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Griva

Next Clan battles season format

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A clan mate told me WG had currently no plans to admit carriers to Clan Battles, don't remember the source, could have been Reddit.

 

My question would be though what are the chances that clan battles are held on a different Tier than Tier X. It might even be a business opportunity. All the premium ships you can buy outright are on lower tiers; people would conceivably use up doubloons to transfer their top commanders down there... smaller maps, closer distances = more action and excitement...

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9 minutes ago, Nautical_Metaphor said:

My question would be though what are the chances that clan battles are held on a different Tier than Tier X. It might even be a business opportunity. All the premium ships you can buy outright are on lower tiers; people would conceivably use up doubloons to transfer their top commanders down there... smaller maps, closer distances = more action and excitement...

 

T10 in itself is reasonably balanced, and while some ships arent played that frequently, there usually is still a variety going on in CBs.

Other tiers... might get more onesided. F.e. T9 ranked right now. Most people play BB/DD, mostly Musashi/Kitakaze/(Black/Chung Mu). That says a lot. While in CBs you could take 1 BB, which would result in more Cruisers, Kronshtadt would most likely be the go to ship because it has so much HP and Radar. Is a bit like Stalingrad, but with a better protected Citadel actually.

 

Imo it gets only worse on other tiers, and there you even have ships which arent available any longer (Belfast/Kutuzov/Kamikaze/Nikolai if you wanna go that low).

Maybe T6 would be an option, which is also a reasonably balanced tier in itself imo.

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Vor 44 Minuten, DFens_666 sagte:

Imo it gets only worse on other tiers, and there you even have ships which arent available any longer (Belfast/Kutuzov/Kamikaze/Nikolai if you wanna go that low).

 

There's a lot more concerted team action in CBs, so Ranked is somewhat limited as an indicator.

 

That said, I thought Tier 8 Ranked was very well balanced and without carriers, it would be even better.

 

Even Tier VII could be good. Belfast players have been insisting the ship has been powercrept and against a well-balanced team of seven working together, it might not be a worse proposition than Stalingrad at Tier X.

 

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21 hours ago, Griva said:

 

@MrConway do you have any informations about next cb format?

 

It has not been decided yet, stay tuned.

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Going to be a tad controversial here, yes, CV's will mean that cruisers and BB's are spotted a lot earlier, but isn't that just a "learn to adapt" thing?

 

The really good clans, will monitor, adapt and overcome the limitations.

 

Having some clans running 4/5 radar ships means caps are perma spotted, I'm always told as a DD player to "learn to adapt", why is that only the case for 1 class of players. 

 

So what if you're spotted? So what if a CV is in the game? the constant radar meta has pushed many clans to not using DD's at all, we were also told to "adapt" to the Stalingrad, why all the fuss over CV's?

 

Seems it's one rule for some and one rule for others.

 

TB.

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2 hours ago, Nautical_Metaphor said:

My question would be though what are the chances that clan battles are held on a different Tier than Tier X. It might even be a business opportunity. All the premium ships you can buy outright are on lower tiers; people would conceivably use up doubloons to transfer their top commanders down there... smaller maps, closer distances = more action and excitement...

The logical tier would, presumably, be T8 - lots of expensive premiums to sell etc. I don't think there are any obvious OP monsters either (I think everyone worked out Loyang ages ago, plus there's lots of radar about these days as well)...?

That said, T10 hasn't been getting the systematic rinsing lately that was happening six moths or so ago, so there might be less T10 fatique these days; remove CVs (until they're balanced), and T10 would still be pretty decent.

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19 hours ago, Tyrendian89 said:

Mistakes were definitely involved in him dying like that

You mean mistakes like getting hit by 6 of 8 shells on 25.5km? Even if all those hits would have been overpens only I would have raged like hell in that Hinden...

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2 hours ago, T3ddyBear said:

Going to be a tad controversial here, yes, CV's will mean that cruisers and BB's are spotted a lot earlier, but isn't that just a "learn to adapt" thing?

 

The really good clans, will monitor, adapt and overcome the limitations.

 

Having some clans running 4/5 radar ships means caps are perma spotted, I'm always told as a DD player to "learn to adapt", why is that only the case for 1 class of players. 

 

So what if you're spotted? So what if a CV is in the game? the constant radar meta has pushed many clans to not using DD's at all, we were also told to "adapt" to the Stalingrad, why all the fuss over CV's?

 

Seems it's one rule for some and one rule for others.

 

TB.

Thats not the point. If you add CVs to CB the gameplay will change, and obviously you can adapt, you have to adapt. The problem is the gameplay will be broken and not fun. Also it's not possible to overcome some limitations.

In case of  DDs people are talking about adapting too but that was [edited] - it's not argument. On top of that we are not talking about breaking balance of one class but all classes. The game is simply broken.

 

Looks like you want justice so much that you will push yourself and everyone else into hell just to "doom" cruisers (even without radars), but you don't realise DD's are in the same position...

 

1 hour ago, Verblonde said:

The logical tier would, presumably, be T8 - lots of expensive premiums to sell etc. I don't think there are any obvious OP monsters either (I think everyone worked out Loyang ages ago, plus there's lots of radar about these days as well)...?

That said, T10 hasn't been getting the systematic rinsing lately that was happening six moths or so ago, so there might be less T10 fatique these days; remove CVs (until they're balanced), and T10 would still be pretty decent.

Higher tiers are made to be skill dependent more than RNG as tier II. Also it's quite balanced and fun but except this, by adding gamemode on tier X they relieve tier 8 MM from higher tiers. That was the role of arms race before too.

 

And still I have no idea how changing tier would solve the problem :crab:

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17 hours ago, Kuritaclan said:

How about CVs only on even numbered days ;) So Tuesday, Thursday and Saturday or on the odnumbered.

how about on mondays, tuesdays and fridays?

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Jokes aside, OP raises some very valid points about spotting and that bringing in CV's isn't just a meta change, it'd be a whole different game mode.
CV's are being balanced currently around a 12 man opposition too, 7 or 8 opponents only strengthens their hand.
Thanks OP for opening the debate, you've highlighted areas I'd not really considered, I'd been looking at it from a DD-centric PoV and was looking forward to less Hydro and builds a little less DPM focused but that really is an irrelevance if we lose the whole dynamic of play calling and second guessing the opponent.

CV's should have a place in team competitive somewhere, maybe not Clan Battles though.

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From my point of view ( and probably a lot of other clans without TX CVs) it would mean that we lost even before we started so it would be no point in playing at all. Someone probably would be able to grind/freeXP TX CV (or jump in a rental ship) but not everyone can play all the time. It can be challenging to get 7 decent players sometimes now we would need to find every time one good with CVs as well.  Why forcing ppl into another boring camp fest? We have enough of this over spotting :etc_swear: in randoms with CV, where you can not sneak on the enemy with stealthy CC, can not flank with BB, spot or cap with DD because you are seen and focused before even you start trying to do something else then blob behind the nearest island. I think CVs should be left in randoms, coop and scenarios plus KoTS. Maybe in a distant future if these problems will be addressed somehow (can't see the way thought) we could try CVs in CBs.

I am not saying this because I do not play CVs. I am saying it because CVs are killing the fun and class balance in this game by making it boring, campy and predictable.

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I suppose you could enforce mirrored MM if you were really keen to include CVs in Clans (capped at one CV, obviously); that way, any team that doesn't include a CV, would face a similarly bereft team.

Might well not do the queue times for the CV-including teams much good though.

 

I still think that no CVs is the way to go though, at least until CVs are properly sorted out. To increase the likelihood further: if WG leave out CVs, we'll have to pay doubloons to re-equip our ships to make them more suitable for a no-plane environment - that's WG's motivation sorted out, right there...

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9 minut temu, Verblonde napisał:

 To increase the likelihood further: if WG leave out CVs, we'll have to pay doubloons to re-equip our ships to make them more suitable for a no-plane environment - that's WG's motivation sorted out, right there...

1

To be fair they do offer free respecs. Do not give them ideas about doubloons pls... :cap_haloween:

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16 minutes ago, DariusJacek said:

To be fair they do offer free respecs. Do not give them ideas about doubloons pls... :cap_haloween:

If I'm completely honest, I'd forgotten that they do that for Clans...!

 

Edit: slightly in my defence, I usually play DDs, and my old random set-up worked pretty much fine for Clans too.

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Well since now most clans run dds mostly for spotting (ie you dont fire guns unless already spotted and cant run so you dont get pinned down) cv would probably make dds mostly an obsolete pick it would all boil down to taking a cv and a crapload of dps cruisers -> cv go find the nearest target -> all focus it -> next target

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18 hours ago, MrConway said:

 

It has not been decided yet, stay tuned.

I guess a more informative feedback would be like that:

 

1. WG DEVs are still working on balancing the CVs - that is based on public references made earlier. It is not expected that CVs balance will be final before 0.8.2 most probably

2. While it is not a WG organized event, but KoTS season 8 is starting and there the decision was to admit CVs as an option. The point here is the test the system through a community organized competitive event.

 

Last but not least: while there is no calendar announcement on the next Clan Battle season it is expected within a month based on previous track record.

 

BTW: regarding CV season 4 there was absolutely no announcement about the winner and participation. It simply got forgotten at least on the EU portal.

 

(this took me 5 minutes to compile - WG could do better)

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well i dont see the problem i really dont see it, youre spoted huh? old haku had 8 squads in the air permaspotting all he wanted.... AA after reowrk is more punishing than before so cvs are in a bad spot atm, and if any of you played (and i know few of you did) old team battles in 7 vs 7 we had cvs, and it worked, and it was fun and people played it....

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How many times have you guys gone into stealth with a sliver of health left? Lots of times right?

How many times will you go into stealth with a sliver of health left when there is a CV around? Right. never.

Because in a clanbattle environment the enemy CV will always use his planes to either keep low hp targets spotted or to finish them off himself.

CVs in a 7v7 gamestyle will be massively overpowered and influential, as shown by the screenshots provided by @Tyrendian89 (and that is 9v9 so just imagine 7v7).

 

I can pull this one again:

image.png.fa6f6800c56e05923f5c16284b1f5f11.png

 

The clanbattles gamemode is pretty polished as it is. Lets keep it that way.

 

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23 hours ago, MrConway said:

 

It has not been decided yet, stay tuned.

 

When will the season 5 starts?

Our Squadron mostly just wait to play CB, the rest isnt really enjoyable any more

 

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46 minutes ago, dhyran said:

 

When will the season 5 starts?

Our Squadron mostly just wait to play CB, the rest isnt really enjoyable any more

 

 

We'll have information on dates closer to launch, but you shouldn't expect anything during update 0.8.1.

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On 2/26/2019 at 12:12 PM, Tyrendian89 said:

well yeah of course they would like to... that should be kinda obvious from their perspective. Doesn't mean they will definitely do it...

 

When WG said, they will never do something, and in the end they do it anyway, then i translate

"would like to do it" into "hell yeah, we WILL definetely do it"

:cap_haloween:

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49 minutes ago, MrConway said:

 

We'll have information on dates closer to launch, but you shouldn't expect anything during update 0.8.1.

allright, when will 0.8.2 be released? 

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10 hours ago, Yedwy said:

Well since now most clans run dds mostly for spotting (ie you dont fire guns unless already spotted and cant run so you dont get pinned down) cv would probably make dds mostly an obsolete pick it would all boil down to taking a cv and a crapload of dps cruisers -> cv go find the nearest target -> all focus it -> next target

 

So what you say is, CVs would make the SINGLE DD that's worth bringing obsolete? Ie, instead of one DD you'd get one CV, so unfair.. or something?

 

That says more about DDs position in CW than anything else.

 

And in CW you don't get people just lining up to be focused down in range of every opposing CA.

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4 hours ago, SexyCroat said:

well i dont see the problem i really dont see it, youre spoted huh? old haku had 8 squads in the air permaspotting all he wanted.... AA after reowrk is more punishing than before so cvs are in a bad spot atm, and if any of you played (and i know few of you did) old team battles in 7 vs 7 we had cvs, and it worked, and it was fun and people played it....

The basic difference is that previously CVs fought against each other and on the other side there was other Haku with the same amount of planes and you could not just yolo spot every time, everywhere you wanted, becuase you needed to deal with enemy planes. Previously the issue of overspotting existed too but assuming you had at least half skilled Cv in your team, you had tool to partly prevent from that. If I just decide (as CV) to finish back line Zao with 5k HP, how you are going to prevent it? I don't even have to strike him - it's enough if I keep him spotted, how to stop me?

Also second significant difference is that previously when game started you needed to wait first, to load your planes and then again wait to take off every single squadron, while now you start in first second of game and getting full speed takes like 3s + on top of that rocket planes are insanely fast.

 

Do you really think that spotting whole enemy team in 45 - 60 seconds and all other stuff listed above seems right?

Still you can disagree because you are CV player or you just like this kind of gameplay but I think it's way more interesting when team is unspotted and there is more tactical play and guessing than only pew pew.

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2 hours ago, AgarwaenME said:

 

So what you say is, CVs would make the SINGLE DD that's worth bringing obsolete? Ie, instead of one DD you'd get one CV, so unfair.. or something?

 

That says more about DDs position in CW than anything else.

 

And in CW you don't get people just lining up to be focused down in range of every opposing CA.

Yes it would becouse it can spot pretty much the same (ranges are a bit of handicap otherwise its straight up better) and cant be killed off quite that easy, especially now that you have regernating planes - planes die, you send other...

 

And  yes they align quite nicely for the most part, range is acctually less of an issue the prevalent problem is keeping them spotted long enough to finish them off when they retreat so they dont regenerate and come back after 3-4 min with half of HP restored, or said dd needs to risk his bacon to get sights on the enemy especially with those cruisers that have radar range near or above concealment - you come in spot them they see you detecting them, radar pops up you are fu** this way its only a flight of planes gone...

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