Time for Type 91 on Mutsu?

[Nishi_Kinuyo]

With West Vergina in the game, isn't it time for poor old Mutsu to get better AP shells?

[1MajorKoenig]

Haha sure bud !

 

If they do I‘ll have a heyday all day everyday 

[HaachamaShipping]

I'd say no. As it is, Mutsu is more mobile, longer-ranged, more hp and pays for it with gun performance and a citadel weakness. WV over Mutsu only has it going for it that it has the pen and the better citadel protection. If you give Mutsu the full Type 91 shells, the thing in skilled hands powercreeps WV (and the rest of the tier) hard, being able to punch through ships at 20 km out with still quite accurate guns.

 

And yes, WV is slightly better in AA, but nowhere good enough to not be food for CVs. It's likely easier to get use out of Mutsu's 4 km secondaries than out of WVs AA (and I'm talking as someone who actually tried, as I slapped my AFT Kii captain and a leftover Sec range mod on it, just to see where I'd get with that).

[FrankvC_Jr]

If they are not willing to update the AP shells for it, will we ever get a “Mutsu 43”? I hate how the current ones pays a lot (armor, low pen despite the caliber, AA and even secondaries are meh) for a bit of speed advantage vs contemporary BBs (not counting BCs as Eitel Friederich or Dunkerque.....or WG’s Normandie) and gimmick torpedos

 

If they give us a 43 version, don’t know how it would be different Maybe give back a 30 seconds reload to both her and Nagato and then make them different by Mutsu having slightly less HP (60-62k) and range (18,8 maybe) for better turning speed on main battery (30-36 seconds instead of 40 with expert marksman) and maneuverability for being it a “brawler Nagato”, difficult cause lack of armor but doable if done right 

[HaachamaShipping]

32 minutes ago, FrankvC_Jr said:

If they are not willing to update the AP shells for it, will we ever get a “Mutsu 43”? I hate how the current ones pays a lot (armor, low pen despite the caliber, AA and even secondaries are meh) for a bit of speed advantage vs contemporary BBs (not counting BCs as Eitel Friederich or Dunkerque.....or WG’s Normandie) and gimmick torpedos

 

If they give us a 43 version, don’t know how it would be different Maybe give back a 30 seconds reload to both her and Nagato and then make them different by Mutsu having slightly less HP (60-62k) and range (18,8 maybe) for better turning speed on main battery (30-36 seconds instead of 40 with expert marksman) and maneuverability for being it a “brawler Nagato”, difficult cause lack of armor but doable if done right 

I'm going to point at LWM about Mutsu pen: https://forum.worldofwarships.com/topic/175978-premium-ship-review-114-west-virginia-1941/?tab=comments#comment-4138034

Quote

Mutsu gets a bad wrap she doesn't deserve.  Her guns have comparable penetration to the Queen Elizabeth-class battleships, with slightly more penetration at short range and slightly less at long range.  Yet Warspite doesn't get a bad wrap for her AP penetration as much as Mutsu does.  Now, we all know why this is the case -- Mutsu is compared to Nagato's upgraded shells.  While this is meme worthy it doesn't carry over into gun performance at tier VI where Mutsu does very well for herself.  The stigma that she's a downtiered, stock Nagato blinds people to what's a pretty darned fun ship at tier VI, though she suffers from the typical tier VI battleship problems of being a ready victim against tier VIIIs.

It really is adequate for T6. I don't own WV, because I'm still on the fence about the ship, but given I own Dunkerque, I do know what it means to have too much pen at T6.

 

Also, brawler Nagato died with the advent of German BBs and will stay dead as long as the MM is filled with them. The citadel weakness is only one aspect in addition to just not having competitive secondaries and potentially getting torped at close range. Unless you take away Nagato's citadel and give her secondaries with 4 secs reload, that thing is hard-pressed to ever win a brawl against a Gneisenau. Given how many chances are required for that, I frankly am more hoping for a brawling IJN BB at T8 in form of the Tosa-class, where they have more leeway in how they fit that ship out and historically it had torpedoes.

[FrankvC_Jr]

Guess I sometimes have a favoritism for Mutsu that she doesn’t need Funnily enough, I don’t even own her but a friend of mine does and I sometimes do a “pijama party” at the place and.....well, you can guess the rest XD

 

The Tosa should be tier 8 slow BB linking between Nagato and Izumo  Amagi goes to BC tree between something and Owari (Kii done right at it’s deserved place at tier 9) I really need to update my tree with recent news about B65 

[HaachamaShipping]

Honestly, I bought the Shadow Mutsu bundle given a clan mate insisted on playing Mutsu during T6 CB and I wanted to see how Mutsu fares, before investing in a WV. From my experience, if we discount weekend teams and morning hours, the ship is solid enough and the lackluster pen is still enough to get normal pens on most things, if not outright cits, because it doesn't overpen that often. The lack of AA and the overmatchable citadel deck are more serious issues, forcing a very battlecruiseresque playstyle of trying to not tank large guns, but bullying smaller ships (including smaller gun battleships). And Mutsu does have the hp pool to bully things that cannot overmatch her.

[_DeathWing_]

Why?

[wilkatis_LV]

No. She already overmatches everything anyway, why would she get that kind of a boost?

[RAMJB]

  Amagi shells at t7 already are absurdly good. At t6 they'd be utterly ridiculous.

 

So, no 

 

 Oh and there already is a mutsu43 in the game. Its called nagato and is t7's silver ship ;)

 

 

[Odo_Toothless]

It seems that Mutsu has even better pen then Bayern. Anyway I had not problems with penetration. Just on some distance do not fire at armor belts on even slightly angled BB, but higher. Even VI/VIIIFrenchies with much worse pen then Mutsu, can do a lot of DMG this way, using AP only.

 

From the games I played, it looks like she is not worse in randoms then Fuso in dealing DMG. But less guns = less kill secure chance. Especially she has problems with fighting DD. WR is of course too good for normal solo games. Just MM gave me a hand with teams and I helped my luck, always prioritizing enemy DD and cruisers. BB are the last targets anyway in terms of WR and sniping from distance will get you nowhere. Just pretend You are a heavy cruiser fighting on middle ranges, most the time going away from enemy, making turns forward when safe or just angle hard showing your back. But not too close of course, becouse you are not a brawler. And advance if enemy is retreating/weak. Someting like Atago play.