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P2Win

Hindy does not need a buff

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Why are they buffing one of the strongest tx cl in this game? Fool proof armor, godly range, torps, good AA among other things...why does this damn ship need a buff?

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Its armor is better than other cruisers, but far from fool proof.

Its range isn't that great, especially if you can't hit things at range (unlike Moskva or Zao)

Torps are a last ditch effort that mainly used by suicidal drivers who think trading a t10 cruiser is worth torping a t8 BB. These aren't Zao or Mino torps that are actually usable.

Almost all t10 cruisers have good AA, nothing really special.

 

From what I hear the buff is just an extra heal. Its not going to make her super strong or anything like that, she will just be able to stick around in a game a bit longer if she over extends and has to pull back to heal.

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6 minutes ago, JimmyThePirate said:

Its range isn't that great, especially if you can't hit things at range (unlike Moskva or Zao)

Honestly, hitting things at range isn't the issue. Doing significant damage at range is. HE has 50 mm pen, but is otherwise plagued by poor alpha and underwhelming fire chance. AP pen falls off hard.

8 minutes ago, JimmyThePirate said:

Torps are a last ditch effort that mainly used by suicidal drivers who think trading a t10 cruiser is worth torping a t8 BB. These aren't Zao or Mino torps that are actually usable.

Honestly, when up against T8 BBs, Hindenburg torp rush isn't even trading your ship. There is no T8 BB that should brawl Hindenburg, basically any T8 BB should try to avoid getting into range and just hope allies help kill the thing before it dpms you down. Against those targets, no other T10 cruiser has brawling torps as powerful. Zao would need to give enough broadside that you can just smack it into the citadel, Minotaur you can citpen through the bow.Hindenburg has the toughness to just shrug off T8 BB ammo and has 6 torps per side with good angles that mean that at close range, you are pretty much just going to get torp spammed to death before you can kill it. The only reason I would ever not find these torps useful against a T8 in a brawl is because the moron gave broadside and ate all the AP pens before torps arrived.

 

Against T10 though. Have fun trying to torp rush a Yamato, Republique or Kurfürst. 

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54 minutes ago, P2Win said:

Why are they buffing one of the strongest tx cl in this game? Fool proof armor, godly range, torps, good AA among other things...why does this damn ship need a buff?

Because your single opinion does not refect the general server stats.

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34 minutes ago, Riselotte said:

6 torps per side with good angles that mean that at close range,

 

Hasn't Hindy 8 per side?

 

OT: This buff will be mostly insignificant.

You may have some points now free, because you could drop SI, but usually you can't even make full use of the current heals you have, unless you got perma burned,

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Just now, Zemeritt said:

 

Hasn't Hindy 8 per side?

It actually has. Never counted them. I only know it has enough to kill ships when you know how to brawl with torps. And frankly, for that, 6 would be enough too.

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2 minutes ago, Riselotte said:

It actually has. Never counted them. I only know it has enough to kill ships when you know how to brawl with torps. And frankly, for that, 6 would be enough too.

 

Usually you can save one launcher. Just to have a backup if someone else sneaks up to you.

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5 minutes ago, Zemeritt said:

 

Usually you can save one launcher. Just to have a backup if someone else sneaks up to you.

I typically launch both sets, using one to go for where I expect the target to go, the other to account for evasive maneuvers. But I guess I could start just by launching only my forward launchers for that.

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1 hour ago, P2Win said:

Why are they buffing one of the strongest tx cl in this game? Fool proof armor, godly range, torps, good AA among other things...why does this damn ship need a buff?

 

Do you even understand, how this "buff" turns out in reality? Wait. I know the answer: You don´t.

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1 hour ago, Riselotte said:

Honestly, hitting things at range isn't the issue. Doing significant damage at range is. HE has 50 mm pen, but is otherwise plagued by poor alpha and underwhelming fire chance. AP pen falls off hard.

Honestly, when up against T8 BBs, Hindenburg torp rush isn't even trading your ship. There is no T8 BB that should brawl Hindenburg, basically any T8 BB should try to avoid getting into range and just hope allies help kill the thing before it dpms you down. Against those targets, no other T10 cruiser has brawling torps as powerful. Zao would need to give enough broadside that you can just smack it into the citadel, Minotaur you can citpen through the bow.Hindenburg has the toughness to just shrug off T8 BB ammo and has 6 torps per side with good angles that mean that at close range, you are pretty much just going to get torp spammed to death before you can kill it. The only reason I would ever not find these torps useful against a T8 in a brawl is because the moron gave broadside and ate all the AP pens before torps arrived.

 

Against T10 though. Have fun trying to torp rush a Yamato, Republique or Kurfürst. 

Its not the T8 BB that poses the problem, its the rest of their team. With such short range torps and large detection range a Hindy may get the kill but wont be making it out alive.

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If this is one of the strongest T10 cruisers, why does it have the worst stats of all of the free roaming cruisers?

Have a look:

 

Spoiler

Win rate:
Hindenburg - 47,86
Zao - 49,79
Henri IV - 50,51

 

Avg. Xp:
Hindenburg - 1479
Zao - 1570
Henri IV - 1606


Avg. Damage:
Hindenburg - 68596
Zao - 79408
Henri IV - 83198

 

Avg. Kills:
Hindenburg - 0.63
Zao - 0.83
Henri IV - 0.84

 

K/D Ratio:
Hindenburg - 1.02
Zao - 1,47
Henri IV - 1,42

 

http://maplesyrup.sweet.coocan.jp/wows/ranking/20181110/eu_2month/average_ship.html

 

I mean one look at those stats and it's clear that both Zao and Henri IV are very balanced between each other. But Hindy is lagging behind.

 

That +1 heal won't do anything, because that's not the category Hindenburg is weak in. That ship has no killing power. The great pen on a subpar HE doesn't make it good, the great damage on AP that can't penetrate doesn't either.

What WG is doing is going through the moves, to have an argument "we buffed the Hindenburg, we need 1 year to collect stats", while changing nothing.

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5 minutes ago, JimmyThePirate said:

Its not the T8 BB that poses the problem, its the rest of their team. With such short range torps and large detection range a Hindy may get the kill but wont be making it out alive.

Then you are using the ship wrong.

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7 minutes ago, Riselotte said:

Then you are using the ship wrong.

That's what I'm saying. The torps are good in certain situations, but most Hindy drivers I see either never use them or try to bull rush directly into the enemy to try and use them.

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If i am not mistaken the Hindenburg will only get one more heal consumable?!

That is not really significant in my opinion.

Also this ship is quite balanced in ist current state. If you want to rage about something, rage about the Henry buff :P

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22 minutes ago, Aragathor said:

That ship has no killing power.

 

True.

After the reload nerf i think i lost almost 0,1 avg kills on my hindi stats (im at ~0,7 kills/game after the change...)

Damage i lost ~1000 average on hindi stats (ofc reality its more, but since its dropping it says something)

 

The extra heal is pretty much a slap in the face to call it a buff.

Now i can go without skilling SI - which doesnt help me one bit, because other cptn skills are close to useless.

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9 minutes ago, JimmyThePirate said:

That's what I'm saying. The torps are good in certain situations, but most Hindy drivers I see either never use them or try to bull rush directly into the enemy to try and use them.

What you were saying was...

2 hours ago, JimmyThePirate said:

Torps are a last ditch effort that mainly used by suicidal drivers who think trading a t10 cruiser is worth torping a t8 BB. These aren't Zao or Mino torps that are actually usable.

Hindenburg torps however, for what they are, are perfectly usable. These torps are brawling torps and in a brawl, I take these torps over any other torps. And the sole reason you cannot brawl a BB isn't the torps, but because certain T10 BBs crap on your ship. But when against T8s, there is no brawl Hindenburg cannot win. Just learn to not try to brawl when half the enemy team is around (at which point any T10 cruiser would just up and die). Ambushing lower tier BBs (or same tier BBs that don't just ignore your armour) with these torps is however viable.

 

Not saying Hindenburg is in a good spot, but it's hardly because the torps are too short-ranged.

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Vor 41 Minuten, Srle_Vigilante sagte:

You actually calling this a buff?

 

At best this a pat on the back and a motivational speech.

And that is good, because Hindenburg is already a strong Cruiser.

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1 hour ago, Riselotte said:

What you were saying was...

Hindenburg torps however, for what they are, are perfectly usable. These torps are brawling torps and in a brawl, I take these torps over any other torps. And the sole reason you cannot brawl a BB isn't the torps, but because certain T10 BBs crap on your ship. But when against T8s, there is no brawl Hindenburg cannot win. Just learn to not try to brawl when half the enemy team is around (at which point any T10 cruiser would just up and die). Ambushing lower tier BBs (or same tier BBs that don't just ignore your armour) with these torps is however viable.

 

Not saying Hindenburg is in a good spot, but it's hardly because the torps are too short-ranged.

I didn't mean to imply that they are bad or anything like that, they definitely have their uses.

 

They are just highly situational. A Zao or Mino can use their torps in many places without a problem, a Hindy not so much.

 

The main point I was making is how many Hindy drivers will rush themselves into a brawling situation thinking that their torps will save them, yet usually die with minimal return.

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2 minutes ago, JimmyThePirate said:

I didn't mean to imply that they are bad or anything like that, they definitely have their uses.

 

They are just highly situational. A Zao or Mino can use their torps in many places without a problem, a Hindy not so much.

 

The main point I was making is how many Hindy drivers will rush themselves into a brawling situation thinking that their torps will save them, yet usually die with minimal return.

They are specialist torps. As said before, Zao cannot use the torps in brawls as effectively. I brawled Zaos in Kurfürst (cyclones are fun) and had it been a Hindenburg, it likely would have had better chances to torp rush me. With Zao, I basically just had to wait till it tried to go for the torp, then devstrike it as it turns to get the angle. Same in cruiser vs cruiser fights, where Zao basically can get citpenned by any other cruiser if it tries to torp, while Hindenburg only takes massive damage from those cruisers with improved pen angles. So, yes, Zao torps are useful in other situations. They are not very useful here.

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7 hours ago, P2Win said:

Why are they buffing one of the strongest tx cl in this game? Fool proof armor, godly range, torps, good AA among other things...why does this damn ship need a buff?

 

Because you're a BB obsessed troll and it's annoyed you, seems a perfectly good reason. They could just have reversed the 1s reload nerf which would have been better.

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Vor 6 Stunden, Aragathor sagte:

If this is one of the strongest T10 cruisers, why does it have the worst stats of all of the free roaming cruisers?

Have a look:

 

  Versteckte Inhalte sichtbar machen

Win rate:
Hindenburg - 47,86
Zao - 49,79
Henri IV - 50,51

 

Avg. Xp:
Hindenburg - 1479
Zao - 1570
Henri IV - 1606


Avg. Damage:
Hindenburg - 68596
Zao - 79408
Henri IV - 83198

 

Avg. Kills:
Hindenburg - 0.63
Zao - 0.83
Henri IV - 0.84

 

K/D Ratio:
Hindenburg - 1.02
Zao - 1,47
Henri IV - 1,42

 

http://maplesyrup.sweet.coocan.jp/wows/ranking/20181110/eu_2month/average_ship.html

 

I mean one look at those stats and it's clear that both Zao and Henri IV are very balanced between each other. But Hindy is lagging behind.

 

In another thread it was mentioned that Hinenburgs stats are only lagging on the EU server probably due to too many Germans playing it.

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20 minutes ago, Donnerturm said:

In another thread it was mentioned that Hinenburgs stats are only lagging on the EU server probably due to too many Germans playing it.

Here are the stats, for the same period, for the NA server:

 

Spoiler

Win rate:
Hindenburg - 47.90
Zao - 50.34
Henri IV - 52.23

 

Avg. Xp:
Hindenburg - 1514
Zao - 1570
Henri IV - 1670


Avg. Damage:
Hindenburg - 71334
Zao - 79705
Henri IV - 88502

 

Avg. Kills:
Hindenburg - 0.71
Zao - 0.88
Henri IV - 0.95

 

K/D Ratio:
Hindenburg - 1.14
Zao - 1.58
Henri IV - 1.62

 

http://maplesyrup.sweet.coocan.jp/wows/ranking/20181110/na_2month/average_ship.html

 

Hindenburg stats suck on NA too, just look at the K/D ratio and winrate. So the argument "Germans play the ship badly" can be put away as bollocks.

Besides, as the largest server we generate a lot more data than say ASIA. Plus, there aren't enough German players to completely overpower the results of players from other nations.

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Vor 23 Minuten, Aragathor sagte:

Here are the stats, for the same period, for the NA server:

 

  Versteckte Inhalte sichtbar machen

Win rate:
Hindenburg - 47.90
Zao - 50.34
Henri IV - 52.23

 

Avg. Xp:
Hindenburg - 1514
Zao - 1570
Henri IV - 1670


Avg. Damage:
Hindenburg - 71334
Zao - 79705
Henri IV - 88502

 

Avg. Kills:
Hindenburg - 0.71
Zao - 0.88
Henri IV - 0.95

 

K/D Ratio:
Hindenburg - 1.14
Zao - 1.58
Henri IV - 1.62

 

http://maplesyrup.sweet.coocan.jp/wows/ranking/20181110/na_2month/average_ship.html

 

Hindenburg stats suck on NA too, just look at the K/D ratio and winrate. So the argument "Germans play the ship badly" can be put away as bollocks.

 

I was not aware that ze Germans already conquered the NA server.

 

Zitat

there aren't enough German players to completely overpower the results of players from other nations.

You would be amazed how ze Germans can overpower... oh well, let's not go there. :Smile_smile:

 

Thanks for clarifying that.

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WG themselves called it:

 

German cruisers Roon and Hindenburg:

Increased the number of Repair Party consumable charges from 2 (3) to 3 (4).

A greater number of charges of equipment will raise the average life time of ships in battle, however, these changes will be better harnessed when using ships as long-range cruisers and/or played safely.

 

Which may be true-ish for the Roon but so much for the tier X brawler... :cap_like:

Give Hindy back her reload

or give her 5k hp

Or improve her AP

or her armor scheme

 

Another repair that will only be useful if you play her as a long range poor HE spammer? No thanks.

 

 

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