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Chullainn

Which nation and/or tree is the best to start with?

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I'm installing the game as I type this and the only WG game I've played is WOTBlitz; so I'm going in completely blind. Therefore, which line/nation do people think is best for a new pleb to start out on? My sense of patriotism is drawing me towards British Cruisers but I've been told they're hard as hell to play. Other than that, I have no idea at all.

 

Thanks in advance for any suggestions. :)

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2 hours ago, Chullainn said:

I'm installing the game as I type this and the only WG game I've played is WOTBlitz; so I'm going in completely blind. Therefore, which line/nation do people think is best for a new pleb to start out on? My sense of patriotism is drawing me towards British Cruisers but I've been told they're hard as hell to play. Other than that, I have no idea at all.

 

Thanks in advance for any suggestions. :)

Firstly, welcome!

I agree with the suggestion to not start with the RN cruiser line - they are fun, but definitely not a good place to begin. As others have said, you can do a lot worse than the IJN cruisers - they're generally a good balance between guns and torps, and give a good introduction to the class.

 

As a WOT player (both Blitz and PC) myself, I do find the KM BBs a lot of fun - they're great for closer-range fights; just be mindful that they do not teach 'classic' BB play - the US and IJN lines do a better job of that.

 

If you fancy giving DDs a go (and who wouldn't - they're magnificent?!), the IJN line is good for learning about stealthy torp play (beware though: their guns are often a bit weak, and the enemy will see your torps coming from miles away), whilst the Russians are all about guns and being spotted from orbit (and their torps are horribly short-ranged to start with). The US DD line is a good compromise between guns and torps, although you don't get the ability to stealth torp (fire torps without being seen) until T7 in the silver line.

 

Whichever main class you like the smell of, I would suggest playing all classes (except CVs) at least a bit, to get a better understanding of what they're about, and what they'll be trying to do to you in whatever your main class turns out to be.

 

Also, join a clan; quite apart from anything else, it'll usually get you bonuses to resources earned, and discounts on ships etc. (assuming your clan is established enough to have a reasonably developed base). If you find a 'teaching' clan, you'll be able to find players who can give you valuable hints and tips - what works in WOWS often bears very little resemblance to what works in WOT.

 

If you haven't found it already, the wiki is an invaluable source of (usually reasonably accurate) information about mechanics and the various ships in the game: http://wiki.wargaming.net/en/World_of_Warships

 

Finally, keep asking questions on here - there are usually lots of helpful folk about who are happy to help...

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3 hours ago, Chullainn said:

Thanks in advance for any suggestions. :)

Oh yeah, a couple of other potentially useful things (in no particular order):

 

Have a look at iChase's YouTube videos, especially the Captain's Academy series: https://www.youtube.com/user/ichasegaming

 

After (obviously) making your mini-map bigger - situational awareness will make or break most battles - you can enable/disable various indicators; hold down ctrl and click the little cogwheel in the top corner of the map to bring up the options (which are defined separately for each ship) - torp and gun range, as well as surface-to-surface visibility are enabled by default, but there are several other useful indicators (I find the secondary range indicator useful for things with decent secondaries, for example; radar and hydro range indicators are helpful too, where applicable).

 

You want to enable (in the main options) Alternative Battle Interface Mode - it'll give you useful information without having to push keys; also, select one of the aiming reticles that works better than the default (I use the fixed one with lots of diagonals, for example - I find it easier to hit things moving at funny angles with that one; others have different favourites though).

 

Be aware that secondaries and AA guns fire automatically when something is in range; this makes you visible from further away than you normally are (in the same way, main guns make you *very* visible when firing); if you're playing something sneaky, this may not be a good thing. Pressing P will toggle your secondary/AA guns on/off (activating DefAA will reactivate them, as will ctrl-clicking on aircraft or surface targets). If you're playing something where the AA range is greater than the normal spotting from the air distance (press and hold H to see the numbers quickly in game - bear in mind they can change when you get damaged), you generally want to keep your AA guns off until actually spotted.

 

Read up on the vision mechanics; that last point hints at some of it, but it's perhaps the most important bit of the game to understand..

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well easiest lines i guess is the American cruiser/BB line and the IJN cruiser/BB line all other lines have their weird moment ships. 

american cruisers loose their torps at tier 6. but getting either faster or harder hitting guns. and American BB is slow as a slow cow and getting faster after each tier. (you can feel the ships getting better and better the higher tiers you go) while the IJN have destroyer feeling cruisers up to tier 4. and tier 5 and up you will get hardhitting cruisers and or flamethrowers. and the BB in the IJN line is fast from tier 4 and up to tier 9 and 10 then its slow. but a Yamato is sexy as heck

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The first few Tier of British Cruisers are a bit disappointing. The later ships are very good, but the line may give you a bad first impression.

 

Cruisers are a good starting point as they teach you important basics.

I suggest to go for US or Russian Cruisers.

 

If you did not use an invite link, try this one:

https://playtogether.worldofwarships.eu/invite/dLmpQ50

 

 

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I'd say:

  • Japanese cruisers as they have reliable HE shells , decent armor and good concealment
  • US destroyers as they are jacks of all trades (decent guns, torps and concealment)
  • US battleships for their decent guns and well rounded playstyle
  • German battleships if you want slightly worse main guns but much better armor.

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Thanks for the help everyone. :)


Will probably start with US Cruisers or German Battleships. I usually go for brawling styles of gameplay so German BB's sound pretty fun. 

 

Again, thanks for the help.

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IJN cruisers are probably the best to start since they have a pretty straightforward progression and are all around competent ships without any notable stinkers in between. It also ends in the excellent Zao.

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For DDs: USN

For cruisers: USN, IJN, Russian or French

For BB: USN or IJN

 

Typically, USN and IJN are the oldest trees in the game and are often the least weird designs. I don't recommend IJN DD, RU DD, German BB or RN BB, because they can teach bad habits. I don't recommend RN CL, because they are much harder to play. I don't recommend RN DD, because they are slow and need proper positioning skills. Many of these other lines aren't bad. Just, they benefit from people knowing the basics, while they themselves barely teach any.

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4 hours ago, Chullainn said:

Thanks for the help everyone. :)


Will probably start with US Cruisers or German Battleships. I usually go for brawling styles of gameplay so German BB's sound pretty fun. 

 

Again, thanks for the help.

My vote would be to start with the French cruisers or the USSR cruisers. Imo the USN and German cruisers are also quite good picks, though I hated the Hipper at tier 8.

I think the French and USSR cruisers are the most solid across all tiers and they play very similarly and are fun and exilarating to play, as you need to expose yourself and can get deleted easily if you make a mistake...but it's oh so rewarding burning up the reds and showing them the light! :cap_like:

 

For BBs, the German BB line is indeed better for brawling and they could use a buff which they seem to be likely to receive in the near future.

Another line I would recommend, is the RN BB line. You basically can survive by spamming only HE all the time.

I'm fairly sure I will get reprimanded for this, as spamming HE from a battleship teaches you to be lazy instead of learning you how to aim (which is true), but you asked for a good line for a beginner and the British BB line falls into that category as well.

 

Both RN and German BB lines are harder to citadel, but are both squishier.

 

Spoiler

And obviously I will preach the use of HE from my Conq, but now and again I will slip in a sneaky AP braodside, teh ultimate trollsalvo after having spammend HE for 10 minutes :Smile_trollface:

I wouldn't want to recommend the IJN lines at first, unless you don't mind having ships that can differ significantly from their predecessor, which makes them harder to play but also makes the lines more unique. I only played Zao on PTS, but Yamato is a blast! :cap_win::cap_win::cap_win::cap_win::cap_win::cap_win::cap_win::cap_win::cap_win:

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24 minutes ago, NothingButTheRain said:

For BBs, the German BB line is indeed better for brawling and they could use a buff which they seem to be likely to receive in the near future.

Another line I would recommend, is the RN BB line. You basically can survive by spamming only HE all the time.

I'm fairly sure I will get reprimanded for this, as spamming HE from a battleship teaches you to be lazy instead of learning you how to aim (which is true), but you asked for a good line for a beginner and the British BB line falls into that category as well.

 

Both RN and German BB lines are harder to citadel, but are both squishier.

Ah yes, how does a line that "teaches you to be lazy instead of learning you how to aim (which is true)" manage to be " a good line for a beginner". It's basically a line that has a skill floor so low that it discourages learning and that's the least a new player needs, unless they just don't give a damn. Anyone who actually wants to learn a ship class first learns a line that teaches all the basics, to then branch out into lines that are special where you need to adapt, but where the basic knowledge still is handy. If you first learn to HE spam while broadside in the RN line and then learn the hard way that in most other lines you die fast doing this with little to show for it, then that's more of a trap than if you first play something like IJN or USN where angling really matters and AP is far more valuable and you apply this to RN afterwards, where indeed, you should actually use AP too, if you care about winning games, not just farming damage off ships.

 

Also, German BBs being squishier? Uhm, what? yes, Brits get overmatched anywhere and HE penned, but Germans basically get damaged in the superstructure and maybe 1-2 other areas when properly angled. Name me the BBs from T3 to T10 that are tankier than a properly angled German.

41 minutes ago, NothingButTheRain said:

I wouldn't want to recommend the IJN lines at first, unless you don't mind having ships that can differ significantly from their predecessor, which makes them harder to play but also makes the lines more unique. I only played Zao on PTS, but Yamato is a blast! :cap_win::cap_win::cap_win::cap_win::cap_win::cap_win::cap_win::cap_win::cap_win:

IJN BBs from T4 to T8 are pretty consistent and only T9 and T10 slow down a bit. Overall, the line isn't however less consistent than RN BBs.

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20 minutes ago, Riselotte said:

Ah yes, how does a line that "teaches you to be lazy instead of learning you how to aim (which is true)" manage to be " a good line for a beginner". It's basically a line that has a skill floor so low that it discourages learning and that's the least a new player needs, unless they just don't give a damn. Anyone who actually wants to learn a ship class first learns a line that teaches all the basics, to then branch out into lines that are special where you need to adapt, but where the basic knowledge still is handy. If you first learn to HE spam while broadside in the RN line and then learn the hard way that in most other lines you die fast doing this with little to show for it, then that's more of a trap than if you first play something like IJN or USN where angling really matters and AP is far more valuable and you apply this to RN afterwards, where indeed, you should actually use AP too, if you care about winning games, not just farming damage off ships.

 

Also, German BBs being squishier? Uhm, what? yes, Brits get overmatched anywhere and HE penned, but Germans basically get damaged in the superstructure and maybe 1-2 other areas when properly angled. Name me the BBs from T3 to T10 that are tankier than a properly angled German.

IJN BBs from T4 to T8 are pretty consistent and only T9 and T10 slow down a bit. Overall, the line isn't however less consistent than RN BBs.

British BBs may have a relatively low skill floor, but that doesn't make them OP or easy to master.

My advice was aimed at someone asking for a line with relatively low skill floor, as I interpreted it. And I simply served his question.

 

Yes, German BBs are squishier due to the superstructure. You sound like you are surprised or something.

 

And I was talking about the entire IJN BB line. It was (again) an answer to OP's question.

And no, I wouldn't even call t4 to t8 pretty consistent. Myogi has so few guns and then you get the mighty Kongo and then the slower shotgun Fuso. Nagato is different again, you get the picture.

 

Instead of critisizing my advice, maybe you should focus more on formulating your own advice.

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1 minute ago, NothingButTheRain said:

British BBs may have a relatively low skill floor, but that doesn't make them OP or easy to master.

My advice was aimed at someone asking for a line with relatively low skill floor, as I interpreted it. And I simply served his question.

 

Yes, German BBs are squishier due to the superstructure. You sound like you are surprised or something.

 

And I was talking about the entire IJN BB line. It was (again) an answer to OP's question.

And no, I wouldn't even call t4 to t8 pretty consistent. Myogi has so few guns and then you get the mighty Kongo and then the slower shotgun Fuso. Nagato is different again, you get the picture.

 

Instead of critisizing my advice, maybe you should focus more on formulating your own advice.

First off, low skill floor is not equivalent to a good learning class. Thus not one suited for "a new pleb to start out on."

 

Second, taking superstructure damage is universal. You can derp a Queen Elizabeth in its massive superstructure. It's a difference though whether I can farm only superstructure till it gets depleted or whether I can just farm the entire hull for damage.

 

Myogi has 3 turrets, Kongo has 4, Fuso has 6, all the same gun caliber, all are decently mobile, if not most mobile in their tier, all have above average plating and a weak citadel. Nagato then steps up in caliber and reduces the plating, but stays somewhat mobile and has again highest hp for its tier among silver ships and weak citadel. Amagi adds a turret, some speed and citadel protection. Izumo and Yamato again get improved plating, but stay high hp ships with a citadel weakness. Across the line IJN, ignoring T3, there are two jumps in caliber and one break in playstyle. Take RN meanwhile, where you go from silly armoured T4 and T5 to weakly armoured from T6 onwards, you go from 343 mm to 381 mm to 356 mm to 381 mm to 406 mm to 419 mm. 381s in the line have weaker HE than the rest. Also, up to T5 the ships have among the best secondaries, then they are crap. Up to T6 the speed is slow, then it is fast. Sorry, but IJN actually is more consistent than RN in playstyle.

 

IJN T4 to T8 are all roaming BBs with consistent gunnery, good range, bad concealment, better performance at range than most peers. The gun count may vary and caliber changes once, but the core playstyle of the ships differs far less than RN T4-8.

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7 hours ago, Chullainn said:

US Cruisers or German Battleships.

Remember, you starting out so can sample a lot of T1 Cruisers & go from there. You will have enough to do just to grind US Cruisers & Ger BBs.

You also will need to get to Service level 15 asap so all the different equipment/modules/modes of play unlock.

I suggest you try to upgrade all the ships you want to play - to upgrade them all fully - stock ships are weaker.

 

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@Chullainn - Apropos (sort of) the discussion about suitable BB lines: something that may not be obvious right away is that the nature of damage done with HE and AP rounds isn't the same. Ammo choice makes a difference (but you don't have the option of premium rounds to complicate things).

 

HE rounds generally do less damage than a penetrating hit from AP (much like WOT), but HE rounds can start fires. Fires do damage over time, if they aren't put out (with a Damage Control consumable), which can have catastrophic results. Left alone, fires on big ships (BBs) generally burn for longer than on smaller ones (cruisers, say).

 

So far, so bleedin' obvious. One area where the distinction matters is if you're shooting at something that's equipped with a Repair Party consumable i.e. every BB (I think), plus others: with a bit of variation between ships, the amount of damage that a repair party can fix will vary depending on what did that damage in the first place (more here, including exceptions, as well as info on the other consumables: http://wiki.wargaming.net/en/Ship:Consumables#Repair_Party). Crucially, fire damage can be 100% repaired, whereas penetration damage can't (depending on what you hit, a BB can only repair 10-50% of the damage).

 

So what? So, a good habit to get into early on is to use appropriate ammo for the target you're shooting at (like in WOT, you would switch to HE if trying to knock out anything very soft, or open-topped); for BBs, this often means AP (even for the RN line), even though firing HE exclusively can seem like an attractive proposition from a cursory look at damage totals.

 

In general (and others may disagree): if you're shooting at DDs, something very thin (some cruisers, from the side, for example), or something that you can't pen with AP (either because it's very armoured, or angled - think side-scraping), then you want HE; pretty much the rest of the time, AP is your friend.

 

That said, say you're in a BB with AP loaded (as it probably should be as a default), and a DD hoves into view; don't mess about reloading your guns - tap the HE button once, and fire what you already have loaded. By tapping the HE button (and the AP button, to reverse the process), you tell the game that the next rounds to load should be HE. A double tap on the HE button will reload the guns without firing, which will take ages - better to do *any* damage with your 'incorrect' ammo first, before loading the better choice.

 

(part of the reason that the RN BB line is contentious is that their HE rounds are very effective, to the point that you can do okay in them only ever firing HE; you shouldn't of course - see the point about repairable damage - but this doesn't stop people, and it's a really bad habit to get into, as it won't work in most other BB lines that you might want to play later, forcing you to re-learn, and possibly waste time curing any acquired bad habits)

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2 hours ago, antean said:

I suggest you try to upgrade all the ships you want to play - to upgrade them all fully - stock ships are weaker.

This is very good advice!

 

You'll start accumulating free xp (as in WOT), once you reach the appropriate account level - use this to research upgrades; you'll generally want to avoid using it to unlock new ships (that goes triple at lower tiers - putting the time in at lower tiers is too important to skip).

 

Playing ships stock (like in WOT) is fairly torrid; if you can avoid it, you'll get less frustrated. Some players find Coop mode worth going back to, as a less demanding environment in which to grind at least the more essential ship upgrades...

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10 hours ago, ColonelPete said:

If you did not use an invite link, try this one:

https://playtogether.worldofwarships.eu/invite/dLmpQ50

@Chullainn - do this too - it'll get you two free premiums (one right away, and one after you play your first battle in a T6 silver ship)...

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It doesn't really matter since a) any kind of national specific "flavor" doesn't come out until the higher tiers; b) ships are unlocked super quickly in the low tiers (II through IV); c) many of these supposed "national flavors" are subject to inconsistencies and breaks and exceptions. So you can try all manner of things without really missing out on much; there isn't really a risk of getting too invested in any one direction.

 

That said, I do recommend to go with either or both of the two biggest nations at the beginning, i.e. Japan and/or USA. If only because they have more options.

 

The one thing you should definitely do though, especially if you don't plan to spend any or much real money on the game, is get an invite-code (if you haven't already) and use that to set up your account. Or if you did already set up an account wthout one, abandon that account (for now) and set up a new one with an invite code. The benefit may not be immediately apparent but in a month, you will be glad you did.

 

Besides my Wallet Warrior main account, I started a few almost completely F2P accounts just to see what it's like from the perspective of grown experience. As a F2P player, the going can get really tough even at Tier VI already, although maybe it's not quite as harsh any more now that WG have introduced discounts and things like the Arsenal and Daily Shipments and such, and generally more free stuff. But still.

 

In order to have decent games and bolster your credit income, and also have some fun in the process, it is a good idea to grind the American destroyer (DD) line up to the Nicholas as quickly as possible, as well as the Japanese DD line up to the Minekaze and the US battleship (BB) line at least up to the Wyoming. These, as well as some of their predecessors like the highly overpowered (OP) Tier IV DDs Isokaze and Clemson, are ships you might be wanting to retain even after progressing to much higher levels.

 

Starting with Tier V, even the faintest remnants of protection for new players fall by the wayside and things will get a lot harder. At the same time though, that is where all manner of Events and Combat Missions and Challenges come in and yield all manner of enhancements (camos, signal flags etc.) So you want to quickly get a few ships to access that source.

 

Also, getting ships like these very quickly and playing them every day for a month is your chance to get your hands on a free premium HMS Dreadnought, and as a Brit you will probably kick yourself if you miss out on that. It involves winning at least six battles in ships of Tier V or above, per day, on at least 20 days until New Year. Probably more like eight or ten such daily wins though. So if you want that, then you need to get cracking and keep at it until after Christmas.

 

By the time you've reached T V, things will hopefully become a lot clearer all by themselves and from looking at the tech tree alone, as well as growing insight into the game mechanics and in-game economy. Regarding the British cruisers, I don't think they're particularly hard to play but they are decidedly different than all other nations' cruisers, already fairly early on and quite consistently so. At Tier V, where the game gets harder anyway, the line includes a ship that is regarded by many players as painfully underpowered and weak. I don't think it's that bad actually, especially after the most recent buffs. In fact I quite like plucky little Emerald. But the fact is you need to play her carefully and really use your head to make her work, especially when uptiered, and not rush in like a fool, and she is a definitely more "situational" than all other T V cruisers. And if you don't bring that off, then she will be a dreadful grind that holds you back and stands in your way to the far stronger higher tier ships of that line. Leander is competitive, Fiji is very strong and if Edinburgh and Neptune struggle, then it is mainly because of the uptiered matchmaking at their place in the game. Minotaur is top notch.

 

And it's a similar story with the Royal Navy DDs, Tier II to VI are absolutely nothing special but then comes the cracking Jervis at Tier VII and makes up for all of it.

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As a new player myself (as of yesterday) I'd just like to thank you all for the helpful answers in replying to the OP. You kept it simple, identified the priorities, and gave interesting pointers of where and why to start on the different tech trees. 

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DDs: USSR. Not only is it the simplest playstyle but also suffers the least from lack of Concealment Expert. If I had to start my account over, I'd choose USSR, get to t6 and then 5-star Operations in order to get 10-point captains for other countries' DDs so I can have Concealment Expert. It's that important.

 

BBs: Not sure but can't really go wrong with France. The first few ships are ho-hum bog-standard dreadnoughts. From t7 though, you should know a few things about AP mechanics and armor schemes because that's where the gun caliber becomes a bit deficient for a BB.

 

Cruisers: they're the hardmode class and I'd avoid them unless specifically interested in them. USSR is fine, pretty much for the same reasons as the DDs. Kirov is a pain though. French have a similar playstyle but t3-5 have weird armor schemes that might teach you some bad habits that won't work elsewhere. Whatever you choose, avoid UK cruisers. They're meant for more experienced players.

 

CV: Don't touch them yet unless you really want to. Everything you learn will be undone when the rework goes live in a couple months maybe.

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Stay away from Brits! Minotaur was my first tier x and the learning curve was STEEP, far beyond anything I had imagined.
US destroyers are fun but the safest line to learn dds is the Japanese line, up to a certain tier US dds have very short ranged torpedoes compared to their concealment and are very tricky to play, Umikaze though, the tier 2 japanese one is very fun to play.

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There are many great answers in this thread.

 

What to remember is, wargaming did not put any ships in this game, that are worse or better than each other - Some are just simply better at one thing, and others other things. Which means, before you know what nation or ship you should go to, you should identify yourself with what role you find most attractive, and then, what would you like? Fast guns, faster speed but less guns, etc. And then, you can ask on the forums or look up at the Wargaming wiki, to find out what line and nation fits you the most.

 

Hope you find what you like. :cap_rambo:

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1 hour ago, Immoxb said:

What to remember is, wargaming did not put any ships in this game, that are worse or better than each other - Some are just simply better at one thing, and others other things.

What is Bretagne better at than New York and Iron Duke?

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If you go onto Wiki.wargaming.net And look up both ships, I see different numbers. I also see different pro's and cons :) 

 

I'm not saying that every ship is different, but if you look at higher tiers in each line, I'd say theres a pretty different ways playing each ship. But you can look up both ships, and see their difference. 

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4 hours ago, Riselotte said:

What is Bretagne better at than New York

 

Off the top of my head, AA.

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1 hour ago, MoveZig said:

 

Off the top of my head, AA.

Bretagne:

27 dps @5 km

60 dps @3.5 km

45 dps @3.1 km

 

Texas:

187 dps @3.5 km

158 dps @2 km

 

Iron Duke:

38 dps @5 km

96 dps @2.5 km

8 dps @1.2 km

 

König:

66 dps @4.5 km

16 dps @3.5 km

30 dps @2 km

 

Note that only the 4.5-5 km auras get ever affected by Manual AA. If you wanted an AA skilled BB, Bretagne basically only provides a decent mid-range AA, which outperforms Iron Duke in AA spec because it kicks in 1 km earlier, but it has less long range. Given the long range on Bretagne is negligible though, the actual AA BBs at T5 are either Texas, featuring a far better mid range AA that doesn't need Manual AA or König that can get quite brutal values if it specs into Manual AA, as all the AA is frontloaded. Both offer the same 5x2 gun layout with similar dpm and accuracy, Texas offering better firepower, König offering better armour and speed, both offering more hp. Overall, for self-defense AA purposes, Bretagne is basically just a bit better armed than Iron Duke (by virtue of mid-range range, not dps), but there's little reason ever to take Bretagne over another ship in any role.

Note that the mid-range AA is susceptible to getting knocked out by any kind of HE shell that lands on the deck, far more than long range, so towards the end of a battle, Bretagne can end up with worse dpm than most competition as even Kongou features better long range AA. Also note that AA is going to change next patch, with AA builds getting made far harder, so AA power becomes a far less meaningful stat.

6 hours ago, Immoxb said:

If you go onto Wiki.wargaming.net And look up both ships, I see different numbers. I also see different pro's and cons :) 

 

I'm not saying that every ship is different, but if you look at higher tiers in each line, I'd say theres a pretty different ways playing each ship. But you can look up both ships, and see their difference. 

I know both ships. I looked them up, I played both. The wiki is nice to get values from, but the fluff text is often something you can ignore, because it's dumb. For example:

Quote

For a Tier V ship, Bretagne’s armor is not bad. It certainly holds it's own against equal tiered opponents, and her belt armor even extends up to the the bow of the ship, just above the waterline. Other than that strip of belt armor, she has the usual 19mm plates vulnerable to overmatch by any other battleships, so take care when fighting others.

This for example is just sugarcoating. Bretagne has a reinforced lower bow, yes. So do König, Oktyabrskaya Revolutsiya and Kongou. The Bretagne bow is far less reliable than König's and OR's and is barely better than Iron Duke's which has a bit more 19 mm area. In every area other than the lower bow plating, Kongou, OR, König and Iron Duke are just way better armoured, be it the deck (where most HE lands), the barbettes, Iron Duke and König also have better belt and citadel protection (and 15% more hp). In actual ship to ship combat, the Bretagne is basically always at a handicap against these ships and the wiki just tried to find something that is actually good about this ship. Because in pretty much ever aspect other than AA and a reinforced bow, this ship is among the worst. 

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