Matchmaker Discussion Thread & MM Balance

[deathsadow]

11 hours ago, DFens_666 said:

 

That should not be a big deal, especially since you have 15k games...

There are only a few important thresholds, because there arent that many different caliber sizes (for BBs that is, since most others cant overmatch anything anyway)

 

Yeah basically what you need to know:

 

25mm gets overmatched 380mm

27mm gets overmatched 406mm

30mm gets overmatched 457mm

32mm gets overmatched 460mm

 

the only outlyer might be the Shikishima what is extremly rare and if you consider is same as a 460 you should be mostly fine

 

[Floofz]

16 minutes ago, deathsadow said:

Yeah basically what you need to know:

 

25mm gets overmatched 380mm

27mm gets overmatched 406mm

30mm gets overmatched 457mm

32mm gets overmatched 460mm

 

the only outlyer might be the Shikishima what is extremly rare and if you consider is same as a 460 you should be mostly fine

 

431 mm overmatches 30 mm btw, you dont need 457s. (Republique).

[Captaindanz]

And people are asking why people are playing in divisions...

This player base is so slow.

[mns_2_tuga64]

On 2/24/2019 at 9:37 AM, Excavatus said:

Hey there ladies and gentelmen,

Same as other similar titles, the matchmaking of this game will never give rest to people.

The discussion about that will never cease to exist.

 

+-2 tier differences,

Radar ship imbalances in MMs,

or anything regarding to the MM.. from now on, goes here.

 

 

So, please keep your Discussions about the subject on this pinned thread for now on.

And as always, keep calm, stay civil and be nice to each other.

 

Have a good day.

Unfortunately the matchmaking of this game is terrible as it is possible 5 matches in ranked 5 losses always with opposing teams of higher value unfair matchmaking and without criteria, that if you lose 2 or 3 in a row can now be 5 in a row. It is bad organization of who created the game.

2 tiers of difference even worse for when the player's option can say he doesn't want to play with tiers above his tier.

Unfortunately I am obliged to write in English for when a forum in Portuguese of Portugal.

[mns_2_tuga64]

Unfortunately the matchmaking of this game is terrible as it is possible 5 matches in ranked 5 losses always with opposing teams of higher value unfair matchmaking and without criteria, that if you lose 2 or 3 in a row can now be 5 in a row. It is bad organization of who created the game.

2 tiers of difference even worse for when the player's option can say he doesn't want to play with tiers above his tier.

Unfortunately I am obliged to write in English for when a forum in Portuguese of Portugal.

 

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[Darkeid]

Its the same fail in both random and ranked , just look at this major imbalance between teams 

 

Since February 2019 we have 135 pages of players asking an improvement in the MM engine , sadly WG is not even responding to this thread this is just a place to vent frustration with no effect. 

[ColonelPete]

17 minutes ago, Darkeid said:

Its the same fail in both random and ranked , just look at this major imbalance between teams 

 

Since February 2019 we have 135 pages of players asking an improvement in the MM engine , sadly WG is not even responding to this thread this is just a place to vent frustration with no effect. 

They just adapted the MM. Seems like that is "no response" for you...

[Darkeid]

35 minutes ago, ColonelPete said:

They just adapted the MM. Seems like that is "no response" for you...

You cant possibly call the MM shown as an "adaptation" , they cant have implemented an improvement? adaptation? and have 7 way below average players go vs a certainly more experienced team. The outcome of this match was kind of pre-decided by the MM rng due to the teams imbalance. 

However, if what you claim is not a lie or a IRL smoke screen, whoever took notice and gave the effort to "adapt" the MM obviously did not pay enough attention to what is really happening nor did he care to follow up the outcome of his "adaptation". 

 

[ColonelPete]

7 minutes ago, Darkeid said:

However, if what you claim is not a lie or a IRL smoke screen, whoever took notice and gave the effort to "adapt" the MM obviously did not pay enough attention to what is really happening nor did he care to follow up the outcome of his "adaptation".

You should read up on MM changes when you do not trust other posters...

 

[loppantorkel]

3 hours ago, Darkeid said:

You cant possibly call the MM shown as an "adaptation" , they cant have implemented an improvement? adaptation? and have 7 way below average players go vs a certainly more experienced team. The outcome of this match was kind of pre-decided by the MM rng due to the teams imbalance. 

However, if what you claim is not a lie or a IRL smoke screen, whoever took notice and gave the effort to "adapt" the MM obviously did not pay enough attention to what is really happening nor did he care to follow up the outcome of his "adaptation".

..but who says 'the community' wants the changes to MM that you propose - skill-based MM? I don't. Random MM should be random, meaning some games are tougher and some games are easier than others. If you stop using XVM or similar mods, you won't see it.

[Echo_519]

For the love of all gods available, WG, please give us skillbased matchmaking finally. PLEASE.

I want to have 11 teammates that are on similar skill and understanding of the game as me. But no, You give me the worst 11 players you could find and put them all together in my team. Not one single of my teammates managed to receive first blood today. I managed to get it 3 times, the other 8 all the enemy. How?????? I don't care about having better players on my enemy team then normal, aslong as my teammates are aswell.... PLEASE WG, do it finally. It's not that hard to achieve... 

[ColonelPete]

39 minutes ago, Echo_519 said:

For the love of all gods available, WG, please give us skillbased matchmaking finally. PLEASE.

I want to have 11 teammates that are on similar skill and understanding of the game as me. But no, You give me the worst 11 players you could find and put them all together in my team. Not one single of my teammates managed to receive first blood today. I managed to get it 3 times, the other 8 all the enemy. How?????? I don't care about having better players on my enemy team then normal, aslong as my teammates are aswell.... PLEASE WG, do it finally. It's not that hard to achieve... 

• feel free to play more Clan Battle
• it is very unlikely that all 11 players are worse than you

[Captaindanz]

CHOO CHOO!!!

[Darkeid]

On 8/1/2020 at 6:34 PM, loppantorkel said:

..but who says 'the community' wants the changes to MM that you propose - skill-based MM? I don't. Random MM should be random, meaning some games are tougher and some games are easier than others. If you stop using XVM or similar mods, you won't see it.

... 135 pages in this thread say that MM should be improved , so THAT part of the community wants it. I agree that a new mode should be added , in which a more fair chance is given to both teams playing. As it is right now (most recent game):

 

The engine disregards the super unicum division, or the vast difference in avg dmg of the players and adds 2 more super unicums stat players in 1 team whereas the other has none. Absolutely no chance of winning. 

 

Another roflstomp - did not even have time to gain normal base xp. , courtesy of WG's unbalanced mm engine. The players with less than or around 1k battles were simply absent in both the deployment and the critical exchanges of the game. I would bet that if all new players were informed that i.e. around 1 out of 4 matches are a complete waste of time they would not continue playing. Also, the solution "dont look at it so that it wont bother you" is more similar to "yeah its unfair but its better for all that players never find out about it"...

[159Hunter]

@Darkeid you show us one game. You do realize you aren't winning all games? So how is one screenshot a sign of bad mm? 

Now come back to us with screenshots of your last 100 games and then we have something substantial to talk about.

 

And no, I do not want SBMM. I want the ****** people playing this game to actually learn it. Probably won't make me win more, but will at least decrease the amount of annoying roflstomps.

[DFens_666]

7 hours ago, Darkeid said:

I would bet that if all new players were informed that i.e. around 1 out of 4 matches are a complete waste of time they would not continue playing.

 

If you would tell them to [edited]git gud, then this wouldnt be a thing either. Roflstomps only happen because many players are so abysmally bad, that they literally are not playing the game. You need either enough players who just yolo before the 5 minute mark, or those running behind the nearest island in spawn. First one is gifting the enemies the points directly, the latter indirectly through caps and mapcontrol.

 

This problem has NOTHING to do with MM, its all about the players. How come, roflstomps in CBs dont happen? (well usually dont happen atleast). Right, because teams dont suicide like idiots. And in the end, even raising the level of play will not prevent guaranteed losses - it would only prolong the game.

[ForlornSailor]

10 hours ago, Darkeid said:

... 135 pages in this thread say that MM should be improved , so THAT part of the community wants it.

 

lol nice projection. I and others, that post regulary here, are against the proposed changes (rather often against the posted so-called-evidence aswell). so I could say: "135 pages in this thread say that MM is perfectly fine , so THAT part of the community loves the matchmaker."

 

Beeing dishonest and generalize never does any good to any discussion. and for sure it doesnt do any good to your cause nor your reputation.

[RamboCras]

Sometimes the game starts, you are uptiered and you know you have NO place in the game. Being tier 8 German BB and coming in the range of Smolensk and Yoshino, 1 you can't see, the other impossible to hit with your dispersion. Meanwhile, they melt you don't with fire and damage in seconds.

 

What, for f*ck sake, is the fun in that game WG? Seriously???

 

Can you make it impossible for your incredibly stupid OP ships to come out against lower tier ships? How hard can that be? Show some intelligence and competence...

 

(intelligence and competence is not making a DD that can do 40 torps btw.... that's the opposite)

[Echo_519]

Am 2.8.2020 um 15:54, ColonelPete sagte:

it is very unlikely that all 11 players are worse than you

I guess you never where in a match with me, were you?

If you ever are, you will n otice how i carry carry carry, my teammates throw throw throw and i get rewarded with 0% winrate because i'm the best player iof my team all the damn time???? How does this make any sence WG?n Give me 11 players of my skills and i would have a damn 100.00% winrate because the opponents are not good either. But all 12 oponents are always better then anny of my 11 teammates, so give me some normal teams finally 

this is jus thorrible

Me trying to win all the time, my teammates ust throwing every dman battle like they never playeed any videogame before-.

WG just give us skillbased matchmaking. It would solve so many problems. Noobs not always geting slapped instantly, good players like me not having such teams anymore, everone is hapüpe, good any bad players.

[ColonelPete]

2 minutes ago, Echo_519 said:

1. I guess you never where in a match with me, were you?
2. If you ever are, you will n otice how i carry carry carry, my teammates throw throw throw and i get rewarded with 0% winrate because i'm the best player iof my team all the damn time????

1. Probably not
2. Less than you think...

[DFens_666]

30 minutes ago, Echo_519 said:

I guess you never where in a match with me, were you?

If you ever are, you will n otice how i carry carry carry, my teammates throw throw throw and i get rewarded with 0% winrate because i'm the best player iof my team all the damn time???? How does this make any sence WG?n Give me 11 players of my skills and i would have a damn 100.00% winrate because the opponents are not good either. But all 12 oponents are always better then anny of my 11 teammates, so give me some normal teams finally 

this is jus thorrible

Me trying to win all the time, my teammates ust throwing every dman battle like they never playeed any videogame before-.

WG just give us skillbased matchmaking. It would solve so many problems. Noobs not always geting slapped instantly, good players like me not having such teams anymore, everone is hapüpe, good any bad players.

 

You are pretty much ~server average in damage and kills on most of your ships... how are you carrying again?

[eliastion]

6 hours ago, Echo_519 said:

WG just give us skillbased matchmaking. It would solve so many problems. Noobs not always geting slapped instantly, good players like me not having such teams anymore, everone is hapüpe, good any bad players.

Just for clarity's sake: what do you mean when you say "skill-based matchmaking"?

Two general interpretations come to mind. I doubt you'd be happy with either of them, however. Assuming, that is, that you really are a good player that carries hard (as you claim), hate having bad teams (as most people) and that you like and care about winning (as seems to be the case based on you talking about winrates rather than, idk, low XP gained from lost battles).

 

So, what is it that you'd like to see as "skill-based matchmaking"?

[BanzaiPiluso]

This morning, 10 ships aside and 2 (TWO!) CVs per side, one T8 and the other T6. 

Why do they keep thinking we want more CVs in a game? One CV is more than enough.

4 CVs in battle should be stopped. There are more CVs than ever now so you end up playing CV battles anyways, why to give them priority when there are less players?

 

 

[aler1x]

I personally think +1 MM would be the way to go - it wouldn't stop the complaints, but I think it would lower the frustration. And proof of that is already in the game: From T2 to T3 to T4 to T5 is a steep increase in ship's overall power, but the single steps are manageable and +1 MM means that even if you get uptiered constantly you don't feel completely helpless. Imagine being uptiered to a T5 battle in a T3 ship and, for example, having to fight the likes of König and New York while in your South Carolina. Luckily that can't happen, and Myogi, Gangut and so on are much more manageable.

 

And basically the same goes for T5, T6, and T7 aswell as T8 and T9: The individual steps aren't too big and a T6 ship in a T7 battle can still do fine, but taking two at a time due to constant +2 MM gets frustrating after some time - tell me what Aoba's business is in fighting Clevelands and Tchapayevs or Emerald's in fighting New Orleans? But, again, I think +1 MM would be reasonable - at least for myself I can say that I could live with being constantly uptiered one tier while ten games of low-tier T6 gameplay in a row, preferrably even with T8 Cvs involved, make me quit the game for that day.

 

The only really big one-tier jumps I see are the ones from T7 to T8 due to the change from mid- to high-tier plating values and the introduction of radar and the likes aswell as the jump from T9 to T10 due to ship's stats generally going crazy at that point. But I think that most T7 ships can just about handle most T8 ships, so +1 MM should be fine there. On the other hand, T10 is such a league of its own that it might even warrant to give T10 their own T10-only battles and completely exclude them from the normal matchmaking - that might even raise T9 games played as T9s would be guaranteed to be top tier…

 

Anyway, thoughts?

[ColonelPete]

2 hours ago, aler1x said:

Anyway, thoughts?

Look at the frustrated complaints about Ranked. That is +0 MM with smaller teams.