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Kenliero

Grosse secondary monster?

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grosse.jpg

 

 

Now that this 16x105mm secondaries can pen 32mm of armor with IFHE... What do you think?

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Vor 26 Minuten, Kenliero sagte:

Now that this 16x105mm secondaries can pen 32mm of armor with IFHE... What do you think?

The ship will still remain Kitakaze fodder because the secondaries need to see a target to fire at it.

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[BYOB]
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The upcoming changes to Frederick the Great won't change the fact that it will remain ineffectual.

With their large superstructures and lack of concealment, German BBs are prime targets for IFHE using ships. A brawling secondary specced BB is just dead weight, especially at T9-10.

Also, the 1/4 pen rule should have been given to all German BBs armed with 105mm secondaries and not only the Freddy.

 

PS: Investing in IFHE will leave you with no defensive skills, as secondary builds are very skill intensive.

 

 

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1 hour ago, Aragathor said:

The upcoming changes to Frederick the Great won't change the fact that it will remain ineffectual.

With their large superstructures and lack of concealment, German BBs are prime targets for IFHE using ships. A brawling secondary specced BB is just dead weight, especially at T9-10.

Also, the 1/4 pen rule should have been given to all German BBs armed with 105mm secondaries and not only the Freddy. 

In the next update only the 105s of Freddy will pen 26 cm without IFHE. 

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They will be simlar in effectiveness to the GK.

Considering the GK has 50% more main guns, it will be no monster.

 

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Vor 7 Stunden, 22cm sagte:

In the next update only the 105s of Freddy will pen 26 cm without IFHE. 

Yes well but there's this "bug fix"...

Zitat
  • Fixed an issue with incorrect armor penetration. The armor penetration capacity of the 150 mm HE shells of the secondary guns has been increased from 36 mm to 37 mm for the following German ships: Prinz Eitel Friedrich, Admiral Graf Spee, HSF Graf Spee, Gneisenau, Scharnhorst, Bismarck, Tirpitz, Tirpitz B, Graf Zeppelin, Roon, Friedrich der Große, Großer Kurfürst, and [Großer Kurfürst].

The question is which potential targets have any 37mm armor and thus can now receive pens where they couldn't before.

 

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9 hours ago, Nautical_Metaphor said:

Yes well but there's this "bug fix"...

The question is which potential targets have any 37mm armor and thus can now receive pens where they couldn't before.

 

32mm pen is the magic number. All Battleships (except GK )in T10 has 32mm bow and aft armor, which it can now penetrate with those 105mm guns. Also French BB's have 32mm everywhere, including the belt. British BB's have 32mm everywhere, except the belt, so it will pen pretty much all ships from front and aft and French/British from pretty much everywhere, which makes massive difference, considering those 105mm have really fast reload also., down to 2.3s if you spec it to the maximum. Even though the main battery is a bit weak(main battery reload was also buffed in 0.7.12), it has pretty fun secondaries now.

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19 hours ago, Nautical_Metaphor said:

The ship will still remain Kitakaze fodder because the secondaries need to see a target to fire at it.

Imagine if you could blindfire your secondaries on a point on the map. boiiiiiiiiiiiiii :Smile_trollface:

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15 hours ago, Nautical_Metaphor said:

Yes well but there's this "bug fix"...

The question is which potential targets have any 37mm armor and thus can now receive pens where they couldn't before.

 

That bug fix is a different matter and pretty inconsequential. It only adjusts HE pen of 15 cm guns by 1 mm to where it should have been all along, but this does not pass any meaningful tresholds with or without IFHE.

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5 hours ago, aboomination said:

Currywurst a viable secondary-build ship? Breaking news! :Smile_trollface:

 

That is actually pretty low secondary damage in that game. He was spending a lot of time in the open ocean and out of secondary range.

 

PS. He also lacked maximum range in secondaries. Probably missing secondary module.

 

 

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6 hours ago, Kenliero said:

That is actually pretty low secondary damage in that game. He was spending a lot of time in the open ocean and out of secondary range.

Who said that secondary builds were super competitive?

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1 hour ago, aboomination said:

Who said that secondary builds were super competitive?

My point was in that video secondary damage was only like 27k, when I mostly do around 40-50k in almost all games... up to 70-100k in good ones.

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One time i had 80k base damage (without fires!) from secondaries with IFHE on GK. After some research on test server i think that:

  • there is little chance to do even half of that again,
  • IFHE isn't that OP - you can extra smash Des Moines, Republique and some vurneable parts of BBs
  • secondaries even with Aux mod 1 are very vurneable, after some hits you can loose all of them :D
  • moving closer than 12km to enemies isn't smart on GK
  • secondaries are still nice for self-defence vs DDs and rushing enemies,

There is no sense to invest more than 2 skills in secondaries (PM and manual). Actually i have survival build captain and another one with manual instead of fire prevention. That build need only to change main battery mod 1 to aux mod 1, becouse BB main turrets are enought armored. Manual give them enought accuracy with aiming mod to hit enemies. I have similar captain for Japan and French BBs
 

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FDG and GK still remain monsters. You just have to know how to play them. Simple as that. If you can’t of course you’re going to struggle.

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I bought back FDG after the buff to see whats all the fuss about and to knock off its flake and I see no relevant change in performance, IMHO its still just something you need to grind through to get to T10 (as are most t9s I guess) or skip, its only merrit is maybee some vague collector value as AFAIK it was an acctual project and thats about it... For pure sec fun i stll rather take bismark, tirpitz or some of the french firestarters or if its high tier go for the big guy and 12x420mm

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[-DKBG]
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The biggest issue is that in short time you will meet more CVs. You need to spec up for AA. That will most likely take away points from HE spam protection and/or Secondary build.

 

You can of course go that secondary build but will likely be hurt badly against planes with no chance to stop them. If it is any different than with full AA speced ship is another question.

 

There are a lot of HE spam in the game at the moment, your secondaries really need to survive that long.  Also many ships tend to stay out of those close range with secondary fire. DDs do not fear them much with smoke and torps. And the cruisers well below 11.5 km is often just a very bad idea due to being nuked with main guns.

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