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WorkOstrich

How to improve aiming (esp in Nurnberg)

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Does anyone have any magic tips on how to improve aiming?

 

After 3 years of playing this game I'm am still absolutely rubbish at aiming and the Nurnberg in particular.

 

I average about 20% hit rate and after 50 Nurnberg games only 15K damage (usually less). 

 

I've watched every video I can find on Youtube on aiming, and still can't get any better. Every other player seems to be able to hit me even when I'm WASDing like mad, but I can hit a battleship that's sailing straight.

 

How can this rotten tomato improve?

 

Cheers

 

Steve

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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Depends on the ships you play. I used the big yellow fixed recticle (14) and just salvo single turrets to walk the fire onto the target.  Eventually you should get a feel for the individual guns and be able to guestimate leads. I also tend to shoot at closing or crossing targets over departing ones. I play in Australia with a ping of 180 so all the usual advice doesn't work for me. This is my solution to hitting.

 

Other than that, don't plink at maximum range,  get into effective gun range and plaster them. 

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[SHAFT]
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Do you follow where your shells land?

I mean, that should normaly tell you what is wrong with your aiming.

Too much lead or not enough?

 

CAn you post a replay? The folder exists for everyone these days, so you should have some afaik. Should be clear why you dont hit when looking at that.

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Vor 2 Minuten, That_Other_Nid sagte:

just salvo single turrets to walk the fire onto the target

if you want to farm his broadside  that can  alert the enemy to turn away...

 

i would say dont use shitps with highly different shell velocity. (like if i play a lot of desmoins (high arcs, low shell velocity), then play zao (low arcs, high velocity))

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19 hours ago, 000_LULU_000 said:

if you want to farm his broadside  that can  alert the enemy to turn away...

Yup, but for IFHE it doesn't matter. I save waterline AP for those times RNGesus has less of a say. 

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36 minutes ago, WorkOstrich said:

Does anyone have any magic tips on how to improve aiming?

 

After 3 years of playing this game I'm am still absolutely rubbish at aiming and the Nurnberg in particular.

 

I average about 20% hit rate and after 50 Nurnberg games only 15K damage (usually less). 

 

I've watched every video I can find on Youtube on aiming, and still can't get any better. Every other player seems to be able to hit me even when I'm WASDing like mad, but I can hit a battleship that's sailing straight.

 

How can this rotten tomato improve?

 

Cheers

 

Steve

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Nurnberg have two issues not helping with aiming - lightweight shells, slowing down massively with range, skewing lead for short and long range as well very high rate of fire. For starters I'd suggest slowing down on reload and look where your salvo went, based on that adjust your aim. Once you get hang of it, you can go full dakka.

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46 minutes ago, WorkOstrich said:

Does anyone have any magic tips on how to improve aiming?

 

Get closer.

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[SM0KE]
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2 hours ago, WorkOstrich said:

Does anyone have any magic tips on how to improve aiming?

Not a magic tip as such (and bearing in mind I struggle to shoot straight myself), but playing several games in a row with the same ship (ideally), or ships (plural) with similar shell characteristics can help e.g. playing a Russian DD right after a US one, is going to make aiming harder as their shells behave wildly differently.

I also make use of a reticle that gives shell time to target, in conjunction with the mini-map: the time to target assumes a BB speed (double it for cruiser; treble it for DD; adjust further for outliers), whilst the map will give you a sense of the target's course, which will require further adjustment e.g. if a 'standard' US BB is going flat-out and it should take ten seconds for your shells to arrive, if the target ship is going 45 degrees towards you, its left-right movement will be half that indicated by the reticle, but you also need to aim lower to account for it getting closer.

The key thing is to practice, and then practice some more, to get your eye in (and muscle memory); a 'mistake' I used to make a lot was to keep zoomed in on the target I was shooting at - whilst it meant I got blapped repeatedly by people I'd not noticed, it did help my aiming, as I watched almost every shell land! I would suggest practicing a bit at lower tiers, where the threat is lower, so you have more time to focus on gunnery, rather than avoiding the enemy. Bots can be useful targets too, although they won't evade like a real person (probably) would.

 

Keep an eye on the smoke (from funnels) given off by your target - that'll tell you a lot about which way your target is going, and how fast (everyone knows the aiming time 'rules' so often go at speeds that make that harder); extra black smoke usually means engine boost is active, which means even more lead, and so on.

 

Basically, the boring answer is practice - lots!

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I watched your replay.

 

-You seem to have difficulty determining whether the ship is approaching you at an angle or not, and this isn't always accounted for with your aim. You can check from the minimap to see whether the enemy ship is distancing themselves away from you or closing towards you.

-You aren't predicting their movement well.

-When decapping with multiple enemies , shoot the ship that has been on the cap without taking a hit for the longest time, so switch target.

 

That said, aiming comes with practice. Play and you get better at it.

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[ADRIA]
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Do you have multiple accounts or is this 525 matches spread over 3 years? That could simply be you massively out of practice, as "getting the feel for it" is probably the most important part of successful aiming. That, and some basic ability to guess where the enemy will go

 

 

Replay:

  • You are WAY too far back. Most of the battle you spent behind your spawn with no enemies within range. I understand being unwilling to push in a ship infamous for being a oneshot, but damn... you're taking it like 5 steps too far
    • The only time when enemies were closer to normal combat ranges to you was when they were coming towards you and you needed to turn thus losing the distance
    • Dispersion area becomes worse with distance - the further you are, the lesser the chance for your shells to actually hit something
    • Shell flight time increases with distance - you were constantly firing at "10s" where even BBs can start dodging you relatively comfortably, not even talking about cruisers / DDs
  • You seem to have trouble recognizing ships changing their movement direction and / or speed. That needs practice, some mods can help to make it easier
  • Do you have "Alternative interface" turned on? Go to settings -> controls and check it (recommended setting - "Full"). Having the range / flight time shown to you can help with determining the amount of lead needed to hit the target
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Some more tips:

 

Ultimately it is depending on your distance to enemy, enemy speed, enemy course (moving away, moving towards, moving in a straight line, turning yes/no).

 

- use the mouse-wheel to zoom in to max zoom right before you fire, and make sure both horizontal (white) lines - those on both sides of reticle- are exactly on the same height of the waterline of the ship.  At distances above 10 km , this  is sometimes more important to do than looking at reticle only.

- directly after firing, zoom out again a little bit to see if enemy ship alter course, excellerates or slows down

- depending on your distance to enemy ship ;  example : enemy at 12+ km going at full speed in a straight line on a 90 degree angle to you : aim at about 10 marks   on the white line  (to the left or right from reticle), 7 km away, 5 marks, and so on ( also depending if you move along same direction (parallel).

- set up a training room for yourself with your Nürnberg and 1 or 2  red Nürnberg as targets. practice aiming at 12 , 7 and 3 km distance , while avoiding torpedoes ofc  :P  

  the AI can be set to easy, normal or advanced, so try them all to see the difference.

- Nürnberg has 2 turrets on the aft deck, make use of them by frequently sailing away from enemies (kiting)

- notice difference in trajectory of shells at long distances compared to mid range or short range.

- personally I do not like using RMB in-battle to follow the shell itself or switching between zoom or RMB, in training room however it can be fun/useful.

 

Good luck and have fun !

 

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1 hour ago, Capra76 said:

Get closer.

You did see he asked it regarding nurnberg?

 

My last advice ever would be to "get closer" :Smile-_tongue:

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[THESO]
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16 hours ago, WorkOstrich said:

First of all, congratulations, you want to improve your play. That is a wise choice and the first step. What immediatly comes to mind when looking at your data: You played 430 battles in 2 1/2 years. One battle every two days will not change your inner clockwork much. Other players will do ten times as many battles. So there is limits to how you can improve. Aiming takes practice and 400 battles over such a long time is not much.

 

So let's analyse that replay:

 

The starting conditions:

You play a Nürnberg on New Dawn map. It's a T7 standard battle, so no caps, but base capture. Your team spawns around I3. You are a squishy mid tier cruiser, so the basic play style is to keep moving and navigate a lot. You should use islands as cover against BBs and keep an eye on your PT-indicator, so you see when BBs start aiming at you to turn into safety. Your job is to get DDs early on and after that you light fires on BBs or shoot broadside cruisers, if the opportunity arises. Finding DDs is a bit more tasking than in domination mode as the DDs are under no pressure to cap but have freedom of movement. Likely they are ahead of their team and will rund into your DDs. So the first task is to be in a position where you can support your DDs by shooting suddenly detected enemy DDs. The DDs have detection ranges of about 6 km, so you should be 5 km behind your own DDs.

 

How the battle evolves:

You start staying way back in the line. Your first enemy is a PEF. You miss it cause you aim at the vertical level of the the current waterline. The ship however is already going 45° towards you and then turning further into you. So your shells, which were not so bad horizontally hit well past the target. It takes some practice to judge the angle correctly. If you are not sure, you can look at the mini map and check the course of the target and the resulting angle towards you. If you consistently hit too far back, you know you got a bias and you can systematically try to correct for it by just aiming shorter. You are too far back, your team is at G5 and I8 and you stay back at I4. You are 7 km behind the Nagato and 10 km behind the Nelson and those are already ships that are played further back. So even the closest target to shoot at is out of your maximum range. You already got a hint on that in your data. Low hit ratio, compared to your peers, is an indicator they play closer to the enemy. More distance means higher dispersion, so fewer shells land on target, even with perfect aim.

 

You then move on to shoot at your closest target, a Yorck. You miss it cause you hit on its current position, while it is going reverse. You can see that it is moving by looking at the icon on the map and the movement relative to the island. You need to look for these signs. Then you shift your fire to a DD. It's at 12-13 km and moving fast. Good players can hit a moving DD at that range, but it takes a lot of practice. One more reason for you to play closer to the front line. The key observation at that state of the battle is that the enemy BBs are at what would be A cap in a domination mode, C3, while you are at I6. No BBs are in front of you, so you could have pushed into the Yorck and the DD much earlier, not risking mid range salvos from a BB. That is what you want, you got the guns to punish and 2 BBs to have your back. Next you switch back to the Yorck. The aim is not bad, but the target is turning aggressively. You aim at the point the ship would be if it was sailing straight, but it is not.

That - by the way - is why I shake my head, whenever players are being accused of using "aim bot". You are aiming as an aim bot would indicate, at the current heading. Still you don't hit. The trick of predicting a turn is beyond the possibilities of any modification.

What you gotta do is not fixate on that point you are aiming at but keep looking at your target. There is a mind working on the other end of your guns and you can feel that. In the case of the Yorck you are shooting at, that Yorck is being shot at by a Nagato and a Nelson. So you can conclude, he will avoid turning broadside to these ships, turn just slightly to the left side and move back to the right to angle away. So you know you don't aim ahead to the left but almost on target cause he will be there 10s from now. By now you are 7 min into the battle and have done 3.5k damage, about 2.5k on the PEF and 1k on the Yorck.

 

The Yorck is destroyed and the DD retreats. Your team pushes counter-clockwise while the opposing team starts pushing down the middle. Again you are 7-10 km behind your BBs. If your Nürnberg was heavily damaged and you needed to carefully move from cover to cover, that would be acceptable positioning. Your Nürnberg however is still full health, not 1hp of damage. The Nürnberg is easily destroyed, yes, but no risk, no fun. You are not shot at cause you are just not there. You are no threat, you neither do damage nor are you a target that the enemy shoots at, giving your team mates a chance to get away. Basically your team is playing with 11 players against 12. Whenever I watch replays of the best players, I am amazed how much they get into the face of the other team. Let's not go yolo here, you don't need to play like a superhero, just a bit more joy in being where the music plays.

 

It is when the enemy King George V and New Orleans push through the middle that you - I dare say involuntarily - get pushed back into action. Suddenly you have targets in range and are in a good position to defend the base. That is a key moment in the battle, cause the threat of your base being captured makes your team nervous and results in individual mistakes that cost your team some ships. Back when the Yorck was destroyed and only a DD left, that was the chance to take a look at the map and realize that following your pushing team was no longer fruitful, that a Shiratsuyu was last spotted going south towards your cap and CV and that your best course of action was to go to your base and defend it. But you again run away from the enemies coming from the north, the enemy KGV is destroyed and you end up shooting at the NO at max range. It is moving at full speed. Leading a cruiser going some 32kts at 15-16km is very hard and ineffective, especially with 150mm guns cause of air drag. Again there is no threat but you play very cautious. You then turn going the I line back towards I1, which is the right decision, shooting the New Orleans now being in your cap. The NO is going full speed in a straight line and broadside to you. You should shoot your excellent german AP now, trying to get citadel shots, but you stick with HE. Your first salvo is still hanging in the air and you can already see it is lagging behind. That would be the indicator to lead your target more but you don't see it and keep your lead unaltered. An enemy squadron is spotting the CV and the NO starts shooting your CV. You are now close enough to land good hits with AP on the citadel of the NO, but your shells land well behind the target. Your scope is zoomed in too far, you don's even see, where the shells land. You should zoom out, observe and correct your aim. Had you hit the citadel of the NO only once with AP, the player would have startled and immediately turned his ship, stopping to shoot your CV and maybe even opening fire on you. You see a NO has weak armor, too. The No-player knows that. So the player will get very nervous and insecure when suddenly a chunk of his health is gone. He will react as a frightened squirrel and might make mistakes. He is however not disturbed and quickly finishes your CV.

Another BB is deleted and now it's 4v5, 8 min left on the clock and for the first time your ship starts taking any damage.

 

The game at this point seems already lost. A BB and the Shira are in your base, an Atlanta and another BB behind support them. Four enemies against you and an Indianapolis that is quickly focussed down.

If you could create some distraction and get one or more enemies to shoot you instead, the Indianapolis might get close enough to use radar, detect the DD in your base and reset it. Again you are a few km behind the Indianapolis, so it is the priority and eventually gets destroyed.

Your problem now is unsolvable. You would need to get into the base and chase the Shira, but the BBs would kill you. It is your own surviving DD that safes your team and secures victory by sneaking into the enemy base and avoiding the air strikes of the enemy CV trying to reset him. Your Shinonome is a very good player, probably nobody complimented him, though he deserved it. Your key contribution to the battle is shooting the enemy BB in your base, resetting the base and so your team caps the enemy base and wins 3 vs 5. That last bit is not bad. If you intended that I don't know. At that point it was not about damage or deleting enemies, the game had been reduced to resetting your base while hoping your DD could hide in smoke.

 

Conclusion:

You are lagging behind. Your aim is biased so you hit behind your targets. Try hitting further ahead. If your brain tells you to hit a certain spot, add a bit of lead and correct your aim. If you shoot at turning targets try to visualize in your inner eye the position it will be in 10s and aim for that "ghost". Aim however is not the real thing to work on. Positioning is what makes it so hard for you. You are too far back. Get closer. You will have more targets to shoot at and hit them better. Be as close as possible while staying away as much as needed to be safe. Don't be at distance and improve your aim, but hit and then increase distance, when you can reliably hit. At that point, you will not want to be at distance anymore.

Take your time to study the map. Where are the threats to your ship? Think what they will do? Will a BB 20 km away shoot at you or is it busy fighting on the other side of the map? As you get closer to the enemy think about your escape route. How far is your detection? What islands can you use to disengage or which ships must be destroyed so you can get undetected. If that basic plan is in your pocket you can focus on your opponents and do what your Nürnberg is best at, bullying DDs, ambush CLs and burning down BBs.

 

Best of luck.

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Vor 6 Stunden, Garfield4 sagte:

use the mouse-wheel to zoom in to max zoom right before you fire

i would say use shift to zoom in and mousewheel only to adjust a bit if needed.

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[TALOS]
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I think that KOENIGSBERG and Nuremberg r the most accurate CL!

I have about 50% on them. I use dynamic crosshair, but now the most time I fired just seeing the target. Practice in Coop battles. Stay behind a big ship and just fired at enemies.

Without the argue of win u have time to practice. If u cant hit more than 50% in COOP dont get in random battles...

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[-IMR-]
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Folks many thanks for the extensive and detailed advice. Beyond the call of duty!

 

I think my key take-aways from this are:

1) Get closer. The Nurnberg is a bit of a glass cannon (and I've been punished many times for this), but I'm over playing this aspect.

2) Lead even more than my initial estimates.

3) Get closer.

4) Use the scroll wheel. A bit problematic for me, I suffer from RSI a lot (hence my low battle figures, I go for months at a stretch without being able to play). Scroll wheels really aggravate it.

 

Anyone have any tips on using keys for zoom? (currently I leave it fixed on max zoom, and just use shift to come in and out of bino view. It's a problem for side running DDs at full speed, but otherwise most ships stay on screen)

 

 

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13 minutes ago, WorkOstrich said:

Folks many thanks for the extensive and detailed advice. Beyond the call of duty!

 

I think my key take-aways from this are:

1) Get closer. The Nurnberg is a bit of a glass cannon (and I've been punished many times for this), but I'm over playing this aspect.

2) Lead even more than my initial estimates.

3) Get closer.

4) Use the scroll wheel. A bit problematic for me, I suffer from RSI a lot (hence my low battle figures, I go for months at a stretch without being able to play). Scroll wheels really aggravate it.

 

Anyone have any tips on using keys for zoom? (currently I leave it fixed on max zoom, and just use shift to come in and out of bino view. It's a problem for side running DDs at full speed, but otherwise most ships stay on screen)

 

 

In controls you can enable "dynamic crosshair" which, how do I say it, keeps scale on lead indicator regardless of zoom and when you're at it, set "Alternative Interface mode" to full, shows quite lot more info than "here is enemy". Also last known position and ship names on minimap - ingame, press Ctrl to unlock mouse, click on small cog next to minimap. And IIRC Pg Up and Pg Dwn controls zoom camera, they might work for sniper mode too. 

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4 hours ago, Minos_of_Creta said:

I think that KOENIGSBERG and Nuremberg r the most accurate CL!

I have about 50% on them. I use dynamic crosshair, but now the most time I fired just seeing the target. Practice in Coop battles. Stay behind a big ship and just fired at enemies.

Without the argue of win u have time to practice. If u cant hit more than 50% in COOP dont get in random battles...

 

Average main battery hit rate with Nurnberg in random battles is 23.77%. Even in co-op, it is only 39.84%.

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[LEEUW]
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3 hours ago, WorkOstrich said:

 

Anyone have any tips on using keys for zoom? (currently I leave it fixed on max zoom, and just use shift to come in and out of bino view. It's a problem for side running DDs at full speed, but otherwise most ships stay on screen)

I use shift to zoom in and out. I rarely use the scrollwheel because those two modes of vision are the only ones I need. But it's personal preference I guess. 

 

As for aiming you can use the enemy ship's smokestacks to see in which  direction its moving. But in Nurnberg there is another great atribute you can use: your torpedo system. Select your torpedoes when aiming at a ship to see if it is accelerating or decelerating. 

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[SCRUB]
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Hi all,

 

I wholeheartedly suggest that you try playing with "Training Room" to get the feel for the ship and guns! :Smile_Default:

 

You can really train there in safe and calm environment (i.e. without any interruptions or distractions) and then try the learned skills in the "CoOp" against BOTs... you will see how, after some good practice, your aiming gets much better! :Smile_great:

 

After that just play normal "Random" battles!  :Smile_honoring:

 

Leo "Apollo11"

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4 hours ago, WorkOstrich said:

Use the scroll wheel. A bit problematic for me, I suffer from RSI a lot (hence my low battle figures, I go for months at a stretch without being able to play). Scroll wheels really aggravate it.

As others have said, use the shift key; besides avoiding the mouse wheel, it has the merit of being massively faster.

 

A good habit to get into (especially with ships that take longer to reload) is to zoom out between shots, to have a look around - it makes it harder for people to ambush you etc. due to your being too focused on your primary target.

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[THESO]
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5 hours ago, WorkOstrich said:

4) Use the scroll wheel. A bit problematic for me, I suffer from RSI a lot (hence my low battle figures, I go for months at a stretch without being able to play). Scroll wheels really aggravate it.

 

Anyone have any tips on using keys for zoom? (currently I leave it fixed on max zoom, and just use shift to come in and out of bino view. It's a problem for side running DDs at full speed, but otherwise most ships stay on screen)

You can use the shift button. I mostly use the right mouse button. It will max zoom out while pressed and zoom you back in when released. So I press the right mouse button, take a look around while guns are reloading, release it to be back on target and shoot again. I mostly play at max zoom in or out and only use the scroll wheel when shooting fast ships with slow shells.

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