Jump to content
Server Maintenance - January 18, 6:00 CET (5:00 UTC) Read more... ×
Server Maintenance - January 18, 6:00 CET (5:00 UTC) Read more... ×
Rusty_9

A Guide to Low-tier USN BB's for Potatos by a Potato

11 comments in this topic

Recommended Posts

[W-C]
Players
421 posts
1,775 battles

This is my feeble attempt at outlining some of the things I have learned/am trying to learn  when playing low-mid tier USN BB's (up to the Colorado at T7, excluding the South Carolina at T3!). I have grouped the 'points' into subheadings to make for easier reading... enjoy!

 

This is as much for me to identify flaws/gaps in my learning as much as it is to help others, so all comments will be welcomed. I find that, as a potato, it is quite depressing to look at 'how to' guides and see those amazing games that just seem to work out. I have included some of my 'best' games below, but also some of my very average ones, which still hopefully illustrate the points - and also show what goes wrong when I don't follow my own advice!


Captain Builds:

 

Captain builds, as always, are part 'best practice' and part 'personal preference'. I'd advise more research before choosing an optimal build, but below is what I am finding works well for me...

 

Spoiler

 

1pt - Priority Target. This is my go-to 1st point on every captain (apart from CV) - even on a BB when it is arguably not as relevant, it helps greatly when predicting when DD's are launching torps, and also shows you openings to execute slightly more risky turns when in the open (only when really necessary!)

3pt - Adrenalin Rush. Arguably, the more conventional build would be Expert Marksman because of the terribly turret traverse. However, I believe turret traverse improves at T8+ and I am carrying the captain up the line, so went this route for faster reload on low health.

6pt - Basics of Survivability. NEVER confuse this with Survivability Expert - the useless skill for BB's! In a BB, you expect to be HE spammed a LOT - this reduces fire duration by 15% (and flooding, and reduces time to repair damaged modules too).

10pt - Concealment Expert. Really useful - optimal range for USN BB's is on the edge of their detection range - close enough for the dispersion to not be too bad so you can really devastate cruisers and broadside BBs, far enough away for torpedos to not be too dangerous, and able to drop out of detection if things get too hot! You'll be using your armour and HP to good effect for your team (that is your primary job!) and looking big and menacing so slowing down the enemy (especially cruisers) and forcing them to play more passive. You'll be able to blink out of visibility between salvos too (if you're not on fire), giving you a breather from focus fire, and opportunity to switch targets undetected.

 

From there on, I haven't any more points allocated, although my ultimate 19pt captain will probably add Fire Prevention, Superintendant and Expert Marksman to the above.

 

3 also check @rnat post below on skill choice

 

 

Ship Builds:

 

For me, it's a fairly basic setup - there aren't many good 'choices' at this stage (up to T7)

Spoiler

 

 

Slot 1 is Main Arm Mod 1 for improved survivability of main guns
Slot 2 is Damage Control Mod 1 (nothing else makes sense on BB's)
Slot 3 is Artillery Plotting Room Mod (Better range and improved secondary performance)
Slot 4 I've tended to juggle Propulsion Mod and Steering Gears but based on feedback I think Damage Con 2 is the way forward2 & 3 

 

 

Signals and Cammo

 

Spoiler

Signals do make a massive difference to performance, especially when stacked with the module upgrades and captain skills. This is my 'default' core of signals I use, the remained of which I can swap in and out credit/xp modifying signals.

 

1) India Delta gives +20% to the amount of HP recovered when the Repair Party consumable is used (if you use all 5 charges, that's a lot of HP gain!)

2) India Yankee gives -20% to fire duration - stacking with Dmg Con Mod 2 and BoS this is a big reduction in fire duration

3) Juliet Yankee Bissotwo gives -20% to flooding duration - you hope to never have a perma flood, but if you do, this could be a life-saver

4) November Foxtrot gives -5% reload time on all consumables - get's them up and running a wee bit sooner

 

On top of those, depending on my mood, I also load

 

5) November Echo Setteseven to improve AA - in lower tiers, there are a lot of CV's around although your AA isn't great, it just adds a small improvement

6) Mike Yankee Soxisix to improve secondary performance - not an optimal choice, but sometimes I do it for fun

7) Sierra Mike to (very slightly) improve speed - every little helps, although I try to save these for DD's and CL/CA's!

8) Hotel Yankee to improve likelihood of surviving and being successful in a ram!

 

If you can, I would advise Type 5 as a default cammo choice (if you don't have a premium cammo). Otherwise Type 2 will work - reducing incoming fire accuracy


Early Game Plan:

 

The big thing to remember is to always have a plan. And always be prepared to change it.

 

In domination mode, your primary role is to support the caps. Standard mode it tends to be supporting a push, or discouraging one (although you are not really a kiter!). I tend to run through a mental checklist when planning at the very start of a match, and then keep these points in mind as I'm executing it. Don't forget that in a USN BB, you are VERY slow, so the whole time you want to be in a position where you always have a target, but you want to monitor the minimap very carefully to ensure you don't over-extend.

 

The checklist:

 

Spoiler

 

Part A - MM, team setup and your role
    1) Am I top tier, middle or bottom? As a top-tier BB, you are the most responsible for your teams performance (except maybe the DD's) - you need to use your armour, AP and menacing presence to intimidate the reds, and to give courage to your team to support a push. You can rely LESS on support (note... never go solo!) than if you are bottom tier. Bottom tier, you have to be more cautious... check the spawn and aim to be a close support to the Top-tier BBs 1-2 km behind is good. When they get focussed and need to heal up, you can pull forward and aleviate pressure for a bit - although you won't have as much staying power so need to plan your turns. As mid tier, you can swing between both roles - support when it suits, inspire when it's lacking. Don't forget the stigma that BB drivers in general are regarded with, and be prepared to be the only BB on your team who knows what to do, and be prepared to do the heavy lifting!

    2) Are there any CV's? If there are, it is more important than ever to keep together (note! Together is NOT the whole team - two or three 'blobs' of ships is fine) to share AA - you ideally want to 'layer' AA so that for a CV to get to their 'optimal' targets they have to overfly other AA bubbles. AA heavy ships (i.e. not you) increase in worth, and so it is important to protect yours, and take out the reds ASAP.

    3) Radar cruisers? These will be priority targets. Look at the map and try to plan your positioning so you will be able to cross-fire their most common hiding places. A well played radar (light) cruiser will rarely be spotted, so if you get a chance to shoot one, don't hesitate!

    4) DD's. Number and type. Lot's of DD's are not necesarily a bad thing for you, but they do increase the value exponentially of a well driven radar cruiser - again prioritise these! After that, be prepared to switch ammo types and don't hesitate from shooting DD's (although at more than 10km there probably isn't much point) more often, and be very unpredictable (i.e. use W and S as much as A and D, and don't always alternate which you use either!) with your maneuvers. Don't hang back, but you will need to be quite reliant on your DD's and cruisers to spot torps for you - and they will rely on you for heavy hitting power and to be a damage sponge! They will have a lot on their hands just knife-fighting against the DD's so try to be a good support for them.


Part B - Spawn point and travel path

    1) Game mode. Is it domination or standard? Domination you always want to be near caps, so you plan your path accordingly. Typically this means going to one of the 'flank' caps, securing, then CONTINUING to push into the middle cap. The 4 cap zone maps, apply the same principle, but you sometimes may need to push deeper towards red spawn (e.g. Haven) than usual - but DON'T go wide - you will loose effectiveness! Once you have a cap advantage, if ship-count is still fairly balanced, slow down the push somewhat and try to position such that as the enemy pushes back (which they will have to to regain a point advantage) you have strong cross-fires. Standard is much more campy - again, try to position such that you are setting up cross fires (if people angle against you, they show broadside to your team, and vice-versa). Keep an eye on the base - you don't want to sit around in spawn, but it is a weak spot and people often forget it exists in their rush to get to the red one!!!!!

    2) Map. To be honest, there are no maps I have been on so far that need a totally different strategy - apart from maybe Strait, which is my pet hate map no matter what ship I am in. That said, you do NOT want to go A on Neighbours in a USN BB (or anything apart from a fast DD really!) - your optimal position there is close support for B and C - the islands around C can lead to some suprise torpedo attacks, but as long as you are aware, you can mitigate this by maneuvering and team play (*cough*). When planning you path, use islands to break LoS and give you space to turn, but also make sure you AVOID islands that will block you off from supporting your team - you never want to have loaded guns and nothing to fire at!

    3) Spawn point. You plan will always start from your spawn point (duh!) - typically, if you spawn in the east, you go east. West you go west. But that is 'relative' - check around to see who else is near, what flanks might need supporting, and look where other BB's are going (I generally try to move so you balance BB numbers on either side of the map - or ping other players to see if they will turn round to support XYZ flank). And treat the two columns/rows of squares in from the edges of the map as anathema - don't go there unless it truly is necessary. But also, don't yolo into the middle of the map just because you spawned centrally!

 


General Positioning:

 

Spoiler

As the game develops, you want to be such that you are not the sole target for the enemy, but you are in a position that you are able to meaningfully attract attention (guns fired at you are guns not killing off your DD's and cruisers) and where you are able to get to safety for a short while to recover and heal. Try to place yourself such that you create a cross-fire, and try to avoid getting into a lemming with the rest of your team. That said, USN BB's up to T7 are strongest on a pushing flank, so if you find a train is forming and you are in the thick of it, don't despair - but use your influence to make sure they keep pushing (lemming trains typically fail because they stop pushing because they capped or are scared of an inferior enemy force! Don't let that happen to you). When manoeuvring, because you are so slow, you rarely want to travel below full speed, although slowing down for torp-beating can be necessary!2


Guns, Shooting and Target Priority:

 

Spoiler

 

Target priority is always: DD's under 12km, Radar Cruisers, cruisers under 15km, Broadside BB's and then anything else.3

 

Always shoot AP. Always. Unless you are DD-hunting. You pack loads of alpha strike in your AP salvos - don't get hung up on big damage numbers from fires - this is almost meaningless when you are driving a USN BB! This also translates into always aiming for waterline unless  it is a KM or heavily angled BB - go for upper armour belt on the former, or bow (if you can overmatch)/turrets (Disable/destroy his guns, he can't shoot you without showing more side)/superstructure (overpens are better than bounces!) in the latter.

 

Turrets - you have poor turret traverse. Pre-aim your turrets to the side you expect to be shooting at, and only turn when you have to. Use the 30 sec reload time to soak up some of the turn time, and if it's urgent, use your rudder to turn the ship too! Use free-look loads - I am probably in free-look mode between 1/3 and 2/3 of the time I am in battle (Hold the Right mouse Button to look around whilst your guns remain pointed towards the original aiming direction2)! You have long reloads so you have no excuse for poor situational awareness!

 

If you stuggle with aiming, try shooting one turret and see where it lands (allow for dispersion trolling!) before you do the rest of the salvo. This can warn other captains of your intent though, giving them time to angle against you, so try and use the technique sparingly.

 

 

 

Consumable Use:

 

Always use premium DCP and Repair Party - their value is much greater than their cost in silver, and the staying power they give you is too good to miss. I never bother with premium spotter plane because it's use is situational and it's rare I'd need the reduced cool-down time for it.

 

Spoiler

 

Damage Control Party: Never put out one fire. Never. Unless you are well into the red on your HP and you have no choice. With my 10pt 'tank' build, I rarely even put out 2. If I have 3 fires, I will gtfo and begin maneuvering to where I know I will be undetected in 15-20 seconds, THEN put the fires out - DCP runs for 25 seconds so the HE spam that continues for that last few seconds won't set any perma fires, and you will stop the HP bleed sooner. I also sometimes do this if I am on fire (2 or more) and 5-10 seconds away from eating 2 or more torps (They don't always cause flooding!). You will need to use DCP for a broken rudder or engine too - waiting for a minute for these to repair could cost you dearly2!

 

Repair Party - Use it as early as you can with full effect - tank build with the correct flags mean you will be able to heal more than the damage one fire can do, so don't trigger it as soon as you start burning - let the fire burn itself out, or start it after you have the second fire going.

 

Spotter Plane - Never use it in the first 2 minutes. Don't use it because it gives you extra range. Use it because it gives you a good perspective to blap island-hugging cruisers (think Radar cruisers!) and smoke-firing ones. Don't forget to aim a bit lower (i.e. BELOW the waterline) than normal, and double-check your lead and distances as the perspective makes it look closer than it really is. Try to make sure your guns are already aimied at said targets before popping the spotter - the amount of times i have popped the spotter consumable and then the island hugger goes 'stealth' before my turrets turn in time is most frustrating!

 

OK, I may be being a bit extreme, but the exceptions to these rules of thumb are not common!

 

 

 

Angling and Armour:

Spoiler

 

Number 1 rule. Never show broadside whilst you are spotted. Never. If at all possible.
Number 2 rule. As a general rule you can overmatch a lower tier BB bow armor, while they cannot do the same. the rule is true up to T8, where nobody except Yamato class can overmatch each other. There are exceptions to this, such as Warspite, Bayern and Nagato. (to overmatch a certain armor thickness, the shell calibre needs to be at least 14.3 of the listed(not effective) armor thickness. This is also important in choosing your targets to shoot, as well as angling your own armour!) 1 If in doubt, you are safer to assume that BB you are facing off against can overmatch your bow and stern armour. Angling is NOT bow-camping/pushing.2

 

As a rule of thumb3:

T5 and below is a clusterfuck. Any BB can overmatch you unless you have extra bow-plating which many have

(so you'd actually need a list)

T6-7 BBs can bounce 356mm guns (14'') and below, which are found on most ships at or below T6. Anything bigger will overmatch.

T8 BBs can bounce everything but Yamatos.

T8+ cruisers come in 2 flavours: the Germans, USN CAs (not CLs) (possibly others i can't think of atm) can bounce 381mm (15'') and below.

The rest fall in the same category ast t7 bbs.

 

And that is about it. You have amazing belt armour, use it! The optimal angle is about 60% relative to incoming fire - auto bounce! This may well mean you can't fire your rear turrents but don't worry - wait until the red has fired, then wiggle your stern out enough just enough to engage them, shoot, then wiggle back again. Just watch out for him doing the same!

 

 

 

Videos:

 

(I'll repeat what I said at the start too:)

 

I find that, as a potato, it is quite depressing to look at 'how to' guides and see those amazing games that just seem to work out. I have included some of my 'best' games below, but also some of my very average (and poor) ones, which still hopefully illustrate the points - and also show what goes wrong when I don't follow my own advice! It's also sometimes much easier to see someone else's mistakes than your own .

 

Spoiler

These are actually in reverse order of 'experience' - my latest game at the top, my oldest at the bottom. I have only just fully upgraded and outfitted my Colorado with all Modules and upgrades at time of the latest video.

 

 

A standard game mode - where I didn't want to join the lemming train that was forming early game. Did come close to over-extending, but thankfully had support from a Gneis and my CV so it didn't go badly wrong.

 

 

 

A cyclone game - note how I kept an eye on the minimap when approaching the cap in the cyclone, then turned to angle before I got 'surprised'. I should have moved in to the Alsace to support the Musashi because his guns would have been facing the other way, but I didn't consider that at the time, and was just avoiding showing him broadside and wanting to heal up.

 

 

 

My best game yet - note the mistake with HE at the start, and then the deliberate switch when dancing around the Gaede - this is one of the rare occasions where I use HE (apart from the end of the match before this one too, it would seem) sorry about the potato aiming tho!

 

 

USN BB's are not designed for kiting, and they also can't push islands out of the way... but this was an interesting from a number of perspectives (including me not looking where I'm going!).

 

 

 

This is what happens when you over-extend and get focused down.

 

 

Wyoming in a Standard battle - an old match of mine. Notice my caution with +1 T BB New York and how I (tried) to use the island to shield me from him.

 

 

And another classic example of poor planning ahead, and slow BB's...

 

 


Other Titbits:

 

I'll add to this as I think of things - feel free to comment below with your feedback and I'll ammend/include accordingly.


*disclaimer: I am no unicum... you only need to see my stats and these videos to see the truth! This is only from my own observations and experience, with much more to learn. There are many more useful guides and videos out there - I suggest you read/watch them too :-).

 

Credits:

Spoiler

1 @howardxu_23 thanks for the correction on bow armour and the overmatch formula.

2 @Riselotte thanks for more info on armour and correction on upgrades

3@rnat thanks for more info on armour, target priority tweaks and correction on upgrades

 

 

edit: Lots of.

  • Cool 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Players
301 posts
730 battles

Not bad for a guide. Although for this:

Quote

Number 2 rule. Always assume that BB you are facing off against can overmatch your bow and stern armour. Angling is NOT bow-camping/pushing.

As a general rule you can overmatch a lower tier BB bow armor, while they cannot do the same. the rule is true up to T8, where nobody except Yamato class can overmatch each other.

obviusly there are exceptions, such as warspite, Bayern(although it cannot hit a darn thing) and nagato(very important, it is accurate enough to do that semi reliably)

however the best soloution is to “know your enemy”— know which ships can overmatch your armor, and what your ship is capable of overmatching. And use the formula for over matching: to overmatch a certain armor plate, the shel calibre needs to be 14.3 larger then it. 

A good example is Des Moines vs Bismarck, DM’s 27mm bow cannot be overmatched by Bismarck 380mm guns.

  • Cool 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[W-C]
Players
421 posts
1,775 battles
10 minutes ago, howardxu_23 said:

As a general rule you can overmatch a lower tier BB bow armor, while they cannot do the same. the rule is true up to T8, where nobody except Yamato class can overmatch each other.

obviusly there are exceptions, such as warspite, Bayern(although it cannot hit a darn thing) and nagato(very important, it is accurate enough to do that semi reliably)

Thanks - I'm afraid it probably falls into the 'I'm too lazy to learn/didn't find that out' category but that is helpful, thank you. I'll put that in ;)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Players
301 posts
730 battles

You forget this formula for overmatch, which is very important if you want to look into it further:

to overmatch a certain armor thickness, the shell calibre needs to be at least 14.3 of the listed(not effective) armor thickness

  • Cool 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[POI--]
Players
3,865 posts
5,006 battles
1 hour ago, Rusty_9 said:

 

 

For me, it's a fairly basic setup - there aren't many good 'choices' at this stage (up to T7)

  Reveal hidden contents

 

 

Slot 1 is Main Arm Mod 1 for improved survivability of main guns
Slot 2 is Damage Control Mod 1 (nothing else makes sense on BB's)
Slot 3 is more flexible - I've juggled with Rudder Mod and Propulsion Mod. Both are viable (these tier BB's actually have really good turning circles) although not having propulsion mod can sometimes be really grating as engine performance is terrible. Then again, you should never really be stopping so it's not critical!
Slot 4 is Aiming Systems Mod for better main gun performance.

 

 

Slot 3 you don't get propulsion or rudder, that is slot 4. Also, Damecon Mod 2 is likely a better idea.

Slot 3 is AA Mod 1, Secondary Mod 1, Main Battery Mod 1 or Artillery Plotting Room 1. USN BBs do not have Aiming Systems Mod 1.

2 hours ago, Rusty_9 said:

 

Angling and Armour:

  Reveal hidden contents

 

Number 1 rule. Never show broadside whilst you are spotted. Never. If at all possible.
Number 2 rule. As a general rule you can overmatch a lower tier BB bow armor, while they cannot do the same. the rule is true up to T8, where nobody except Yamato class can overmatch each other. There are exceptions to this, such as Warspite, Bayern and Nagato. (to overmatch a certain armor thickness, the shell calibre needs to be at least 14.3 of the listed(not effective) armor thickness. This is also important in choosing your targets to shoot, as well as angling your own armour!) 1 If in doubt, you are safer to assume that BB you are facing off against can overmatch your bow and stern armour. Angling is NOT bow-camping/pushing.

 

 

And that is about it. You have amazing belt armour, use it! The optimal angle is about 60% relative to incoming fire - auto bounce! This may well mean you can't fire your rear turrents but don't worry - wait until the red has fired, then wiggle your stern out enough just enough to engage them, shoot, then wiggle back again. Just watch out for him doing the same!

 

 

Given this is a low tier guide, it's very hard to bow tank these days. Up to T5, your armour is not capable of stopping any BB caliber shells (even Scharnhorst 28 cm). Ships like the German BBs have improved bow armour and are trollish, but USN is all-or-nothing scheme and basically cannot stop shells from overmatching them. T6 and T7 can stop everything short of 38 cm, which however means that you still get overmatched by:

  • T6 Queen Elizabeth
  • T6 Bayern
  • T6 Warspite
  • T6 Mutsu
  • T7 Colorado
  • T7 Nagato
  • T7 Gneisenau
  • T7 Hood
  • T7 Nelson
  • T7 Ashitaka
  • every T8 and above.
Spoiler

Conversely, ships you can bounce:

  • every T5 or lower
  • T6 New Mexico
  • T6 Fuso
  • T6 Normandie
  • T6 Dunkerque
  • T6 Prinz Eitel Friedrich
  • T6 Arizona
  • T7 Lyon
  • T7 King George V
  • T7 Duke of York
  • T7 Scharnhorst

It is pretty readily apparant that at lower tiers, the number of ships that can overmatch you is about equal to those that cannot overmatch you at T6 and is the majority at T7. Also worth noting, all or-nothing armour means that you only got good armour at the main belt. Bow, stern and upper belt are all soft and ships that can overmatch you can easily brutalise you. As you kind of are forced to bait on the belt and hope it lands low enough to bounce, you really need to get decent at it, given that when you give too much broadside, some guns that don't overmatch have such high pen that they will still go through, even through angled armour (e.g. Dunkerque).

 

Also, note that two of the T7s that don't overmatch you are British BBs with thermonuclear HE. You won't eat cits, but you certainly will feel the pain. Lyon also might switch to HE, but is much easier to deal with.

 

In short, get used to trading away hp. Know what you can afford. It's what you got hp and repair party for.

  • Cool 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[SSA]
Players
515 posts
16,236 battles

First of all, thank you very much for taking the time and making such a guide. :Smile_medal:

 

Just a few points i'd like to make:

4 hours ago, Rusty_9 said:

3pt - Adrenalin Rush. Arguably, the more conventional build would be Expert Marksman because of the terribly turret traverse. However, I believe turret traverse improves at T8+ and I am carrying the captain up the line, so went this route for faster reload on low health.

It gets better but not actually good. (45s/180° if i'm not wrong) I'm a real fan of snappy turrets, so imo EM is still pretty desirable on the NC and up. Then again your mileage may differ, best to test it yourself.

 

4 hours ago, Rusty_9 said:

6pt - Basics of Survivability.

Good choice, especially if you don't run Dmg-Con mod 1 (as you state later), though i'd say go for SI for the extra heal.

I full BB-heal gives you 14% of your ships HP (16.8% with India Delta), assuming you make full use of them

1 full fire costs you 18% (14.4% with India Yankee, less with skills/mod), which can be fully healed back

and BoS will always reduce the fire time by 15% so for maximum effect let's assume it's the only fire reduction you run

and thus reduces dmg taken by 2.7% of your HP/fire.

I.e. you will need ~5.2 full fires to get the same HP-advantage.

(6.2 with India Delta, 8.7 with India Delta+India Yankee, 9.1 with Flags+Dmg-con Mod 1)

As you notice the more you invest elsewhere the less useful the skill becomes.

(c.f. here: https://wiki.wargaming.net/en/Ship:Fire)

 

4 hours ago, Rusty_9 said:

Slot 3 is more flexible - I've juggled with Rudder Mod and Propulsion Mod. Both are viable (these tier BB's actually have really good turning circles) although not having propulsion mod can sometimes be really grating as engine performance is terrible. Then again, you should never really be stopping so it's not critical!
Slot 4 is Aiming Systems Mod for better main gun performance.

Aiming systems is in Slot 3 (500k one), the other ones are in slot 4.

Note that USN Battleships can't mount Aiming Systems and should choose between increased range (prolly best up to t7)and increased AA-range (best choice from T8 and up)

I'd recommend Dmg-Con mod 1 for slot 4 though because it tends to be more useful more often.

Usually the ruddershift on a BB is workable (unless on a Stock hull, if you have spare credits to swap out later). It's slow but since the ship itself tends to be rather sluggish it's usually not the thing that will break your neck when maneuvering, especially if you can anticipate where you want to be going and get the rudder moving well on time.

It's up to your preferences though, some are fine with the extra time, some absolutely loath slow rudders

(e.g. i ran it on the Iowa for example since i couldn't stand that ungodly 20s rudder)

Propulsion mod is not really recommended, since battleships are massive and cumbersome it will rarely be enough to move you out of the way fast enough before an enemy salvo or torpedo-spread (unless fired from afar) gets to you.

 

4 hours ago, Rusty_9 said:

Target priority is always: Radar Cruisers, cruisers under 15km, DD's under 8km, Broadside BB's and then anything else.

This may be for the future, when you're more confident in your aim, but try to go for any DDs that you think you have a chance of hitting.

Even if it's at 12-13km if it sails in a predictable pattern and you believe you can land a shell or two go for it.

At mid tiers we're talking 10-15k HP for a DD, which means a single overpen will chunk it for ~10%

and if you're lucky and get a full penetration that's one very unhappy DD right there. (and lots of exp for you ^^)

Radar cruisers influence the game so massively because they deny Areas to DDs and get them killed,

so for one prioritizing them is very good, but on the other hand enemy DDs do the same in that regard and are spotted less often and squishier.

 

As for armour, here's a rule of thumb [edit] for bow-armour:

T5 and below is a clusterfuck. Any BB can overmatch you unless you have extra bow-plating which many have

(so you'd actually need a list)

T6-7 BBs can bounce 356mm guns (14'') and below, which are found on most ships at or below T6. Anything bigger will overmatch.

T8 BBs can bounce everything but Yamatos.

T8+ cruisers come in 2 flavours: the Germans, USN CAs (not CLs), can bounce 381mm (15'') and below.

The rest fall in the same category ast t7 BBs.

Also most KM BBs, Moskva and Stalingrad get additional plaing along the sides of the bow, making them quite bouncy.

  • Cool 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[W-C]
Players
421 posts
1,775 battles
19 minutes ago, Riselotte said:

Slot 3 you don't get propulsion or rudder, that is slot 4. Also, Damecon Mod 2 is likely a better idea.

Slot 3 is AA Mod 1, Secondary Mod 1, Main Battery Mod 1 or Artillery Plotting Room 1. USN BBs do not have Aiming Systems Mod 1.

Damn... that's what I get for trying to go by memory :fish_palm:. Thanks. Will fix.

 

22 minutes ago, Riselotte said:

[lots of info.... snip]

 

It is pretty readily apparant that at lower tiers, the number of ships that can overmatch you is about equal to those that cannot overmatch you at T6 and is the majority at T7

This should probably go into the 'beyond a potato' guide :Smile_teethhappy:. In the section on armour, that is mostly the point I was trying to drive at - your bow is a weak spot so don't expose it!

 

Good info though, and is stoking my interest in trying to be more scientific/objective in macro-decision making! Will include this in the post.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[POI--]
Players
3,865 posts
5,006 battles
13 minutes ago, rnat said:

Good choice, especially if you don't run Dmg-Con mod 1 (as you state later), though i'd say go for SI for the extra heal.

I full BB-heal gives you 14% of your ships HP (16.8% with India Delta), assuming you make full use of them

1 full fire costs you 18% (14.4% with India Yankee, less with skills/mod), which can be fully healed back

and BoS will always reduce the fire time by 15% so for maximum effect let's assume it's the only fire reduction you run

and thus reduces dmg taken by 2.7% of your HP/fire.

I.e. you will need ~5.2 full fires to get the same HP-advantage.

(6.2 with India Delta, 8.7 with India Delta+India Yankee, 9.1 with Flags+Dmg-con Mod 1)

As you notice the more you invest elsewhere the less useful the skill becomes.

(c.f. here: https://wiki.wargaming.net/en/Ship:Fire)

Imo, the more important question is, are you good enough at damage management to get to repair party #5. If yes, then go for SI. But most often, players who start out and people who are quite aggressive will rather go BoS first, as you get the savings earlier than the fifth repair party and it might allow you to survive to use all four, instead of dying before the third.

10 minutes ago, Rusty_9 said:

Damn... that's what I get for trying to go by memory :fish_palm:. Thanks. Will fix.

 

This should probably go into the 'beyond a potato' guide :Smile_teethhappy:. In the section on armour, that is mostly the point I was trying to drive at - your bow is a weak spot so don't expose it!

 

Good info though, and is stoking my interest in trying to be more scientific/objective in macro-decision making! Will include this in the post.

At some point you get bored and look at armour models in port and realise just how much BS protection some ships have.

28 minutes ago, rnat said:

T8+ cruisers come in 2 flavours: the Germans, USN CAs (not CLs) (possibly others i can't think of atm) can bounce 381mm (15'') and below.

The rest fall in the same category ast t7 bbs.

Actually, it is far more complex (who would've guessed...).

 

USN CA: Can bowtank 38 cm up to T10, cannot tank much beyond that. Easy to cit when broadside.

USN CL: overmatched by everyone, except Worcester, which has 30 mm deck, so it only gets overmatched there by Yamato/Musashi and Republique.

IJN: Mogami and Ibuki get overmatched by everyone at their tiers, Zao has 30 mm amidships and 25 mm bow, so everyone overmatches the bow and stern, but mid section bounces all except Yamato/Musashi and Republique. Atago as a premium gets overmatched everywhere except the deck, which bounces all BBs. Can be pretty troll thus for both sides.

RN: Dies, angle irrelevant. Armour holds off cruiser caliber only and citadel is pretty much most of the ship.

German: Can bowtank 38 cm reliably at T8-10, cannot bowtank anything beyond that except for Hipper which has 40 mm lower bow plating that can tank any BB if it gets hit at the waterline. Midsection of Hipper, Prinz Eugen and Roon bounces 38 cm only, Hindenburg has 30 mm midsection, bouncing all shells except Yamato/Musashi and Republique off that.

MN: Armour isn't great, but they have spaced armour at the sides. Might give 0 damage pens at times. Relies on dodging.

Soviet: T8 Chapa and T9 Donskoi die easily, as they lack armour, T10 Moskva has 50 mm lower bow plating and 25 mm upper bow plating, as well as 50 mm centre deck. Moskva can bounce most shells, but the few that hit the 25 mm section will overmatch. Stalingrad is similar to Moskva, Kronshtadt is 25 mm bow, gets wrecked by BBs.

 

Theoretically, 457 mm Conqueror can overmatch the cruisers just like Yamato, but I forgot that thing exists till I was finished. Says a lot about how often you encounter it. 

  • Cool 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[SSA]
Players
515 posts
16,236 battles
7 minutes ago, Riselotte said:

Actually, it is far more complex (who would've guessed...).

Yeh. I only wanted to give a simple, relatively easy to remember rule of thumb for what bows can be overmatched,

since going into deck-armour and sides would make it quite expansive, as you have shown ^^

Also, very valid point about dmg-management, i plead no contest.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[W-C]
Players
421 posts
1,775 battles
6 minutes ago, rnat said:

Also, very valid point about dmg-management, i plead no contest.

Yeah, based on my experience up until now as a newbie, BoS was the best choice at the time, but around about now I would like SI :). It's not uncommon now that I run out of heals and could see the advantages of this now. Should that be then next skill? I have 2 spare points and am on the way to my 3rd... I just can't decide what to spend them on; EM now, SI soonish or FP not so soon (I don't really want to use doubloons to 'experiment' :) ).

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[POI--]
Players
3,865 posts
5,006 battles

Four added points:

  • On free lookout, I would mention that it works with right mouse button and that it is good because it keeps your guns in place. Not everyone might know that.
  • On positioning, I'd mention that with low tier USN, you always go full speed unless you need to dodge and you try to be central, rather than flanking, because your speed is terrible. It is correct that USN BBs are better joining a lemmingtrain if it unfortunately forms, mostly because on their own they cannot meaningfully delay before dying and they are better off pushing on.
  • On DCP and modules, there actually are two cases where you absolutely should use it: Knocked out rudder and engine. Rudder is rare, typically a torp hit, so you repair anyway to get flooding under control (shells knocking out rudder is more an IJN problem). If you ever lose rudder though without a flooding, you really don't want to sail in a line or in circles for a minute. Consider repairing. Engine is more likely, because citadels in the machinery room can knock out the engine (as can unfortunate torps, but those again cause flooding anyway). A BB that sits dead in the water soon sits dead on the seabed.
  • Signal options are missing, but important.
9 minutes ago, Rusty_9 said:

Yeah, based on my experience up until now as a newbie, BoS was the best choice at the time, but around about now I would like SI :). It's not uncommon now that I run out of heals and could see the advantages of this now. Should that be then next skill? I have 2 spare points and am on the way to my 3rd... I just can't decide what to spend them on; EM now, SI soonish or FP not so soon (I don't really want to use doubloons to 'experiment' :) ).

Personally, I use SI on most BB as first 3 pt, except for Germans, where it is BoS, because of the aggressive playstyle. For you, I'd say PT, AR, BoS, CE, then FP, BoS, EM. In general a decent alternative option for randoms, especially with CV rework at some point, is to replace FP with AFT and to slot AA range mod in slot 3, as gun range at higher tiers is sufficient. At lower tiers, APR 1 might be better, because the ship is slow, so with short range, you might often find yourself without target. BFT is not recommended, because any such semi-AA build should have BFT instead of BoS, not SI. Getting SI is more important. In your case, it might be best to get first SI, then EM, then FP, because SI and EM beat FP in usefulness (though they normally wouldn't beat BoS and AR if one went for the conventional tank build).

  • Cool 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.

×