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Max_Kammerer

Newport scenario after changes

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After last changes in tier and amount of approaching bots is Newport really hard... Before changes we mostly won (Leander or Perth) with  3-4-5 stars, despite the team composition (played maybe 100×). Now, with random teams you are happy if scenario is not lost... :( Very strong bots evading torps and shells with sixth sense to locate you and precisely shot and burn you... I don't unerstand the philosophy of WG in scenarios changes.

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10 minutes ago, Max_Kammerer said:

After last changes in tier and amount of approaching bots is Newport really hard... Before changes we mostly won (Leander or Perth) with  3-4-5 stars, despite the team composition (played maybe 100×). Now, with random teams you are happy if scenario is not lost... :( Very strong bots evading torps and shells with sixth sense to locate you and precisely shot and burn you... I don't unerstand the philosophy of WG in scenarios changes.

 

Im often playing Leander myself and have played a lot of Newport since it was released. Recently, im not sure if its the changes or more and more bad players, but I agree with your observation, that a lof of games are lost. Something, that has never happened before, happened a couple of days ago: the second wave made it into the harbour. I sunk while trying to stop them - alone - since everyone else was already hugging the heal point.

 

Can we maybe have "normal" and "hard" operations finaly, so the difficulty can be fine-tuned accordingly? This concerns many of the operations, f.e. Ultimate Frontier.

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Couple minutes before, another lost in Newport with Leander - combination of poor players and really good bots is deadly. I finished with playing this scenario - it is much more diffcult than random battles now for me.

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I've tried this iteration with Ryujo a few times and for CVs it's a lot easier but, and it's quite a caveat, the friendly bot Baltimore is really hard to keep alive if the team isn't fully committed to do so. I also feel, but it could just be that I had an established routine for dealing with the ships when bot carriers were around and it's now shattered, that the final wave arrives a bit sooner. Combining both facts means that I've only managed to get 4 star completions thus far.

 

40 minutes ago, ForlornSailor said:

Something, that has never happened before, happened a couple of days ago: the second wave made it into the harbour. I sunk while trying to stop them - alone - since everyone else was already hugging the heal point.

Not to that level but yes, I've also noticed that the second wave is now a lot more prone to get awfully close to the harbour, while the only ship that previously used to break through was the Furutaka in the third wave. This might be due to the lack of bot carriers too: since there's no Zuiho to "protect", slowing down the others, the corresponding wave has free reign to push forward.

 

Salute.

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2 minutes ago, Estaca_de_Bares said:

Not to that level but yes, I've also noticed that the second wave is now a lot more prone to get awfully close to the harbour, while the only ship that previously used to break through was the Furutaka in the third wave. This might be due to the lack of bot carriers too: since there's no Zuiho to "protect", slowing down the others, the corresponding wave has free reign to push forward. 

 

Im not exactly sure, but I think, the bots do spawn closer to the harbour now, isnt it? I had the feeling right away in the first game, since I was able to shoot with my Leander before those green forts went down and spotting was gone for a moment. Before, you could only reach them with a BB? Or have the spawns of our ships been altered? Need to check some older yt-vid of the Operation I guess.

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They really need to balance these ops for random teams, not 7 player div's... You know you lose when you see 3 BB's camping hard at the repair ships and have the DD's rushing to a suicide within 5 minutes

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1 minute ago, ForlornSailor said:

Im not exactly sure, but I think, the bots do spawn closer to the harbour now, isnt it?

True, it could be that. Well, the best way I have to check it out is running one of the latest replays and an old one, both with the minimap expanded to the maximum, take screenshots and superimpose them. I suppose I can do that later in the evening.

 

Salute.

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[MUMMY]
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I needed a 7 player division.

 

Found it very difficult to complete with random players due to you almost always getting lumped with a potato or three.

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[SCRUB]
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And I thought this would be a good scenatio to grind Queen Elizabeth :)

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Newport was since release one of the unbalanced Ops but as I saw 2 weeks ago, with the "improvements" they made to Killer Whale, Wargaming *edited* about randoms as the Operations get "progressively" harder each patch.

 

*edited* insentive for new player to play Ops. Well done Wargaming... :Smile_facepalm:

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14 minutes ago, AnEvilJoke said:

Operations get "progressively" harder each patch.

Yes - especially for cruisers.

The bots seem to have a real hardon for cruisers.

(Happens in coop to a lesser extent also)

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After all the improvements there is no point in playing Operations, save those not yet "improved" by WG into oblivion.

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17 hours ago, Admiral_H_Nelson said:

Yes - especially for cruisers.

The bots seem to have a real hardon for cruisers.

(Happens in coop to a lesser extent also)

The way combat in WoWs works, targetting the cruisers first is actually a good strategy, since they a) deal the most damage over time, and b) are the easiest ship type to sink quickly. So I guess they have programmed the AI with this in mind. But it does get a bit silly at times...  :Smile_sceptic:

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I've checked my replays down to 0.7.5 and in none of them the spawns of the second wave coincide with those on this last iteration (old second wave used to appear in the middle, while the new one has shown to NE in all my tries for now). I could go further back but maybe playing some more would be the better approach, which is what I'm going to do now. Send a message if interested, I'll take my Ryujo for that.

 

Salute.

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21 ore fa, Admiral_H_Nelson ha scritto:

Yes - especially for cruisers.

The bots seem to have a real hardon for cruisers.

(Happens in coop to a lesser extent also)

 

20 ore fa, Procrastes ha scritto:

The way combat in WoWs works, targetting the cruisers first is actually a good strategy, since they a) deal the most damage over time, and b) are the easiest ship type to sink. So I guess they have programmed the AI with this in mind. But it does get a bit silly at times...  :Smile_sceptic:

 

No...

Since some patches ago AI aims exclusivly for the citadelle and as they since the start get a "bonus" on dispersion and damage (in other words: "The lazy way of programming AI"), *edited* driving a Cruiser.

 

But hey, half a year ago @MrConway promissed that he'll tell the Devs that they done goofed... But I guess he lied again...

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5 hours ago, hgbn_dk said:

They really need to balance these ops for random teams, not 7 player div's... You know you lose when you see 3 BB's camping hard at the repair ships and have the DD's rushing to a suicide within 5 minutes

Almost sounds like the average random battle, but sure it really doesn't help when the team is smaller and it is a dps against time.

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To me it looks like they don't want people to play these operations.... No reward reset when its the operation of the week. Making them harder for random teams, constant nerfing the XP gained and so on.

 

Just keep your creepy fingers away from Cherry Blossom please.. No need to ruin this one too

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20 ore fa, AnEvilJoke ha scritto:

Since some patches ago AI aims exclusivly for the citadelle and as they since the start get a "bonus" on dispersion and damage (in other words: "The lazy way of programming AI"),*edited* driving a Cruiser.

 

True. You notice in Co-Op, when the bots have a Minotaur or DM and you go with something like a Takao. Theyll rip you a new one so fast, you think a couple of super unicums have replaced the AI.

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I feel its mostly due to players being total garbage rather than changes they made. Yes, Bots evade torps almost 100% of the time and it sucks balls. But they still eat citadels like candy if you get in the right position.

 

Somehow i feel, that the 2nd wave is slower than before, and its harder to kill the 2 BBs in time to get your attention to the 3rd wave. That was the problem the first game i played this week. 3rd wave couldnt be stopped before they reached the harbour.

 

Anyway, to me it feels like WG are really being [edited] about making OPs constantly less fun to play :etc_swear:

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16 minutes ago, ForlornSailor said:

 

True. You notice in Co-Op, when the bots have a Minotaur or DM and you go with something like a Takao. Theyll rip you a new one so fast, you think a couple of super unicums have replaced the AI.

In coop my most feared enemy is the NC because of the 2.0 sigma. The bot NC shells are homing on cruiser citadels like crazy while theres a 95% chance the human NC on your team is the average 42% wr coop player... 

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56 minutes ago, Hyperion84 said:

Almost sounds like the average random battle, but sure it really doesn't help when the team is smaller and it is a dps against time.

Much more difficult for me than normal random now...

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Well, I've made a division with @ForlornSailor and operation completed with 5 stars and Tactical Expertise. Luckily enough, the second wave spawned in its usual place in the middle and it seems that the locations are exactly the same as previously, with the only change of the Furutaka at the rear instead of the Zuiho. We also had the fortune of a listening team that didn't spread much and focused fire, so the stars aligned a lot.

 

Salute.

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54 minutes ago, ForlornSailor said:

True. You notice in Co-Op, when the bots have a Minotaur or DM and you go with something like a Takao. Theyll rip you a new one so fast, you think a couple of super unicums have replaced the AI.

 

As I played with and against unicums aswell as having almost 2k Co-Op battles by now... AI way stronger than any unicum could ever be when it comes to aiming.

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5 hours ago, DFens_666 said:

I feel its mostly due to players being total garbage rather than changes they made. Yes, Bots evade torps almost 100% of the time and it sucks balls. But they still eat citadels like candy if you get in the right position.

This was also my impression.

I didn't notice this particular ops being harder compared to what it was. But the teammates are just really bad.

 

I was in a div with Forlorn and BLUB a couple days ago and we just wanted to get a quick win for the dailies and it turned into a loss.

 

I was second instead of first, kidna surprising considering I played Ryujo and knew this ops from PTS. First place was a Normandie which unfortunately had his stats conceiled.

 

The remaining 3 teammates wereof poor quality, all less then 1000 games played, though 2 had a reasonable winrate of roughly 50%.

 

The bottom feeder of the list was a 43% winrate player. All 3 of them were below all our div members and this Normandie was the best of all of us.

 

But I still believe it's more to do with poor quality teamplayers that don't know what to do and where to be when.

 

But I do think WG should consider a rebalance of this ops at some point, since it relies quite heavily on a good CV player being there and this will change with the CV rework.

 

So far the best balanced ops I ever played with random teammembers, was the Sunray in the Darkness normal mode. It was difficult to fail that one, but you'd need decent teammembers to get all of the stars.

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