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Yamato942

0.8.0.3 mini patch good???

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What do you think about new mini patch, is it too much nerf to cv, is it good? Do you will play cv after it??

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Not sure about the adjustments ...

 

If Midway TB are too strong because 6 torps in each attack, then WG should reduce the number to 4, don't pseudo nerf it by adjusting damage and flooding chance.

 

Rockets planes return to the point where they must initiate their attack while the DD is not spotted, but it is always as easy to spot a DD as PLANES STILL HAVE 6TH SENSE. So I'm not sure that this change will save DD but CV players may find rockets harder and more frustating to use.

 

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Yeah, CVs are unplayable again :cap_old:

I think these days, if the words "CV" and "changes" are together in one sentence, most people are going into rage mode...

 

- Rockets arent retard proof anymore. compared to others, i felt they were too easy to use.

- Reduced air detectability -> something had to be done. If thats the right way? Hard to say.

- Fighters get buffed -> they were a joke anyway

- Midway gets a slight nerf -> to be expected really

 

- Enterprise gets buffed !

 

RN CVs gets nerfed:

1. why would anyone care? They are WiP...

2. They were overperforming by just looking at it.

 

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cant say, heavent tried in randoms but on the first look more nerfs that didnt need to be nerfed , im aimin at midway nerf

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Vor 1 Minute, Mr_Snoww sagte:

stop nerfing things into the ground...

Next are going to be midway DB now that rockets are useless against DDs they will start feeling the REAL hurt and get dropped for 15k per attack run! the complains won't end ever

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6 minutes ago, NoirLotus said:

Rockets planes return to the point where they must initiate their attack while the DD is not spotted, but it is always as easy to spot a DD as PLANES STILL HAVE 6TH SENSE. So I'm not sure that this change will save DD but CV players may find rockets harder and more frustating to use.

This is the crucial point from my perspective:

  • I don't think it's going to change much in terms of which DDs are viable, and which aren't.
  • It will be harder for rocket planes to attack a DD that they've spotted, but that spotting won't be made much harder (due to Sixth Sense).
  • Most times where you get zapped as a DD, it's the enemy ships that sink you, not the CV that spotted you - rocket planes weren't that dangerous on their own anyway.

So, the 'ambush' playstyle that things like Kidd/Gearing etc. are reasonably good at should become slightly easier, whilst the spotting threat to non-AA DDs shouldn't change that much. Personally, I would have left the spotting distances alone, and just removed Sixth Sense from planes, but what do I know...?

 

I could be spectacularly wrong, of course, and it'll be interesting trying DDs out after the changes - it's possible it'll make some of the 'fringe' cases more viable, I guess...

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1 hour ago, DFens_666 said:

- Reduced air detectability -> something had to be done. If thats the right way? Hard to say. 

If stealth radar is a bs mechanism, stealth AA should be too. Mino & wooster will have that now.

 

1 hour ago, DFens_666 said:

- Midway gets a slight nerf -> to be expected really

You mean, after haku got nerfhammered so hard, that everyone would only play midway, so now she has to get the same treatment. Yea.

 

Maingoal of spending over a year of time and money: making CV popular. 10/10

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Spotting nerf welcome - completely spoils the game being spotted at the very start. Especially on a small map with ultra long range BBs in play. Saw a Yam blap a Cleveland last night literally 2km from our spawn. 

 

Rocket attack nerf. A heavy handed and inexact way of dealing with the fact some DDs have no AA capability

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19 minutes ago, DFens_666 said:

- Rockets arent retard proof anymore. compared to others, i felt they were too easy to use.

- Reduced air detectability -> something had to be done. If thats the right way? Hard to say.

The whole rocket aircraft nerf plus air detectability buff for ships is actually pretty damn hamfisted if you look at all the aspects in combination (less air detectability, longer attack preparation, worse aircraft handling and greater spread penalties for adjusting aim).

 

Also means that some ships will have greater AA range than airdetectability again (Minotaur totally needed a buff to its AA efficacy, yup).

 

Also:

19 minutes ago, DFens_666 said:

- Midway gets a slight nerf -> to be expected really

Are you kidding me? There's nothing slight about that nerf: 20% alpha damage nerf and let's not forget the flooding chance had already been nerfed significantly for all airdropped torps last hotfix.

 

 

WG once again balancing with the sledgehammer.

 

 

The only positive change is the improved summon-fighter aggro time.

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Yes.

 

Unsure about the fighter health nerf, but every other decision is at least a step in the right direction. There remain however questionable game design and questionable balance aspects. 

 

Randomly giving one half of my AA better effectiveness at the expense of the other half is about as entertaining as watching paint try and shooting down unlimited aircraft is about as satisfying as damaging unlimited health ship would be. Planes need to be limited, but receive higher health in return. Also CV survival rate - 90%+ even with a lobotomized monkey at the helm - needs to be looked at. Can't have four classes and one is untouchable.

 

And as for balancing, I can only guess. CV spotting and damage against DDs might still be too high, capital ship (BB and CV) damage too low.

 

 

And good timing as well. It indicates the team is looking at data and feedback.

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3 minutes ago, thisismalacoda said:

Yes.

 

Unsure about the fighter health nerf, but every other decision is at least a step in the right direction. There remain however questionable game design and questionable balance aspects. 

 

Randomly giving one half of my AA better effectiveness at the expense of the other half is about as entertaining as watching paint try and shooting down unlimited aircraft is about as satisfying as damaging unlimited health ship would be. Planes need to be limited, but receive higher health in return. Also CV survival rate - 90%+ even with a lobotomized monkey at the helm - needs to be looked at. Can't have four classes and one is untouchable.

 

And as for balancing, I can only guess. CV spotting and damage against DDs might still be too high, capital ship (BB and CV) damage too low.

They nerfed fighters? lmao, i mean they were useless to begin with.

 

im guessing these changes affect all CV's and not just the ones at tier 10?

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14 minutes ago, Aotearas said:

The whole rocket aircraft nerf plus air detectability buff for ships is actually pretty damn hamfisted if you look at all the aspects in combination (less air detectability, longer attack preparation, worse aircraft handling and greater spread penalties for adjusting aim).

 

I argued for going that direction ever since the CV rework. DDs still get spotted by other means, so then their air detectability doesnt count. It looks like, WG has the same way of looking at it, as I do: spotting a DD by yourself AND attacking it should atleast be very hard for a CV. That was my point from the start: CV can spot a DD for the team OR help attacking it while its engaged by a friendly DD or detected through other means. Nothing wrong in that, seriously.

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8 minutes ago, CptBarney said:

They nerfed fighters? lmao, i mean they were useless to begin with.

 

im guessing these changes affect all CV's and not just the ones at tier 10?

you didnt actually read the changes did you? They made fighters better at their job (faster and more of them so they're better at killing), and worse at what made them problematic (less HP so plonking them down above a cap and permaspotting it wont be as effective)...

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14 minutes ago, Saiyko said:

If stealth radar is a bs mechanism, stealth AA should be too. Mino & wooster will have that now.

Stealth AA sounds like you arent getting detected while using AA, which ofc is not true.

Also as i said, im not sure if its the right way to do it, personaly i would have taken a different approach. Doesnt change that there was a problem with spotting the entire team within the first minute of playing.

 

14 minutes ago, Saiyko said:

You mean, after haku got nerfhammered so hard, that everyone would only play midway, so now she has to get the same treatment. Yea.

Kinda... yes thats what i meant. Im just saying that i thought it would happen (hey, others called that one out BEFORE they announced it, and got flamed for that^^). Its clear where they are going with CVs, Haku nerf showed that. Midway was performing much better than Haku, and they didnt show any intentions to buff Haku -> Midway gets a nerf aswell.

Logical imo :cap_tea:

 

14 minutes ago, Saiyko said:

Maingoal of spending over a year of time and money: making CV popular. 10/10

Well, many people (myself included) have said that the reworked CV gameplay is rather boring when they first saw it.

Making them fun to play is making them OP -> that wont happen. So WG shot themselves in the foot with the rework, said it several times by now...

 

10 minutes ago, Aotearas said:

The whole rocket aircraft nerf plus air detectability buff for ships is actually pretty damn hamfisted if you look at all the aspects in combination (less air detectability, longer attack preparation, worse aircraft handling and greater spread penalties for adjusting aim).

See above, i would have also taken a different approach to the spotting problem, but they went with this so... i dont even care anymore because the game and forums are one big shitshow since the rework, well done WG :cap_like:

 

10 minutes ago, Aotearas said:

Are you kidding me? There's nothing slight about that nerf: 20% alpha damage nerf and let's not forget the flooding chance had already been nerfed significantly for all airdropped torps last hotfix

Except you still have 2 other type of planes?! Its not like YY nerf where they slashed the reload from guns AND torps at the same time. So 20% for torp bombers yes, but not overall damage. Unless everyone was using TBs only, then the nerf is totaly in line. I think its also clear, that WG WANTS the players to use all types of planes - not only one. Probably Midway TBs were the way to go, because of permafloods.

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3 minutes ago, ForlornSailor said:

 

I argued for going that direction ever since the CV rework. DDs still get spotted by other means, so then their air detectability doesnt count. It looks like, WG has the same way of looking at it, as I do: spotting a DD by yourself AND attacking it should atleast be very hard for a CV. That was my point from the start: CV can spot a DD for the team OR help attacking it while its engaged by a friendly DD or detected through other means. Nothing wrong in that, seriously.

 

The problem is the aircraft handling and spread increae when adjusting aim. Even if something else is spotting the DD for you to make a good attack run, the moment the DD starts jerking and you need to adjust a bit ... obviously that's subject to how worse the handling and spread got, but knowing how WG likes to balance things I wouldn't be surprised if they turn rockets from OP to basically useless in one fell swoop.

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3 minutes ago, Tyrendian89 said:

you didnt actually read the changes did you? They made fighters better at their job (faster and more of them so they're better at killing), and worse at what made them problematic (less HP so plonking them down above a cap and permaspotting it wont be as effective)...

No but thanks for saving me the trouble :Smile_trollface:

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1 hour ago, Yamato942 said:

What do you think about new mini patch, is it too much nerf to cv, is it good? Do you will play cv after it??

Nobody knows until the patch drops and we have a chance to play it and experience the changes in game.

 

 

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18 minutes ago, DFens_666 said:

Probably Midway TBs were the way to go, because of permafloods.

No, they were the way to go because DBs get buttf*cked by short range continuous dps during their long attack phases.

 

Also permafloods? I consider myself lucky if I get a torphit to flooding ratio of 6:1 and just to emphasize you're not going to hit all 6 torps from a single attack wave unless your target is cooperating to the best of his abilities so that does NOT equal one flooding per attack wave. Unless you land a torp straight on the tip of the nose or straight up a ship's arsehole you can kiss your flooding chance goodbye, ain't going to happen, even on cruisers which basically have no torpedo protection.

Getting permafloods with TBs is exceedingly rare post-hotfix after they nerfed flooding chances for all TBs the first time and now they're going to nerf it again in addition to the alpha damage nerf.

 

What WG probably saw in their stats is that after they nerfed the Hakuryuu TBs from OP to rubbish, people switched to playing the Midway and outperformed the Haku TBs (no wonder).

 

 

I have to ask, have you played the rework CVs after WG started "hotfixing" them? Because your argumentations sounds a lot like you don't, or at least not the tier VIII/X CVs.

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Minotaur can now shoot the planes before she is even spotted. That's gonna be a bloodbath. :Smile_hiding:

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4 minutes ago, Aotearas said:

Also permafloods? I consider myself lucky if I get a torphit to flooding ratio of 6:1 and just to emphasize you're not going to hit all 6 torps from a single attack wave unless your target is cooperating to the best of his abilities so that does NOT equal one flooding per attack wave. Unless you land a torp straight on the tip of the nose or straight up a ship's arsehole you can kiss your flooding chance goodbye, ain't going to happen, even on cruisers which basically have no torpedo protection.

Getting permafloods with TBs is exceedingly rare post-hotfix after they nerfed flooding chances for all TBs the first time and now they're going to nerf it again in addition to the alpha damage nerf. 

 

I guess we have to wait and see how the flooding works out after the change. I expect a raised chance of getting floodings but who knows...

 

About the maneuverability about planes: Its risky, to say atleast, to change all those things at the same time, since they interact and are connected heavily. (Air detectability, maneuverability and alpha damage). Yes, you can very quickly overstretch things this way. I hope they got it somewhat right. Its almost impossible to predict, how it will play out (also across the different tiers) so we have to ride along the balancing-train as it speeds up.

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23 minutes ago, DFens_666 said:

Stealth AA sounds like you arent getting detected while using AA, which ofc is not true.

Also as i said, im not sure if its the right way to do it, personaly i would have taken a different approach. Doesnt change that there was a problem with spotting the entire team within the first minute of playing.

Its not really stealth AA - it cant kill you without you seeing the ship (which WAS the case in some of the previous RTS versions).

It could however be used as "suprise" AA. Turn off the AA. Wait till you get spotted. Turn AA back on. CV has to scramble to turn planes around as they're already 1km into your AA

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50 minutes ago, Aotearas said:

WG once again balancing with the sledgehammer.

71rzGei7HOL._SX700_.jpg

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1 hour ago, NoirLotus said:

Not sure about the adjustments ...

 

If Midway TB are too strong because 6 torps in each attack, then WG should reduce the number to 4, don't pseudo nerf it by adjusting damage and flooding chance.

 

Rockets planes return to the point where they must initiate their attack while the DD is not spotted, but it is always as easy to spot a DD as PLANES STILL HAVE 6TH SENSE. So I'm not sure that this change will save DD but CV players may find rockets harder and more frustating to use.

 

Midway already suffered massively in aim time department for virtue of having 6 torps, and even with that amount of aerial duds they were and even more so will be the most useless Midway strike option

 

30 minutes ago, DFens_666 said:

Probably Midway TBs were the way to go, because of permafloods.

Midway aerial duds already had hilariously bad flood chance, while landing more than 3 torps required BB sized target alergic to WSAD keys, RNGesus approval to not spawn flaks on your way as you're waiting for aiming

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