Asashio cursed?

[PPKinguin]

So I have finally decided to by the Asashio, now that the guns are buffed through general IJN buff.

My friends and I have always joked about the Asashio curse, that whichever team has one will lose, no matter the Asashios performance (often bad ofc because critically missplayed).

I load up my first battle, catch a couple of BBs by surprise and break 100k dmg in 4 mins. 

holymother.jpg

Now by that time half my team is dead. HOW DID THAT HAPPEN?
After 12 min the match ends with me getting 191k dmg, highest of the day, and fastest loss too.
 

So can anybody confirm the Asashio curse? I'm curious...

[Admiral_Noif]

You didn't carry enough your team. You need kills too.

 

My Asashio does fine with many carries and wins.

[FixCVs_Nautical_Metaphor]

You are of course just uselessly damage-whoring while neglecting your spotting, scouting and capping duties, as can easily be seen from the complete lack of the respective ribbons in your screenshot.

 

It's not so much an Asashio curse but rather an Asashio player disease.

[Episparh]

Oh, I can explain. 

The majority of the Asashio players care mostly about damage. So usualy when the battle starts they trend to head to a flank and abondon their team. 

Meanwhile, the red team have +1 DD advantage, so they usualy prevail over Asashio's team (excluding the asashio). And while our brave hero farm that juicy BBs for thousands of damage the green team CAs and BBs are spotted by the red team DDs and murdered. Hance, the battle is lost. 

 

P. S. Advice: Do not be that hero. Do your job of contesting enemy DDs and spot for your team. After that you may have a chance to farm some damage as all other DDs do. 

[MRGTB]

I have the Asashio B and like it best of all the ships I play. And yes, not hard in some games to rack up over 60k damage because of the 20k torps. I generally do better in the ship, than I might do in others I'll play up to T8. That doesn't mean I do good damage every game, just the same as any other ship played, sometimes I do rubbish in it - but have topped 100k damage a few times in it now, which is pretty good really for a DD played.

 

I think it's unfair the say an Asashio player doesn't think of the team and is only interested in farming damage. It's better for the ship (with 20k torps) to stay alive and help kill those BB's that can dictate the way a game goes. A dead Asashio at the very start of the game "through rushing cap" and not having the HP pool, guns to fight other DD's, nor the speed and agility to escape anything close up at cap once spotted - that doesn't do anything for the team.

 

That's not to say I won't rush cap at times. I will do, but really it's not a good way to play the ship because it's too weak to contest caps in fights with other DD's at the very start of a match when they all head for it.

[PPKinguin]

Yes, yes very smart a** of some of you guys, but in this match there were no caps and the map was Estuary with 2 DDs per team going to both sides. I was always the closest to enemy team. 

But I'm not saying that this one match is the standard for all Asashio curse matches, just a prime example.

[Bear__Necessities]

Played 8. Won 7. But then again I play it like a Yugumo so...

[Ze_Reckless]

49 minutes ago, PPKinguin said:

I was always the closest to enemy team.

No, you weren't. You have 0 spotting ribbons.

[Ubertron_X]

The curse is to launch 20km torps from 18km...

[RUSSIANBlAS]

I'm really not a fan of Asashio, clan mates tell me it's good and all but I feel you're completely at the mercy of how good the enemy DDs are.

 

Any gunboat DD will simply laugh at you as unless they have drastically less HP than you. Without the ability to hammer enemy DD with guns (I know they're OK but simply that, they're not amazing) and the torps inability to hit anything except BBs and CVs it essentially leaves you with very little options other than to passively spot and hope your team does their jobs. 

 

At T8 the MM will have a portion of radar cruisers who will also laugh at you all day long as you can do zero against them since the torps can't even stop them pushing you. 

 

The high damage totals are complete lies as they will be 90%+ farmed from BBs, 50k vs DDs is a far better damage total than 200k from BBs as it means you'll likely have won some caps along the way instead of border torped passive players. 

 

I'd sooner take my all round gunboat DDs with the capability to damage everything... 

[Bear__Necessities]

45 minutes ago, Negativvv said:

 but I feel you're completely at the mercy of how good the enemy DDs are.

That’s why you have to be the better, smarter DD player... which most aren’t and this where the paradox of the ship begins. 

 

Ultimate BB killer, super IJN sneakbote, great cap stealer and great screening DD for the team. However she is played by a lot of potato’s who just see the torp range and potato on ahead utterly missing out on the broken but deadly nature of this ship. It sickens my DD sensibilities when I see asasshio players just hug the boarder hoping to land torps on maybe the handful of BB’s that side of the map whilst missing out/failing all her strengths.

 

But then again Shima players do this all the time so I shouldn’t be surprised. And anyone who has only high damage is playing the ship wrong. I have lower average damage but I take out/spot the DD’s so others take them out. Cap, then start focusing BB’s. If you play it like a Yugumo or Kagero you get the best out of the ship and aid the team greatly.

[El2aZeR]

Asashio is designed to farm damage on BBs.

There are few things more useless to your team than farming damage on BBs.

 

Thus there are far better choices if you wish to actually influence the match.

[HaachamaShipping]

3 hours ago, El2aZeR said:

Asashio is designed to farm damage on BBs.

There are few things more useless to your team than farming damage on BBs.

 

Thus there are far better choices if you wish to actually influence the match.

Pretty much this. At the very best, Asashio can manage to devstrike BBs, taking them out. But farming damage on the ship class most resilient to damage doesn't translate into much match influence. Even with the disproportionate killing power of the Asashio. 

[SnuSnu_RIP]

I was expecting something like "my Asashio is cursed because it will not hit cruisers and destroyers with its torpedos".... I'm truly disappointed! 

[DasTongle]

7 hours ago, PPKinguin said:

Yes, yes very smart a** of some of you guys, but in this match there were no caps and the map was Estuary with 2 DDs per team going to both sides. I was always the closest to enemy team. 

But I'm not saying that this one match is the standard for all Asashio curse matches, just a prime example.

Yet still you spotted no ships and all the damage done can be compensated for cause the guns are still in the game hurting people behind your murderous amok run in the front. While that is fine it still does not win matches sadly so yeah i do have an idea about the poor "assashios curse" 

[DJ_Die]

8 hours ago, MRGTB said:

I have the Asashio B and like it best of all the ships I play. And yes, not hard in some games to rack up over 60k damage because of the 20k torps. I generally do better in the ship, than I might do in others I'll play up to T8. That doesn't mean I do good damage every game, just the same as any other ship played, sometimes I do rubbish in it - but have topped 100k damage a few times in it now, which is pretty good really for a DD played.

 

I think it's unfair the say an Asashio player doesn't think of the team and is only interested in farming damage. It's better for the ship (with 20k torps) to stay alive and help kill those BB's that can dictate the way a game goes. A dead Asashio at the very start of the game "through rushing cap" and not having the HP pool, guns to fight other DD's, nor the speed and agility to escape anything close up at cap once spotted - that doesn't do anything for the team.

 

That's not to say I won't rush cap at times. I will do, but really it's not a good way to play the ship because it's too weak to contest caps in fights with other DD's at the very start of a match when they all head for it.

And thats why you average 34k damage in that ship which is roughly 1/2 of the average HP of the class you prey on... Thats pretty bad wouldnt you say? That also translates into very low winrate of 46%. Asashio is a horribly designed ship with very little influence on the match because torping BBs from 20km is just pointless. 

 

Spotting does NOT always equal rushing caps. In fact, it almost never does. You have to keep situational awareness, map out the enemy and friendly radar cruisers, and then either make a push for the cap or play it catiously and screw the enemy DD. 

[Malfuss]

I only played the 25 games for the extra XP in my Asashio before I stopped playing it and put my Captain elsewhere. From what I remember I did far better in it using it as a normal DD than I did trying to flank round and just go for the BB's. I stopped playing it because it was a poor cap contest compared to my Benson and it was just frustrating for me. I might take it out again now the guns have been buffed but don't see it being a regular occurence.

[Amon_ITA]

5 hours ago, El2aZeR said:

Asashio is designed to farm damage on BBs.

There are few things more useless to your team than farming damage on BBs.

 

Thus there are far better choices if you wish to actually influence the match.

 

I dont' agree with this.

 

Asashio is great at farming Batleships, that's clear. But it's even more useful at scaring them away from the cap at game start. When an asashio send torps enemy battleships are obliged to keep their distance or manouvering hard. These things alone give asahio's team a great advantage in the opening phase of the game. Having done that you can often clear a whole flank from enemy battleships, scaring them away or sinking them. And a flank without battleship support is a lost flank.

 

Another thing to keep in mind is than when the game progresses your guns become really important too. when enemy dd's and cruisers are low health you can kill them quite easily if you know what you are doing.

 

 

[Amon_ITA]

Also put torpedo acceleration on that ship. Your range drops to 16 km's but 71kts torpedoes are a great tool. And the range is more than enough.

[RUSSIANBlAS]

1 minute ago, Amon_ITA said:

 

I dont' agree with this.

 

Asashio is great at farming Batleships, that's clear. But it's even more useful at scaring them away from the cap at game start. When an asashio send torps enemy battleships are obliged to keep their distance or manouvering hard. These things alone give asahio's team a great advantage in the opening phase of the game. Having done that you can often clear a whole flank from enemy battleships, scaring them away or sinking them. And a flank without battleship support is a lost flank.

 

Another thing to keep in mind is than when the game progresses your guns become really important too. when enemy dd's and cruisers are low health you can kill them quite easily if you know what you are doing.

 

 

Unless the enemy BBs are potatoes then they may well take a torp or two to push. As unless it's very close range an Asashio isn't nuking anyone.

 

 

Also yeah the guns are ok but if you're waiting for late game to pick the enemy off then you could have already lost by then.

 

Don't deny success is possible but the ship feels sub optimal compared to the competition unless you like trolling BB.

 

[RUSSIANBlAS]

4 minutes ago, Amon_ITA said:

 

I dont' agree with this.

 

Asashio is great at farming Batleships, that's clear. But it's even more useful at scaring them away from the cap at game start. When an asashio send torps enemy battleships are obliged to keep their distance or manouvering hard. These things alone give asahio's team a great advantage in the opening phase of the game. Having done that you can often clear a whole flank from enemy battleships, scaring them away or sinking them. And a flank without battleship support is a lost flank.

 

Another thing to keep in mind is than when the game progresses your guns become really important too. when enemy dd's and cruisers are low health you can kill them quite easily if you know what you are doing.

 

 

Unless the enemy BBs are potatoes then they may well take a torp or two to push. As unless it's very close range an Asashio isn't nuking anyone.

 

 

Also yeah the guns are ok but if you're waiting for late game to pick the enemy off then you could have already lost by then.

 

Don't deny success is possible but the ship feels sub optimal compared to the competition unless you like trolling BB

 

[Kenliero]

Asashio is not designed to farm damage, even though torpedoes let you think that way. It's designed to spot enemies, and only in the end game finish those BB's.

My average damage in Asashio is crap, but the reason I still run 61% wins with "one-trick-pony" is purely because of that 5.4km concealment.

one of the best ways to get win for your team is to spot those enemies and point them with F3, so your team can focus fire at them.

[Amon_ITA]

32 minutes ago, Negativvv said:

Unless the enemy BBs are potatoes then they may well take a torp or two to push. As unless it's very close range an Asashio isn't nuking anyone.

 

 

Also yeah the guns are ok but if you're waiting for late game to pick the enemy off then you could have already lost by then.

 

Don't deny success is possible but the ship feels sub optimal compared to the competition unless you like trolling BB.

 

 

No, my experience in randoms is different from what you are saying. With torp acceleration AND torpedo reload you can saturate an area easily. You dont' need to aim at BB's projected course at all, you just drop 4 salvoes of torps in the general push direction and done, if they go there they're half health, if they don't they'll loose the cap.

 

Having said that you don't have to engage enemy dd's at game start. You just outspot them and let your cruisers do the job. You just have to be ready to kite them if they push. You have spotting advantage with the vast majority of your opposition.

[Amon_ITA]

36 minutes ago, Negativvv said:

Don't deny success is possible but the ship feels sub optimal compared to the competition unless you like trolling BB

 

 

Winning caps and and having enemy battleships removed from an entire flank is much more than denying success.

[HaachamaShipping]

11 minutes ago, Kenliero said:

Asashio is not designed to farm damage, even though torpedoes let you think that way. It's designed to spot enemies, and only in the end game finish those BB's.

My average damage in Asashio is crap, but the reason I still run 61% wins with "one-trick-pony" is purely because of that 5.4km concealment.

one of the best ways to get win for your team is to spot those enemies and point them with F3, so your team can focus fire at them.

For merely spotting targets, Asashio offers little over other DDs. Yes, it has 5.4 km concealment. One of three ships at 5.4 km, with a few more joining in at 5.5. The issue is, unlike for example a ship that can take on enemy DDs, Asashio is far less capable at denying the enemy spotting. As a Harekaze for example, one of the main advantages I hold is that enemy DDs have to keep me in mind not just for my detection, but because if they run into me without support, I can put out some serious hurt. Vs Asashio, the amount of threat Asashio poses is based on the amount of threat the backup poses.

 

And the spotting also does not make make up for lack of impact. Basically, if you cannot nuke BBs fast, what is the point of your ship? A Benson can reasonably well spot and contest spotting, if a Benson gets damage in on cruisers or DDs early with guns or torps, that ship has already way more impact than the spotter with odd torp on a BB.

10 minutes ago, Amon_ITA said:

 

Winning caps and and having enemy battleships removed from an entire flank is much more than denying success.

I think you misinterpreted words here. Negativvv is not denying that success is possible in Asashio. Meaning, that it is him not denying the fact that the ship can be successful.