Jump to content
You need to play a total of 50 battles to post in this section.
mil71

Carriers little to no damage on anything

101 comments in this topic

Recommended Posts

Beta Tester
72 posts

Looks like it's back to playing destroyer plague over again at least destroyers can put out some damage and change games unlike carriers now.

Carriers are pathetic compared to this level of damage, AA instantly destroys your aircraft, destroyers are immune to you while up close and to top the cake you can't even dodge while in combat because you can only auto pilot around the map.

aaafafafafaf.png

  • Cool 1
  • Boring 2
  • Bad 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Players
97 posts
465 battles

DDs are pretty OP and are the dominant Shiptype. If you can't locate a DD for a couple of minutes a BB, some Cruiser or CV will die in glorious Torpedo hell.

  • Cool 1
  • Funny 8

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Players
822 posts
7,760 battles
5 minutes ago, sgtmarple said:

DDs are pretty OP and are the dominant Shiptype. If you can't locate a DD for a couple of minutes a BB, some Cruiser or CV will die in glorious Torpedo hell.

DDs are OP? How would you know? :) And no, BBs are the dominant ship type and has been for a long time.

  • Cool 3
  • Funny 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Players
2,488 posts
2,601 battles

I'd agree that a shiptype that can't do its own HITPOINTS worth of damage is a pretty pathetic piñata.

Maybe reduce the hitpoints...  16000 for Langley sounds allright to me :Smile_trollface:

  • Cool 1
  • Funny 1
  • Bad 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Players
2,488 posts
2,601 battles

Just had a few TVIII games in Ranger... LOL... how about reducing the hitpoints for that one to 5000? :Smile_facepalm:

At least then it can 'pull its own weight'. Because that's the average, sort of. 

Last squadron got shot down in 3 seconds and I don't even know by what. :fish_nerv:

 

Strangely though, I still keep getting credits. So I must be doing something right. Can't imagine what. 

Last game I had a great idea, I'll go put a ramming flag on it and then see how that goes. 

Can't be much worse and at least it will be over quickly. :Smile_trollface:

  • Cool 2
  • Funny 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Players
4,085 posts
6,265 battles
17 minutes ago, BLUB__BLUB said:

Last game I had a great idea, I'll go put a ramming flag on it and then see how that goes. 

 

Ramming with the auto-pilot might be a whole new challenge. Be sure to make some screens or a video when you succeed :Smile_veryhappy:

  • Cool 5

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Players
2,488 posts
2,601 battles
3 minutes ago, ForlornSailor said:

 

Ramming with the auto-pilot might be a whole new challenge. Be sure to make some screens or a video when you succeed :Smile_veryhappy:

I will, maybe I get some kind of bonus. But really - all funnies aside, OP is right.

You can't do much in a T8 game. I think I'm pretty N00B - so I must be the "new-style-CV-target-group", right?

Well I do more damage in a DD, and I suck at DDs... man it's ridiculous. Whole squadrons get deleted in seconds. 

And sometimes you do not even know what hit them (it stays undetected or I'd see it on the minimap).

"I guess that AA cruiser is somewhere over there cause they're falling like flies", LOLZ. :Smile_trollface:

 

In a T6 game it's better but still can't even do my own hitpoints in damage. 

And then I think T4 CV was bad... hahaha! :Smile_hiding:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[SM0KE]
Players
2,635 posts
6,496 battles
1 hour ago, sgtmarple said:

DDs are pretty OP and are the dominant Shiptype.

My DDs appear to be broken - would correct form call for me to have a tantrum at this point, and demand a refund (with a modicum of stamped feet)?

 

:Smile_unsure:

  • Funny 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Players
4,085 posts
6,265 battles
5 minutes ago, BLUB__BLUB said:

In a T6 game it's better but still can't even do my own hitpoints in damage. 

And then I think T4 CV was bad... hahaha! :Smile_hiding:

 

But yea, something needs to be done. WG doesnt want +/- 1 mm. AA and CVs are too different, especially in the ranges T5 to T8 and T6 to T10. This goes for CVs aswell as for any surface ship. Check the greatest gaming achievements thread and you see, what a T8 CV in T6 mm can do. I dont know. For the moment, there is not much we can do I think. Guess we need to start to learn chinese then. Im already on it myself. 你好同志 ! See ?  I like green tea anyway more then coffee :cap_tea:

 

Im in favour of a dynamic mechanic, that adjusts planes and/or AA accoring to the current matchmaking. I know this sort of opens pandoras box, since everyone could ask for a similar mechanic for their favourite class/ship but it doesnt get us anywhere. The way I see it, this linear method, that WG used to upscale AA/Plane HP/Plane speed/etc. is either too steep or just wrong in itself. I know, thats how the game is build and they are influenced by historical values but sometimes this doesnt make for a great gaming experiance. Imagine such a linear, steep table would be used for concealment. Like a T6 DD has a concealment of 10 km while T8 cruisers have also 10 km and T8 DDs are at 8 km. Its very hard to throw a "you need to adjust" card at a T6 DD player, when he asks, what he should do in such a game, right?

  • Cool 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Players
2,488 posts
2,601 battles
27 minutes ago, ForlornSailor said:

But yea, something needs to be done. WG doesnt want +/- 1 mm. AA and CVs are too different, especially in the ranges T5 to T8 and T6 to T10. This goes for CVs aswell as for any surface ship. Check the greatest gaming achievements thread and you see, what a T8 CV in T6 mm can do. I dont know. For the moment, there is not much we can do I think. Guess we need to start to learn chinese then. Im already on it myself. 你好同志 ! See ?  I like green tea anyway more then coffee :cap_tea:

Wahhahahhaaaaahahaaa :Smile_teethhappy: <---- look yellow face and squinty eyes, like they always knew..

Yeah +/-1 MM would solve a bit, I can do 40-50k in a T7 match with a T6CV. 

But the problem is, you cannot deal damage worth crap. This isn't an AA problem or something.

The problem is flooding and everything is nerfed to the max. They need to step that up... 

 

If I can do more damage with a T4 CV than I can with a T6 CV, something is rotten... might be me but I don't think so.

The damage output should increase, because the target hitpoints increase. If it doesn't, the weapons are too shabby. 

Meaning they don't do enough damage, which is logical: a DD torpedo does LOTS more damage, and they get more of them.

Now, if CV torps can't hurt a DD 'too much'... then what am I to do with a BB? 

images?q=tbn:ANd9GcQsVm6P_biwqlfwtjGwGva

 

 

27 minutes ago, ForlornSailor said:

Im in favour of a dynamic mechanic, that adjusts planes and/or AA accoring to the current matchmaking. I know this sort of opens pandoras box, since everyone could ask for a similar mechanic for their favourite class/ship but it doesnt get us anywhere. The way I see it, this linear method, that WG used to upscale AA/Plane HP/Plane speed/etc. is either too steep or just wrong in itself. I know, thats how the game is build and they are influenced by historical values but sometimes this doesnt make for a great gaming experiance. Imagine such a linear, steep table would be used for concealment. Like a T6 DD has a concealment of 10 km while T8 cruisers have also 10 km and T8 DDs are at 8 km. Its very hard to throw a "you need to adjust" card at a T6 DD player, when he asks, what he should do in such a game, right?

Would be crap, mate. How about other T6 thingies, getting uptiered? They'd indeed be upset and rightly so.

The problem is they are setting everything up so the CV is not able to 'out-kill' the lowest class - which is the DD.

The mistake they make is they are setting it up so the CV cannot damage the DD too much. Meaning: is powerless against anything stronger than a DD.

 

I think they have done the planes/squadrons/attack-waves wrong. What should happen is you get more planes every tier. 

As in, T4 you get 4 torpedo bombers, all in one attack wave. So you get to launch 4 torps at once. Or 6, at tier 6. 

But the planes that are shot down, now they get replaced - this must NOT be, so you get 'gaps'. DDs can escape through those gaps.

BBs cannot escape through those holes that quick, therefore making it easier on DDs and harder on BBs.

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Players
4,085 posts
6,265 battles
6 minutes ago, BLUB__BLUB said:

The mistake they make is they are setting it up so the CV cannot damage the DD too much. Meaning: is powerless against anything stronger than a DD.

 

Yep, that is true. Even before the rework, I was thinking at times: Its not the BB that should have the damage reduction for torpedos - its the DDs and to some degree the cruisers. Like... I remember once taking 2 torps with my edinburgh very early in the game (they were not meant for me) and I was at 1k health. The game was over. Now If I were a Yamato... I would hardly care. A DD would have been dead. So if they would go round the other way, they could scale the alpha damage much better. Imagine a torp doing 3k dmg on a DD, 8k on a cruiser and 15k on a BB (just to get an idea on the scaling, actual numbers are subject to change, because if I dont add that, someone will come an say WOOOT thats not enough damage you have no idea you dont even play DD/CL/CA/BB/DDs !!11:Smile_trollface:). To put it into perspective: we have this kind of mechanic already in place. DDs have no cita - they used to have them - and BB AP dmg on DDs is capped. So there is no reason from that perspective to limit the damage taken from other classes. (holy s*** now I will really get it, if the right persons read that "LOOK! the CV-hater is back! He wants to buff his OP-DDs even more!!11)

 

Ofc you need to take into account, that its easier to hit a BB with torps then a DD. It would be equally stupid if you need 7 torp hit to sink a DD and a Yamato would already go down after 5 or so.

 

12 minutes ago, BLUB__BLUB said:

The problem is flooding and everything is nerfed to the max. They need to step that up... 

 

Im expecting it will step up with the next patch. It doesnt say anywhere but logic does imply, that torp hits on the bow/aft section will result in a higher rate of floodings. It would make sense and Id really wish, WG would tell us if that is so and what the coefficient is. If we dont know these numbers and know, if something changes, we will see a lot of talk in the forums again. I predict both kind of topics: "REDUCE FLOODING CHANCE: MY BB HAS NO CHANCE" and "I HIT 250 TORPS AND GOT 0 FLOODINGS".

 

 

 

  • Bad 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[-SOG-]
Players
116 posts
1,971 battles
2 hours ago, sgtmarple said:

DDs are pretty OP and are the dominant Shiptype. If you can't locate a DD for a couple of minutes a BB, some Cruiser or CV will die in glorious Torpedo hell.

As a BB and cruiser main I don't get that impression. Unspotted DDs are dangerous, yes. That's the reward you get for being a DD that outplays the enemy team. Insofar as I am concerned, I never felt like I didn't have counterplay against these stealthy ships and I feel that people who complain about their existence are simply not very good at playing mind games with DDs. Often I find myself in situations in which a shima tries to torp me, gets frustrated, then opens fire before getting blapped by my big boy guns. The point is to make calculated moves and understand how the mind of a DD player works. Map awareness is key.

 

When I play against CVs, I feel no such thing. The counterplay is basically hoping and praying that the CV player isn't any good at avoiding my RNG flak bursts. Because, otherwise, the player will blap me from the sky with impunity if he really wants to and has a modicum of skill. After playing CVs in the test server and on live, I got confirmation of this. It's not incredibly hard to avoid flak, though it could be (and should be) frustrating. After all, you're playing a class of ship whose "salvos" expose the ship itself to no risk of loss of HP.

I particularly love playing CV as a tactical instrument that could provide zoning for teams and spot ships that are parked behind islands. =)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Players
4,379 posts
7,767 battles
4 minutes ago, mlgomez said:

As a BB and cruiser main I don't get that impression. Unspotted DDs are dangerous, yes. That's the reward you get for being a DD that outplays the enemy team. Insofar as I am concerned, I never felt like I didn't have counterplay against these stealthy ships and I feel that people who complain about their existence are simply not very good at playing mind games with DDs. Often I find myself in situations in which a shima tries to torp me, gets frustrated, then opens fire before getting blapped by my big boy guns. The point is to make calculated moves and understand how the mind of a DD player works. Map awareness is key.

 

When I play against CVs, I feel no such thing. The counterplay is basically hoping and praying that the CV player isn't any good at avoiding my RNG flak bursts. Because, otherwise, the player will blap me from the sky with impunity if he really wants to and has a modicum of skill. After playing CVs in the test server and on live, I got confirmation of this. It's not incredibly hard to avoid flak, though it could be (and should be) frustrating. After all, you're playing a class of ship whose "salvos" expose the ship itself to no risk of loss of HP.

I particularly love playing CV as a tactical instrument that could provide zoning for teams and spot ships that are parked behind islands. =)

But you can't avoid dps, which is extra useful now for making sure CV won't comeback for a while, as you farm his planes on RTB.

Also fighter consumable, be it catapult of summon variety is ridiculously effective and basically unavoidable now.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Players
1,242 posts
7,726 battles
3 hours ago, mil71 said:

Looks like it's back to playing destroyer plague over again at least destroyers can put out some damage and change games unlike carriers now.

Carriers are pathetic compared to this level of damage, AA instantly destroys your aircraft, destroyers are immune to you while up close and to top the cake you can't even dodge while in combat because you can only auto pilot around the map.

I notice that your Asashio was at 1/3rd health when that picture was taken and that the Montana appeared to have Detonated. So clearly you'd had to work to get into that position and had been the beneficiary of some massive RNG damage. How would you propose to make CVs work in that way?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Players
2,488 posts
2,601 battles
9 minutes ago, ForlornSailor said:

 

Yep, that is true. Even before the rework, I was thinking at times: Its not the BB that should have the damage reduction for torpedos - its the DDs and to some degree the cruisers. Like... I remember once taking 2 torps with my edinburgh very early in the game (they were not meant for me) and I was at 1k health. The game was over. Now If I were a Yamato... I would hardly care. A DD would have been dead. So if they would go round the other way, they could scale the alpha damage much better. Imagine a torp doing 3k dmg on a DD, 8k on a cruiser and 15k on a BB (just to get an idea on the scaling, actual numbers are subject to change, because if I dont add that, someone will come an say WOOOT thats not enough damage you have no idea you dont even play DD/CL/CA/BB/DDs !!11:Smile_trollface:). To put it into perspective: we have this kind of mechanic already in place. DDs have no cita - they used to have them - and BB AP dmg on DDs is capped. So there is no reason from that perspective to limit the damage taken from other classes. (holy s*** now I will really get it, if the right persons read that "LOOK! the CV-hater is back! He wants to buff his OP-DDs even more!!11)

Exactly. The way it was before, with CVs doing a crossdrop on a DD with 6+6 torps... well... :Smile_facepalm:

But then giving the CV just ONE or TWO torps... with meagre damage if you hit anything at all??? 

 

9 minutes ago, ForlornSailor said:

Ofc you need to take into account, that its easier to hit a BB with torps then a DD. It would be equally stupid if you need 7 torp hit to sink a DD and a Yamato would already go down after 5 or so.

Flooding and fire damage, also citadels should be able to take care of that.

DDs shouldn't get any flooding and as a result the only damage a torpedo would do is alpha.

Then make it so the planes launch 4 torps, but at such a spread a DD should be able to 'swim through'. 

For bombs, similar thing. Then bombs or torps would not work well on DDs, and only so-so on cruisers. 

 

BTW - why would I spot DDs? I cannot kill them anyway without help. And my team will not protect my CV, have been sunk by DDs quite a few times.

Screw DDs, I'm not gonna spot them as that doesn't give me XP, and since I cannot kill them anyway why would I try. To save my team? 

Harharhar l;ike my meagre 30k damage in a T6 CV is gonna save a T8 game LOLOLOL! :Smile_trollface:

 

9 minutes ago, ForlornSailor said:

Im expecting it will step up with the next patch. It doesnt say anywhere but logic does imply, that torp hits on the bow/aft section will result in a higher rate of floodings.

Yeah does. BBs have a 'torpedo reduction belt'. 

 

9 minutes ago, ForlornSailor said:

It would make sense and Id really wish, WG would tell us if that is so and what the coefficient is. If we dont know these numbers and know, if something changes, we will see a lot of talk in the forums again. I predict both kind of topics: "REDUCE FLOODING CHANCE: MY BB HAS NO CHANCE" and "I HIT 250 TORPS AND GOT 0 FLOODINGS".

I'm not taking that bet... It will cost me beer... WG should care less about the meao-meow brigade and instead play the stuff themselves ( @MrConway ).

If they did they'd find it is easier to do damage in T4 than in T6... I'll manage to get 100k though, somehow. Still I think it is easier in a T4 CV than in T6 CV. :Smile_unsure:

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[HEROZ]
Players
723 posts
6,389 battles
3 hours ago, DJ_Die said:

DDs are OP? How would you know? :) And no, BBs are the dominant ship type and has been for a long time.

You are mistaking "dominant" with "most common". A good DD will win a battle. A potato DD can doom whole team. A good BB may slighty increase chance of winning. A bad BB will still provide distraction.

 

Its all about skill gap and potential.

 

Yes, DDs are OP. But only when driven by someone who knows how to use them. And thats what potential mean.

 

Today I had a great dd player. Real teammate. Spotted targets for me, forced enemies to show me broadside with torps, covered with smoke when needed. I ended top of the team thanks to him. He was second with 3 base xp points less.

  • Cool 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[NWP]
Players
691 posts
9,611 battles
3 hours ago, sgtmarple said:

DDs are pretty OP and are the dominant Shiptype. If you can't locate a DD for a couple of minutes a BB, some Cruiser or CV will die in glorious Torpedo hell.

 

EA2A9995-8A0C-4042-A41C-654D4342AA44.gif

  • Cool 2
  • Funny 4
  • Bad 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[HEROZ]
Players
723 posts
6,389 battles
46 minutes ago, ForlornSailor said:

 Like... I remember once taking 2 torps with my edinburgh very early in the game (they were not meant for me) and I was at 1k health.

 

If you took 2 torps with edingburgh, that means that you were hiding in your own farts, stationary with a ship that has hydro.

 

Those torps were for you.

  • Funny 3
  • Bad 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Players
4,085 posts
6,265 battles
1 minute ago, Oderisson said:

If you took 2 torps with edingburgh, that means that you were hiding in your own farts, stationary with a ship that has hydro.

 

Those torps were for you.

 

Dont try to make a living as a fortune teller. All your clients will bang your door for a refund.

  • Funny 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Players
3 posts
3,395 battles

So, I decided to check the CV's out.

The current survivability of any aircraft is a joke. Losing complete squadrons without hitting anything.

95% of the playerbase is running an AA build so Destorying tier 10 aircraft is now a cakewalk. 

 

Right now the carriers are nothing more than spot platforms.

 

Thanks to the DD complaints Attack aircraft is no longer usable. Line up a shot, miss, squadron is destroyed. 

Returning aircraft never returns, so you ran out of planes very quickly, a 1 single attack run, then bang- black sky, all planes down. This is unplayable for a casual dude like me. 

 

I guess my Midway Will be an excellent weekend ship.

  • Cool 2
  • Boring 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[HEROZ]
Players
723 posts
6,389 battles
14 minutes ago, ForlornSailor said:

 

Dont try to make a living as a fortune teller. All your clients will bang your door for a refund.

You are aware what fortune telling is, right?

 

You know, predicting the FUTURE. 

 

What i stated was presenting facts. One cant be struck in the most manuverable cruiser line that has hydro without fartsniffing and being braindead.

 

Or maybe you are trying to tell me you were leading an assault. In edinburgh. And maybe you took radar insted of smoke for random game. Oh let me guess: you were protecting battleships with your armor. Real MVP.

  • Bad 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Players
4,085 posts
6,265 battles
3 minutes ago, JoeStackhouse said:

Losing complete squadrons without hitting anything.

 

You know you need to dodge flak...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Players
4,379 posts
7,767 battles
5 minutes ago, JoeStackhouse said:

So, I decided to check the CV's out.

The current survivability of any aircraft is a joke. Losing complete squadrons without hitting anything.

95% of the playerbase is running an AA build so Destorying tier 10 aircraft is now a cakewalk. 

 

Right now the carriers are nothing more than spot platforms.

 

Thanks to the DD complaints Attack aircraft is no longer usable. Line up a shot, miss, squadron is destroyed. 

Returning aircraft necer returns, you ran out of planes very soon, as 1 single attack run, then bang- black sky, all planes down. This is unplayable for a casual dude like me. 

 

I guess my Midway Will be an excellent weekend ship.

Midway Tiny Tims seems to be unaffected, combined with better accuracy they still remain viable. Still, you don't even need "AA build" on most cruisers as either they will be hilariously ineffective regardless how many skills you tack to them or they will mow down planes due to base dps/flak values, further buffing is bordering on overkill.

 

Just now, ForlornSailor said:

 

You know you need to dodge flak...

Even with WSAD, simply flyover with single rocket run over Wooster WITHOUT DFAA ends with at least half the squadron gone.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Players
536 posts
3 minutes ago, JoeStackhouse said:

I guess my Midway Will be an excellent weekend ship.

For now... until more nerfs come to it. :Smile-_tongue:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.

×