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SteveTheSquid

Nuke Torps for CV's?

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Hi Folks,

 

I've read a lot of opinions on the CV re-work (both for and against). For myself, I'm still undecided (never played CV's - main class is DD's) although a couple of games last night got me thinking...

I'm pretty sure that a Tier 5 RN DD is no longer worth playing in any game with CV's - you can't even defend yourself, let alone influence the game (unless you count being being rocketed/bombed to oblivion useful - as a distraction from the rest of the team having same done to them?).

 

However, my main issue is something I've (thankfully) only experienced once -

 

 

 

Anyone know how a single air-dropped torp could instantly do 26,000 damage to a Normandie?

Nuke Torps.jpg

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3 minutes ago, SteveTheSquid said:

OK, I know the ship detonated - my question is how a single air-dropped torp managed to take out 26,000 health from a BB?

Detonation is guaranteed instakill. Single DD round can detonate enemy warship, so why not torpedo, even aerial one

Bm3O90E.gif?noredirect&key=522baf40bd391

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So can someone please explain the 'Detonation' mechanic?

How a torpedo with the ability to do a maximum of 9867 damage can detonate a ship with 26000 health left.

I think I'm missing something basic here - I'd always assumed detonation occurred because the weight of fire hitting a ship exceeded the ships remaining health pool  (or if the magazine was deemed to have been hit) - is this wrong? I was flying the flag which (supposedly) completely removes the chance of magazine detonation happening.

Your knowledge and advice would be much appreciated on this.

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1 minute ago, SteveTheSquid said:

So can someone please explain the 'Detonation' mechanic?

How a torpedo with the ability to do a maximum of 9867 damage can detonate a ship with 26000 health left.

I think I'm missing something basic here - I'd always assumed detonation occurred because the weight of fire hitting a ship exceeded the ships remaining health pool - is this wrong (or if the magazine was deemed to have been hit) . I was flying the flag which (supposedly) completely removes the chance of this happening. 

Your knowledge and advice would be much appreciated on this.

 

Detonations are possible if the target has less than 75% of his maximum health. Doesnt matter what max damage the shell/torp has. You can even detonate something without hitting the target - HE splash can penetrate the hull and detonate the magazine! (i have screenshots, but would take ages to find:  Orion without hitting the target detonated a Cruiser, and ive seen screenshots here in the forums from CV bombs detonating ships without hitting them aswell)

 

And yes, if you have the Flag which removes detonations, you CAN NOT detonate. Maybe you ran out of them and didnt use it anymore?

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9 minutes ago, SteveTheSquid said:

So can someone please explain the 'Detonation' mechanic?

How a torpedo with the ability to do a maximum of 9867 damage can detonate a ship with 26000 health left.

I think I'm missing something basic here - I'd always assumed detonation occurred because the weight of fire hitting a ship exceeded the ships remaining health pool - is this wrong (or if the magazine was deemed to have been hit) . I was flying the flag which (supposedly) completely removes the chance of this happening.

Your knowledge and advice would be much appreciated on this.

Projectile catches ammunition magazine within its detonation blast, which ignores armor plating - after all, no ammo is stored outside yet ships explode. Damage is dealt, presumably some sort RNG is added to save from explosion to discourage "ammo sniping" (see War Thunder), if ammo hitbox reaches zero - you get 10 anti detonation flags.

 

And make sure you had the flag, they tend to end without notice.

http://wiki.wargaming.net/en/Ship:Detonation

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5 minutes ago, DFens_666 said:

 

Detonations are possible if the target has less than 75% of his maximum health. Doesnt matter what max damage the shell/torp has. You can even detonate something without hitting the target - HE splash can penetrate the hull and detonate the magazine! (i have screenshots, but would take ages to find:  Orion without hitting the target detonated a Cruiser, and ive seen screenshots here in the forums from CV bombs detonating ships without hitting them aswell)

 

And yes, if you have the Flag which removes detonations, you CAN NOT detonate. Maybe you ran out of them and didnt use it anymore?

Hi DFens_666,

 

thanks for the info on the 75% rule - wasn't aware of that!

Still got around 50 of those flags but maybe I'd missed applying it as you suggest... :(

Oh well, learn something new every day. :)

Still smarts though......:cap_fainting:

 

Thanks guys.

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22 minutes ago, SteveTheSquid said:

OK, I know the ship detonated - my question is how a single air-dropped torp managed to take out 26,000 health from a BB?

 

21 minutes ago, SteveTheSquid said:

So can someone please explain the 'Detonation' mechanic?

How a torpedo with the ability to do a maximum of 9867 damage can detonate a ship with 26000 health left. 

I think I'm missing something basic here - I'd always assumed detonation occurred because the weight of fire hitting a ship exceeded the ships remaining health pool  (or if the magazine was deemed to have been hit) - is this wrong? I was flying the flag which (supposedly) completely removes the chance of magazine detonation happening.

Your knowledge and advice would be much appreciated on this.

Detonations are a (not very popular among the playerbase, might I add) mechanic that doesn't really represent the shell/torpedo/bomb being powerful enough to destroy the ship in a single hit. The situation modeled is when the enemy attack sets off explosives onboard of the target ship. Basically - it's not the torpedo that dealt 26 000 damage to a BB. Torpedo caused some (perhaps badly stored and loosened during the fight) ammunition to explode, causing an explosion of the entire magazine and blowing half the ship sky-high. It's the BB that dealt all this damage to itself - the torpedo being merely a trigger. The same can be caused by a single unlucky shell, as experienced by many DDs in the game and some ships - like HMS Hood, for perhaps the best known example - in the real world.

 

As for the signal... this can mean two things

a) you weren't actually flying it

or

b) it's a bug that you should report

 

But while we're at it - I'd strongly advise against using the anti-detonation signals on BBs. What you experienced happens sometimes but it's a very, VERY rare occurrence. BBs need to be extremely unlucky to get detonated - which is it's preferable to save the signals for when you play a destroyer or, at worst, a cruiser. You're quite unlikely to suffer a similar situation within the next 50 BB matches even without the signal.

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40 minutes ago, SteveTheSquid said:

Still smarts though......:cap_fainting:

I bet it does - but maybe you'll feel better when you consider that at least you're not that Yamato getting detonated by Udaloi (I think it was, cant make it out) HE in the gif Panocek posted :Smile_teethhappy:

 

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12 hours ago, SteveTheSquid said:

So can someone please explain the 'Detonation' mechanic?

Detonation =  ships magazine blew up

 

For a historical reference read about HMS Invincible, HMS Indefatigable, HMS Queen Mary, and probably most infamously - HMS Hood

 

Or, as a visual, here's HMS Barham, already sinking, whos magazine detonation was caught on camera. And this didn't even seem that powerful in comparison to some others:

 

 

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3 minutes ago, wilkatis_LV said:

 

Or, as a visual, here's HMS Barham, already sinking, whos magazine detonation was caught on camera. And this deidn't even seem that powerful in comparison to others:

 

 

On a bit of a side note, that video has always sent chills down my spine..

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HMS Barham has always morbidly fascinated me - the aft deck peeling forward is just frankly scary.

 

The other one which is worse, or better (in a they wouldn't have known a thing kinda way) was ammo ship SS John Burke in the Pacific

 

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37 minutes ago, DB2212 said:

HMS Barham has always morbidly fascinated me - the aft deck peeling forward is just frankly scary.

 

The other one which is worse, or better (in a they wouldn't have known a thing kinda way) was ammo ship SS John Burke in the Pacific

 

They probably never knew they got hit..

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2 hours ago, SteveTheSquid said:

Hi DFens_666,

 

thanks for the info on the 75% rule - wasn't aware of that!

Still got around 50 of those flags but maybe I'd missed applying it as you suggest... :(

Oh well, learn something new every day. :)

Still smarts though......:cap_fainting:

 

Thanks guys.

On the bright side, you have won a few of these flags ;-)

But yeah, better save them for DDs (or clan battles)

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I was thinking that using some flags was increasing chance of detonation.

So the prevent detonation flag is giving you -100% chance of detonation, but some flags add +5%.

So you can end up with 10% chance even when flying the anti detonation flag.

That was my understanding.

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27 minutes ago, Sir_Grzegorz said:

I was thinking that using some flags was increasing chance of detonation.

So the prevent detonation flag is giving you -100% chance of detonation, but some flags add +5%.

So you can end up with 10% chance even when flying the anti detonation flag.

That was my understanding.

That would be incorrect 

The anti detonation flag is applied at the end, so regardless of anything else you get 0% chance

Trust me

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58 minutes ago, Sir_Grzegorz said:

I was thinking that using some flags was increasing chance of detonation.

So the prevent detonation flag is giving you -100% chance of detonation, but some flags add +5%.

So you can end up with 10% chance even when flying the anti detonation flag.

That was my understanding.

The detonation chance is already pretty small, it is not 110% ;p So the small chance minus 100% makes it 0.

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Vor 11 Stunden, DFens_666 sagte:

And yes, if you have the Flag which removes detonations, you CAN NOT detonate. 

Oh, yes you still can!

Cause if you read carefully the flag "reduces the detonation chance by 100%". Thats not the same like "no detonation". Cause there are other flags in game that increase your detonation chance again (e.g. +5% flooding chance comes with +15% detonation chance). So using one of these makes your calculation like: 100% basic chance + 15% flag1 chance - 100% flag2 chance = 15% chance left for detonations. Not much, but still something.

I learned it the hard way...

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Oh ffs, stop spreading false statements. If you have the flag equipped you can NOT detonate. This has been clearly stated multiple times. Please learn game mechanics before you post

 

PS here, educate yourself 

 

http://wiki.wargaming.net/en/Ship:Detonation

 

2nd PS: let me try to explain it like this - 

Base chance of detonation = F 

Detonation modifiers (eg fire and flooding flags) x 1.05 and x 1.15

Anti detonation flag is x 0.00

 

No matter how many modifiers you stack, when you multiply by 0 you. Always. Get. Zero

 

 

Forget game mechanics. This is basic math

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Basic math wasnt in game from the beginning.

WG changed so the -100% applies in the end like 2 years ago. Before you could detonate even running the juliet signal if you ran the +4 signal.

I even think it had something todo with the order of equipping... dont take me on that one, I forgot the details.

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11 hours ago, DB2212 said:

HMS Barham has always morbidly fascinated me - the aft deck peeling forward is just frankly scary.

 

The other one which is worse, or better (in a they wouldn't have known a thing kinda way) was ammo ship SS John Burke in the Pacific

 

Holy crap this looks like a 30kt fission blast exept for less light

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