerf to GZ’s torpedoes 

- a fix to stealth AA cruisers 

 

It is something but doesn’t address the AA topics such as:

- excessive overlapping AA

- overbuffed Constant AA DPS

You've missed

-increased amount of TB on board for Shokek and Haku (2 full squads)

-4th heal with shorter cooldown on IJN TBs

-considerable buff to stock plane hp, not relevant long term though, but nice

 

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6 minutes ago, Panocek said:

You've missed

-increased amount of TB on board for Shokek and Haku (2 full squads)

-4th heal with shorter cooldown on IJN TBs

-considerable buff to stock plane hp, not relevant long term though, but nice

 

 

You’re right 

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On 3/4/2019 at 4:55 PM, Cadelanne said:

The title is self explanatory. I have no clue on how I'm supposed to achieve basically anything. Since I came back after a 2-years break to test this assassination rework I have something like 30k damage average on Shokaku ... it feels unplayable. Had a baltimore wiping a full DB squad out of the sky in litteraly less than 2 seconds.

The best way to approach heavy AA is with full bost. So never waste your boost. Safe always enough boost for approaches. Also it needs some training to do a max. Speed approach.

With Haku AP Bombs you can somtimes two-shot CAs, so it's kinda nice with IJN.

You should also always consinder, if an attack makes sense, or if you should wait for a better target, same like you did with the pre-rework CV. Look for easy targets and have patient.

Also: Are really the Flak-explosions the issue, or the continuous dps?

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Am 4.3.2019 um 16:55, Cadelanne sagte:

The title is self explanatory. I have no clue on how I'm supposed to achieve basically anything. Since I came back after a 2-years break to test this assassination rework I have something like 30k damage average on Shokaku ... it feels unplayable. Had a baltimore wiping a full DB squad out of the sky in litteraly less than 2 seconds.

It's not that bad as some people say.

Yes, the alpha damage potential is a lot lower than before.

Yes, the overall damage was reduced but over the time you have (not beeing shot at until late game) gives enough time to add up damage.

Yes, they start shining in mid and late game cause AA of early game ship bubbles is very strong. But it was the same with the old gameplay too IMO.

No, it's not easier than old RTS gameplay cause you still have to know a lot.

 

Beeing uptiered is hard (and was with old gameplay too). That's were plane management kicks in. And thats something that a lot of players seems not to do or understand judgeing by Youtube Videos. Starts with flying into already discovered "no fly zones" and ends with "pressing F key bevor flown out of AA zones" so that some planes could be saved for return. But to be honest theres no tutorial from WG or on youtube which tells people how to do it right.

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Manage health on planes, if you have 5 yellow and 3 red health planes, it's usually better to send them back to cv for repairs than to throw them away in attack (unless it's something you can kill). 

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Ok so I tried a bit more to understand how flak works but I still have some questions.

 

Whenever I approach a ship with flak he start shooting at me with regular AA and flak. As you guys described there is a "flak wall" that I have to avoid. Problem is that I don't really understand. Sometimes it works as you described, the flak shoot with a lead on my planes and if I maneuver I can dodge it, but sometimes it repetedly shoot at the  exact same place. It actually looks like the same shells are detonating several time at a .5 seconds inverval. Slowing down doesn't help and I either have to turn and mess the strike, or eat the flak wall. What does trigger this ? How to avoid it ?

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You have to turn to avoid it, I don't think management of speed will help you. However, you can use this to lead flak to wrong direction.

 

For example divebombers: Let's say you are coming from the side of the ship. You actively avoid flak (going a bit left and right) while you are approaching. You are a bit in front of the ship now, but still on his left or right side (you don't want to bomb the side, less impact). Change course to for example hard right when you are in front of him. His last flak salvo will be in your previous direction and you have a window now before next flak will adapt to your new direction. You are now  within bombing area, so no more flak to worry about until after bombs hit. 

 

This was just an example, in other situations it's better to fly straight in,but try to avoid as much flak as possible (sometimes you have to take quite a detour around a flak wall). 

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23 minutes ago, Nit0 said:

You have to turn to avoid it, I don't think management of speed will help you. However, you can use this to lead flak to wrong direction.

 

For example divebombers: Let's say you are coming from the side of the ship. You actively avoid flak (going a bit left and right) while you are approaching. You are a bit in front of the ship now, but still on his left or right side (you don't want to bomb the side, less impact). Change course to for example hard right when you are in front of him. His last flak salvo will be in your previous direction and you have a window now before next flak will adapt to your new direction. You are now  within bombing area, so no more flak to worry about until after bombs hit. 

 

This was just an example, in other situations it's better to fly straight in,but try to avoid as much flak as possible (sometimes you have to take quite a detour around a flak wall). 

 

Yeah on most ship flak is the only thing that really deplete your planes now. It also make striking groups even harder than it already was as you can dodge flak from one ship, not from 4.

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Hi guys , reading a lot about constant dps and flak and how to do but still my planes get shredded. 

I play Midway with almost all hp boosters except SE because of the CE I have on midway. 

 

Whenever I try to attack the first run goes pretty ok but right after that my planes vanish in thin air trying to get out the AA. 

Is the AA still that strong or am I doing something wrong ?

also my DB and TT seem to lack accuracy. When I approach the ideal position for example a BB with my DB , I approach from nose or back and the green circle covers the ship but still my bombs get only 1 or 2 hits and the rest drops in the water??

 

any help is very welcome ! 

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2 hours ago, HoLeeKow said:

Hi guys , reading a lot about constant dps and flak and how to do but still my planes get shredded. 

I play Midway with almost all hp boosters except SE because of the CE I have on midway. 

 

Whenever I try to attack the first run goes pretty ok but right after that my planes vanish in thin air trying to get out the AA. 

Is the AA still that strong or am I doing something wrong ?

also my DB and TT seem to lack accuracy. When I approach the ideal position for example a BB with my DB , I approach from nose or back and the green circle covers the ship but still my bombs get only 1 or 2 hits and the rest drops in the water??

 

any help is very welcome ! 

When disengaging you still need to WSAD your way through, "F" key within any AA range is almost guaranteed death sentence as planes fly predictably for about 10s, enough to spawn and get shredded by AA flak.

 

Dive bombers are still subject to RNGesus whims, so nothing hitting target despite you doing everything (presumably) right is working as intended. Though late bomb drops, from (very) low altitude seems to somewhat fix dispersion, or at least I get such impression.

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So you have this also with Hakuryu?

i was wondering if it’s same or worse if she is worth researching. 

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