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Admiral_H_Nelson

AA Aura calculations - How fast are planes in game?

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TL;DR Could someone tell me how much "official" aircraft speeds are scaled up in game, please.

 

SHIP SPEED SCALING
As I am sure we all know by now, ships in-game travel far faster than their stated speed.
For example in a recent game in my Anshan, I covered 31.62km at an average speed of 96.3 knots.
The official unmodified speed of Anshan is 38 knots.

I've checked the forums, Wiki and Reddit and most answers seem to think that the official speed is scaled up by a factor of 5 or 6.

 

AA CALCULATIONS
I'm trying to do some calculations of the theoretical damage done by flak in each aura (Short-, medium-, and long-range).
I want to work out how much time an aircraft will spend in each aura.
I'm aware that there are factors which modifiy this, but for now I simply want to apply the stated speed of an aircraft - which I can get from the WIKI or the game - to the actual speed in-game.

 

 

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[ADRIA]
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Ships speed is scaled by 2.61

Shell speed is scaled by 5.22 (2.61*2)

 

I'd say Planes probably get the same treatment as ships

 

Distances are not scaled, 10km is 10km

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Planes are still a fraction of the real relative speed they would have had to ships.

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[YARRR]
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GZ bombers go approx. 1km per second at a boost speed of 260kn.

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11 minutes ago, El2aZeR said:

GZ bombers go approx. 1km per second at a boost speed of 260kn.

I'm quite sure anyone can calculate that 1km/sec is 3600km/h... which is > mach 2. 

A bit more than 2.61...(no propeller plane ever was faster than ~850 km/h):Smile_trollface:

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5 minutes ago, BLUB__BLUB said:

I'm quite sure anyone can calculate that 1km/sec is 3600km/h... which is > mach 2. 

 

It's almost Mach 3 (3704,4km/h) in fact. :Smile_trollface:

260kn would be 481,52km/h irl, which would mean plane speed is multiplied by a factor of ~7,5.

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4 minutes ago, El2aZeR said:

It's almost Mach 3 (3704,4km/h) in fact. :Smile_trollface:

260kn would be 481,52km/h irl, which would mean plane speed is multiplied by a factor of ~7,5.

Mach speed depends on altitude, but yeah it's pretty 'arcade' at that. They should slow down the planes, and introduce 'cruising altitude'.

I'm not sure how much time the planes stay in AA zone - but I am definately sure a slower speed would allow more calibration/balance.

 

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2 hours ago, BLUB__BLUB said:

Mach speed depends on altitude, but yeah it's pretty 'arcade' at that. They should slow down the planes, and introduce 'cruising altitude'.

I'm not sure how much time the planes stay in AA zone - but I am definately sure a slower speed would allow more calibration/balance.

 

Would it, though? :cap_hmm:

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Perhaps you could start a test server, place an enemy ship that can not move but attack. Pick one with something like 6 km AA range or an easy number. 

Fly over it with same speed and time the seconds with stop watch from AA start to AA end.

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11 hours ago, eliastion said:

Would it, though? :cap_hmm:

Yes it would. There is always some measure of 'RNG'. Now if you talk about 'damage over time', there is the factor 'time'. 

If the planes can move in and get out very fast, it follows that there is just a little time for RNG to work it's 'magic'.

Also, ships have less time to react (adjust the 'focus zone' or press DefAA button). 

Keep in mind that they can return for a second attack from same flight - this would be the main thing.

If that would take longer, more time for the ship-player to adjust. 

 

When I play the CV I always make sure my planes have maximum speed when going near the ships. 

I have less chance of getting damage or getting shot down. 

 

 

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11 hours ago, gizaman said:

Perhaps you could start a test server, place an enemy ship that can not move but attack. Pick one with something like 6 km AA range or an easy number. 

Fly over it with same speed and time the seconds with stop watch from AA start to AA end.

I think they can better calculate irt... the time is so short, stopwatch use will take to much reaction time.

Also it would be easier to do it 50 times and check what score the ship gets on the planes, and how many it shoots.

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10 hours ago, BLUB__BLUB said:

Keep in mind that they can return for a second attack from same flight - this would be the main thing.

If that would take longer, more time for the ship-player to adjust. 

 

Actually untrue. Being slower also means a slower exit time, aka being able to turn around earlier to attack again. Attack frequency thus remains unchanged, only the speed of the initial attack would be affected.

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12 minutes ago, El2aZeR said:

 

Actually untrue. Being slower also means a slower exit time, thus being able to turn around earlier to attack again. Attack frequency thus remains unchanged, only the speed of the initial attack would be affected.

Ah might be so in higher tiers, I don't know. But at T4, i must always fly away a bit, else I cannot get the planes 'on target'. 

If I turn around immediately they sort of 'overshoot', somehow. 

 

BTW today I got killed 3x by enemy DD, they seem to have CV hunting down to an art at T4. :Smile_trollface:

 

 

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5 hours ago, BLUB__BLUB said:

Yes it would. There is always some measure of 'RNG'. Now if you talk about 'damage over time', there is the factor 'time'. 

If the planes can move in and get out very fast, it follows that there is just a little time for RNG to work it's 'magic'.

The only relevant bit of RNG would be "what planes out of the squadron get affected by aura DPS". If you lower the speed of planes and the damage from DPS, what you get is damage more spread out, meaning that the planes survive longer before any are shot down and then they start dropping from  the sky all at once.

 

5 hours ago, BLUB__BLUB said:

Also, ships have less time to react (adjust the 'focus zone' or press DefAA button). 

 Keep in mind that they can return for a second attack from same flight - this would be the main thing.

If that would take longer, more time for the ship-player to adjust.

The speed of the former can be balanced if too long without touching the speed of planes. The latter is literally pressing one button - if someone struggles with pressing it in time then he probably deserves to suffer much more damage from an airstrike than he does with current "death of a thousand cuts" CVs...

No, seriously, how would it help in balancing to give players more time for pressing one button? At this point you might just set it on "auto" like CV consumables because if they struggle to use it now, I doubt they would manage much better with some more time.

 

5 hours ago, BLUB__BLUB said:

When I play the CV I always make sure my planes have maximum speed when going near the ships. 

I have less chance of getting damage or getting shot down. 

Well, this doesn't really change much no matter what you do. Speed helps - but it's just one of the balancing factors. Making planes slower wouldn't make balancing easier - it is just something that can be done if they are too strong to make the weaker. One of the knobs you can turn in balancing - lowering it wouldn't suddenly make the other knobs work better. Also, as a balancing factor (compared to lowering their hp, for example) speed has a significant problem of making CVs more tedious to play as you lower it (low tier planes are painfully slow - and the only reason it sort of works is because the maps are relatively small).

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4 minutes ago, eliastion said:

Well, this doesn't really change much no matter what you do. Speed helps - but it's just one of the balancing factors. Making planes slower wouldn't make balancing easier - it is just something that can be done if they are too strong to make the weaker. One of the knobs you can turn in balancing - lowering it wouldn't suddenly make the other knobs work better. Also, as a balancing factor (compared to lowering their hp, for example) speed has a significant problem of making CVs more tedious to play as you lower it (low tier planes are painfully slow - and the only reason it sort of works is because the maps are relatively small).

Agreed on most of that. I did expect planes to have a chance (at least torpedo planes) to steer clear of the DPS aura.

I might be wrong there though. Main thing I'd like more FLAKburst damage and less DPS aura. 

 

Oh, and if possible give the Langley some more secondaries - now it is a pinata for every ship that wants it.

Can't flee, the secondaries suck and I cannot even defend it with rockets against a DD. 

I'm OK that if you get torped by a DD well then you're dumb, but I cannot even fend one of - and usually there comes TWO of them.

If it is one then they should not be able to come near enough to use the guns. Now they just casually shoot you down.

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38 minutes ago, BLUB__BLUB said:

Ah might be so in higher tiers, I don't know. But at T4, i must always fly away a bit, else I cannot get the planes 'on target'. 

If I turn around immediately they sort of 'overshoot', somehow. 

 

BTW today I got killed 3x by enemy DD, they seem to have CV hunting down to an art at T4. :Smile_trollface:

 

 

At T6 with Ryuujou, I have that issue mostly only with torpedo bombers due to long aim time, but dive bombers can turn within the mid range of a PEF and attack again in my experience.

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It's 5.22 for planes, ships and torps and 2.61 for shells.

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20 minutes ago, Seiranko said:

At T6 with Ryuujou, I have that issue mostly only with torpedo bombers due to long aim time, but dive bombers can turn within the mid range of a PEF and attack again in my experience.

Explains it, with the Langley I always have to fly away from the ship a few seconds before turning.

No matter torps, rockets or bombs. Makes spamming the F button more attractive. :Smile_teethhappy:

 

But again, two DDs went for the carriers and I didn't manage (even with help from other CV) to kill them.

We did get one of them though. :Smile_trollface:

913173303_Langleytorped.thumb.jpg.536845cdf8e4a557772497281e99c1e4.jpg

 

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Many thanks for the replies everyone! :Smile_honoring:

Much appreciated.

 

I'll now go away and crunch some numbers in a spreadsheet, when I have some free time.

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