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OnceBittenTwiceShy

A Newbie Question - HOW can they hit me instantly ?

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As suggested in the title - I am new. I have 70K battles in WoT under my belt and my stats are green - so I am not completely rubbish . . I hope.

Anyway . .

I found aiming in this game much harder than in WoT, the lead you have to give, especially on longer distances, still gives me problems.  ( . . and I run into islands all the time but that's another topic ) I usually fire only one shot and then adjust the rest of my batteries to (hopefully) hit my opponent. Sometimes it works - sometimes I have to re-adjust a couple of times. What baffles me completely is how opponents hit me from their maximum firing range - while I am wiggling and dodging like a  pro at 40 kts. Are they so much more skilled than me . .  or is there some kind of cheat . .  I wonder

Actually, i don't wonder no more.

Warpack  ? Aim Bots ? Ah well . . Google says it's all there  . .  . and I thought this garbage is only present in Wot.

Can't you WG guys just not allow any mods whatsoever ? No mod / resmods folder - nothing. Vanilla only.

That would be nice. 

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[DC-DK]
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No cheats just experience and good aim. Good aim is gained by experience just that simple.

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Rule of thumb is to enable advanced crosshair. Then look at the seconds counter in the center. That is the amount of seconds your shells will take to reach the bullseye position. If it's a slow BB you give the amount of lead in seconds. Normal speed cruisers you give twice the lead. DDs and quick cruisers you give 3 times the lead. Speedboats like russian DDs you give a bit more than 3 times. After you start hitting targets and learning lead you must learn timing so your shells hit the target when it's broadside. After you master that you get into hitting specific parts of the ship. For non-german BBs and generally all cruisers at mid  range (about 10 to 15Km)you aim about waterline. For German BBs you aim about bowline. For low armour cruisers at short range (sub 8Km) you aim about a milimetre below waterline. After this you get into angling as you start meeting players that know how to angle their armour to your shells. For angled targets you either aim at low armour points (superstructure) or you use HE shells that "splash" on impact and have a chance to start fires.

 

All of this you learn as you progress through the tiers. It gets gradually harder and more technical as armour schemes get better and hitting the right position with the right shell type at the right time becomes crucial.

 

I strongly suggest the "How it works" series from WG on YouTube to learn basic mechanics, as most of us had to learn with eachother without those video aids.

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[_MIA_]
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How do you know they are on their maxrange? I see you play a lot of DDs. They have slower shells than Cruisers and BBs (usually) So the time your shells travel to ~12km, a BB will have the same for ~20km.

And there must be a reason why you are spotted? Usually you dont want to be spotted as a DD (some exceptions).

 

I never played WoT, but i dont think aiming there has anything to do with aiming in WoWs.

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11 minutes ago, DFens_666 said:

I never played WoT, but i dont think aiming there has anything to do with aiming in WoWs.

There are similarities - I find it a bit like trying to hit moving light tanks with a KV-2 (but with lots of guns)!

Lead is much more significant in WOWS, but you generally don't have to worry about up/down - everything you're shooting at in WOWS as on the same basic level...

 

If you've messed around a lot with the howitzer type derps in WOT, you've got the basic idea of using guns in WOWS.

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Weekend Tester
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An aimbot would do a worse job then a player. An Experienced player at least...

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[SM0KE]
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Oh yeah, something else: although not directly relevant to the question, if you're playing a lot of DDs, you'll actually want to not fire your guns a lot of the time - as you'll have seen from the mini-map (being a WOT alum, I imagine you've already made it bigger), when you fire, your visibility balloons hugely.

Same as with lights in WOT: you fire, you get spotted, you die (sometimes, anyway). Happily, with DDs, you always (?) have torps, and they often have a longer range than you can be spotted from - when this happy occurrence happens, use torps; they won't give you away as much.

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36 minutes ago, OnceBittenTwiceShy said:

Actually, i don't wonder no more.

Warpack  ? Aim Bots ? Ah well . . Google says it's all there  . .  . and I thought this garbage is only present in Wot.

Going to have to erase these thoughts out of your mind. Yes there are some iffy mods, yes some of them work. But most of these just help bad players get up to average levels. Good or really good players will just be hindered by such mods as stated above. Aiming comes from practice and in some cases pure guesswork.

 

And if you go around blaming mods or cheats you will never improve on a personall level.

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Alpha Tester, Players, In AlfaTesters
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l2p and git gud

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[NOHE]
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Sometimes I like to imagine what kind of face clueless people would make if  they stood behind you and watched as you aim correctly time and time again with just experience.

 

Would it be an epiphany, or just utter lack of understanding?

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1 minute ago, ollonborre said:

Going to have to erase these thoughts out of your mind. Yes there are some iffy mods, yes some of them work. But most of these just help bad players get up to average levels. Good or really good players will just be hindered by such mods as stated above. Aiming comes from practice and in some cases pure guesswork.

 

And if you go around blaming mods or cheats you will never improve on a personall level.


This - the thing that I have witnessed good players doing, that defines them over not-so-good-players, is "anticipation" and "Positioning" - anticipating when and where a ship will turn (often the best time to shoot it) and then where they position themselves on the map.

Neither can be taught or gained from mods... including aiming mods... as you are shooting at where the ship will be when it is no longer doing the thing it is currently doing... i.e. if you aim where it is going at X knots good players will be jinking and changing speed anyway, which makes aiming there a kind of a waste.

So.... you could have the best aim in the world and not hit much.

This is hard to learn.

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4 minutes ago, Turnipsi said:

Sometimes I like to imagine what kind of face clueless people would make if  they stood behind you and watched as you aim correctly time and time again with just experience.

 

Would it be an epiphany, or just utter lack of understanding?

Bit of both I would imagine. Speaking out of personal experience, I spectated several really good players in Red Orchestra and Rising Storm, and could not believe how they could see people sometimes through thick foliage and get the godlike timing of being exactly where they needed to be at exactly the right time. 

 

Still it did help to watch those players. I am still not that good at the games even though I enjoy them, but I am enjoying them much more after getting that sort of eye opener.

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[HMSR]
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I wont tell you everything that you were told by the vets here :Smile_Default: just add my thoughts. 

Personally it took me about 1500 battles to get good at aiming and another 800 till now when i can hit any ship from any distance with any gun with pretty good hits (counting in RNG) 

 

Take you'r time as you just started, watch a few vids on YT about ship types, game mechanics, and you will do well :Smile_honoring:

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23 minutes ago, Turnipsi said:

Sometimes I like to imagine what kind of face clueless people would make if  they stood behind you and watched as you aim correctly time and time again with just experience.

 

Oh, no worries, I had that precise situation at gamescom.

Quite honestly it was one of the most depressing things I have ever experienced.

Or in the words of an onlooker:

"YOU CAN USE NUMBER KEYS TO SELECT AIRCRAFT?!"

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You need to play cruisers more, they teach you a lot about shooting. Aimbots are out there, but probablt not in very significant numbers. And if you're wiggling, aimbots aren't even that helpful since they can only solve one dimensional problems. 

 

1) Enlarge the minimap to huge size. Depending on the ship you play you'll be looking at it 70+% of the time so make it readable.

2) CTRL-mouseclick the cog icon above the minimap and enable spotting range and other relevant circles, ship names and last known positions.

3) Turn off anti-collision stuff in the options, turn on alternate battle interface.

4) static crosshair 7 will help you estimate angles when shooting long distances.

5) ONLY EVER USE SHIFT FOR ZOOMING, ZOOM IN AND OUT BETWEEN EVERY SHOT. Only ever stay in zoomed in mode for the few seconds it takes you to line up the shot and fire.

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[NED]
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Much has said already. Few more tips from my part. Make sure your intended target is selected (iirc X key: I have appointed a mouse button just for that). Also when dodging: don't do that too predictable. Opponents will adapt to that. Remember you play a ship, not a tank. A short left/ right command will hardly change your course. When aiming you don't need to take your own speed in account for the lead. You aim as if you're stationary.

 

But the main thing I repeat: experience. I tried WOT for a spell and had the same experience: getting shot by unseen enemies. Grew old very quickly: drive 500m, get tracked, get shot. Uninstalled it after 10 matches...at least with wows your ship can take a punch in most of the cases and isn't being oneshot by some thing which manages to squeeze itself in a letterbox, shooting right through the keyholes of 25 doors and destroying you with the wind caused by the shell passing you.

 

Last thing: if you're playing DD's your job isn't to rush in guns blazing in the first minute.

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If you want to wiggle and dodge at max range whilst firing your guns you're going to need to learn to play the RU DD line. 

 

The problem I can see (judging by your stats) is that you appear to be trying to do it with the US and German DDs, neither of which are suited to open water gunboating. 

 

Grind your way up to at least a Podvoisky with Preventative Maintenance, Last Stand, BFT, and AFT. (After that it's Demolition Expert, Adrenaline Rush and Priority Target) Then try it. Once you get to the Minsk and above invest some coal in the special speed boost upgrade (3 minutes of speed boost ftw) . 

 

It's a fun playstyle, but your stats and Karma rating will tank while you get the hang of it. (It you haven't already I recommend you watch a load of Flamu's YouTube videos to learn more about how to play). 

 

 

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3 hours ago, OnceBittenTwiceShy said:

As suggested in the title - I am new. I have 70K battles in WoT under my belt and my stats are green - so I am not completely rubbish . . I hope.

Anyway . .

I found aiming in this game much harder than in WoT, the lead you have to give, especially on longer distances, still gives me problems.  ( . . and I run into islands all the time but that's another topic ) I usually fire only one shot and then adjust the rest of my batteries to (hopefully) hit my opponent. Sometimes it works - sometimes I have to re-adjust a couple of times. What baffles me completely is how opponents hit me from their maximum firing range - while I am wiggling and dodging like a  pro at 40 kts. Are they so much more skilled than me . .  or is there some kind of cheat . .  I wonder

Actually, i don't wonder no more.

Warpack  ? Aim Bots ? Ah well . . Google says it's all there  . .  . and I thought this garbage is only present in Wot.

Can't you WG guys just not allow any mods whatsoever ? No mod / resmods folder - nothing. Vanilla only.

That would be nice. 

I made the same mistake in my first few weeks of playing, calling a top CC at the time a cheat, after the match, I received a message from him, explaining that with experience comes skill (Really decent guy), something you should already realise after playing so many games in WoT.

There will be a few cheats in every game, but they soon realise after a life ban that cheating is no longer tolerated.

 

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[CATS]
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The best shots are:

  • turning enemy is randomly spotted between a gap between islands
  • you know that you have 2, max 3s, to aim before the target vanishes or your guns are blocked by islands
  • you just whip your crosshairs across the screen, because you have done that over tenthousand times, and fire
  • the target gets unspotted as expected
  • Devastating Strike

 

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5 hours ago, OnceBittenTwiceShy said:

Warpack  ? Aim Bots ? Ah well . . Google says it's all there  . .  . and I thought this garbage is only present in Wot.

Really, there is no thing like aim bot. The only thing that comes close to aim bot is the predictor on the torpedo. That one actually tells you where to aim your torps to hit a target NOT CHANGING COURSE AND SPEED. Now you will see after very few torpedo attacks how good that aim bot is. Targets change course and speed quite regularly. Some of the worst players are actually harder to hit than the mediocre ones, cause they themselves don't know from one second to the other what they wanna do and where to go.

An aim bot for artillery would follow the same logic, only of course the time to target is much shorter, so it could hit. Still most targets will move. A good player is much better than any aim bot. I play some of the most dodgy ships of the game and I am regularly surprised how good players can anticipate my turns and shoot exactly where I am going to turn, not where I am heading at the moment of the shot.

 

Another phenomenon is bias. It is hard to describe. A ship may appear to be sailing more towards you than it actually is. In reality it is moving more sideways. So you aim only slightly to the side. now the target is moving towards you and you accidentally hit it. Especially ships moving in a pattern can accidentally counter a bias so they get hit although the aim was initially way off.

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[SOCKS]
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To this day I've been puzzled by other players gunnery just once. Yesterday actually. Playing Algerie in my (lucky I am) usual T9 game with a T7 ship.

I'm coming bow on near a cap. There's an enemy Alsace some 18km away. I'm spotted because I'm firing. I stop firing, go stealth, go full left rudder. After having completed more than 100 degrees of a turn a volley comes from nowhere and smashes 2/3 of my health. The long fire warning skill had not warned me of any incoming fire, so whatever shot happened was untargetted (yes, I have that skill. Splendid for cruisers which thrive at long range).

So the dude was looking and aiming at me, and fired only after I dissapeared, before knowing I had turned, or in which direction I had turned. And fired an untargetted volley that got 23k hp off my ship.

Luckiest gambler in the world, I tell you. Might have been a good guess only, but... What a BS shot.

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10 hours ago, OnceBittenTwiceShy said:

As suggested in the title - I am new. I have 70K battles in WoT under my belt and my stats are green - so I am not completely rubbish . . I hope.

Anyway . .

I found aiming in this game much harder than in WoT, the lead you have to give, especially on longer distances, still gives me problems.  ( . . and I run into islands all the time but that's another topic ) I usually fire only one shot and then adjust the rest of my batteries to (hopefully) hit my opponent. Sometimes it works - sometimes I have to re-adjust a couple of times. What baffles me completely is how opponents hit me from their maximum firing range - while I am wiggling and dodging like a  pro at 40 kts. Are they so much more skilled than me . .  or is there some kind of cheat . .  I wonder

Actually, i don't wonder no more.

Warpack  ? Aim Bots ? Ah well . . Google says it's all there  . .  . and I thought this garbage is only present in Wot.

Can't you WG guys just not allow any mods whatsoever ? No mod / resmods folder - nothing. Vanilla only.

That would be nice. 

1. When you are aiming at the ship you target, unless your enemy is still, you need to understand deflection shooting. You are trying to estimate with your crosshair where your target will be when your shells land before you fire. Takes time and practice.

2. The minute you fire a gun or are detected, any ship within range of you can shoot at you and you may not have suffered hits from the ship you are looking at. I play Destroyers more than any other class myself and even in flight attempting to dodge incoming fire some of the shells will hit you if more than one enemy has you in their sights.

You also suffer secondary fire hits which come at you from any angle if you are within secondary fire range of enemy ships. Battleships and Cruisers have main guns which are controlled by the player and automatic secondaries which are not. Secondaries can range to over 11km on certain ships and if the player has certain skills in place their secondaries can be quite deadly.

3. I have only once in two years had a game where I could not explain the uncanny accuracy of my enemy..

4. Ensure you use modules, upgrades and skills that are helpful to the ship you captain.. there are plenty of members here who can and will give you sound advice and these will help you in game. I have had my fair share of help from more experienced members of the game.

 

WOWs is nothing like WOT.

 

Don't lose heart and have patience... You will improve.

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The usual thing:  Adverse result = Enemy must be cheating.

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